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View Full Version : Idea for Bullet Button Modification (no, not that kind) FOR SPEED!


aplinker
02-22-2008, 6:29 PM
As usual, I give up all my good ideas before I actually build them.

I'm still working on the Choco-15. I realized the grip/triggerguard part is all just machining and have been messing with ways to keep a good feeling, nice trigger.

But anyways, on to the newer stuff....

So one issue I have with the BB is that it takes some effort to find the little hole to insert tool. Like many others I built a ring device, a retractable bullet, etc. etc etc.

The problem still comes down to having to look away from the target to find the little hole.

I came up with the following idea when I was staring at a BBI that sticks way out (it's in a Carbon lower and not to the bottom, but STUCK) and thought, "Hey it sure would be nice if it were easier to find the hole."

So think BB + this :43:
http://www.subtraction.com/pics/0305/030506_elizabethan_collar.jpg


Here's my "add-on" "Bullet Button Funnel" schematic the blue being the BB in cross-section
It would attach with a set-screw (or two). Only one is shown in the diagram.
http://i187.photobucket.com/albums/x82/uclaplinker/image003.gifhttp://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g52/elrojo14/BBvBB.jpg

In the end I think it might be easier to just machine a funnel with a BB neck at the bottom.


After looking at the shape of the AR lower a few more times, I think it would be easier to just machine the funnel

http://i187.photobucket.com/albums/x82/uclaplinker/image005.gif

I'll see how it goes.

Stanze
02-22-2008, 6:39 PM
Looks like someone with a small pinky finger and/or long skinny finger nail still might be able to work it. I'd test it first.

aplinker
02-22-2008, 6:52 PM
Looks like someone with a small pinky finger and/or long skinny finger nail still might be able to work it. I'd test it first.

There's no modification from the design of the current BB, except the "funnel."

I'm not looking at reinventing the wheel, just making it faster to find the button.

rksimple
02-22-2008, 6:55 PM
Looks interesting. Like a flared magwell and such. Cool idea.

aplinker
02-22-2008, 7:00 PM
Looks interesting. Like a flared magwell and such. Cool idea.

Yeah, exactly. I just want something so I don't have to search for the button.

Riodog
02-22-2008, 7:47 PM
Could you splain to us dummies why it is so important that you find the button post haste? Tell us, do you really think that your ability to change mags in 2 seconds instead of three is going to save your young as* in the next civil uprising?

SCRATCHING MY HEAD THINKING ABOUT THIS...

While the Bulletbutton is a convenience for sure, by utilizing this convenience at your local range it's just going to draw attention to what you're shooting and sooner or later some a-hole is gonna say let's enact a new law that outlaws BULLETBUTTONS.

If you're just out shootin bunnies and can't hit um with 10 then you don't need to concentrate on your mag changes but on your shooting.
JMHO, go for it flamers,
Rio

JagerTroop
02-22-2008, 8:12 PM
Quick mag change for competition

Riodog
02-22-2008, 8:22 PM
Darn, why didn't i think of that!!!:D
Rio

hntnnut
02-22-2008, 8:45 PM
I LIKE!!!!!!!!


Richard

aplinker
02-22-2008, 8:58 PM
Yes and also it would allow a more positive feedback "feel" without having to look at the gun.

Drawing attention at the range? Who is really worried about that? If your rifle is legal, your rifle is legal. PERIOD.

Quick mag change for competition

CALI-gula
02-23-2008, 8:35 AM
....is that it takes some effort to find the little hole to insert tool.



Hehehehehe.... :D

I think the funnel concept is a great idea, and may be the key in getting me to change from my adherence to Monster Man Grip only builds. It would make the bullet button such an easier device to use - you would not even need to look much as to where the button is - probably not even need to take you eye off your sights. Putting the bullet tip in the apporximate area and hit home. If deep enough, you wouldn't be able to use a finger, finger-nail, or small penis for that matter. It's a brilliant improvement!

