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View Full Version : Eotech Knockoffs....


blisster
03-01-2008, 6:33 PM
Anybody here try these things out? I saw an "Eotech 551 Replica" at a gun show today, selling for 160.00. Looked reasonably sturdy and well built. These reasonably decent for casual plinking and recreational target shooting?
I welcome your opinions and experience.

1lostinspace
03-01-2008, 6:39 PM
Anybody here try these things out? I saw an "Eotech 551 Replica" at a gun show today, selling for 160.00. Looked reasonably sturdy and well built. These reasonably decent for casual plinking and recreational target shooting?
I welcome your opinions and experience.

What was the MOA?

aplinker
03-01-2008, 7:08 PM
Worthless. Not an EOTech knockoff

There's no such thing.

It's a red dot in a body made to look like an EOTech. The way EOTech optics work is extremely unique (and VERY expensive to duplicate). I don't expect a true knockoff for a while.

thefinger
03-01-2008, 7:41 PM
I thought I read that there was a Chinese manufacturer that is now making EOtech replicas which actually work like the real thing. But from what I read, the MOA of the center dot isn't the same as the real deal. It may be one of those, or it may be one of the crappy airsoft knockoffs that are just red-dot sights in an EOtech body.

blisster
03-01-2008, 7:56 PM
What was the MOA?

I can't recall.

MrNiceGuy
03-01-2008, 8:05 PM
I don't recommend using airsoft or knockoff stuff on your real gun.
But here's a link to some cheap airsoft stuff that actually works if you're so inclined.

http://www.airsoftvanguard.com/index.php?r=40&p=1&cat0=12&lang=en

chsk9
03-01-2008, 8:06 PM
It has been my experience that you cannot go cheap on optics without regret. Check for used models.

boosterboy
03-01-2008, 8:25 PM
it's a glorified red dot in a different housing.

not a holographic pattern created by multiple laser like the real Eotech.

maxicon
03-01-2008, 9:01 PM
Yep, it's not a holosight.

Nobody's made a holosight copy yet. If you want to pay that much for a red dot that looks like an Eotech, it's OK, but that's as far as it goes.

TKM
03-01-2008, 9:13 PM
With all the money that you save you can go enjoy a nice meal.

The beff and loobster may be to your liking.

blisster
03-01-2008, 9:53 PM
ahh, so it's airsoft crap then. Makes sense. I suppose if I don't want to spend the high $$ for an Eotech, there are better options out there than this.

Thanks all.

aplinker
03-01-2008, 11:56 PM
ahh, so it's airsoft crap then. Makes sense. I suppose if I don't want to spend the high $$ for an Eotech, there are better options out there than this.

Thanks all.

Big money for an EOTech? I see them frequently up for $300-$320 on this board and arfcom, sometimes less for beat up ones.

There are likely to be more of them on the block with the new 516/556 coming out, too.

chsk9
03-02-2008, 12:07 AM
The Trijicon reflex RX09 can be found for about $300 onilne and is a solid, compact sight... I love mine.

ivanimal
03-02-2008, 12:09 AM
MOA = Minute of angle

aplinker
03-02-2008, 1:55 AM
The Trijicon reflex RX09 can be found for about $300 onilne and is a solid, compact sight... I love mine.

The Trijicon reflex, for all practical purposes, is an inferior sight to the EOTech, except in some select cases. It's nice, but it doesn't do what an EOTech does.

jumbopanda
03-02-2008, 3:15 AM
Don't buy cheap knockoff garbage. If you can't afford a real EOTech, go buy a cheaper red dot sight that is in your price range.

saber
03-02-2008, 9:18 AM
I bought one of those knock-off red dot sights and it didn't last through the first shooting session before it crapped out. I ended up saving my money for an Eotech.

If cost is an issue, there are a number of options:

1.) You could go with a used Eotech. That might save you $100-$150 or more off the new price.

2.) You could go with one of the cheaper holosights, like the Bushell holosight. I've seen some of those on sale at Midway and others in the $200 range.

