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View Full Version : Grisham arrested again in TX for OC of antique firearm


Ninety
11-12-2013, 2:51 PM
http://bearingarms.com/open-carry-texas-protest-at-state-capitol-on-veterans-day-ends-in-arrests/

Open Carry Texas President C.J. Grisham is turning into a gun rights Kardashian, and canít seem to to help from thrusting himself into the spotlight.

Perhaps best known nationwide for his AR-15 open carry case in Temple, TX that ended in a hung jury (a retrial is pending), he was recently arrested for carrying a blackpowder revolver at the Texas State Capitol during a protest in what appears on the surface to be an illegal arrest. Open Carry Texas claims that under Texas law, it is not illegal to carry antique firearms in public. Texas State troopers obviously have a different opinion.

He was also arrested again but while carrying a toy gun , but on trespassing charges..

Texas is getting interesting .. Democrats are trying to change that state into a blue state.

a1c
11-12-2013, 2:53 PM
Play stupid games...

CAL.BAR
11-12-2013, 2:56 PM
Absolutely inevitable! Even in TX. Cities grow into megalopolises whose residents fear firearms and slowly outnumber the rural inhabitants who don't. We saw it in WA, OR and CO. Same thing in TX. Right now I'll bet that more than half of the population lives in a large urban city and has no interest/regard for firearms.

stix213
11-12-2013, 4:24 PM
If we lose Texas, we risk losing everything nationally, gun rights wise. This is a bigger issue than many would think.

a1c
11-12-2013, 4:52 PM
If we lose Texas, we risk losing everything nationally, gun rights wise. This is a bigger issue than many would think.

Agreed. So the last thing we need are self-righteous OC hotheads who are going to spoil it for the rest of gun owners.

big jim
11-12-2013, 5:29 PM
:rolleyes:Everyone should stop speaking up about anything the government does. This will cause them to limit our first amendment rights. Darn hotheads ruining it for all of us:rolleyes:

Tanner68
11-12-2013, 5:35 PM
If we lose Texas, we risk losing everything nationally, gun rights wise. This is a bigger issue than many would think.

Texas is lost. It will be a blue state soon. Just give it a little time. And then we will be really screwed.

bodger
11-12-2013, 5:38 PM
Texas is lost. It will be a blue state soon. Just give it a little time. And then we will be really screwed.

That's a depressing thought. What is happening is Colorado is depressing too. I used to live there, it was as pro-gun as anywhere I can think of back in those days.

SonofWWIIDI
11-12-2013, 6:16 PM
I'm saddened by the news about Texas in general. :(






IBFP
IBDE
IBSL7

morfeeis
11-12-2013, 8:23 PM
Play stupid games...
How is abiding by the law stupid? just because you don't agree with something doesn't make it equal to " stupid games". Funny how you and the people that pass anti freedom laws hold the same view.

correct me if i'm wrong but didn't someone from Washington dc get put in the tx legal system some how? Someone on the federal level? Isn't it the same person responsible for all the anti OC crap? something i read a while back but cant recall the details....

wjc
11-12-2013, 8:40 PM
http://bearingarms.com/open-carry-texas-protest-at-state-capitol-on-veterans-day-ends-in-arrests/



He was also arrested again but while carrying a toy gun , but on trespassing charges..

Texas is getting interesting .. Democrats are trying to change that state into a blue state.

This is true. Freedomworks has a program to fight this.

Check their site.

a1c
11-13-2013, 9:06 AM
How is abiding by the law stupid? just because you don't agree with something doesn't make it equal to " stupid games". Funny how you and the people that pass anti freedom laws hold the same view.

correct me if i'm wrong but didn't someone from Washington dc get put in the tx legal system some how? Someone on the federal level? Isn't it the same person responsible for all the anti OC crap? something i read a while back but cant recall the details....

Just because something is legal doesn't mean you should do it for no good reason other than get publicity, and take the inevitable risk to see more gun control legislation be the result of your actions.

Haven't we learned anything from the self-righteous, misguided OC movement in California?

This is politics. It's a dangerous game. Do you want to be right, or do you want to win? Because there is little satisfaction or point in losing even if you're right.

cr250chevy
11-13-2013, 9:27 AM
With Texas falling, it further supports my belief that federal preemption is our only savior. Once all states adopt the same laws, those laws will be viewed as "common" and "normal" and thus adopted at the federal level down the road. It's only a matter of time unless we stop it in its tracks.
Some in more free states fear this idea will lead to more 2A restrictions in their free state, but they fail to realize these restrictions are coming to their states regardless...

meaty-btz
11-13-2013, 10:36 AM
I love the silly Californicated perspectives on this.

There is a Gubernatorial candidate for Texas running on an Open Carry platform, and he isn't a "long shot".

There is a bill with strong support that was shutdown by Perry alone, that legalizes open carry in Texas.

What we are dealing with is nothing beyond the usual authoritarian thuggery. They don't like something so they make up rules and laws that don't exist in order to "discourage" a behavior they don't like.

diverwcw
11-13-2013, 10:41 AM
Texas is lost. It will be a blue state soon. Just give it a little time. And then we will be really screwed.

