PDA

View Full Version : Help me pick an upper


Born2Lose
03-10-2008, 9:03 PM
Did some searching but it didn't answer all of my specific questions.

I have decided on building a monsterman grip build and i need some advice on what upper to get.

What is the shortest upper i can get with the A2 stock/mm grip?

Does anyone sell the uppers with muzzlebreaks instead of flashhiders?

There is a good sale in the commerical section on CMMG uppers but i see none that have breaks.

Also i don't know the difference between all the socom and m4 and etc cause there are no pictures on the post.

I like the look of the flattop upper with the short handguards but i'm too cheap to buy good optics for it.
I had an AR years ago and i liked the carry handle style sights and was dead on with it..how are the removable carry handles in comparison to the non removable carry handle upper?

What about flip up sights..are those good with a flat top style upper?

Thanks for any input.

damon1272
03-10-2008, 9:55 PM
The shortest over all barrel length is 16". This can be done with a shorter barrel with a permenantly attached muzzle brake.

shark92651
03-10-2008, 10:45 PM
I would recommend a 16" upper and either a muzzle brake (note spelling ;)) or a thread-protector. The reason I would recommend a 16" upper is for flexibility - if you wanted to remove the MMG one day and go with a Bullet Button, you could put a flash-hider back on there with just an adjustable wrench.

A detachable carry handle is just fine, and again offers more flexibility should you decide to remove it later and add optics. Most vendors can install the muzzle brake, forearms, sights, gas-blocks, etc... for you.

If you want to compare CMMG uppers go to their site to see the specs and pictures, and then come back and buy from one of us calguns vendors :D

aplinker
03-10-2008, 11:18 PM
Different profiles are different names... here's an initial primer:

http://ar15barrels.com/profiles.shtml

Hopefully you can understand things like medcon=medium contour, etc...

Unless you know for certain you'll always want it with a brake (featureless build), you should stick with a 16" barrel for flexibility, as Shark said.

On CMMG's website there is a plethora of brake options when you customize.

I'd go for a lighter contour if you're going to be carrying it a lot. For mostly bench shooting, heavier is better. Some length would help too.

ABSOLUTELY get mid-length or longer for the gas system.

jacques
03-10-2008, 11:55 PM
There was a good thread here, I read it when I was trying to figure out the difference in uppers. There are so many options and variations you can sit and study up on it for weeks, like I did. Ultimately, I kept refering back to this reference.

http://forums.officer.com/showthread.php?t=81462

Some of the people on this forum did not like some of the guys comments etc., but if you just stick to the facts, it is informative. I ended up with a CMMG 20" Govt profile flat. I have only been using sights on it so far and it is real accurate. I will be getting a scope soon, and then it will be complete. (U-15 stock).

My next build, I will stick with a CMMG 16" with a bullet button and all the evil features.


I do have a question for anyone that reads this though,

How is a 10 1/5" LMT upper legal? I saw them at CWS at the Ventura gun show last weekend.

aplinker
03-11-2008, 12:10 AM
Permanently attached 10.5" extended flash hider, registered SBR (unlikely in CA) or a pistol build.

There was a good thread here, I read it when I was trying to figure out the difference in uppers. There are so many options and variations you can sit and study up on it for weeks, like I did. Ultimately, I kept refering back to this reference.

http://forums.officer.com/showthread.php?t=81462

Some of the people on this forum did not like some of the guys comments etc., but if you just stick to the facts, it is informative. I ended up with a CMMG 20" Govt profile flat. I have only been using sights on it so far and it is real accurate. I will be getting a scope soon, and then it will be complete. (U-15 stock).

My next build, I will stick with a CMMG 16" with a bullet button and all the evil features.


I do have a question for anyone that reads this though,

How is a 10 1/5" LMT upper legal? I saw them at CWS at the Ventura gun show last weekend.

jacques
03-11-2008, 12:28 AM
Permanently attached 10.5" extended flash hider, registered SBR (unlikely in CA) or a pistol build.

That's what I thought, SBR would be against CA penal code anyway wouldn't it? and it seems too long for a pistol build. I wonder why they bother.

aplinker
03-11-2008, 12:44 AM
That's what I thought, SBR would be against CA penal code anyway wouldn't it? and it seems too long for a pistol build. I wonder why they bother.

I don't understand the 10.5" barrel + 5.5" FH, but I do seem them for sale...

Makes no sense to me. I want usable barrel length.

ar15barrels
03-11-2008, 12:55 AM
I don't understand the 10.5" barrel + 5.5" FH, but I do seem them for sale...

