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View Full Version : Transporting a gun through a no-gun city


Scarecrow Repair
12-11-2007, 3:22 PM
Someone told me once to stuff a starter pistol in my luggage with all the proper declarations at the airport to keep the TSA thievery to a minimum, and I know Bill has carried guns many times. I mentioned this starter pistol trick to someone else who wondered about the legality of it at the other end.

For example, flying into DC, at least before Parker, would probably be illegal, right? If so, what would happen -- do airlines notify anyone at the destination that a passenger is arriving with a gun in a locked container?

What about transfers within the airport -- would your presence there, even without having your checked luggage in your possession, be something to get arrested for?

What about transferring from one DC airport to the other? Would that cab ride across town with a gun in your locked luggage be arrestable?

What if you take a cab from the airport to a location outside DC where guns are legal?

I would guess that the airline doesn't waste time telling anyone at the destination that you will be arriving with a gun, but one never knows about the TSA.

Smokeybehr
12-11-2007, 3:46 PM
AFAIK, the "Safe Passage" provisions of the Gun Owner's Protection Act should cover you completely, no matter where you're going, as long as you've got a firearm unloaded in a locked container in your luggage.

RAD-CDPII
12-11-2007, 4:22 PM
I don't think I would want to try that in NY, NJ or DC until the Supreme Court rules. In NY you will get arrested. I heard of one case where a person was flying with a gun in checked luggage, he was going to a state where it was legal to do so. Due to bad weather, the plane could not land and they got diverted to NYC, where he was arrested, even though he never had an intent to go there. I believe that he finally got things workd out, but he did spend some time in jail and it cost him big bucks. Just driving through the state with a gun in a locked box in your trunk with no ammo in the car is a fellony, unless you have a NY permit to own one.

bwiese
12-11-2007, 4:32 PM
Correct. FOPA '86 is still young and cities back East don't seem to honor it without a fight.

Expect a court fight at best if you're flying out that away (NY/NJ/MA/MD). I know the NRA is backing two cases out there that have at least as much drama as BWO's.

It'd be interesting to see what happens if you were flying from a legal state (say, VA) to a legal state (say, Maine) and mechanical problems made the flight stop in NY or NJ with a baggage change. Given the NY/NJ mentality something negative could happen.

I only fly to free states anyway unless forced otherwise for biz, and haven't found much reason to go back to East Coast for any reason.

Yes, it's unlikely TSA tells anyone of legal-to-TSA conduct.

1911_sfca
12-12-2007, 12:00 PM
I'm not sure I understand your question. Are you advocating putting a starter gun in your luggage to keep the TSA from stealing things?

I don't understand the logic. Seems like it would just create massive hassles and have no net positive effect.

But maybe my perspective is different -- I have flown 120,000 miles so far this year and wouldn't want to have to deal with going into the TSA office and unlocking my gun case for them on every flight. But then again, I've never had anything stolen by the TSA so I guess I don't even get the premise.

Scarecrow Repair
12-12-2007, 12:07 PM
I'm not sure I understand your question. Are you advocating putting a starter gun in your luggage to keep the TSA from stealing things?

Yes. When you declare you have a firearm in your luggage, they require you to lock it such that the TSA employees can not open it. Otherwise you have to leave it unlocked or with a TSA approved lock which they can open.

Of course, if you have reason to carry a real gun, go ahead. But starter pistols are cheap and small.

At least that is my understanding; I have not flown since all this nonsense started. I am not particularly fond of commute driving, or even driving for errands on nice back roads, but I do like long road trips. I find them very peaceful and much more interesting.

metalhead357
12-12-2007, 6:13 PM
Scarecrow-- Did you post the same over at Amback?

Shotgun Man
12-12-2007, 8:14 PM
Yes. When you declare you have a firearm in your luggage, they require you to lock it such that the TSA employees can not open it. Otherwise you have to leave it unlocked or with a TSA approved lock which they can open.

Of course, if you have reason to carry a real gun, go ahead. But starter pistols are cheap and small.


Gotta love this forum. I learn something new everyday.

Scarecrow Repair
12-12-2007, 11:40 PM
Scarecrow-- Did you post the same over at Amback?

Don't even know what Amback is. I did mention it on an MR2 mailing list. Maybe someone from there posted it. Post a link, that would be interesting.

metalhead357
12-13-2007, 5:49 AM
I had just read these two threads over there, then came here to find your two recent threads and just wondered if one might have been yours....

http://www.ambackforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=53593

http://www.ambackforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=53569

think it was just one of them strange coincidences.....

Scarecrow Repair
12-13-2007, 10:05 AM
I had just read these two threads over there, then came here to find your two recent threads and just wondered if one might have been yours....

http://www.ambackforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=53593

http://www.ambackforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=53569

think it was just one of them strange coincidences.....

Those links are for the other thread only, and I reckon they get the same email newsletter. This thread is unrelated, other than by chance being at the same time.

Glock22Fan
12-13-2007, 10:29 AM
IIRC, the Federal gun transportation rules apply to people travelling through a location, non-stop (except maybe for things like gas).

As soon as you, say, make an overnight stop, or a business call, or personal visit or whatever within that location you are no longer covered by the Federal transport rules and local rules take over.

So, it should be legal to change planes in, say, N.Y. (without leaving the airport), but if your plane is diverted there and you pick up your luggage and go to a hotel, you are in potential trouble.

You might think of it this way. Suppose you were flying to Nairobi on a hunting trip. You might change planes in London, but don't even think about taking your rifles to a London hotel for a stopover.

IANAL, and this isn't legal advice.

rbgaynor
12-13-2007, 10:48 AM
For example, flying into DC, at least before Parker, would probably be illegal, right? If so, what would happen -- do airlines notify anyone at the destination that a passenger is arriving with a gun in a locked container?


Actually, Washington National Airport (now Reagan National) is located in the free state of Virginia, so you would be fine. Follow the rules and you'll have no problems there.

Scarecrow Repair
12-13-2007, 8:28 PM
IIRC, the Federal gun transportation rules apply to people travelling through a location, non-stop (except maybe for things like gas).

As soon as you, say, make an overnight stop, or a business call, or personal visit or whatever within that location you are no longer covered by the Federal transport rules and local rules take over.

So, it should be legal to change planes in, say, N.Y. (without leaving the airport), but if your plane is diverted there and you pick up your luggage and go to a hotel, you are in potential trouble.

And if your change of planes is delayed by bad weather and they want to put you up for the night in a hotel?

Glock22Fan
12-13-2007, 10:06 PM
And if your change of planes is delayed by bad weather and they want to put you up for the night in a hotel?

Exactly!

Sleep in the airport (been there, done that, got the t-shirt). Don't take your guns outside the secure zone.