.

tenpercentfirearms
02-23-2008, 8:57 AM
LOL. I was just thinking about this exact thing the other day! Its like we have a Bruin sixth sense. I will talk to Prince about it. The key is to just have a larger hole to guide the tool into, but have the standard BB I depth. Some of you wouldnt mind the added material to the rifle and some of you won't like it. Let's do it.

aplinker
02-23-2008, 9:07 AM
:D

Sweet. Exactly. Some will love it, some will hate it, some won't understand, but I think it would be a nice addition to be able to drop without having to LOOK for that hole.

LOL. I was just thinking about this exact thing the other day! Its like we have a Bruin sixth sense. I will talk to Prince about it. The key is to just have a larger hole to guide the tool into, but have the standard BB I depth. Some of you wouldnt mind the added material to the rifle and some of you won't like it. Let's do it.

I still love my other idea even more, though. This would make a nice, easy change to increase usability. It's incremental.

It's definitely a Bruin thing. We're never ok with "good enough."

ivanimal
02-23-2008, 9:21 AM
:D

Sweet. Exactly. Some will love it, some will hate it, some won't understand, but I think it would be a nice addition to be able to drop without having to LOOK for that hole.



I still love my other idea even more, though. This would make a nice, easy change to increase usability. It's incremental.

It's definitely a Bruin thing. We're never ok with "good enough."

Too bad the football team doesn't think that way.:p:D:D:p

aplinker
02-23-2008, 9:47 AM
Too bad the football team doesn't think that way.:p:D:D:p

We have a new coach now.

Our b-ball team is OK ;)

Not to mention our aggregate number of national championships in all sports is untouched.

gn3hz3ku1*
02-23-2008, 9:50 AM
i am also a bruin and i was also thinking about that... why? because its perfectly legal and i dont lose sight.. why didnt i post it? well because i am ashamed to admit i havent hit the range in more than 6 month.. 3 guns i havent even shot yet... wata loser!

aplinker
02-23-2008, 10:06 AM
You must have visited SC at some point in the past 6 months to have become such a loser. We will forgive you. You will need to go to Maloney's to watch their next BBall game and get buzzed up enough that you can only stumble over to Diddy Reese for a cookie sandwich.

That is your penance. Now go in peace, my child.

i am also a bruin and i was also thinking about that... why? because its perfectly legal and i dont lose sight.. why didnt i post it? well because i am ashamed to admit i havent hit the range in more than 6 month.. 3 guns i havent even shot yet... wata loser!

It's not a real revolutionary idea. It's just, "Hey I don't like this. We should change it."

bohoki
02-23-2008, 10:56 AM
why not just glue a super magnet to a ring and use it to pull the mag catch from the other side

ChrisSig
02-23-2008, 11:11 AM
why not just glue a super magnet to a ring and use it to pull the mag catch from the other side

Brilliant, I like it. Maybe sewn it into the palm of your left hand glove?

aplinker
02-23-2008, 11:12 AM
Anything that "attaches" itself to the rifle, no matter how impermanent, would not make me comfortable to use.

I'm not sure any of the rare earth "supermagnets" could hold that much, either. The force required for the mag catch is pretty high. The best magnets I know of do a few pounds. in a size that equates with the mag catch.

big50_1
02-23-2008, 11:18 AM
While I understand the concept behind this and really, really, applaud the inventive tinkering since I've ripped car engines apart and understand easier is better, I am in the process of building a featureless rifle to not deal with a bullet button (which I have). So, I'm getting a flashhiderless (if that's a word?) barrel and monsterman grip. So if I want (and I don't) a rip-shortin' fast mag. change, I can play with Magpuls on 10/20 mags and practice...practice...practice until it becomes second nature on my featureless rifle.

shark92651
02-23-2008, 3:02 PM
If you were willing to cut down the mag catch, you could create a drop-in kit that is flush with the receiver that then funnels down to the catch. Then you could even drag your "tool" accross the receiver in the area (easy to do from muscle memory, or using fingertips as probe) until it just drops in.