3.) You could also shoot your rifle initially with just the iron sights. If you have an optice, you should at least have some backup sights in case the crap out on you. AR's shoot well with iron sights with minimal effort.

I've just found that cheaper scopes are really a waste because you end up replacing them eventually.

blisster
03-02-2008, 10:34 AM
I bought one of those knock-off red dot sights and it didn't last through the first shooting session before it crapped out. I ended up saving my money for an Eotech.

If cost is an issue, there are a number of options:

1.) You could go with a used Eotech. That might save you $100-$150 or more off the new price.

2.) You could go with one of the cheaper holosights, like the Bushell holosight. I've seen some of those on sale at Midway and others in the $200 range.

3.) You could also shoot your rifle initially with just the iron sights. If you have an optice, you should at least have some backup sights in case the crap out on you. AR's shoot well with iron sights with minimal effort.

I've just found that cheaper scopes are really a waste because you end up replacing them eventually.

yeah, that's what I've been thinking since starting this thread. No sense wasting 150.00 on something that will break, then I'm out the 150 and end up spending another 350-400 on what I really wanted in the first place anyway.

MEU(SOC)
03-02-2008, 12:10 PM
Anybody here try these things out? I saw an "Eotech 551 Replica" at a gun show today, selling for 160.00. Looked reasonably sturdy and well built. These reasonably decent for casual plinking and recreational target shooting?
I welcome your opinions and experience.

At the Cow Palace yesterday I looked at the one in this guy's booth:
http://www.xopticsinc.com

I was very impressed. It's pretty darn close to the real thing. The reticle does in fact float around and move like a real EOTech. The controls are identical, with "NV" color changing from green to red, brightness, and I think it even has an auto off. I have to say, it was nice. It was not a POS red dot like people have said in this thread. It was certainly a valiant effort by the Chinese to copy the EOTech. I don't know what it would look like outdoors in bright sunlight, since I only saw it indoors. He was asking $170 at the show and another vendor had it for $185. Overall, I was impressed. I don't know how it would hold up to recoil or field conditions though. I think the best bet is to get the real EOTech, but if this one could hold up well it's certainly worth the cost if it gets the job done. Might be a good "beater" sight if it can hold up.

The guy also has a lot of AimPoint copies which were better than expected. He was also pimping the Asian made Vector rifle scopes. I didn't bother looking at those.

Conclusion:
If you want a cheaper HALO sight for a .22 or maybe just a beater sight...it could work. I just don't know how it would work in sunlight, what the battery life is, and if it's water resistant. You take a chance if you buy things like this. In the end, it's best to buy a known quality like the genuine EOTech. Best to buy a used one if money is the concern. As another option, look at the Bushnell HALO sight (Chinese made without the protective aluminum cage, but with a warranty/support).

blisster
03-02-2008, 12:16 PM
At the Cow Palace yesterday I looked at the one in this guy's booth:
http://www.xopticsinc.com

I was very impressed. It's pretty darn close to the real thing. The reticle does in fact float around and move like a real EOTech. The controls are identical, with "NV" color changing from green to red, brightness, and I think it even has an auto off. I have to say, it was nice. It was not a POS red dot like people have said in this thread. It was certainly a valiant effort by the Chinese to copy the EOTech. I don't know what it would look like outdoors in bright sunlight, since I only saw it indoors. He was asking $170 at the show and another vendor had it for $185. Overall, I was impressed. I don't know how it would hold up to recoil or field conditions though. I think the best bet is to get the real EOTech, but if this one could hold up well it's certainly worth the cost if it gets the job done. Might be a good "beater" sight if it can hold up.

The guy also has a lot of AimPoint copies which were better than expected. He was also pimping the Asian made Vector rifle scopes. I didn't bother looking at those.

Conclusion:
If you want a cheaper HALO sight for a .22 or maybe just a beater sight...it could work. I just know how it would work in sunlight, what the battery life is, and if it's water resistant. You take a chance if you buy things like this. In the end, it's best to buy a known quality like the genuine EOTech. Best to buy a used one if money is the concern. As another option, look at the Bushnell HALO sight (EOTech made without the protective aluminum cage).

yeah, those are the exact ones I was checking out.

