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View Full Version : KTLA Poll: Heller / Is 2nd Amendment a right?


sc15
11-22-2007, 9:55 AM
I did a search and saw that no one had posted this yet. So far, we're ahead, but let's try to bury this "unscientific poll" deep into their end zone.

Please don't hotlink:

(cut & paste into a new window)

http://ktla.trb.com/news/local/eveningnews/ktla-primenews-poll,0,4116652.special

Addax
11-22-2007, 10:10 AM
Thanks for posting.

I just voted.. so far 84+% in favor of the individuals rights to bear arms under the 2A

Bizcuits
11-22-2007, 10:19 AM
Gave em my vote, 84.4%

SemiAutoSam
11-22-2007, 10:45 AM
Wow that what somewhat refreshing a poll that asked a straight forward question.

IE not like a lot of the other polls that asked it in a way that confused some that may have answered it.

C.G.
11-22-2007, 10:47 AM
84.6%:)

PonchoTA
11-22-2007, 11:15 AM
Not according to that useless POS John Edwards.

I do though! :D
(voting now!)

RP1911
11-22-2007, 11:43 AM
voted 84.7% :)

VegasND
11-22-2007, 12:43 PM
Thanks for providing the link. We need to stay on top of these to bury them. When these 'unscientific' polls go against our view they always make the news. When they go our way they are quietly forgotten...

The only thing we can do is to vote in each one to support our natural rights.

Santa Cruz Armory
11-22-2007, 1:00 PM
I voted....84.9% :D

Piper
11-22-2007, 1:49 PM
:confused: I'm confused. 84.9% of those polled say that the second amendment is an individual right. If this is, shall we say, an indication of the general population of California, why don't we have shall issue? :shrug:

Rivers
11-22-2007, 2:39 PM
:confused: I'm confused. 84.9% of those polled say that the second amendment is an individual right. If this is, shall we say, an indication of the general population of California, why don't we have shall issue? :shrug:

Three possible reasons:

First, the respondents to the polls are either not voting consistent with this poll's result, or

Second, the respondents to these polls are a very polarized group of activists who are in a minority to those who actually vote, or

Third, the people vote for legislators who damn well do what they please once they've gained their office.

I think it's a combination of each, with portions changing depending on where in the state you vote.

Equalizer2
11-22-2007, 2:49 PM
Do you think the right to bear arms is an individual right?

85.4%
Yes (2292 responses)

14.6%
No (392 responses)

2684 total responses:):):)

jumbopanda
11-22-2007, 2:49 PM
Anyone who thinks that the Second Amendment is not an individual right must be mentally deficient.

Fjold
11-22-2007, 3:01 PM
85.5% correct

Crazed_SS
11-22-2007, 4:26 PM
Three possible reasons:

First, the respondents to the polls are either not voting consistent with this poll's result, or

Second, the respondents to these polls are a very polarized group of activists who are in a minority to those who actually vote, or

Third, the people vote for legislators who damn well do what they please once they've gained their office.

I think it's a combination of each, with portions changing depending on where in the state you vote.

Also, we need to keep in mind that everyone who supports the RKBA does not have a single borg-style hive mind. Many people think citizens should be able to own a gun, some of those same people dont think shall-issue CCW is a good idea.

My manager at work who was a Captain in the Marines shoots pistols regularly and was talking to me recently about buying a shotgun for HD. I was showing him some AR stuff and he says, "Well, people dont need guns like that"

So even amongst gun owners and enthusiasts, opinions can vary widely. According to some here, I dont support the 2nd because I dont want an OLL. However, my other buddy who owns simply owns an old .38 cal revolver thinks I'm a "gun nut" and other colorful names.

BigDogatPlay
11-22-2007, 4:50 PM
My vote is in and we've cracked 86%.

subdjoe
11-22-2007, 6:34 PM
Do you think the right to bear arms is an individual right?