AJAX22
02-23-2008, 3:10 PM
Here's my "add-on" "Bullet Button Funnel" schematic the blue being the BB in cross-section
It would attach with a set-screw (or two). Only one is shown in the diagram.
http://i187.photobucket.com/albums/x82/uclaplinker/image003.gifhttp://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g52/elrojo14/BBvBB.jpg

In the end I think it might be easier to just machine a funnel with a BB neck at the bottom.


After looking at the shape of the AR lower a few more times, I think it would be easier to just machine the funnel



I'll see how it goes.
I dont know why y'all have trouble finding the button.

I used to bullseye whomp rats in my T-6 back home.... ;)

seriously though, its a good idea.

AJAX22
02-23-2008, 3:11 PM
Here's my "add-on" "Bullet Button Funnel" schematic the blue being the BB in cross-section
It would attach with a set-screw (or two). Only one is shown in the diagram.
http://i187.photobucket.com/albums/x82/uclaplinker/image003.gif

In the end I think it might be easier to just machine a funnel with a BB neck at the bottom.


After looking at the shape of the AR lower a few more times, I think it would be easier to just machine the funnel



I'll see how it goes.
I dont know why y'all have trouble finding the button.

I used to bullseye whomp rats in my T-6 back home.... ;)

seriously though, its a good idea.

bohoki
02-24-2008, 10:08 AM
I dont know why y'all have trouble finding the button.

I used to bullseye whomp rats in my T-6 back home.... ;)

seriously though, its a good idea.

i think the same thing when i see people trying to sell them mag funnels (they call them "magwells" which is lame since it already has a well)

gn3hz3ku1*
02-24-2008, 10:59 AM
haha your right... I was there last monthYou must have visited SC at some point in the past 6 months to have become such a loser. We will forgive you. You will need to go to Maloney's to watch their next BBall game and get buzzed up enough that you can only stumble over to Diddy Reese for a cookie sandwich.

That is your penance. Now go in peace, my child.



It's not a real revolutionary idea. It's just, "Hey I don't like this. We should change it."

Chunky_lover
02-25-2008, 7:40 AM
Too bad they cant keep real shooting ranges exempt from the removable mag thing. Then if your in a competition you can use all the evil features except high cap mags. Maybe like a day permit you can buy from the range thats registered through the government, I bet the ranges would get alot more business.

Breadfan
02-25-2008, 8:08 AM
thats cool

tenpercentfirearms
02-25-2008, 9:46 PM
This project has officially started. Expect results in about...two weeks!

Plus a little extra toy I thought up a while back, but just let slip through the cracks has been revived. I hope to release it along with this. They are related so no wild guesses.

All your base are belong to us. :TFH:

JagerTroop
02-25-2008, 10:15 PM
This project has officially started. Expect results in about...two weeks!

Plus a little extra toy I thought up a while back, but just let slip through the cracks has been revived. I hope to release it along with this. They are related so no wild guesses.

All your base are belong to us. :TFH:

Uh Oh! :eek: This seems all too familiar. Just tell us what it is, so we don't get another 80 page thread of people guessing, only to be let down (Not that another OLL is a letdown... you know what I mean ;))

aplinker
02-25-2008, 10:26 PM
I get the 1st one, right? :D

This project has officially started. Expect results in about...two weeks!

Plus a little extra toy I thought up a while back, but just let slip through the cracks has been revived. I hope to release it along with this. They are related so no wild guesses.

All your base are belong to us. :TFH:

tenpercentfirearms
02-26-2008, 5:23 AM
I get the 1st one, right? :D

Yes and probably at a discount too.