MEU(SOC)
03-02-2008, 12:20 PM
yeah, those are the exact ones I was checking out.

Correction on my part. The Bushnell HALO site is probably Chinese made just like the fake EOTech we saw but it has a warranty and support network since it's Bushnell. I had said it was EOTech made, which was wrong. It's Chinese with a Bushnell label.

MrNiceGuy
03-02-2008, 12:26 PM
+1 on what MEU said.

I have a real 552 for my real guns and a knockoff 552 for an airsoft G36C (since I can't have a real one in Kali).
Just for kicks I put the knockoff on my M1A and took it to the range.
The fake 552 "dot" works just like the real 552.
I moved my cheek off the stock (on purpose, just to test the holo dot) and had to look off center at the sight (but still can see the dot), squeezed off 10 rounds, all landed where the dot was pointed at (and where I intended to aim at).
HOWEVER, after 20 rounds of so, ALL the screws came loose on the fake 552, they were falling to the ground, literally (but .308 have more "kick").

So the conclusion (for me anyway):
The fake 552 (that I have) works like the real thing.
Will it hold zero indefinetly like a real 552?
Probably NOT.
I won't use it in situations where me life depended on it.
I might uses it on a .22 or a beater low caliber/recoil rifle, that's it.

Incidentally, the fake dot was "crisper" at the range that day (sunny day but under the shade) compared to my real 552.
But that's expected since the fake 552 projects a solid image as oppose to the real 552 projecting a very slight "fuzzy" image by design.

FlyingPen
03-02-2008, 2:26 PM
If the screws are backing out, couldn't you just get better screws/mount or just use a tiny dab of locktite?

aplinker
03-02-2008, 2:57 PM
The Bushnell HOLOSight is not junk. It has the same core functionality as an EOTech as it's made by EOTech on license.

It lacks some features and armoring.

IMHO, wait for an EOTech to come up on the board for about $320.

EOTechs don't project a fuzzy image by design, but rather it's an artifact of the fact they use coherent light.

HALO = an XBox game. Holo = holography = EOTech. ;)

Correction on my part. The Bushnell HALO site is probably Chinese made just like the fake EOTech we saw but it has a warranty and support network since it's Bushnell. I had said it was EOTech made, which was wrong. It's Chinese with a Bushnell label.

MrNiceGuy
03-02-2008, 4:10 PM
If the screws are backing out, couldn't you just get better screws/mount or just use a tiny dab of locktite?

I guess you can locktite the screws.
But don't expect for the knockoff to hold zero indefinetly, especially not with bigger recoil guns.

Bottom line is I know the knockoff works like a my real one (I've tested it out) but I won't use it in real life since I can't trust it like I trust my real one.

FlyingPen
03-02-2008, 4:14 PM
Yeah, i definitely would opt for the best if I my life was on the line but if the unit doesn't break, I don't see why you wouldn't use one on the range. Can you tell us where you got yours?

eguns-com
03-02-2008, 4:23 PM
Correction on my part. The Bushnell HALO site is probably Chinese made just like the fake EOTech we saw but it has a warranty and support network since it's Bushnell. I had said it was EOTech made, which was wrong. It's Chinese with a Bushnell label.

Actually the Bushnell Holosight IS an EO Tech. It is the older commercial EO Tech made for Bushnell. They even used to be listed on the old EO Tech website before L3 took over if I remember correctly. The Bushnell one is an older version without the metal hood etc (ie, not military or leo tough).

It is possible that Bushnell has taken the license for them and is manufacturing them in China, I don't know, but it is a real EO Tech and not a Chinese knock off made for Bushnell.

Chad

MEU(SOC)
03-02-2008, 6:47 PM
Actually the Bushnell Holosight IS an EO Tech.

Chad

Damn, so I was right to begin with! Doh!

