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elite_is3
11-08-2007, 6:33 PM
i had finished my first stag arm a couple months back, shot it, and found my groupings low so i assumed i was flinching so i resumed. This time today, months later, same thing, had a friend shoot it, same lower grouping....obviously now im sure the elevation is off since the Hits where about 5 inches below target area at 25 yards.

i thought they were zeroed from factory? am i missing something lol :confused:

CSDGuy
11-08-2007, 6:40 PM
It might be factory boresighted or it might have been zeroed for someone else. Case in point, a friend of mine has a K31 with some VERY nice iron sights on it. He shoots X ring with it... w/o changing his settings, I will shoot about 1/2 MOA to the right... same size groups.

elite_is3
11-08-2007, 6:44 PM
hmm...ok, well whatever it is we both have same issue...very odd. ill have to zero the front sight next time

Paratus et Vigilans
11-08-2007, 6:49 PM
If you have a flat top receiver, with the attachable carry handle or the ARMS 40L flip up rear sight, you need to get a taller front sight post. Trust me, been there, done that, don't know why Stag ships 'em that way - - get the taller front sight posts from the Bushmaster website. BM even explains why you need them with the flat top receiver and iron sights.

Oh, and NO Stags are factory zeroed - - nor are BM's or anyone else I know of, except White Oak Armament zeros their CMP service rifle uppers for 100 yds. When it comes to zeroing, you're on your own! 25 yds = 300 yds for a 5.56 mm 55 gr. FMJ round. Same crossing point on the trajectory. Search the web for zeroing an AR and you'll get scads of hits on how to do it. I use the "improved battlefield zero" on my irons, except for my CMP service rifle upper. You have to take the sight apart a little bit to do that, and you have to have one that's adjustable for elevation to do it, too! If you've just got a flip up rear sight, then it's all in the front sight post. Oh yeah, buy the front sight post tool from BM too, it makes life a lot easier!

Good luck!

4 Brigada
11-08-2007, 6:50 PM
Eye postion, face structure cheek weld is different for everyone. If its shooting low for both re zero the sight. Lots of info on zero and battlesighting AR type rifle on the internet, pick one you like

elite_is3
11-08-2007, 6:54 PM
yea i have the Stag 2 with a midwest industries rear flip up, ill pick up that tool as well. thanks guys

CSDGuy
11-08-2007, 6:55 PM
If the front sight is too tall relative to the rear sight... THAT would easily cause the 5" low groupings. At least with my M1 Garand, zeroing the rifle was pretty easy. I just needed to adjust about 2 MOA right and 8 clicks up from bottom for a decent 200 yard zero... for that particular rifle.

ocabj
11-08-2007, 7:25 PM
Am I missing something? How can a gun be factory zeroed if you have 3rd party sights? Did you buy the Stag direct from Stag with the Midwest Industries flip up rear sight and whatever front sight?

PanzerAce
11-08-2007, 7:54 PM
Different zeros for different people.

Personally, I liked zeroing my AK. I just guessed how many turns the front sight needed in elevation :p

Paratus et Vigilans
11-08-2007, 7:55 PM
yea i have the Stag 2 with a midwest industries rear flip up, ill pick up that tool as well. thanks guys

I don't know if the MI flip sight has the same front sight post issues as the ARMS 40L and the carry-handle A3. You may not need the taller front sight post with that one, and the low groups certainly suggests that you've already got that front sight post cranked up too tall.

Before you go for any other fixes (other than the tool - that's a must-have for any AR owner's range bag) try cranking it down a dozen clicks or so (three full rotations) and see where you are. Try to use a rest of some kind so you've got a fairly stable base from which to fire.

Does the MI flip sight have alternate aperatures? If so, are you using one that's appropriate for the 0-300 meter distances? You should be, if you're zeroing at 25 yards.

Hey, at least you're on paper! :D

Fjold
11-08-2007, 8:05 PM
Adjust your sights.

Very few people can shoot the same zero with iron sights.

Lon Moer
11-08-2007, 8:09 PM
Zeroing methods (http://groups.msn.com/TheMarylandAR15ShootersSite/zeroingmethods.msnw)

PanzerAce
11-08-2007, 9:34 PM
Adjust your sights.

Very few people can shoot the same zero with iron sights.

:werd:

when the local PD gets a new officer/rifle, they don't even bother to pre zero, they just take them to the range and make them do it.

akjunkie
11-09-2007, 8:09 AM
originally i had my ARs zeroed using the USMC 25/300M battle zero.

recently my LEO buddy turned me onto this.

25yds, POI 1.2 inches below POA. seems it provides the flattest trajectory.

http://www.policeone.com/police-products/firearms/accessories/sights-scopes/articles/1298015