MEU(SOC)
03-07-2008, 9:40 PM
If any individual or business needs some mechanical design help, let me know. I do it for living. So, I can whip up any widget in SolidWorks, Pro/ENGINEER, AutoCAD, etc. No, I'm not doing lower billet receivers for people. :D

So if any of you think of innovative parts like this, send me a PM and I'll see what I can do to help.

aplinker
03-07-2008, 9:49 PM
If any individual or business needs some mechanical design help, let me know. I do it for living. So, I can whip up any widget in SolidWorks, Pro/ENGINEER, AutoCAD, etc. No, I'm not doing lower billet receivers for people. :D

So if any of you think of innovative parts like this, send me a PM and I'll see what I can do to help.

Darin (Prince50) is taking care of this one.

I have another something... my CAD program is crap and I don't have time to finish the full dimensions. I'll drop you a PM.

Army
03-08-2008, 7:24 AM
May I suggest the names of:

"Bullet Bucket" or..
"Bucket Button"


....or not :D

CrippledPidgeon
03-08-2008, 2:34 PM
Yea, that funnel idea, and something like this with a bullet shaped tip (http://www.warriorjewelry.com/armorrings.htm) would solve all our problems :P

aplinker
03-08-2008, 10:12 PM
I wanted to make sure the home-brewed implementation of this got added to the thread (nice work WhiteDingo!).

The commercial version (BBIII) is allegedly in the works by P50 and 10%.

After some thinking (and attempting reloads with my "BB Glove"), I decided that having some sort of funnel to lead my middle finger (can't reall have the tool on the trigger finger, now can we?) to the correct area for the mag release would really help me get the hang of actuating the bullet button. So I set about to build one.

I had some 1 3/4" diameter solid PVC rod sitting about from a vortex bb gun project I had done a few years back, and I though to myself: "That would be perfect for a prototype of my idea". I didn't really draw anything out, per se, I just kinda imagined what I wanted in my head.

I used the "fence" on the lower for a sizing guide, and cut a piece of PVC that was approximately that size and just under 1/2" thick. Using my dremel (with the full round milling/cutting bit), I routed out one face of the PVC to slide onto the bullet button. It was a little sloppy, not the greatest fit in the world, but it would get me in the general ballpark.

Having the bullet button in place on the PVC allowed me to mark w/ a punch where I needed the actual "hole" in the PVC to be. I found the appropriate sized drill bit (1/4"), and drilled the hole from the routed side, outwards. After this, I took a 1/2" drill bit, and countersunk the hole on the outboard side of the funnel (this gave me a starting point for the actual funnel shape). I used a pointed milling bit on my dremel to get the actual shape of the funnel the way I liked it, then used a sanding/grinding bit to smooth it out.

Turns out, the funnel itself was too tall, so I had to file down the front face so that my glove/tool would actuate the BB properly. It took about 15 minutes of trial and error to get the funnel to the correct height that it would actuate the BB all the time.

Once this step was completed, I drilled and tapped two holes, the upper and left hand sides of the funnel, and used #6-32 set screws to hold the unit in place.

It's quick and kinda dirty, but it works. Good starting point for someone else to make a nicer version, no? :)
And before anyone asks, yes, you still need to use some sort of tool to actuate the BB, there's no way you can do it with your finger (after all, all this does is sit on top of the BB).

Well, here's a picture of what my finished product looks like. It's not the prettiest thing in the world.

http://img112.imageshack.us/img112/3734/img1775lv2.jpg



I knew I couldn't have come up with it on my own! I was thinking I had seen this idea somewhere, heh.

Oh, here's a video of it in use. I could still use some practice, but it's faster than having to grab a tool! I may need to smooth up the nub on the glove though, so that it doesn't get snagged

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v103/whitedingo/th_AR15BBFunnel_0003.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v103/whitedingo/?action=view&current=AR15BBFunnel_0003.flv)

http://www.truetip.com/graphics/SVT_90.jpg

mrjones98
03-24-2008, 10:06 AM
The commercial version (BBIII) is allegedly in the works by P50 and 10%.


When could one expect to purchase this alleged BBIII?

aplinker
03-24-2008, 12:48 PM
When could one expect to purchase this alleged BBIII?

