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View Full Version : Price of Armed Guards in Schools


Uriah02
10-14-2013, 11:18 PM
I know there are not any hot button issues that prompts this, I worked out many of these details follows the NRA's speech after Newtown and wanted to work this out practically.

According to Department of Education there are 98,817 public schools from 2010 stats (fact check me when the shutdown ends and the site is back up).
Ehow (http://www.ehow.com/info_12147617_much-money-armed-security-guard-paid.html) rates the median wage of guards between $12.92/hr (26,874/yr) and $19.83/hr (41,246/yr)(Calculator (http://www.calcxml.com/calculators/pay04?skn=#calcoutput)).

Since this is a large scale estimate on the national scale we can work with median numbers just fine. The average salary would then be 34,060/yr of an armed security guard. We can't realistically entertain the idea of using volunteer guards nation-wide especially armed volunteers with liability being what it is.

Let us indulge ourselves and not assume a single guard will be sufficient for every school, there needs to be at least 2 per school to account for sick days while maintaining coverage.
So here's the math: 2 guards x 34,060/yr x 98,817 schools = 6,731,414,040/yr
5,048,560,530/school year not offering guard during break/summer (estimating school is not in session for 25% of the year)
So there we have it, are our children worth 5-6.7 Billion dollars per year?


Oh wait, this is a loaded question, because if we dropped the gun-free zone aspect and gave staff the option to be armed that might work out a bit better. We don't need armed guards, we just need to combat the soft-target nature of schools. For instance if each school got a federal grant of say... 2000/yr (197M) for weapon training, weapon purchase, and ammo would that be just as good? I'm just throwing numbers out at this point but you see where it is going...

DannyInSoCal
10-14-2013, 11:26 PM
30,000 flights a day.

700 Air Marshals.

The THREAT that there might be a randomly assigned undercover school marshal is enough to deter these criminal asshats from trying.

Besides - Reasign the 20,000 Marines sent to the unemployment lines instead.

$30k per year seems pretty cheap to me.....

safewaysecurity
10-14-2013, 11:32 PM
How baout ZERO cost. Let teachers and staff carry. Let pilots carry etc. Pretty simple.

teg33
10-14-2013, 11:50 PM
How baout ZERO cost. Let teachers and staff carry. Let pilots carry etc. Pretty simple.

This the best solution

voiceofreason
10-15-2013, 5:35 AM
This is in ARIZONA!

The left's push to make guns bad through the schools is clearly working.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/10/03/arizona-police-officer-asked-not-to-wear-uniform-at-daughters-school/

skyhanger00
10-15-2013, 5:35 AM
30,000 flights a day.

700 Air Marshals.

The THREAT that there might be a randomly assigned undercover school marshal is enough to deter these criminal asshats from trying.

Besides - Reasign the 20,000 Marines sent to the unemployment lines instead.

$30k per year seems pretty cheap to me.....

I believe no guns were ever fired by air marshals (yes they ccw on a fragile aluminum frame airliner), but they have successfully accosted and detained unruly passengers before. Hijackings are a thing of the past. Now the terrorists are focused on either destroying airliners or softer targets.

I don't remember the source, but I remember this opinion article claiming that 1/3 of public schools already have armed security around the time when the NRA president gave his famous sandy vagina speech, and soccer moms were going "no guns in my school!". The horse has left the barn already mom.

Helpful_Cub
10-15-2013, 6:12 AM
30,000 flights a day.

700 Air Marshals.

The THREAT that there might be a randomly assigned undercover school marshal is enough to deter these criminal asshats from trying.

Besides - Reasign the 20,000 Marines sent to the unemployment lines instead.

$30k per year seems pretty cheap to me.....

Actually that's a great idea. But don't stop at just Marines. We've got all kinds of National Guard and Army people cycling back and need stuff to do. Its good advertisement for the DoD and they may even be able to talk to the kids about what respect and honor and all of that stuff actually means.

