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PonchoTA
11-19-2007, 12:06 AM
Ok, I'm just about sold on getting an AK for my SHTF rifle next due to it's reliability characteristics. (I'll work on getting an AR later too though!)

My questions are:
Is the AK-74 better/easier/less expensive than the AK-47? The AK-74 is a newer/refined version of the AK-47, but shoots a different round, a 5.45mm I believe? How good is this round really? Also, how readily available is the round? Can I get it at Wally World? (or similar, my reasoning just not having to go to a specialty store or online to get ammo is the actual question) I hadn't heard of the round at all prior to hearing about this gun today, so I'm a bit leery getting a weapon that I may trust my life to that I won't be able to keep stocked with ammo easily.
There is plenty of material concerning the 5.56mm NATO round, and the old 7.62mm traditional round, but I would like some first hand experience and accounting with this if possible!

Lastly, concerning the AK-47/74 (and all the variants), with so many manufacturers of them, which is the better buy, for reliability, and longevity as well: Romanian? Russian? Czech? Chinese? Others? Several different places make them, but I've heard that they all have different levels of quality as well. Can you help me decipher which is which?

I hope I haven't bored you with questions I'm sure you've heard many times, but still want to get the straight answers here!

Thanks again,
Paul

5150-417
11-19-2007, 12:34 AM
never seen 7.62 at walmart. I got the vector arms ak-47 from chris at lanworldinc which i beleive is made of hungarian parts, i've never had a missfire out of the 700 hundred wolf rounds i put through her.

http://lanworldinc.com/AK47.html


here's my babe if you wanna check her out
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=73949

jandmtv
11-19-2007, 1:13 AM
stick to a ak47. the 7.62x39 round is much more powerful. but then again is more expensive than 5.45. so its really up to you. but for me its the original 47 that does it.

JeffM
11-19-2007, 1:24 AM
ak74=more expensive, less available rifle and parts. Cheaper, but less readily available ammo.

ak47=less expensive, more available rifles and parts. More expensive, but much more available ammo.

Stay away from WASR.

That's about it.

Enjoy!

JeffM
11-19-2007, 1:28 AM
If I ever get around to it, this is going to be my SHTF gun:

http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/cc154/JeffMsJunk/P1010010.jpg

bigthaiboy
11-19-2007, 1:58 AM
The AK-74 fires the 5.45x39mm round which is known for it's wounding effect due to a pronounced tumbling effect against soft tissue. It is a 50gr bullet which travels at a touch under 3000ft/sec. The only sources of 5.45mm ammo at present appears to be Wolf and bulk surplus of 1200rd can for around $120 (10 cents a round). It is an uncommon round to find in gun stores, so no chance of finding it in any Walmart, any time soon. It's all steel cased and steel jacketed (not CA range safe) ammo.

AK-74 rifles tend to be more expensive than AK-47, as the only ones currently hitting our shores are US built rifles from de-milled parts kits. Even the parts kits will cost you minimum $350.

The AK-47 is as common as dirt and fires the 7.62x39mm round which is harder hitting and is available from several sources in the form of Wolf, Brown Bear, Barnaul, Silver Bear, and Golden Tiger for steel case, or Winchester, Fiocchi, and Remington for brass case. You can find Remington 7.62mm in some Walmarts.

Romanian? Russian? Czech? Chinese? Others? Several different places make them, but I've heard that they all have different levels of quality as well. Can you help me decipher which is which?


You can no longer find Russian or Chinese AKs, as they have not been imported since the 90's (blame Bill Clinton's administration), the Czechs did not have the AK, but had their own version, the VZ-58, which is entirely different: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sa_58

The only parts kits for K-47s still in circulation seems to be Hungarian, Polish, Yugo, but the most common and cheapest being the Romanian G kits.

AK-74 kits are either Romanian or Bulgarian.

You can build your own AK-47 for about $300 (including the necessary 922(r) U.S. made parts) and AK-74 for $500+. Either that or you could buy a REAA Saiga.

PonchoTA
11-19-2007, 6:28 AM
Wow! Thanks for the info guys!

A couple of new ones now!

What's "WASR"? And why stay away from them?
I searched for the REAA Saiga, can't find it. More info? Would this be a good gun for my purpose and that's why you mentioned it?

I presume that like the AR guns, only parts of the AK are controlled, so I could buy everything else separately, then just get the last DROS piece and assemble myself? I can buy the part already made (receiver with 'bullet button' or whatever?) which will allow me to have the detachable magazines, yes? I realize this will require the use of an MMG or similar, so that will suck.

Then what do I do? Do I have to get it "checked" by some authority that I haven't made an "assault rifle"?

