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Skidmark
08-21-2013, 6:21 AM
Hmmmph. I don't want anyone keeping records of my firearms purchases.

WASHINGTON — The National Rifle Association has rallied gun-owners — and raised tens of millions of dollars — campaigning against the threat of a national database of firearms or their owners.

But in fact, the sort of vast, secret database the NRA often warns of already exists, despite having been assembled largely without the knowledge or consent of gun owners. It is housed in the Virginia offices of the NRA itself. The country’s largest privately held database of current, former, and prospective gun owners is one of the powerful lobby’s secret weapons, expanding its influence well beyond its estimated 3 million members and bolstering its political supremacy.

That database has been built through years of acquiring gun permit registration lists from state and county offices, gathering names of new owners from the thousands of gun-safety classes taught by NRA-certified instructors and by buying lists of attendees of gun shows, subscribers to gun magazines and more, BuzzFeed has learned.

http://www.buzzfeed.com/stevefriess/how-the-nra-built-a-massive-secret-database-of-gun-owners

Granite
08-21-2013, 8:06 AM
Just a fake story to divide and conquer.

Skipper
08-21-2013, 8:30 AM
http://florians.org/jslayer/bs.jpg

Skidmark
08-21-2013, 9:12 AM
Just a fake story to divide and conquer.

Actually, no, it wasn't from Foxnews...

It strikes me as disingenuous at best that la pierre was arguing against the government compiling just such a database, when NRA had been doing exactly that for quite a while. I don't want, need, or trust anyone tracking my ownership or use of guns. And you can bet that any list NRA has compiled has already been snooped by government agencies.

send it_hit
08-21-2013, 9:24 AM
Just a fake story to divide and conquer.

good point

diverwcw
08-21-2013, 9:26 AM
I call bull***** on that!

hardlyworking
08-21-2013, 10:18 AM
Big BIG difference between your government (with the power to compel confiscation through force) generating a list, and a private advocacy group with no power to do anything except lobby on behalf of list-members for already recognized through rule of law rights of all Americans against infringement.

speedrrracer
08-21-2013, 10:27 AM
Big BIG difference between your government (with the power to compel confiscation through force) generating a list, and a private advocacy group with no power to do anything except lobby on behalf of list-members for already recognized through rule of law rights of all Americans against infringement.

ftw

Plus, anyone can join the NRA -- they don't require you to have a gun. As hardlyworking said, Big BIG difference.

Therefore, the database is not of gun owners, but of pro-gun citizens.

nick
08-21-2013, 10:34 AM
Saw this article earlier. From the tone and style of the article, it looks a lot like an attack on the NRA for the purpose of an attack on the hated organization, not "reporting news". Which makes sense, since the antis pull this sort of things quite often. Divide, vilify, and conquer. Works pretty well, since most people don't analyze what they read, and just take it as it is (especially if they were unhappy with the subject of the article already, and just need a little nudge in the "right" direction").

Looking at the substance of the article, they pretty much take what a normal company/organization does for compiling marketing lists these days, and make it into a "registry of gun owners". I especially liked the "list of potential gun owners". And "buying the lists of attendees at gun shows"? Hmm, most of the people I saw buying those tickets paid cash. So much of the list would then be "John Doe, no info".

Oh, and let's not forget the insidious NRA gun owner registry called 'membership roll'! Millions of people there! On which I, for example, was even before I owned a firearm. I guess, I was on that list of "potential gun owners" :)

It's also interesting how the article's author lowers the number of NRA members to 3 million. The actual number isn't hard to get, the NRA keeps touting it (and every claim they make does get scrutinized by the "friendlies"). So, citing such a low number can be either out of utter ignorance and inability/lack of desire to verify such an easy to verify fact (which makes me question the rest of the claims in the article), or an intent to show the NRA less significant than it is (which does blend in well with what I perceive as the idea behind the article - an attempts to make the NRA less significant in politics, and attack it through its power base - the gun owners).

Not worth it to go into more detail. The article is full of innuendo, and short on substance.

kalimus
08-21-2013, 10:50 AM
How does one make a database of "prospective gun owners"? Keep track of who might buy a gun? Wouldn't that database have roughly 300 million people in it? Former gun owners? People write the NRA to tell them they used to have a gun, but they decided to get rid of it? What a ridiculous article.

POLICESTATE
08-21-2013, 11:00 AM
You know why this article reeks of liberal bull ****? Because Buzz Feed is liberal bull ****.

http://www.buzzfeed.com/about
BuzzFeed is the leading media company for the social age, intensely focused on delivering high-quality original reporting, insight, and viral content across a rapidly expanding array of subject areas. Our technology powers the social distribution of content, detects what is trending on the web, and connects people in realtime with the hottest content of the moment. Our site is rapidly growing and reaches more than 60 million monthly unique visitors. Jonah Peretti, founder & CEO of BuzzFeed, previously co-founded the Huffington Post. Ben Smith is its Editor-in-Chief, Jon Steinberg is its President & COO and Kenneth Lerer is the Executive Chairman.

robcoe
08-21-2013, 11:56 AM
Reading past the hysterics, it's a marketing list, not a list of gun owners.

It's anyone who attended a gun show(where a lot of things besides guns are sold)

People who attended gun training(again, not all of them own guns, some just are interested and seeing if they would want to)

Magazine subscription lists.

It is not a list of gun owners and their weapons.

If you are going to panic about this, you should also panic about the secret lists of what you eat compiled by supermarkets.

stix213
08-21-2013, 1:56 PM
A list of people with interests in guns for the purpose of targeted marketing by a private organization is not the same as a government run gun registration.