MEU(SOC)
03-02-2008, 6:52 PM
HALO = an XBox game. Holo = holography = EOTech. ;)

I'm aware of that. I refer to them as a halo sight because of the reticle geometry, which is a halo ring around a dot. I guess it's a matter of terms. I call a helicopter a Helo, while others call them birds, choppers or copters (smack!). ;)

MrNiceGuy
03-02-2008, 8:14 PM
Can you tell us where you got yours?


See page 1, post #6 :)

redcliff
03-02-2008, 9:42 PM
The Bushnell Holosight pioneered the way for Eotech's products in America. It was the 1996 Shooting Industry Optic of the Year. Certainly the current Eotechs are substantially improved over Bushnells product, which was made by Eotech afterall, but it's not that bad of a sight. Some people, like me, have original Holosights from 1996 that still work fine at the range.

maxicon
03-03-2008, 1:51 PM
Both the Bushnell and the Eotech holosights are made in the same L3 factory, using the same technology. They're not made in China.

The Bushnell is the pre Rev F version of the Eotech, with lower battery life and less brightness range. It's also missing the hood.

The name "holosight" comes from the holographic laser technology used for the reticle, not because the reticle has a "halo" around the central dot. If you look at the reticle in the Chinese knockoffs, you'll see there is no laser speckle there (the "fuzziness" referred to). They're basic LED sights, not laser-based holographic sights - it's an entirely different technology.

If you want an LED red dot sight that looks like an Eotech for $160+, the knockoffs are the thing for you, but realize you are just getting a 2 color Chinese red dot sight, all dressed up. I wouldn't pay half of that for one, but that's because you can get good, name brand red dot sights for less.

aplinker
03-03-2008, 2:16 PM
100% agree :D

I'll again add that a real EOTech 511 can be picked up here or on the EE for $280 for LNIB or less for a beat up one.

Both the Bushnell and the Eotech holosights are made in the same L3 factory, using the same technology. They're not made in China.

The Bushnell is the pre Rev F version of the Eotech, with lower battery life and less brightness range. It's also missing the hood.

The name "holosight" comes from the holographic laser technology used for the reticle, not because the reticle has a "halo" around the central dot. If you look at the reticle in the Chinese knockoffs, you'll see there is no laser speckle there (the "fuzziness" referred to). They're basic LED sights, not laser-based holographic sights - it's an entirely different technology.

If you want an LED red dot sight that looks like an Eotech for $160+, the knockoffs are the thing for you, but realize you are just getting a 2 color Chinese red dot sight, all dressed up. I wouldn't pay half of that for one, but that's because you can get good, name brand red dot sights for less.

palakaboy
03-03-2008, 2:18 PM
100% agree :D

I'll again add that a real EOTech 511 can be picked up here or on the EE for $280 for LNIB or less for a beat up one.

WHERE?!

GenLee
03-03-2008, 3:04 PM
Why has no one mentioned the Burris FastFire, while on this topic? Ive been researching them and at 170.00 burris has always been ggod stuff? any input?

blisster
03-03-2008, 3:17 PM
100% agree :D

I'll again add that a real EOTech 511 can be picked up here or on the EE for $280 for LNIB or less for a beat up one.

What's EE?

Patriot
03-03-2008, 3:19 PM
What's EE?

I'll hazard a guess that it's ar15.com's Equipment Exchange (?)

aplinker
03-03-2008, 3:21 PM
What's EE?

arfcom equipment exchange.

I'm not doing your deals search for you :p

Here's a 512 that went for $200
http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=7&f=23&t=520904

this board is helpful:
http://www.elitedealseeker.com/?category=gunstuff

blisster
03-03-2008, 3:23 PM
arfcom equipment exchange.

I'm not doing your deals search for you :p

Here's a 512 that went for $200
http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=7&f=23&t=520904

this board is helpful:
http://www.elitedealseeker.com/?category=gunstuff

lol, I can do my own searches, just didn't know what EE was :p

Thanks for the tips!

FlyingPen
03-03-2008, 3:52 PM
What's the advantage of the EOTech laser vs. a standard red dot?

aplinker
03-03-2008, 4:11 PM
What's the advantage of the EOTech laser vs. a standard red dot?

search! This has been covered extensively, ad nauseum, repeatedly.