When I was at Wes' shop a couple weeks ago he 1/2 expected to see them in a shipment, but it looks like it hasn't happened yet.

Unless Prince50 decides to say a specific day, we'll just have to be patient.

cmaynes
03-24-2008, 1:24 PM
This is a little wacky but...


There is a Nintendo- (yes THAT Nintendo) little finger cap game stylus that is a perfect fit for the BBmk1- it fits onto your finger- (I use my second finger) that will allow you to drop the mag pretty quickly- It takes a little getting used to, but it is cheap and effective...

It comes in a blisterpack with 2 regular gameboy stylus's-

and no I am not a Nintendo person- my kids turned me on to it...


they have them at circuit city...


cm

tenpercentfirearms
03-24-2008, 8:51 PM
There will be no BBIII. It will be called something else. I am just waiting for Darin. I guess he leads a busy life. Whatever. :rolleyes:

aplinker
03-24-2008, 9:38 PM
There will be no BBIII. It will be called something else. I am just waiting for Darin. I guess he leads a busy life. Whatever. :rolleyes:

What you say? Someone set up us the button?

You mean Darin doesn't just surf Calguns, make bullet buttons and shoot 50's all day, every day?

The Gunslinger
03-25-2008, 10:26 AM
This is a little wacky but...


There is a Nintendo- (yes THAT Nintendo) little finger cap game stylus that is a perfect fit for the BBmk1- it fits onto your finger- (I use my second finger) that will allow you to drop the mag pretty quickly- It takes a little getting used to, but it is cheap and effective...

It comes in a blisterpack with 2 regular gameboy stylus's-

and no I am not a Nintendo person- my kids turned me on to it...


they have them at circuit city...


cm

How about this...I made this out of a chunck of scrap plastic at work and had it molded and cast out of urethane material...first proto..more to come: Thinking of doing an overmolded soft rubberband for better fit. As it is, it is a very rigid material. It works very well especially when used with a funnel typ bullet button cover...Cheers!


http://img170.imageshack.us/my.php?image=92920428pw5.jpg


http://http://img170.imageshack.us/img170/3462/79358966kf4.th.jpg (http://img170.imageshack.us/my.php?image=79358966kf4.jpg)

aplinker
03-25-2008, 10:39 AM
Doesn't that interfere with your trigger feel/activation? Moving it to the middle finger might work, but then you still have the issue that it's going to be in an awkward position for your grip.

I'd suggest something that's out the fingertip, like those stylus tips up above. http://www.truetip.com/graphics/SVT_90.jpg That wouldn't interfere with the trigger finger, which is the most natural one to use for the mag release.

How about this...I made this out of a chunck of scrap plastic at work and had it molded and cast out of urethane material...first proto..more to come: Thinking of doing an overmolded soft rubberband for better fit. As it is, it is a very rigid material. It works very well especially when used with a funnel typ bullet button cover...Cheers!


http://img170.imageshack.us/my.php?image=92920428pw5.jpg


http://http://img170.imageshack.us/img170/3462/79358966kf4.th.jpg (http://img170.imageshack.us/my.php?image=79358966kf4.jpg)

The Gunslinger
03-25-2008, 10:47 AM
I thought it might, but when I tried it it work rather well...I put it about to the first knucle and when firing I use just the pad of my trigger finger. It is also kinda kool because it feels almost like you would naturally depress the mag release with your index finger. Let me know I could send you one and you could give it a try let me know what you think...

mrjones98
05-02-2008, 8:40 AM
Any updates on the funnel idea?

The Gunslinger
05-02-2008, 9:23 AM
I've got one in the works..for personal use..when I get some pics or a vid I'll put it out there...Cheers!!

l_Z_l
05-02-2008, 9:51 AM
1+ mo w/o updates...looks like it kinda died...

aplinker
05-02-2008, 3:09 PM
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?p=1050146#post1050146

he posted videos and nice pics of his own version...

I don't know what's happened to the Prince version of this... Vaporware?