86.2%
Yes (2467 responses)

13.8%
No (395 responses)

2862 total responses

"I'm confused. 84.9% of those polled say that the second amendment is an individual right. If this is, shall we say, an indication of the general population of California, why don't we have shall issue? "

Because too many gun owners in CA are content to sit on their backsides and debate the merits of the latest fad cartridge v. the classic that it is a ballistic twin of, rather than hammering the capons in Sacramento and holding their feet to the constitutional fire.

Here is a rant I wrote a few years ago on this subject:


GET OFF YOUR COMPLACENCY AND DO YOUR PART!
In California there are at least 6,000,000 firearms owners, yet we
have some of the most draconian and Byzantine firearms laws in the
country. Why? Because too many of us are content to sit and complain
but are unwilling to take half an hour a week to do anything about it.
Most of us would rather stand around at the range or in a gun shop
and spend a couple of hours debating the merits of .300 Magnum over
the latest .270 super short ultra mag. Can you find five minutes a
day to support your civil rights? That is all it takes. If you can't
give that little amount of time, you deserve to have your guns
legislated away from you. Imagine if in your assembly district EVERY
gun owner called his or her assembly member once a week to complain
about restrictive firearms legislation. Say there are only 15,000 gun
owners in your district (with 80 districts that comes to 1.2 million,
a far cry from all the legal gun owners in the state) and each one
makes a call once a week which takes 3 minutes of staff time. It
would take 750 man-hours per WEEK just to listen to gun owners
complain about restrictive gun laws. That would mean that every
member of the Assembly would need almost 19 full time staff members to
do nothing but pay attention to our calls. Think they might hear us?
After all, politicians are concerned with numbers.

There are five calls you need to make each week to one assembly
member, one state senator, one member of the House of Representatives,
and two members of the US Senate. That is what it will take, each of
us calling once a week to make our views known.

Yes, you may belong to the NRA or Gun Owners of America, or the
California Rifle and Pistol Association, but so what? Do you think
that absolves you from taking personal responsibility for what
happens? YOU are responsible for protecting your rights. No one else
can do it for you.

cadurand
11-22-2007, 6:53 PM
Here is a rant I wrote a few years ago on this subject:

GET OFF YOUR COMPLACENCY AND DO YOUR PART!
In California there are at least 6,000,000 firearms owners, yet we
have some of the most draconian and Byzantine firearms laws in the
country. [rant edited for everyone's sake ] You assume that those 6,000,000 firearms owners vote as a single block. They do not. As someone else has already stated those 6,000,000 voters(assuming they even vote) run from "everything is fine - I can get the guns I want" to "take my gun from my cold dead fingers".

I too am amazed when one of my gun owning friends says things like "Why would anyone need an AR-15?" or "Can you imagine if everyone was carrying a pistol?" But that is their right to think that.

The problem isn't complacency. The "problem" is most people, including a lot of firearms owners, don't understand how the Consitution works and the purpose of the Bill of Rights. The Bill of Rights grants no rights to the people. We are born with those rights and those rights are inalienable. The BOR tells the government to leave those rights alone. It's time for the Supreme Court to clarify this point to the gun grabbing government.

So instead of pointing your finger at 6,000,000 people and telling us how to defend our rights just lead by example.. those who want to follow your lead will.

m03
11-22-2007, 8:26 PM
"Well, people dont need guns like that"


My response is usually along the lines of "What's with this 'need' crap? I'll have it because I want it, and because it's my right."

Then I'll point out how they don't 'need' a car, or a television, or an internet connection, etc, etc.

subdjoe
11-22-2007, 8:36 PM
Cadurand, you sort of missed my point. I wasn't assuming that they vote as a block, I was suggesting that they get off their behinds and make phone calls and write letters concerning CAs oppressive gun laws. There is a slight difference. (But, wouldn't it be nice if we could all get together and vote as a block?)

I agree with you about what the Constitution and BoR do. I point that out to people, too. They are the contract between the People and the Government. We cede some of our sovreign power to the State in the Constitution and carefully circumscribe that power. The BoR is our way of basically telling it "You will NOT have any power in these areas." I'll often ask people what the Constitution does. All too often I get the "It gives us our rights" line as an answer. And then quote the 9th & 10th to them to show that the framers could indeed differentiate between the State and the People and between powers and rights. And then ask where the unenumerated rights mentioned in the 9th come from.