Thanks for all the help so far guys! You rock!

:cheers:

viras
11-19-2007, 7:28 AM
Wow! Thanks for the info guys!

A couple of new ones now!

What's "WASR"? And why stay away from them?
I searched for the REAA Saiga, can't find it. More info? Would this be a good gun for my purpose and that's why you mentioned it?

I presume that like the AR guns, only parts of the AK are controlled, so I could buy everything else separately, then just get the last DROS piece and assemble myself? I can buy the part already made (receiver with 'bullet button' or whatever?) which will allow me to have the detachable magazines, yes? I realize this will require the use of an MMG or similar, so that will suck.

Then what do I do? Do I have to get it "checked" by some authority that I haven't made an "assault rifle"?

Thanks for all the help so far guys! You rock!

:cheers:

I think BigThaiBoy meant the "RAA Saiga", i.e. the Russian American Armory Saiga (not to be confused with the EAA Saiga, i.e. the European American Armory Corporation's version of the Saiga Rifle). The RAA Saiga is legal in Cali, whereas to my knowledge, the EAA Saiga is not.

http://www.raacfirearms.com/Saiga.htm

You can get it chambered in .308, .223, or 7.62x39mm.

I have the .308, and it kicks @$$.

This rifle is CA Gun Law compliant out-of-box because it doesn't come with the traditional pistol grip that other AK's come with. If you wanna add a pistol grip, you will need to do some work to it. I think it looks fine just the way it is:

http://img53.imageshack.us/img53/162/dsc01210nl9.jpg

savageevo
11-19-2007, 8:01 AM
just buy both, combine price for both is equal to one ar.

supersonic
11-19-2007, 1:02 PM
more available ammo.

Stay away from WASR.


Enjoy!

Unless you are mechanically inclined enough (and have about $5.00 for parts)to fix the "little bugs" involved. Yes, they're rough at first, but mine now runs like a true AK should: PERMANENTLY. Oh, and they are only about $329 NEW!!!!:)

bobfried
11-19-2007, 4:09 PM
Give your business to the vendors here on the forum and spend that extra $100 on a quality AK. You can get excellent quality AK's in the $400-$500 range easily that will cheaper in the end than buying a WASr and "upgrading" it. Henderson Defense (one of our vendors here on Calguns based in Nevada) has AK47's with all the good stuff I would want for $475. You'd be hard press to build it yourself for that kind of money and using the same quality parts. I didn't even know it was possible to see words such as: DC Industries, K-Var, chromelined in an AK costing less than $800.

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=75295

bigthaiboy
11-19-2007, 9:54 PM
Sorry, REAA = mistyped. Its RAA, Russian American Armory. Here's their site:
http://www.raacfirearms.com/Saiga.htm

mason1800
11-19-2007, 11:46 PM
Just get both. You'll kick yourself later if you dont.

thedrickel
11-19-2007, 11:58 PM
If I ever get around to it, this is going to be my SHTF gun:

http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/cc154/JeffMsJunk/P1010010.jpg

Dude, that is MY SHTF gun! .223 AK (Saiga) with folding stock, pistol grip & Galil/AR mag adapter :drool5:

I have the .223 Saiga already, gotta get the bullet guide & mag adapter and undo the funky trigger linkage

JeffM
11-20-2007, 12:12 PM
Same same. I don't even have the base Saiga yet, but I hope to when I build up the gun-fund reserve. I actually like the stock Saiga and will probably keep it that way to use detachable mags.

Dude, that is MY SHTF gun! .223 AK (Saiga) with folding stock, pistol grip & Galil/AR mag adapter :drool5:

I have the .223 Saiga already, gotta get the bullet guide & mag adapter and undo the funky trigger linkage

supersonic
11-23-2007, 7:16 AM
Give your business to the vendors here on the forum and spend that extra $100 on a quality AK. You can get excellent quality AK's in the $400-$500 range easily that will cheaper in the end than buying a WASr and "upgrading" it. Henderson Defense (one of our vendors here on Calguns based in Nevada) has AK47's with all the good stuff I would want for $475. You'd be hard press to build it yourself for that kind of money and using the same quality parts. I didn't even know it was possible to see words such as: DC Industries, K-Var, chromelined in an AK costing less than $800.

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=75295

Got my WASR from a C.G. sponsor/affiliate. "upgrades" were only a $5.00 part/$6-7 for stain&outer finish for wood (optional)/lube w/ quality stuff (I used MilComm TW25/ send about 200 rds. downrange & (my) WASR was then 100% reliable & (for an AK) surprisingly accurate! Oh, and the BBL on a GP WASR10 is hard chrome-lined.:)