I don't think it's lost just yet but I've seen some real nonsense coming out of there. I think they are definitely headed that way.

That's a depressing thought. What is happening is Colorado is depressing too. I used to live there, it was as pro-gun as anywhere I can think of back in those days.

Yes it is, but the good people of Colorado had the sense to recall some of the politicians who were going that direction. It was funny hearing them whine and complain about how unfair it was they were recalled.

morfeeis
11-13-2013, 4:12 PM
Just because something is legal doesn't mean you should do it for no good reason other than get publicity, and take the inevitable risk to see more gun control legislation be the result of your actions.

Haven't we learned anything from the self-righteous, misguided OC movement in California?

This is politics. It's a dangerous game. Do you want to be right, or do you want to win? Because there is little satisfaction or point in losing even if you're right.
I strongly disagree, the law is not here to tell us what to do, it's here to tell us what is unlawful. what use is a right if not used; it's as useful as a moral person watching immorality and saying nothing.

As for your reference to CA and its OC movement, what i dd learn is i should have fought with them rather than stand on the sidelines. I learned that when they divide us as gun owners they win. I learned that the corrupt will do whatever they want as long as we fear them and worry what they will take from us next.

If i had to trade off being right to win i wont play that game, I'll do whats right and let the cards fall where they may. better that than to regret or to bow down to a master in hopes of better treatment while he readies the rope.

What some forget or don't understand is that there is no gun control law that will stop the salivating wolf that is coming for your arms. the only thing they want is complete disarmament. They don't care if you CCW OC LTC or whatever is the new term of the time. They want you disarmed so they may rule you as they wish.

a1c
11-14-2013, 8:15 AM
I strongly disagree, the law is not here to tell us what to do, it's here to tell us what is unlawful. what use is a right if not used; it's as useful as a moral person watching immorality and saying nothing.

As for your reference to CA and its OC movement, what i dd learn is i should have fought with them rather than stand on the sidelines. I learned that when they divide us as gun owners they win. I learned that the corrupt will do whatever they want as long as we fear them and worry what they will take from us next.

If i had to trade off being right to win i wont play that game, I'll do whats right and let the cards fall where they may. better that than to regret or to bow down to a master in hopes of better treatment while he readies the rope.

What some forget or don't understand is that there is no gun control law that will stop the salivating wolf that is coming for your arms. the only thing they want is complete disarmament. They don't care if you CCW OC LTC or whatever is the new term of the time. They want you disarmed so they may rule you as they wish.

A right is too precious to be played around with.

The problem with people like you is that you're idealists with no regards for the brutal reality of politics as usual.

You're not playing the same game as those who control the power. You're playing by your rules. But it's their game. If you play it your way, you will lose everytime.

So you would have been part of the OC movement. And you would have lost just the same. Congratulations. People like you like to pretend you're doing this out of principle, for the rest of us. But you're doing it out of some ego trip. It's a feel-good move. Because in the end, there is nothing to be gained for the rest of us. You feel good and self-righteous, but the result is inevitably a failure.

The other problem in your reasoning is that you belong to that group of "us vs. them", convinced that they will do whatever they can to disarm you, and this is your last stand. And when they do, you can go "I told you do".

You know what? It's a stupid and selfish approach. It's all about you. Yes, they want to disarm us. No, they will not necessarily win. And even if they do, I'd rather enjoy my 2A rights a little bit longer. So please, lay off the stupid publicity moves that are a sure way to get us all in trouble.

Grow up.

morfeeis
11-14-2013, 10:04 AM
A right is too precious to be played around with.

The problem with people like you is that you're idealists with no regards for the brutal reality of politics as usual.

You're not playing the same game as those who control the power. You're playing by your rules. But it's their game. If you play it your way, you will lose everytime.

So you would have been part of the OC movement. And you would have lost just the same. Congratulations. People like you like to pretend you're doing this out of principle, for the rest of us. But you're doing it out of some ego trip. It's a feel-good move. Because in the end, there is nothing to be gained for the rest of us. You feel good and self-righteous, but the result is inevitably a failure.

The other problem in your reasoning is that you belong to that group of "us vs. them", convinced that they will do whatever they can to disarm you, and this is your last stand. And when they do, you can go "I told you do".

You know what? It's a stupid and selfish approach. It's all about you. Yes, they want to disarm us. No, they will not necessarily win. And even if they do, I'd rather enjoy my 2A rights a little bit longer. So please, lay off the stupid publicity moves that are a sure way to get us all in trouble.

Grow up.

I will refrain from calling you names or trying to belittle your intelect. I will however say that i am happy my fathers raised me to be a man and not think as you do. I will say that a mindset such as yours is that which has allowed things to become as bad as they are. I will say that you are no more a friend to my rights then Jerry Brown. I will say that you and your ilk are the type thankful to Jerry for not taking your rights away.

While you think they control power i know that the power is in the people and if more would wake up and think less like you things could be a lot better. Had the founders thought as you we'd be flying a different flag right now.