And how do I "lead by example" in this area? Post all my letters to the capons in Sac & DC? Show the stubs from my ballots? Produce my phone bills to show that I make the calls that I ask them to make? I'm trying to goad people into taking responsibility for their rights and recognizing their civic duty.

I think we are after the same thing. But I'm tired of gun owners whining about the bad gun laws, and when asked if they are contacting their legislators claim they don't have the time or it doesn't matter what they do. The capons look at numbers. If we were to bury them with our concerns, they might take notice. If Koretz got 15k calls/letters every week complaining about restrictive gun law, do you think he would still introduce all the loopy legislation he does? He wants to get reelected (or if he is being termed out, elected to the other house). To do that he needs votes. If he thinks he is going to piss off a block of at least 15k voters, he just might think 2 or 3 times about acting against the RKBA.

Am I too harsh? Maybe. But, can one be too harsh in trying to protect our civil rights?

brassburnz
11-22-2007, 11:13 PM
Just tryig to keep this thing going. The link is still good. Don't know how much longer it will last.



Randy
NRA Life Member

subdjoe
11-23-2007, 1:52 AM
Do you think the right to bear arms is an individual right?

86.7%
Yes (2636 responses)

13.3%
No (405 responses)

3041 total responses

(Poll results not scientific

Rob P.
11-23-2007, 7:44 AM
And how do I "lead by example" in this area? Post all my letters to the capons in Sac & DC? Show the stubs from my ballots? Produce my phone bills to show that I make the calls that I ask them to make?

Run for office. Even if you lose you provide a visual and societal example of someone who acts on his beliefs. You provide substance for social commentary. And you get your 15 mins to promote your message.

And if you win.....

DRSFEFA
11-23-2007, 7:56 AM
I voted. And it's up to 87% !

SemiAutoSam
11-23-2007, 8:11 AM
Please remove the hotlink

Just tryig to keep this thing going. The link is still good. Don't know how much longer it will last.
Randy
NRA Life Member

jester
11-23-2007, 1:10 PM
87.4% Yes! 11/23/07 1410pm

ybz
11-23-2007, 1:27 PM
KTLA Poll: Heller / Is 2nd Amendment a right?


the poll should be: is it 'the bill of rights' or 'the bill of some rights' or 'the bill of rights for some' ???

Charliegone
11-23-2007, 3:23 PM
Also, we need to keep in mind that everyone who supports the RKBA does not have a single borg-style hive mind. Many people think citizens should be able to own a gun, some of those same people dont think shall-issue CCW is a good idea.

My manager at work who was a Captain in the Marines shoots pistols regularly and was talking to me recently about buying a shotgun for HD. I was showing him some AR stuff and he says, "Well, people dont need guns like that"

So even amongst gun owners and enthusiasts, opinions can vary widely. According to some here, I dont support the 2nd because I dont want an OLL. However, my other buddy who owns simply owns an old .38 cal revolver thinks I'm a "gun nut" and other colorful names.

You are correct. Some do not take it that seriously as we really should. "Hey they're not going after my hunting rifle so I'm fine with it." That kind of mentality will split and destroy our goals....because let's face it. Once they have banned something or implemented another draconian gun law, they will keep going after it until nothing exists.

wilit
11-23-2007, 3:32 PM
87.4%

BillCA
11-23-2007, 3:58 PM
Just voted... seems to still be working.

Do you think the right to bear arms is an individual right?

Yes http://ktla.trb.com/images/standard/red.gif 87.8%
(3067 responses)

Nohttp://ktla.trb.com/images/standard/red.gif 12.2%
(425 responses)

3492 total responses

(Poll results not scientific)

Shotgun Man
11-23-2007, 4:03 PM
Very good post. I just voted. I'm pleased with the amount of replies.

boogak
11-23-2007, 4:11 PM
89% my friends