NFA Trusts (EDIT: Fee Added)
I have been approached by quite a few people interested in NFA Trusts. I am currently researching the issue and expect to be able to draw these up very soon.
Just wanted to put this out there so that people didn't think I had forgotten about them. :) EDIT: thread updated - see this post http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...3&postcount=97 |
Do you need a LE sign off for a trust? As a class 3 holder I think you do but not 100%.
Plus I know the ATF wont give you a stamp if its not allowed in your state. Just some things you prolly already know.:) |
Thats one of the main points of a trust, no LE sign off. No fingerprints or photos either.
ATF has given CA trusts tax stamps for CA-legal NFA items. |
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I think you can make a short bbl shotgun.
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:Ivan:
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Basically AOWs, and C&R SBSs/SBRs are CA legal NFA items. Sound suppressors, MGs, and non-C&R SBSs/SBRs are not. |
Ooh.
What is the approx cost, normal NFA trust set up, standard, no outside issues, etc to set up a trust for NFA guns? Thanks |
good to know, thanks for tackling this.-cam
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Practically, only C&R SBS/SBR, DDs under .60", and AOWs (except pen-guns). They also need to comply with the AW regs. I'd take any more specific NFA firearms questions to the AOW/SBS/SBR thread, http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...ad.php?t=82693 so we don't further hi-jack oaklander's NFA trust thread. |
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As is, that AK pistol is not an AOW. Planning on putting the forward grip back on? There is another calgunner planning on the same thing, getting an AOW form 1 so he can put the forward grip back on.
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Yep, I'd like to put the front grip back on. Still have to keep the BB, but oh well. I'll live I guess ;)
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Mmm, serbu super shorty sounds mighty appealing. Would be nice to have a 12ga in the dresser drawer :43:
ETA: Oh my, I just got giddy at the thought of OCing a serbu super shorty since is not classified as a shotgun and i think there may be no prohibition on the OC of an AOW. :tt1: |
Hey Oak - how much you charging per?
-Gene |
Hello, also wondering how much would you be charging for your service? I know there are programs that you can buy that will draft a quick Trust for you.
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Not sure yet. I will know in a couple of days. . .
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I will have more details in a couple of days. |
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How about someone coming up with a list of ideas of what to buy. Kind of like a shopping cart...err..wishlist of what to get :D -bb |
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And C&R SBS/SBRs are ok as well. And I gues if you really wanted a big boomer, you could make something in 14.5mm Russian or find one of these, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PTRD . |
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The pistol AW regs may apply per Quote:
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Ah, that's it. I forgot. Thanks for reminding me.
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I would be interested, but I would like to know specifics about the "value added" over Quicken Willmaker trusts, which have shown to be perfectly adequate as NFA ownership vehicles in other states.
I understand some lawyers who have advertised specialized NFA trusts have highlighted the issues regarding transfer after the grantor's death. It seems to me that leaving a detailed letter of instruction to the successor trustee along with a partly completed form 5 would take care of these issues. Am I mistaken, and are there other concerns? |
PM Sent.
:notworthy: |
The main idea is to make sure that the trust, by its operation, never creates an illegal situation. This has to remain true now, 20 years from now, 40 years from now, etc. . .
If you, or anyone else for that matter, wishes to use commercially available software to generate a revocable living "NFA trust" - by all means, give it a shot - and let me know how it works. . . :) BUT, please, please, please make sure that you have a lawyer who is familiar with NFA issues review the completed document before you submit it to the ATF. There is simply too much at risk to attempt to save a few bucks on something like this. Quote:
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I've read into the use of NFA trusts since they became widely known. It seems the common places where the legality of ownership comes into question are:
- someone other than trustee in possession - trustee unable to serve, or legally disabled from possession - beneficiary legally disabled from possession - situations arising from a trust merger Again, I've seen a lot of innuendo from lawyers, but I'd like to hear specifics of why Willmaker trusts are deficient. |
It is not proper for me to answer specific legal questions here. Nor do I wish to debate the relative costs vs. benefits of using a real lawyer versus using a "lawyer-in-a-box."
The purpose of this thread was simply to give a "status update" to the people who have contacted me in the past about NFA trusts. I'd like to stay on topic. You sound like you have done a lot of research on NFA trusts. That's a good thing. I would still strongly recommend that you have an experienced attorney look over the resulting document that you create. Quote:
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OK - the waiting is over - the fee is $600.
:) Anyone who is interested is welcome to PM me - I can start immediately! Quote:
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Do income tax returns need to be filed on trusts, even if there is no money made?
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[crying mode]
but i want a supressor... [/crying mode] |
ok, here goes the bank account again. . . .
first it was OLL's. . . . then it was ammo. . . now its NFA. . . . . . my kids didnt need a college education anyways. . . . :D |
PM in bound Kev
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Guys, if you want to own an NFA weapon in CA this is the way to do it. Kevin knows what he's doing, and will see that you don't get into trouble.
This is actually pretty complex, and things like Quicken Will Maker and the like can quite easily create accidental felons out of you and your loved ones. (infact, they will...) they are not built with the NFA in mind and do not take into account state law either. Kevin's done the DD. |
After setting up the trust, will you reveiw the NFA paperwork, form 1, form 4, whatever it is?
Or is this even needed? |
Is that what the fees are for O? A review/look-over to make sure everything is kosher?
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Tomorrow I will give you guys a link to NFA trusts, it's on a favorite silencer forum. And it works.
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1) $600 NFA trustit would then be legal to cut on the dotted lines? http://www.nf6x.net/tmp/shotgun2.jpg Assuming this would be legal, would the resulting very short 80 year old POS shotgun then be considered "transferrable" under NFA rules? And would the POS be worth the $900 invested until/unless NFA gets overturned, thus immensely de-valuing it along with all of those $10k Sten tube guns? :) Please forgive me if these are dumb questions. I haven't seen much reason to seriously look into NFA weapons before. |
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