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Do you mean like using the IRS to target political opponents? That kind of overreach?
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Perhaps using George Bush's patriot act to spy on all Americans an even kill a few in unmanned drone attacks is the kind of overreach you are taking about.
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I'll start of by stating I am an independent and hold both parties in equal disdain as they both have myopic viewpoints on how things should be run.
That being said, I find the progressive approach to be much less palatable to my life. It is very perplexing to me that you (the OP) are OK with general government intrusion, but are now concerned with one aspect of that intrusion. For me, and it looks like many others, that unacceptable intrusion level started a long time ago and is accelerating in all aspects of life. Why do you feel the need to have government tell you how to live any aspect of your life? You can make the same decisions on your own without their interference, and that allows the rest of us to make the right decisions for ourselves. From my perspective your are trying to remove a unsightly growth that bothers you, when the fundamental problem is the patient has cancer that needs to be treated. I do not disagree with your stated goal, but for most of us, the people that vote for progressive candidates have enabled the cancer and we feel the cure needs to go much deeper than just the addressing gun issue. Relative to the 2a issues, I am all for changes that will protect the public from the loonies, but the latest crop of bills does nothing that I am aware of to stop any future violence. It is also very disturbing to me that the progressives are willing circumvent/ignore the Constitution when it fits their agenda. This should scare every American citizen as it is clear they do not think it applies to them and they will do whatever they need to do to get their way. On a final note, I would also like to see where you draw the line on what should be allowed under the 2a. I know I am not aligned with a majority of the people on the right, but think it is a reasonable question for you to answer since you started this thread. |
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It's called Google. |
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Now back to the topic........... |
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Now why do you keep bringing up "sport" then? |
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If it's not about sport, then stop trying to tell us that's what we need to pretend that it's about. |
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Welcome ericb!
You and I won't agree on politics... That doesn't mean you get a special forum to talk "progressive" stuff! Somebody said earlier "This forum's for everyone" and that's true, it's also true most of us probably have more in common than not, so... Just join the discussions, put on your flame suit and get in there. /thread :43: eta: Oh and quit fighting w/ merc and fivefivesix. You're not gonna get the last word in on them (LOOK AT THEIR POST COUNTS MAN)! :rofl: |
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Since you wanted a "progressive 2A thread" I'm interested in seeing what "progressives solutions" can be tabled. So far its "conservatives need to ask progressives out shooting". Which boggles my minds since conservatives/gun owners have been pilloried by progressives as "hill billy, red necked, racist, misogynist, homophobe, haters" in order to advance progressive ideology over the last 50 yrs. So what other "progressive solutions"? I can give you some. Progressive gun owners showing up at democrat functions and start working the crowd. Advance the same progressive gun owners up through the democrat ranks. Even perhaps telling other progressive that using name calling or "fixing your enemy" shouldn't be used when it comes to gun owners because "darn it, progressives love their guns too". Thats 3 for a start. |
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Also, I realize you were trying to keep your political beliefs out of the thread, but I am following your suggestion of engaging "progressives" to affect positive change, and just carried it past your initial stated goal. I realize, this is not the correct forum for that dialogue, but I figured I would poke at anyway. Enough said on it from me. |
The fact remains your political party is infringing on our second amendment rights. Thats a fact. I believe that if we all want to see justice done and for the politicians who are trying to take away our second amendment rights we need to come together as a community not try to segregate ourselves because "we" think it would be easier to share our political views and beliefs with others who share similar views. We need to take constructive criticism and share new ideas with each other. Hopefully we can come to understand one another.
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Libertarians: more socially liberal than dems. More fiscally conservative than GOP. The CA libertarian platform supports the 2A to the FULLEST extent. They support all personal freedoms that don't infringe on another persons rights. They believe the government should be protecting individuals rights rather than stripping them away. There is room for a leftist pro 2A person in the libertarian party. While they support such left ideas as gay marriage, they don't support subsides, handouts, corporate tax breaks... It's a growing party. Donkeys and Elephants just try to decide which rights to allow us or revoke, or who is allowed "rights" and to what extent.
I suppose it may be a radical stance to support a third party, but it makes you free to despise D/R equally and to support and advocate for all of your own individual rights (so long as they do not infringe on another persons individual rights). Everyone is entitled to their own beliefs. The government does not legislate based on any specific religious view or anti religious view. Both the dems and GOP want to be your nanny. OP: progressive? What does that mean? Does it mean socialist? I don't even know what a progressive is. Does that mean the same thing as liberal? Or democrat? If it does, then why is there even such a thing as a progressive? Are any republicans progressive (that's rhetorical). I've always felt liberal as far as social issues, but the attack on the 2A has caused me to wake up. Damn the CA democrat party. The right wing view on social issues (pro-life, homophobes, creationists, tea party) I could never support. Feinstein, pelosi, boxer, Yee, de Leon, skinner, etc, etc, etc, are a bunch of emotional bleeding hearts that feel that disarming everyone is the best way to secure progressive votes. They would have everyone believe that supporters of the second amendment approve of killing children. And their constituents agree. They show it with their votes. It seems that the only politicians who believe in ALL civil rights are the libertarians. Separation of church and state. Equal rights for all. Individuals right to keep and bear arms. What does a progressive even believe? Or is that just another name to use instead of democrat? I know the democrats in CA believe that I should not be able to own or carry most types of firearms due to public safety. That position is terribly Misguided, but that is what they believe, when actually, public safety would not be jeopardized if I carried a gun. My personal safety and the safety of my family would be bolstered. The democrat agenda would not allow me to carry, and would severely restrict my choice in weapons, because I choose to abide by laws. Criminals choose not to abide by laws. Dems are ensconced in this state. GOP is not electable in the statewide elections. They are all garbage. It's all cronies, kickbacks, and power whores. There is only one party that believes in ALL of your individual rights and personal freedoms. It might be a fringe element. Might not have the ability to win state wide elections (neither does GOP). But the fact is if you believe in the 2A, you can't cast your votes for the pelosis ET al. If you believe that all are created equal, you can't vote red. There is another choice if you believe in freedom and YOUR RIGHTS. It might be radical. But that's my .02 |
Eric, welcome to the forum. Don't mind the prevalence of far-right members in this forum. There's also quite a few moderates, independents, libertarians and liberals in support of the Second Amendment here.
It's not all Conservatives. I consider myself a moderate with strong Libertarian leanings. Not everyone is as stubborn about fitting you into a conveniently pre-packaged stereotype. What I find interesting is how some of these loudmouths will cry foul when someone in the media wrongly tries to paint gun owners as a bunch of paranoid redneck gun-nuts, but as soon as someone around here speaks up having political views an inch to the left of Rush Limbaugh they get the McCarthy treatment. By fighting among ourselves we play right into the anti-gun gameplan. Divide and conquer. Some folks get it, some don't. |
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This makes way too much sense for a LIBTARD!!!! :p |
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Go on the ca libertarian website and read their platform. They are gaining some traction. It's maybe unconventional. And they maybe get a little radical with some of their ideas of privatization.... But they are the one party who believes in freedom and individual rights. It's possible that libertarians can get elected or appointed to some offices on small local levels. The mayor of Mountain View is a libertarian. They are uncompromising on YOUR 2A rights and all of your personal freedoms. We probably can't unseat the dems at the senate level. But maybe someday.....
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Sorry, just don't see it. |
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Nice thread ya got 'ere. Pity if sumpin' would 'appen to it. Talkin' 'bout the topic 'stead o the talkers'd be a big help. |
Is there a better choice? Is your only goal to beat the dems? Or is your only goal supporting the GOP? Those parties suck!
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