You keep your CA state of mind, i'll keep my balls.

Shorthair
11-14-2013, 10:49 AM
A right is too precious to be played around with.

The problem with people like you is that you're idealists with no regards for the brutal reality of politics as usual.

You're not playing the same game as those who control the power. You're playing by your rules. But it's their game. If you play it your way, you will lose everytime.

So you would have been part of the OC movement. And you would have lost just the same. Congratulations. People like you like to pretend you're doing this out of principle, for the rest of us. But you're doing it out of some ego trip. It's a feel-good move. Because in the end, there is nothing to be gained for the rest of us. You feel good and self-righteous, but the result is inevitably a failure.


The other problem in your reasoning is that you belong to that group of "us vs. them", convinced that they will do whatever they can to disarm you, and this is your last stand. And when they do, you can go "I told you do".

You know what? It's a stupid and selfish approach. It's all about you. Yes, they want to disarm us. No, they will not necessarily win. And even if they do, I'd rather enjoy my 2A rights a little bit longer. So please, lay off the stupid publicity moves that are a sure way to get us all in trouble.

Grow up.

Total agreement. People need to grow up and deal with the unpleasant realities in the times in which we live. This aint the wild west and it never ever will be again. The times they are a changin for the worse, please don't hurry the process along. This crap is along the same lines as pornographers hiding behind the 1st ammendment. Well, maybe not quite that bad but you get my drift. Don't abuse OUR freedoms to get your jollies please.

a1c
11-14-2013, 1:45 PM
I will refrain from calling you names or trying to belittle your intelect. I will however say that i am happy my fathers raised me to be a man and not think as you do. I will say that a mindset such as yours is that which has allowed things to become as bad as they are. I will say that you are no more a friend to my rights then Jerry Brown. I will say that you and your ilk are the type thankful to Jerry for not taking your rights away.

While you think they control power i know that the power is in the people and if more would wake up and think less like you things could be a lot better. Had the founders thought as you we'd be flying a different flag right now.

You keep your CA state of mind, i'll keep my balls.

I live in California. I'm a Californian. I don't know what you call a "Californian state of mind", but it sounds like you already surrendered the entire identity of the state to the antis. Which is pretty sad.

You think whatever you think of me. I don't care.

What I read from your posts is that you're the kind of person who is ready to do our cause more harm than good. Just so you can feel that you're right about something.

And don't pull the Founding Fathers card, please. It's pathetic. The FF were a thousand times smarter and politically savvy than you. They would have never gone down that stupid trap. They were master negotiators and strategists.

morfeeis
11-14-2013, 2:23 PM
I live in California. I'm a Californian. I don't know what you call a "Californian state of mind", but it sounds like you already surrendered the entire identity of the state to the antis. Which is pretty sad.

You think whatever you think of me. I don't care.

What I read from your posts is that you're the kind of person who is ready to do our cause more harm than good. Just so you can feel that you're right about something.

And don't pull the Founding Fathers card, please. It's pathetic. The FF were a thousand times smarter and politically savvy than you. They would have never gone down that stupid trap. They were master negotiators and strategists.
No good will come of this, you're part of the problem and you don't even see it. the fact that you don't understand what a california state of mind means gives more credence to my statement. you fight a losing battle, no progress has been made in this state, they steal your rights one by one while you cry and say "pick our battles, pick our battles". if not for Jerry you would be ready to hand over or register your firearms soon. They are winning useing your way, so how much worse could grabbing your balls and doing it another way hurt.

But hey; if insanity is working for you ......

LoneYote
11-14-2013, 4:32 PM
Total agreement. This crap is along the same lines as pornographers hiding behind the 1st ammendment. Well, maybe not quite that bad but you get my drift.

I love this train of thinking. After all, the first amendment only covers the right for you to speak your mind in your own home to a mirror....right? If anyone speaks in public they will totally lose you the right to never exercise the right you have for fear "they" will take it away.

Corsair415
11-14-2013, 5:20 PM
I will refrain from calling you names or trying to belittle your intelect. I will however say that i am happy my fathers raised me to be a man and not think as you do. I will say that a mindset such as yours is that which has allowed things to become as bad as they are. I will say that you are no more a friend to my rights then Jerry Brown. I will say that you and your ilk are the type thankful to Jerry for not taking your rights away.

While you think they control power i know that the power is in the people and if more would wake up and think less like you things could be a lot better. Had the founders thought as you we'd be flying a different flag right now.

You keep your CA state of mind, i'll keep my balls.Well said.

Nevada Hudson
11-14-2013, 5:54 PM
I live in California. I'm a Californian. I don't know what you call a "Californian state of mind", but it sounds like you already surrendered the entire identity of the state to the antis. Which is pretty sad.

You think whatever you think of me. I don't care.

What I read from your posts is that you're the kind of person who is ready to do our cause more harm than good. Just so you can feel that you're right about something.

And don't pull the Founding Fathers card, please. It's pathetic. The FF were a thousand times smarter and politically savvy than you. They would have never gone down that stupid trap. They were master negotiators and strategists.