EOTech technology needs a coherent light source, i.e., laser.

JohnJW
03-03-2008, 5:46 PM
Anybody here try these things out? I saw an "Eotech 551 Replica" at a gun show today, selling for 160.00. Looked reasonably sturdy and well built. These reasonably decent for casual plinking and recreational target shooting?
I welcome your opinions and experience.

Is it a "replica" or is that just a polite way of saying counterfeit?

Crazed_SS
03-04-2008, 7:30 AM
Actually the Bushnell Holosight IS an EO Tech. It is the older commercial EO Tech made for Bushnell. They even used to be listed on the old EO Tech website before L3 took over if I remember correctly. The Bushnell one is an older version without the metal hood etc (ie, not military or leo tough).

It is possible that Bushnell has taken the license for them and is manufacturing them in China, I don't know, but it is a real EO Tech and not a Chinese knock off made for Bushnell.

Chad

I have the Bushnell Holosight here.. http://www.bushnell.com/general/riflescopes_holosight_51-0023.cfm

On the bottom it says, "Made in the USA for exclusively for Bushnell Sports Optics World Wide"

maxicon
03-04-2008, 11:02 AM
lol, I can do my own searches, just didn't know what EE was :p

Thanks for the tips!

To find the hot deals on the EE, you have to camp there. The good stuff, like a $200 Eotech, tends to go in minutes, rather than hours. I've gotten great deals there when I have the time to focus on it.

Is it a "replica" or is that just a polite way of saying counterfeit?

There are several levels of copies. It's a grey area, but these are the rough distinctions.

A counterfeit is a fake that's labeled like the real thing, and can be hard to tell from the real thing if you're not familiar with them. They may or may not be close copies (usually are not), and are becoming an increasingly large problem in the optics world. These infringe on trademarks, and the trademark owner can sue and get legal help at suppressing them.

A clone is a very close copy of the real thing that attempts to duplicate the actual design and workings, and may infringe on patents. Sometimes they're counterfeits too, and sometimes are unmarked or marked differently. These aren't all that common, but there are some out there.

A look-alike is an optic that looks like something else, but works differently. These are the most common, and many people buy them if they want to look tactical without spending the money. They generally don't work the same, but may or may not be functionally similar. The Eotech look-alike functions similarly to the real thing (it's got a similar reticle and is used similarly), but doesn't work the same (LED vs. laser), while the Acog look-alikes generally don't function the same (most are not magnified).

The Eotech knock-off is a look-alike, unless it's got Eotech markings, in which case it's a counterfeit.

jandmtv
03-04-2008, 11:10 AM
the bushnell holosight is not made by bushnell, it is made by eotech for bushnell, i have the xlp version of the bushnell holosight (low profile version) im still on my first set of AAA batteries. if you are looking for a low cost holosight, get the bushnell, and stay away from the fake stuff.

like others said, the only thing thats different with the bushnell holosight is that it does not have the hard shell on it. so if you plan on dropping your rifle anytime soon, then get the real eotech. otherwise the bushnell is a great buy.

maxicon
03-04-2008, 11:20 AM
Why has no one mentioned the Burris FastFire, while on this topic? Ive been researching them and at 170.00 burris has always been ggod stuff? any input?

The FastFire's a good bit smaller, and doesn't have the same FOV as the Eotech, and tends to wash out more easily in certain situations, according to reports. Their strength is that they're small and light, so make good handgun optics or piggyback CQB optics on magnified scopes.

I'm not sure where the FastFire is made, but I wouldn't be surprised if it's China or Korea. Like most electronic sights from traditional scope vendors, it doesn't get the lifetime warranty of the regular scopes, but only has 1 year. Due to the auto-brightness feature, they can flicker or shut down in very low light, but there aren't a lot of reports out on how low it has to be before it's a problem.

It does look like one of the better deals in the mini red dot market, and I wouldn't mind running one through its paces.