Fate
08-21-2013, 3:48 PM
Trollpost

SilverTauron
08-21-2013, 3:48 PM
Show of hands-anyone here ever heard of the ATF's Etrace? No?

Don't worry. Uncle Sam's got your gat's registered there. The NRA's member list isnt nearly as comprehensive or as dangerous to the RKBA.

RM14
08-21-2013, 3:58 PM
Not surprising. I suddenly started receiving snail mail and (paper) magazine offers from the NRA, 2 weeks after purchasing my first firearm from the lgs.

dchang0
08-21-2013, 4:36 PM
Reading past the hysterics, it's a marketing list, not a list of gun owners.

It's anyone who attended a gun show(where a lot of things besides guns are sold)

People who attended gun training(again, not all of them own guns, some just are interested and seeing if they would want to)

Magazine subscription lists.

It is not a list of gun owners and their weapons.

If you are going to panic about this, you should also panic about the secret lists of what you eat compiled by supermarkets.

Very well put. There are some really scary things being done with Big Data and neuromarketing at just about every major company, from Target to Facebook... And strangely, consumers often voluntarily sign up for this type of surveillance, by getting "rewards cards" or "club cards" at the grocery stores to signing right up for Facebook/Twitter/LinkedIn.

gobler
08-25-2013, 4:15 AM
Funny thing on this is, I was a member, and currently know folks who are who never owned a gun. Yeah, it's only a hand full but still. One can be a member of the NRA, GOA or 2AF with out needing to own a gun..... Just food for thought.


Sent from somewhere in time & space...

five.five-six
08-25-2013, 4:31 AM
Hmmmph. I don't want anyone keeping records of my gun purchase

LOL. Next are you going to tell me Obama was born in Kenya? 9/11 was an inside job? :TFH:



Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I437 using Tapatalk 2

Dvrjon
08-25-2013, 9:59 AM
Show of hands-anyone here ever heard of the ATF's Etrace? No?
Don't worry. Uncle Sam's got your gat's registered there. The NRA's member list isnt nearly as comprehensive or as dangerous to the RKBA.


Originally Posted by Skidmark
Hmmmph. I don't want anyone keeping records of my gun purchase

Too late. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ETrace#ATF_firearms_databases. :willy_nilly:

five.five-six
08-25-2013, 10:10 PM
Well, I guess we know who gunless poser plants on calgunz are now.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I437 using Tapatalk 2

rayz13
08-25-2013, 10:26 PM
the NRA is not the government-big difference...

2nd Mass
08-26-2013, 12:44 AM
Nice to see the trolls found the new sub-forums.

Frito Bandido
08-26-2013, 6:01 AM
Considering a very small percentage of gun owners are even NRA members, that is not a gun owner database. It's basically a marketing database.

This story definitely has "divide and conquer" and "hit piece" written all over it.

gunsmith
08-26-2013, 8:19 PM
Just a fake story to divide and conquer.

yup

Skidmark
09-05-2013, 5:57 PM
And... what's in today's news? NRA joins ACLU suit against NSA spying which cold lead to a national registry of gunowners? I read it on foxnews, so it must be true... still, the NRA could just turn over its internal database, and save the government the trouble.

The National Rifle Association on Wednesday filed an amicus brief in federal court supporting an American Civil Liberties Union lawsuit challenging a government phone-tracking program that collects the telephone records of millions of Americans.

The brief argues that the National Security Agency's phone records collection program could "allow identification of NRA members, supporters, potential members, and other persons with whom the NRA communicates, potentially chilling their willingness to communicate with the NRA."

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/09/05/nra-joins-aclu-spying-lawsuit-over-gun-registry-fears/

Frito Bandido
09-05-2013, 8:31 PM
Only like 6% of gun owners are NRA members...

NSA probably has a much more comprehensive database.

njineermike
09-05-2013, 8:35 PM
Basic comprehension fail.

tankarian
09-07-2013, 7:35 AM
Hmmmph. I don't want anyone keeping records of my firearms purchases.



You seem to always have something smeared around your mouth. PM me your address, I have a box of Charmin to send you.
Free.

Skidmark
09-07-2013, 3:11 PM
You seem to always have something smeared around your mouth. PM me your address, I have a box of Charmin to send you. Free.

Manny, why do you always drop your discourse down into the gutter?

tankarian
09-07-2013, 5:31 PM
Because that's where you reside.

Sunday
09-07-2013, 6:16 PM
Realistically one of the reasons you can own a gun today is because of the NRA. I have been at this a long time so I know. The dues paying pro second amendment workers and donating gun owners are carrying the non working non donating gun owners. I know in todays mush head world it sounds harsh but that is the truth.

Sunday
09-07-2013, 6:17 PM
Hmmmph. I don't want anyone keeping records of my firearms purchases.

WASHINGTON — The National Rifle Association has rallied gun-owners — and raised tens of millions of dollars — campaigning against the threat of a national database of firearms or their owners.

But in fact, the sort of vast, secret database the NRA often warns of already exists, despite having been assembled largely without the knowledge or consent of gun owners. It is housed in the Virginia offices of the NRA itself. The country’s largest privately held database of current, former, and prospective gun owners is one of the powerful lobby’s secret weapons, expanding its influence well beyond its estimated 3 million members and bolstering its political supremacy.

That database has been built through years of acquiring gun permit registration lists from state and county offices, gathering names of new owners from the thousands of gun-safety classes taught by NRA-certified instructors and by buying lists of attendees of gun shows, subscribers to gun magazines and more, BuzzFeed has learned.

http://www.buzzfeed.com/stevefriess/how-the-nra-built-a-massive-secret-database-of-gun-owners
The government has records. I wouldn't believe anything else.