Try telling them at Berkeley that they cannot have free speech. See how far that would go. 2nd amendment is like the 1st, use it or lose it!

Ninety
11-14-2013, 6:35 PM
Curious as to when Open Carry Texas was started..

It's interesting that this thread has turned into another OC vs non OC argument. I don't and won't ever understand having a right and being too afraid to exercise such right.. If you were to infringe on any of the other enumerated rights there would be a huge ****storm about it.. but for some reason people are willing to bend over and take while pointing the finger at the same time.

If you are charged with enforcing a set of laws , then I expect you to enforce them properly.

It takes great courage to risk your freedom in the name of Liberty.

Sunday
11-14-2013, 7:24 PM
Texas will turn Democratic real soon.

Shorthair
11-14-2013, 7:44 PM
"I don't and won't ever understand having a right and being too afraid to exercise such right".

Rights and Responsibilities. Exercise your rights responsibly. I have the right to do many things everyday that I choose not to do because I choose to behave responsibly. Please don't get things like manhood and wisdom confused with some misguided tripe about "keeping your balls", whatever that utterly ridiculous statement means. Grow up or take to the hills in revolt. I don't think you will do either.

a1c
11-14-2013, 10:14 PM
Try telling them at Berkeley that they cannot have free speech. See how far that would go. 2nd amendment is like the 1st, use it or lose it!

And those who abuse it take the risk of losing some of it. For instance, the Naked Guy... in Berkeley. Kept claiming his right to go around naked was a 1A right. Well, one day, the city decided to pass an anti-nudity ordinance. That was over - he got arrested the next time he showed up naked.

See the analogy?

a1c
11-14-2013, 10:16 PM
No good will come of this, you're part of the problem and you don't even see it. the fact that you don't understand what a california state of mind means gives more credence to my statement. you fight a losing battle, no progress has been made in this state, they steal your rights one by one while you cry and say "pick our battles, pick our battles". if not for Jerry you would be ready to hand over or register your firearms soon. They are winning useing your way, so how much worse could grabbing your balls and doing it another way hurt.

But hey; if insanity is working for you ......

So what's your strategy, big guy? What's working out for you so far?

five.five-six
11-14-2013, 10:19 PM
Play stupid games...Just because something is legal doesn't mean you should do it for no good reason other than get publicity, and take the inevitable risk to see more gun control legislation be the result of your actions.

Haven't we learned anything from the self-righteous, misguided OC movement in California?

This is politics. It's a dangerous game. Do you want to be right, or do you want to win? Because there is little satisfaction or point in losing even if you're right.


Agreed,

Like that time that stupid Rosa Parks played the stupid "sit at the front of the bus" game.

a1c
11-14-2013, 10:23 PM
Agreed,

Like that time that stupid Rosa Parks played the stupid "sit at the front of the bus" game.

Before you pull that card, you let me know when you have the same momentum she had when she did that.

I don't see any of you bussing to Austin to champion the rights of that open carry cowboy.

So if you're going to go there, study up on the Civil Rights movement and the strategy its leaders used. It was carefully thought out and orchestrated.

five.five-six
11-14-2013, 10:25 PM
Before you pull that card, you let me know when you have the same momentum she had when she did that.

I don't see any of you bussing to Austin to champion the rights of that open carry cowboy.


LOL, a1c hates civil rights.

It's not by accident that klansmen like Duke and Byrd kept getting reelected by all the democrats.

a1c
11-14-2013, 10:27 PM
LOL, a1c hates civil rights.

What are you, 12?

It's not by accident that klansmen like Duke and Byrd kept getting reelected by all the democrats.

I don't even know how that relates to what we're talking about.

five.five-six
11-14-2013, 10:29 PM
What are you, 12?



I don't even know how that relates to what we're talking about.

I am talking about standing up for civil rights

You argue vehemently against civil rights. Sorry, but your sheet is showing.

a1c
11-14-2013, 10:36 PM
I am talking about standing up for civil rights

You argue vehemently against civil rights. Sorry, but your sheet is showing.

I'm having a hard time someone could actually believe what you're saying. I am not sure whether you're displaying intellectual dishonesty, or just being very dense.

So I'm going to break it down very simply for you, since you don't seem to be a man of nuance.

I don't support stupid actions in the name of civil rights.
I advocate organized, well thought-out actions in favor of civil rights. Yes, sometimes you need to wait it out. You need to wait for the right move. You think Rosa Parks was the first black person to refuse giving up her seat?

Now you may paint me as some KKK activist simply because I don't agree with your strategy (or lack thereof), but that just betrays your lack of valid arguments. It's pretty pathetic, really.

five.five-six
11-14-2013, 10:46 PM
I advocate organized, well thought-out actions in favor of civil rights. Yes, sometimes you need to wait it out. You need to wait for the right move. You think Rosa Parks was the first black person to refuse giving up her seat?


Apparently you support contradicting yourself in the same paragraph. Go to bed you are too tired to think straight. Do you think Grisham was the first person to UOC.... or it wasn't thought out?