Uriah02
10-15-2013, 6:07 PM
What world do we live in that simply allowing CCW school staff would be "enough" with no gov't oversight over such a thing? At least with the plan I suggested it might satisfy both 2A crowd and the gov't crowd. Think compromise. Plus, how many more people would be interested in shooting if the costs were subsidized? That alone should get everyone on the forum on board. Sure CCW school staff would be cheaper and just as efficient, but lets not get too carried away.

safewaysecurity
10-15-2013, 6:09 PM
What world do we live in that simply allowing CCW school staff would be "enough" with no gov't oversight over such a thing? At least with the plan I suggested it might satisfy both 2A crowd and the gov't crowd. Think compromise. Plus, how many more people would be interested in shooting if the costs were subsidized? That alone should get everyone on the forum on board. Sure CCW school staff would be cheaper and just as efficient, but lets not get too carried away.

Teachers in states like Utah have already been able to carry for decades...

KABA556
10-29-2013, 8:40 PM
I know there are not any hot button issues that prompts this, I worked out many of these details follows the NRA's speech after Newtown and wanted to work this out practically.

According to Department of Education there are 98,817 public schools from 2010 stats (fact check me when the shutdown ends and the site is back up).
Ehow (http://www.ehow.com/info_12147617_much-money-armed-security-guard-paid.html) rates the median wage of guards between $12.92/hr (26,874/yr) and $19.83/hr (41,246/yr)(Calculator (http://www.calcxml.com/calculators/pay04?skn=#calcoutput)).

Since this is a large scale estimate on the national scale we can work with median numbers just fine. The average salary would then be 34,060/yr of an armed security guard. We can't realistically entertain the idea of using volunteer guards nation-wide especially armed volunteers with liability being what it is.

Let us indulge ourselves and not assume a single guard will be sufficient for every school, there needs to be at least 2 per school to account for sick days while maintaining coverage.
So here's the math: 2 guards x 34,060/yr x 98,817 schools = 6,731,414,040/yr
5,048,560,530/school year not offering guard during break/summer (estimating school is not in session for 25% of the year)
So there we have it, are our children worth 5-6.7 Billion dollars per year?


Oh wait, this is a loaded question, because if we dropped the gun-free zone aspect and gave staff the option to be armed that might work out a bit better. We don't need armed guards, we just need to combat the soft-target nature of schools. For instance if each school got a federal grant of say... 2000/yr (197M) for weapon training, weapon purchase, and ammo would that be just as good? I'm just throwing numbers out at this point but you see where it is going...



Armed guards in schools are only a partial solution... Some high schools have thousands of students and it would take at least 4-5 minutes to briskly walk from one end of the school to the other end, and it might take 2 minutes to jog or borderline run [moving as fast as you'd want to while still being able to maintain some awareness of your surroundings and what you're running/jogging into] to get to the other end of the building/complex.


If a shooting begins in the library which is a several minute walk away from the cafeteria where guard A is located and it is 90 seconds away from where guard B is on patrol, then 20-30 people can be dead by the time either guard arrives.


The best solution is to arm teachers because they are dispersed throughout the building and teachers are likely to be immediately in/around the area where shooting is likely to occur.

KABA556
10-29-2013, 8:42 PM
I believe no guns were ever fired by air marshals (yes they ccw on a fragile aluminum frame airliner), but they have successfully accosted and detained unruly passengers before. Hijackings are a thing of the past. Now the terrorists are focused on either destroying airliners or softer targets.

I don't remember the source, but I remember this opinion article claiming that 1/3 of public schools already have armed security around the time when the NRA president gave his famous sandy vagina speech, and soccer moms were going "no guns in my school!". The horse has left the barn already mom.


I don't believe hijackings are a thing of the past, I believe they will eventually use multiple armed hijackers who will be armed with submachine guns or automatic rifles, having gained access to the plane in a third world country or some mess of a nation with poor security, or they'll bribe their way on, or they'll just circumvent crappy TSA security.

KABA556
10-29-2013, 8:45 PM
30,000 flights a day.

700 Air Marshals.

The THREAT that there might be a randomly assigned undercover school marshal is enough to deter these criminal asshats from trying.

Besides - Reasign the 20,000 Marines sent to the unemployment lines instead.

$30k per year seems pretty cheap to me.....


I thought after 9/11 they hired about 4,000 to 5,000 new air marshals...

EMPTYITOUT
10-29-2013, 9:41 PM
Thanks OP for the financial breakdown. First time I've seen a comparison of guards vs firearms training. Keep it up!