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View Full Version : Carbine or Mid-Length AR15 Upper?


Mezcalfud
03-17-2008, 12:05 AM
I have one of each 16" picked out, and they are equal in price without the bcg. I can not decide on one and can't afford both. I read thad carbine needs the heavier bcg and hbuffer due to short stroking, and is generally rougher on parts? Midlength can run on a standard bcg and has less jump.

This is my first AR15 build and my lower is almost done. LMT and Sabre are quality from what I have seen, so just feedback and experience on the systems is what I can use.

SuperSet
03-17-2008, 12:09 AM
It's not a hard choice.. get the midlength for the reasons you already mentioned.

dfletcher
03-17-2008, 12:16 AM
I'm new to the whole AR build adventure, went with this as a starter.

http://www.model1sales.com/item-detail.cfm?ID=UDE160CL&storeid=1&image=udispre.gif

I got the A3 flat top and a no site gas block only up front. It has the full length gas assembly.

jandmtv
03-17-2008, 12:35 AM
get the midlength

Deadred7o7
03-17-2008, 12:49 AM
Every time I go to Model 1 sales check out I get a page that pops up that says "There is a problem with this website's security certificate." what give is it my puter or their site??

J_Rock
03-17-2008, 1:12 AM
there are no disadvantages to a midlength

aplinker
03-17-2008, 4:03 AM
Heh. Early on, the naysayers claimed the disadvantage was the rarity of midlength gas tubes and handguards.

Not that rare anymore.

How old are you?! ;) Did they make flat-tops back then? :p

There are so many reasons to get mid-length, while the only reason to go carbine is to mimic the M4.

railroader
03-17-2008, 6:55 AM
Mezcalfud, I'm on my 1st build and I had the same questions too. I went with a mid-length because they are suppose to run smoother and they have a longer sight picture. They just look better to me with the longer handguard, more balanced. I also looked at how I shoot mainly. Most of the time I shoot my rifles from a rest so the longer sight picture will be a plus. I ordered my rifle kit from del-ton and should be here thursday. I hate waiting. Mark

Mezcalfud
03-17-2008, 9:29 AM
Midlength it is. Sabre Defence it is.....a bit more $ than some of the others, but I have not seen a negative comment yet. CMMG is a runner up, sounds like they are hit and miss, and some of the comments made make me uncomfortable spending my hard earned money with them.
Thanks all, I am sure I will have more....

Blacktail 8541
03-17-2008, 9:43 AM
Good choice and good company. Sabre is a supplier of barrels to the DOD.

viras
03-17-2008, 10:11 AM
Good choice and good company. Sabre is a supplier of barrels to the DOD.

Lowest Bidder? :p

CrippledPidgeon
03-17-2008, 11:26 AM
Old enough to remember when there were only two versions of the semiautomatic AR15 available in one color from one company.

Ford model AR15?... ;)

aplinker
03-17-2008, 11:53 AM
Wow, and I thought I was just teasing you TascoTed. Now I feel young. :D



While Sabre Defence is an OK company, why not go with LMT, Colt or Noveske for that kind of money?

Mezcalfud
03-17-2008, 12:04 PM
Mezcalfud, I'm on my 1st build and I had the same questions too. I went with a mid-length because they are suppose to run smoother and they have a longer sight picture. They just look better to me with the longer handguard, more balanced. I also looked at how I shoot mainly. Most of the time I shoot my rifles from a rest so the longer sight picture will be a plus. I ordered my rifle kit from del-ton and should be here thursday. I hate waiting. Mark


Being my first AR, not much to use as a gauge. Fired the gov't AR's in the USAF, but other than that, a Garand guy. Found a great seller that has everything I want at very good prices, saving me a substantial amount, but only with the LMT...The frustration comes from finding what I want in one or two places.

FlyingPen
03-17-2008, 12:16 PM
I bought a carbine LMT upper in 14.5 because I wanted an LMT upper and use a VLTOR CASV rail.

I personally don't see any problems at all using a carbine system for civilian use, they see heavy military use in full auto configurations and run just fine. I'm going to balk at bullet prices way before something goes mechanically wrong in the system.

That said, if the CASV and LMT upper was available in mid length, I would have gone with that if it didn't cost any more.