You are taking a stand against civil rights and it appears that your don't even know it.


LOL

a1c
11-14-2013, 10:49 PM
Apparently you support contradicting yourself in the same paragraph. Go to bed you are too tired to think straight. Do you think Grisham was the first person to UOC.... or it wasn't thought out?

It obviously wasn't thought out. Unless he's got some genius plan to avoid an OC ban in Texas. Hell, maybe he's got a team of attorneys on top of the NRA and the GOA behind him, ready to spring into action.

You are taking a stand against civil rights and it appears that your don't even know it.
LOL

Sure. Whatever helps you sleep at night, honey.

morfeeis
11-14-2013, 10:54 PM
I don't support stupid actions in the name of civil rights.
I advocate organized, well thought-out actions in favor of civil rights. Yes, sometimes you need to wait it out. You need to wait for the right move. You think Rosa Parks was the first black person to refuse giving up her seat?


Like OC'ing a pistol that doesn't meet the code for a firearm in the middle of a well organized protest and video taping the whole thing. Yeah, sounds like something only a person that knows nothing about the law would do.

a1c
11-14-2013, 10:59 PM
Like OC'ing a pistol that doesn't meet the code for a firearm in the middle of a well organized protest and video taping the whole thing. Yeah, sounds like something only a person that knows nothing about the law would do.

Where did I say the guy didn't know anything about the law?

Oh, that's right - I didn't.

Hey, those California OCers knew the law too. Some of them would recite the PC by heart in front of news cameras and police officers.

They did such a brilliant job exercising their right irresponsibly that it only took a few months for that right to disappear from the books. Now it looks like it gave some ideas to some idiots in Texas, one of the most pro-gun states historically.

morfeeis
11-14-2013, 11:13 PM
Where did I say the guy didn't know anything about the law?

Oh, that's right - I didn't.

Hey, those California OCers knew the law too. Some of them would recite the PC by heart in front of news cameras and police officers.

They did such a brilliant job exercising their right irresponsibly that it only took a few months for that right to disappear from the books. Now it looks like it gave some ideas to some idiots in Texas, one of the most pro-gun states historically.

How do you not see the problem with what you're saying? Do you hate OC'ing that much?

Let me sum up what you're saying
i don't agree with oc'ing
the public doesn't like oc'ing
oc'ing is a stupid way to exercise your right
if you exercise your right that the public dislikes for no reason they will take your right away
don't exercise your right that way they won't take it away even though i think it's a stupid way to exercise said right.

Please point out what i have wrong, i'm trying to understand your point but it just doesn't match up with a progun stance (FROM MY POINT OF VIEW!!!).

Nor Cal Scot
11-15-2013, 6:03 AM
Play stupid games...

Agreed. So the last thing we need are self-righteous OC hotheads who are going to spoil it for the rest of gun owners.
Oh, you're one of those kind. Between this thread and the Jefferson thread, you have exposed yourself fairly well. YOU and people like you are the reason us gun owners are in the position we are are in. You'll gladly give up the inches and be fine with the miles they will take... Sad really. America wasn't built on cowards.

Shorthair
11-15-2013, 6:24 AM
So what's your strategy, big guy? What's working out for you so far?

My belief is this. Anything given by men can be taken away by men. Constitutional rights fall into this category. We always have the option of revolt or some sort of protest , like the OC open carry rally. I take the "responsibility" position because I have a family that depends on me. I know full well that many who post much stronger positions here than I also have families that depend on them as well. I see the "big balls" position as requireing a full devotion to the cause like the framers of the constitution had. Many of those men were wealthy family men who risked everything, life, fortune, imprisonment etc. and were fully devoted to the cause. Many did loose everything. I don't think most of us who post here are willing to do this. We all, myself included, like to talk big talk, but in the end, we don't want to risk our cushy lifestyles, warm beds, monday night football and regular income, let alone our lives in a revolt against oppressive government policies. The only real right I believe we have is to worship the God of Abraham, our Creator, He gives us this right and it is the ONLY right we can claim that no oppressor can take away. You can break a mans body and mind, but his spirit and soul are his alone. I know that not everyone takes this view. I view life as being forever either in heaven or hell at our choosing. Again, not everyone sees life this way. I believe as men grow older we must trade our testosterone fueled ideals for equal portions of wisdom. I know that many here went to war and risked life and limb for freedom. I served in the miltary between wars in the 80's and never had to do this. If it all hits the fan I will fight for my family. If the time comes, thats where my "balls" will be fully utilized.

LoneYote
11-15-2013, 6:27 AM
And those who abuse it take the risk of losing some of it. For instance, the Naked Guy... in Berkeley. Kept claiming his right to go around naked was a 1A right. Well, one day, the city decided to pass an anti-nudity ordinance. That was over - he got arrested the next time he showed up naked.

See the analogy?

