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Addax
11-21-2007, 8:33 AM
Just found this and thought it would be interesting to compare different states:

http://www.disastercenter.com/crime/

Interesting to look at crime rates in California vs. other states

Of course the populations densities are not the same as California, but it is still interesting to see that we have much higher crime rates than other states.

I wonder what the California Crime Statistics would be like, if we had firearms laws like those in Texas?

Ford8N
11-21-2007, 4:16 PM
In Kalistan:


The murder rate went UP after the 1968 federal gun laws were enacted.
The murder rate went UP after the Roberti/Roos AW ban was enacted.
The murder rate went UP after SB 23 was enacted.

I wonder if this means something...

5968
11-21-2007, 6:05 PM
More control for us. That is excatly what we need. Yes, I'm being sarcastic..

Addax
11-21-2007, 9:49 PM
In Kalistan:


The murder rate went UP after the 1968 federal gun laws were enacted.
The murder rate went UP after the Roberti/Roos AW ban was enacted.
The murder rate went UP after SB 23 was enacted.

I wonder if this means something...

Exactly how I saw it too.

Especially the jump after RR!

Crazed_SS
11-21-2007, 9:59 PM
Just found this and thought it would be interesting to compare different states:

http://www.disastercenter.com/crime/

Interesting to look at crime rates in California vs. other states

Of course the populations densities are not the same as California, but it is still interesting to see that we have much higher crime rates than other states.

I wonder what the California Crime Statistics would be like, if we had firearms laws like those in Texas?

I think a better comparison would be to compare crime rates in two like areas.
Like compare a big city like Dallas, TX to a big city like San Diego, CA.

Addax
11-21-2007, 10:08 PM
I think a better comparison would be to compare crime rates in two like areas.
Like compare a big city like Dallas, TX to a big city like San Diego, CA.

That would be a good comparison except, doesn't San Diego have allot of crime due to being in such close proximity to the US-Mexico Border? My guess would be that the crime rate (would need to research this more) would be much higher in San Diego vs. Dallas?

Crazed_SS
11-21-2007, 10:12 PM
Actually San Diego has doesnt have that much crime. We have a pretty low crime rates in the country for a city of this size. Apparently Dallas is the worst.. even with their shall-issue CCW and normal gun laws.. but then other Texas big cities are up there with the safer cities..

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14910822/
(article is kinda old)

So, honestly I dont think the mere presence or abscense of guns and gun laws have a huge affect on crime. Crime is more of a social and sometimes cultural ill.

MedSpec65
11-21-2007, 11:00 PM
CA is rated #9 in overall violent crime. Higher up on the list than New York, Michigan and Jersey. Detroit is the murder capital of the country. Oakland, CA is number 4. Richmond, Ca is #9.

BillCA
11-22-2007, 12:55 AM
A picture is worth a thousand words, so...

http://i241.photobucket.com/albums/ff111/BillCA/Hobby/misc/CACrime1960_2006.jpg

Apologies for some of the sloppy graphics.

Historical notes:
1960-1968 : Vietnam war, Civil Rights & Vietnam protests
1968-1980 : Declining Economy
1981-1996 : Improving Economy, Crack Cocaine introduced, Gulf-War I
1996-2000 : Dot Com Economy boom
2001-2006 : Good Economy, War on Terror

Draw your own conclusions.

If anyone has or knows where to get immigration stats for the same time period you'll see an interesting relationship to crime & immigration. I've lost my source for the information, unfortunately.

LECTRIKHED
11-22-2007, 9:06 AM
Most of the crime stats are lies. If you live in a small town and look at the official crime reports for the year, they substantially differ from what is reported in the news.

I think the crime stats only go with convictions. For example if person A paints swastikas on a Jewish person's house, is arrested but pleads out to misdermeanor vandalism, they report it as misdermeanor vandilism not a hate crime. It is a convenient way of keeping crime stats lower. Police can also fail to take a report, some will refuse to do a report. Many stats do not report the actual crimes rather the convictions.

Higher crime rates can mean many things such as tougher DAs, or better police.

Yankee Clipper
11-22-2007, 8:20 PM
Actually San Diego has doesnt have that much crime. We have a pretty low crime rates in the country for a city of this size. Apparently Dallas is the worst.. even with their shall-issue CCW and normal gun laws.. but then other Texas big cities are up there with the safer cities..
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14910822/
(article is kinda old)
So, honestly I dont think the mere presence or abscense of guns and gun laws have a huge affect on crime. Crime is more of a social and sometimes cultural ill.

The FBI agrees with you SS, crime levels are determined by such factors as economic conditions, cultural factors, climate, citizens attitudes towards police but not gun control (American Rifleman, Dec 2007).
Interestingly, CA has more target shooters then any other state including TX. That's from American Sports Data (ASD) as quoted by Gun Test, Aug 2007. CA has 2,162 target shooters (using shotgun, handguns and rifles) to TX 1,262.
Maybe TX has more hunters and other gun owners then we do and that could skew the percentage of total gun-ownership in TX favor.
Bottom line is the number of guns and legality of so called assault weapons does not impact crime statistics.

Ford8N
11-23-2007, 4:51 AM
The FBI agrees with you SS, crime levels are determined by such factors as economic conditions, cultural factors, climate, citizens attitudes towards police but not gun control (American Rifleman, Dec 2007).

Bottom line is the number of guns and legality of so called assault weapons does not impact crime statistics.

If that is the case, why do all the leading LEO organizations support bans on AW's and are against CCW's?

And the fact that these statistics show that AW bans have NO effect on crime rates, yet our rulers vote to restrict EBR.

And people like AM and Rep. Carolyn McCarthy (D) use silly emotional arguments about how "evil" barrel shrouds and "hip spraying" is when describing AW's. Then the rulers vote to ban AW's.


Maybe I just too "left brained" for this state.:(

mini rant off...:D

BillCA
11-23-2007, 6:05 AM
I think the crime stats only go with convictions.

Actually, it's the opposite. The FBI's UCR is based on police reports of crimes reported to the police.

Thus, if a police officer takes a crime report about the defacing of Jewish home and lists it as a hate-crime, that's how it will be classified. If the arrestee later pleads to a misdemeanor, it's not shown in the UCR. Likewise, if the person is convicted in the following calendar year it's not listed as a "cleared" crime in the year of occurance.


Higher crime rates can mean many things such as tougher DAs, or better police.

Higher crime rate can indicate several things -- a better police force, better relations between the police & public, less "gaming" the system by the police administration and, of course, more crime.

Some agencies have been accused of "gaming" the system to keep their stats lower -- so property values stay up and money comes into the area. For example, Fremont, CA no longer responds to burglar alarms without a person reporting an actual crime in progress. If you call about a burglary that occurred, it's likely to be classified as "theft" if the loss is below $1k. Several cities in the East were accused of "cooking the books" to show lower crime rates by not taking crime reports if there were no suspects.

There are quite a few known problems with the UCR, but it's still the standard statistical system for judging crime rates.