Makes no sense to me. I want usable barrel length.

http://ar15barrels.com/tech/fake115.jpg

jacques
03-11-2008, 1:00 AM
Yeah, this is the LMT I was talkng about.

http://www.coldwarshooters.net/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=17&products_id=369

ar15barrels
03-11-2008, 1:02 AM
Yeah, this is the LMT I was talkng about.

http://www.coldwarshooters.net/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=17&products_id=369

I have that upper in stock for about $50 less AND I can do a permanent attach job before it ships out.

aplinker
03-11-2008, 10:46 AM
http://ar15barrels.com/tech/fake115.jpg

Still looks stupid. :p

Born2Lose
03-11-2008, 6:32 PM
Cool. Thanks for the input guys.
As always you're a wealth of info.

randy
03-12-2008, 1:31 AM
Randall you build some cool stuff. My hats off to you.

htalkomar
03-12-2008, 7:09 PM
There are companies out there that also have 14.5" and 14.7" barrels with permanently attached flash hiders that bring them to 16 inches (the min. req. by Federal Law). Of these CMMG is the best. However, you would need them to custom build one for you using a muzzel break instead of a flash hider, because without a maglock a flash hider is not allowed. If you were building a fixed magazine build, it would not be an issue. Since most of the guys with monsterman grips usually build with a straight barrel, and no muzzel device at all. I would say the normal 16" barreled upper with a post-ban style barrel would be the shortest you could do.

RECCE556
03-12-2008, 10:38 PM
Randall is a little crazy but his work is top notch! ;) If he has what you need, by all means, buy it from him.

Personally, I'm not a fan of CMMG (cough...giffman...cough...5.56-marked-.223-chamber...cough) but that's just me. If I were you, I'd go with a decent quality 16" barrel (Colt [ha...good luck], BCM, etc...), a PWS FSC556 (classified as a muzzle brake by the BATFE and it works well as a flash suppressor...NOT A "HIDER"...no flash suppressor "hides" flash...it just suppresses it.) and a M4 upper of some sort (Colt, Daniel Defense, Vltor, LaRue, etc.). I know I'm talking about expensive parts here but I believe in buying quality (maybe *I'm* crazy?)

Hopi
03-12-2008, 11:10 PM
There are companies out there that also have 14.5" and 14.7" barrels with permanently attached flash hiders that bring them to 16 inches (the min. req. by Federal Law). Of these CMMG is the best. However, you would need them to custom build one for you using a muzzel break instead of a flash hider, because without a maglock a flash hider is not allowed. If you were building a fixed magazine build, it would not be an issue. Since most of the guys with monsterman grips usually build with a straight barrel, and no muzzel device at all. I would say the normal 16" barreled upper with a post-ban style barrel would be the shortest you could do.

I don't know about CMMG being the 'best', but....I have a 14.5" Bushmaster upper with a permanent mb on it to bring her over the 16" mark on my "feature-less" build. I beat her up pretty good, i was marveling at how dirty she is, still goes bang every time I pull the trigger.....probably at around 1500 rounds between 'cleaning' with nothing more than a liberal use of CLP.

Addax
03-12-2008, 11:36 PM
I would recommend a 16" upper and either a muzzle brake (note spelling ;)) or a thread-protector. The reason I would recommend a 16" upper is for flexibility - if you wanted to remove the MMG one day and go with a Bullet Button, you could put a flash-hider back on there with just an adjustable wrench.

A detachable carry handle is just fine, and again offers more flexibility should you decide to remove it later and add optics. Most vendors can install the muzzle brake, forearms, sights, gas-blocks, etc... for you.

If you want to compare CMMG uppers go to their site to see the specs and pictures, and then come back and buy from one of us calguns vendors :D

+1 CMMG, RRA and STAG have a nice selection.

MrLogan
03-12-2008, 11:43 PM
Still looks stupid. :p

I think that looks cool. :D

ar15barrels
03-12-2008, 11:45 PM
Randall is a little crazy but his work is top notch! ;)

Only a little?
Have you seen the demolition derby car?

RECCE556
03-12-2008, 11:57 PM
CMMG, RRA and STAG have a nice selection.
Actually, outside of RRA's LPK's (which are EXCELLENT!), I generally stay away from them (Stag and CMMG in particular).

For me +1 for Colt, BCM, Daniel Defense, LaRue, Vltor, etc. in terms of complete uppers. However, I think custom building your upper with hand picked parts is the way to go. The only "factory" upper I have in my collection is a Colt 6920 upper...everything else is custom configured.

RegularLT1
03-13-2008, 1:23 AM
Another angle to think about when choosing barrel length is the intended use. Obviously, the 20" will have the best range and velocity. There isn't a huge jump from 20 to 16, but there IS a huge loss in velocity when going from 16 to 14.5" barrels. I wish I could find a better reference than this one, but you get the drift.

This is a quote from here:
http://www.btammolabs.com/tests/6.htm


Preliminary experiments show that reliable fragmentation for the rounds will extend to at least 225 meters in 16" weapons. The authors have additional reason to believe (but insufficient data as of yet to make a supported claim) that reliable fragmentation may, in fact, extend out to 250 meters from a 16" barrel and 220 meters from a 14.5" barrel. Testing in this area continues.