For the analogy to be correct your position would have to be that there IS a right to be naked in public and he ruined it for everyone by actually doing it and causing a fuss.

a1c
11-15-2013, 6:48 AM
Oh, you're one of those kind. Between this thread and the Jefferson thread, you have exposed yourself fairly well. YOU and people like you are the reason us gun owners are in the position we are are in. You'll gladly give up the inches and be fine with the miles they will take... Sad really. America wasn't built on cowards.

Please tell me how I've "exposed myself". Sounds like you have me conveniently pegged.

a1c
11-15-2013, 6:49 AM
For the analogy to be correct your position would have to be that there IS a right to be naked in public and he ruined it for everyone by actually doing it and causing a fuss.

But there was. There was no law prohibiting it at the time. Zero. He was correctly invoking the First Amendment to justify being naked in public.

five.five-six
11-15-2013, 7:15 AM
Where did I say the guy didn't know anything about the law?

Oh, that's right - I didn't.

Hey, those California OCers knew the law too. Some of them would recite the PC by heart in front of news cameras and police officers.

They did such a brilliant job exercising their right irresponsibly that it only took a few months for that right to disappear from the books. Now it looks like it gave some ideas to some idiots in Texas, one of the most pro-gun states historically.

I am trying to find the post where you made a point without contradicting yourself

Oh thats right - you didn't.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I437 using Tapatalk

Ninety
11-15-2013, 7:35 AM
OCing is already banned in TX for handguns... no laws yet on long guns..

I think we do have a fair amount of momentum in our favor.. not here in CA but Nationally it seems to be going in the favor of protecting our GOD given rights.. not rights given by man.

OC is common in many states.. sadly some of you feel that by OCing those privledges will be stripped by law makers.. I don't feel that this is the case.. but it does seem the more blue a state gets the more it becomes like CA.

On another note.. we have a right to keep and bear arms.. in and out of the home.. to ban the OC of long arms would be restricting that right.. being you cant conceal a rifle. TX has plenty of wild hogs where a rifle would be far more useful then a handgun.

California mindset. You have already lost.

sarabellum
11-15-2013, 3:58 PM
Absolutely inevitable! Even in TX. Cities grow into megalopolises whose residents fear firearms and slowly outnumber the rural inhabitants who don't. We saw it in WA, OR and CO. Same thing in TX. Right now I'll bet that more than half of the population lives in a large urban city and has no interest/regard for firearms.

Brought to you by corporate yuppies afeared that ground down working people might rebel against them for, er, um, manipulating the market causing the mass layoff of people. Oops, damn, did I just spill the beans on the recession?

LoneYote
11-15-2013, 3:58 PM
But there was. There was no law prohibiting it at the time. Zero. He was correctly invoking the First Amendment to justify being naked in public.

Faulty assumption in my opinion there is not such protection of the 1a. Please, convince me that the 1a protects the right to wander around nude in public. Assuming it does protect that activity, I would support his action as much as I support the OC people.

five.five-six
11-15-2013, 5:06 PM
This is my rifle; This is my gun; This is for fighting; This is for fun.

a1c
11-15-2013, 6:51 PM
Faulty assumption in my opinion there is not such protection of the 1a. Please, convince me that the 1a protects the right to wander around nude in public. Assuming it does protect that activity, I would support his action as much as I support the OC people.

No such case has as far as I know gone to SCOTUS, so whether it's a constitutional right remains for you and I to debate.

That said, keep in mind all the cases that went to lower courts had some context. The Naked Guy liked to argue it he was making some sort of statement. Just like some demonstrators have in the past done, whether going around naked on bicycles or walking in groups.

The OC people have tried that route before - and in some cases have been even supported by the ACLU - claiming that them OCing was a form of free speech.

Now I'm sure that's what Grisham was going for, and I personally think he had a right to open carry then, and that it was a form of free speech, and therefore constitutional.

But what we see in this thread is a drift between those who think that just because what he did was right, we should support him wholeheartedly (although I don't exactly see anyone in here wiring him funds for his legal defense), and those who believe that even though he had a constitutional right to OC then and there, it was not a good idea at all, because such behavior endangers our community, and motivates our adversaries to pass further gun control legislation.

This is why this discussion is being needlessly aggressive. We all think it's ridiculous he got arrested. But some people think he did something brave and right, and others (like me) think he exercized his 2A rights irresponsibly, and might bolster gun control legislators to tighten gun laws in Texas - of all places.

five.five-six
11-15-2013, 7:00 PM
All lies and jest. Still, a1c hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest.

LoneYote
11-15-2013, 9:33 PM
But some people think he did something brave and right, and others (like me) think he exercized his 2A rights irresponsibly, and might bolster gun control legislators to tighten gun laws in Texas - of all places.

The problem lies in the bold area. If any group restricts its activity, even by choice, on the basis that it may offend someone and result in the loss of the freedom then there is in fact no freedom. Example - 1a protects speech. If one were to say that the President was wrong to have a drone kill an American citizen. Then the man was arrested. Would it be a good argument that we should not speak against POTUS because it may lead to the government rescinding the 1a completely? I doubt anyone would be so willing to jump on that bandwagon. The example is more extreme in behavior than the actions described in the thread.

five.five-six
11-15-2013, 9:49 PM
It's a lot like refusing to sit at the back of the bus, that's why a1c hates OC so much.