Hopi
03-17-2008, 12:17 PM
Being my first AR, not much to use as a gauge. Fired the gov't AR's in the USAF, but other than that, a Garand guy. Found a great seller that has everything I want at very good prices, saving me a substantial amount, but only with the LMT...The frustration comes from finding what I want in one or two places.

Mmmmmmm, tasty Mezcal. Nothing quite like hitting the bottom and having that worm find a home in your belly.

RECCE556
03-25-2008, 9:08 AM
Sabre is a supplier of barrels to the DOD.
Doesn't mean that they sell the same quality barrel to the commercial sector. Also, they don't supply M16 barrels to the DOD. ;)

mltrading
03-25-2008, 11:24 AM
Doesn't matter to me. My build is without gas system. :D

Frankly, mid-length gas system is a little bit "smoother" than carbine-length one. Why don't you build a carbine-length gas system with adjustable gas block?

ar15barrels
03-25-2008, 12:05 PM
How old are you?! ;) Did they make flat-tops back then? :p

I remember when mid-length gas tubes were hard to get. ;)

ar15barrels
03-25-2008, 12:08 PM
Why don't you build a carbine-length gas system with adjustable gas block?

While that fixes the overall gas problem, the dwell issue is still there and the upper gets finicky.
When dialed-in for hot ammo, wolf ammo may not function.

Mid-length really is the supreme setup for carbines.

RECCE556
03-25-2008, 1:32 PM
I remember when mid-length gas tubes were hard to get. ;)
I remember when there was no such thing as Mid-Length! :)

Mid-length really is the supreme setup for carbines.
+1

I wish the military would adopt mids over carbines so Colt would start making mid-length barrels...but we know what a monumental task it is for the military to just pick a shade of black to use. :) I guess until that happens, I'll be using either Noveskes or custom cut blanks...

aplinker
03-25-2008, 2:17 PM
I remember when there was no such thing as Mid-Length! :)


+1

I wish the military would adopt mids over carbines so Colt would start making mid-length barrels...but we know what a monumental task it is for the military to just pick a shade of black to use. :) I guess until that happens, I'll be using either Noveskes or custom cut blanks...

I sure wouldn't mind Noveske making a 16" N4 with midlength gas...

OutlawDon
03-25-2008, 2:21 PM
I sure wouldn't mind Noveske making a 16" N4 with midlength gas...

Done!

http://noveskerifleworks.com/cgi-bin/imcart/display.cgi?item_id=n4lr&cat=47&page=1&search=&since=&status=

http://noveskerifleworks.com/imimg/n4lr_1d.jpg

aplinker
03-25-2008, 3:24 PM
Yeah, but can I get it without the SWS rail, CMT upper, ??? carrier group...
(yeah, I just want the barrel)

:D

Done!

http://noveskerifleworks.com/cgi-bin/imcart/display.cgi?item_id=n4lr&cat=47&page=1&search=&since=&status=

http://noveskerifleworks.com/imimg/n4lr_1d.jpg

RECCE556
03-25-2008, 3:46 PM
Wes, over at MSTN can build up an upper with whatever parts you want and a N4 barrel. He's the only Noveske dealer that's getting them stripped. I tried but John won't sell me any cuz I'm not a big enough client apparently. No biggie, I have another barrel that will give the higher velocities like PacNor's Polygonal rifling (the blanks that Noveske uses), longer wear and more accuracy. ;)

AxonGap
03-25-2008, 4:09 PM
Absolutely go w/ the Middie, there is no reason why not to get one!

You can also fix a bayonet on it for those occasional zombie encounters!

aplinker
03-25-2008, 4:27 PM
Yeah, I knew MSTN got Noveske barrels, but I'm not willing to pay the $500 privilege charge for having MSTN build my upper.

What barrel are you referring to? That I'd like. Mid-length gas, 16"...?

I'm gathering parts now for a Recce. I still hadn't decided on barrel... was waffling between a few choices... Wanna pro/con the top choices for me so I can stop doing my homework? :D


Wes, over at MSTN can build up an upper with whatever parts you want and a N4 barrel. He's the only Noveske dealer that's getting them stripped. I tried but John won't sell me any cuz I'm not a big enough client apparently. No biggie, I have another barrel that will give the higher velocities like PacNor's Polygonal rifling (the blanks that Noveske uses), longer wear and more accuracy. ;)

RECCE556
03-25-2008, 5:45 PM
discussed via email...