LoneYote
11-15-2013, 10:32 PM
Influence those in your immediate circle.

I try my best.... mostly on College females... They love shooting!

Ninety
11-15-2013, 11:02 PM
Not Grisham .. but same basis...
S8UXEFhyBz4

parkwaylakes
11-16-2013, 7:20 AM
If this keeps up, TX will be come California. If you push a right to damn far and use bad judgment others will find a way to put you in your place. People like this need to STOP pushing the limits.

a1c
11-16-2013, 8:13 AM
It's a lot like refusing to sit at the back of the bus, that's why a1c hates OC so much.

Grow up.

LoneYote
11-16-2013, 12:27 PM
If this keeps up, TX will be come California. If you push a right to damn far and use bad judgment others corrupt officials will find a way to put you in your place. People like this need to STOP pushing the limits and submit completely to the whims of their betters.

fixed it for ya... that's what you meant right?

five.five-six
11-16-2013, 3:12 PM
Grow up.

OC is exactly like refusing to sit at the back of the bus.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk (http://tapatalk.com/m?id=1)

a1c
11-16-2013, 3:33 PM
OC is exactly like refusing to sit at the back of the bus.

Wow.

So, when's the last time you OCd to demonstrate your dedication to gun rights?

LoneYote
11-16-2013, 4:02 PM
Wow.

So, when's the last time you OCd to demonstrate your dedication to gun rights?

Rosa is memorable because NOT everyone did what she did....

five.five-six
11-16-2013, 5:57 PM
Wow.

So, when's the last time you OCd to demonstrate your dedication to gun rights?


When was the last time you walked around town naked? Next time you do I hope you are CCWign a 1911

jeremiah12
11-24-2013, 5:32 PM
Grisham is good at spinning the media his way. Texas prohibits open carrying of handguns. Texas does not specifically prohibit or permit the open carrying of long guns or antique guns.

That part is covered under Texas Law Sec. 42.01. DISORDERLY CONDUCT. (a) A person commits an offense if he intentionally or knowingly:
(8) displays a firearm or other deadly weapon in a public place in a manner calculated to alarm;

In Temple, somebody called to report a man carrying rifle. That gave the officer probable cause to stop and speak with him. He knew that, having been stopped many times before doing the same thing.

Their is a lot of FUD on the net that you can open carry a loaded black powder pistol in Texas because legally it is not a firearm. These Internet warriors forgot to look up Texas' definition of dangerous weapons which included black power firearms and other antique firearms.

A little more googlefu will find that local communities in Texas can ban all open carry if they choose to.

Also, Texas enacted its open carry ban in 1873. CA had no restriction on open carry until 1967. So by basing blueness on OC, Texas started down that path long before CA, we just reached the end point quicker.

In 1967, the republicans wanted to ban OC to disarm all the radical democrats running around SF and LA protecting the inner city dwellers from rogue cops. There was a real fear of revolution in the streets. I remember my very conservative and very republican family were all against handguns because only those inner city thugs were using the guns to rob us good people. Us good people only needed hunting rifles and we could always count on the police to protect us from those thugs.

The more things change, the more they stay the same. Well, at least my local banks are not having bombs explode in them. In the Sacramento-Stockton area in the 70s, Crocker (sp?) were not the safest banks to do business with. A few others were hit also but it seems Crocker was target the most.

SoCalCitizen
11-24-2013, 8:28 PM
Morfeeis wins by knockout. The other debater's arguments are the tail between the legs approach. Exactly the ones the opposition can or have already gotten to.

sigsour223
11-24-2013, 8:44 PM
honestly we as gun owners are not doing enough one million gun march on Washington lol but seriously we should be more political no one in big cities care about guns because there too busy buying merc and bmw trying to out do each other forgetting what this country was built upon face it none of these people ever worked a honest day in there life or needed a gun to protect themselves we can blame everyone but we need to be more political as far as a even a gun party lol sorry for the rant

a1c
11-24-2013, 9:12 PM
When was the last time you walked around town naked? Next time you do I hope you are CCWign a 1911

But that's the thing. Just because you can doesn't mean you should.

TRICKSTER
11-24-2013, 9:30 PM
Morfeeis wins by knockout. The other debater's arguments are the tail between the legs approach. Exactly the ones the opposition can or have already gotten to.

:rofl2: I don't agree with Grisham's tactics, but I have to give him credit. Unlike the keyboard commandos here who are nothing but talk, at least Grisham practices what he preaches. Some here may be barking, but that doesn't change the fact that they too have their tails between their legs no matter how much noise they make.

five.five-six
11-24-2013, 10:58 PM
But that's the thing. Just because you can doesn't mean you should.


It's a lot like sitting at the front of the bus.

Colt-45
11-25-2013, 12:15 AM
Excellent thread:thumbsup:

For those that oppose OC, So why is open carry so bad again?

All I have ever gotten is: It will be Armageddon! There will be mayhem in the streets! shootouts in every corner! :willy_nilly: :willy_nilly:

I got the same argument in response to CCW but then....... nothing happened.

LoneYote
11-25-2013, 6:25 AM
Colt... The opposing point is... If you open carry it will scare people so the government will ban it. Thus, it is better to have the right but never ever exercise it under penalty of death so that you can continue to have the right to never ever use it lest it be a crime and you are punished for exercising it.

TRICKSTER
11-25-2013, 6:33 AM
Colt... The opposing point is... If you open carry it will scare people so the government will ban it. Thus, it is better to have the right but never ever exercise it under penalty of death so that you can continue to have the right to never ever use it lest it be a crime and you are punished for exercising it.

Actually I believe that the opposing point is to use some discretion. It doesn't help the cause when you go out with an in your face, "everyone look at me, I'm carrying a gun" attitude.

LoneYote
11-25-2013, 7:51 AM
Actually I believe that the opposing point is to use some discretion. It doesn't help the cause when you go out with an in your face, "everyone look at me, I'm carrying a gun" attitude.

Like quietly walking down a back road with your son? That kind of "in your face" demonstration??

a1c
11-25-2013, 7:59 AM
It's a lot like sitting at the front of the bus.

You do realize that Rosa Parks was not the first African American to taunt the established segregation rules on that bus line, right?

She's the first case the NAACP took on because she was the first case they realized they had a chance to win. It helped that her husband was the head of the local chapter.

Point is - you may want to OC if you want (I see a lot of supporters for this guy here, but I'd bet none of you will show up on his court date), but if you do so, better have a good plan in mind.

And frankly, the analogy is getting a little tired. We may have our 2A rights trampled, but the level of oppression in our daily lives is NOTHING like what blacks were experiencing in pre-70s America. It'd be a good idea to tone down the rethoric if we want to be taken seriously by the other side.

a1c
11-25-2013, 8:01 AM
Faulty assumption in my opinion there is not such protection of the 1a. Please, convince me that the 1a protects the right to wander around nude in public. Assuming it does protect that activity, I would support his action as much as I support the OC people.

The faulty assumption is yours. Research the case. There was no law against it until that ordinance was passed.

TRICKSTER
11-25-2013, 9:31 AM
Like quietly walking down a back road with your son? That kind of "in your face" demonstration??

No that is not what I was referring to and somehow I think that you know it. Funny how you don't want to address the real problems caused by some in the open carry movement. :rolleyes:

five.five-six
11-25-2013, 2:25 PM
a1c thinks that Grisham was the first person to OC Evah!

And that sitting at the front of the bus is never a good idea unles it is sanctioned by the NAALCP.....

a1c, you're amazing :thumbsup:

a1c
11-25-2013, 3:04 PM
a1c thinks that Grisham was the first person to OC Evah!

Really? Where did I say that? I think you have serious comprehension issues. Your SAT scores must be a joke.

And that sitting at the front of the bus is never a good idea unles it is sanctioned by the NAALCP.....

a1c, you're amazing :thumbsup:

OK, I'm going to break it down for ya:

The Civil Rights movement had momentum on their side. They had a carefully planned strategy. Those weren't the Black Panthers' aggressive demonstrations of force to scare the white man. Those were attorneys, thinkers, church and community leaders who had a thought out path.

The rights were theirs to win. They had support among the rest of society, not just African Americans, even when the majority of Americans were reluctant or downright hostile to desegregation and integration. They had the momentum on their side. They had sympathy from of a significant part of the media. The courts had been progressively siding in their favor over the past few decades.

We, on the other hand, have everything to lose. Everytime some mad man or idiot uses a firearm to kill or endanger people, you know it's going to motivate some career politicians to write some stupid bills that will aim at restricting our rights even further. We don't have the media on our side. We don't really have the courts on our side either. So we have to play this right. Loose cannons are not a good idea.

Again, I don't think any of you is going to be busing to Texas anytime soon to demonstrate your support to Grisham. So if you really think this guy is today's Rosa Parks, by all means, the least you can do is support him on his court date. Otherwise you're just bystanders.

five.five-six
11-25-2013, 4:35 PM
a1c only likes civil rights that are popular and trendy, he gets his view from The View.

LoneYote
11-25-2013, 4:39 PM
The faulty assumption is yours. Research the case. There was no law against it until that ordinance was passed.

Just because there is no law against something does not mean that it is a protected activity. Please recognize the difference.

No that is not what I was referring to and somehow I think that you know it. Funny how you don't want to address the real problems caused by some in the open carry movement. :rolleyes:

Not a General OC thread. This thread is about this man and this action....

a1c
11-25-2013, 4:50 PM
Just because there is no law against something does not mean that it is a protected activity. Please recognize the difference.

I know, but remember: this is also how antis justify all sorts of restrictions on the RKBA.

LoneYote
11-25-2013, 7:35 PM
I know, but remember: this is also how antis justify all sorts of restrictions on the RKBA.

Cute but I am on the narrow path not in the weeds...