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View Full Version : Question for you Highpower guys...


nic
11-06-2007, 12:47 PM
... or rifle shooters in general.

I've always been primarily a rifle shooter, and with the exception of my scoped heavy-barreled bolt action rifle I do all of my range practice from the different shooting positions (i.e. offhand, sitting, kneeling, prone). My question is this- in the cross-legged sitting position, do any of you ever have a problem with your legs starting to tense and wobble? It actually funny that I have no tension problems in my upper body but after awhile of holding my sights on a target in the cross-legged sitting position I notice my legs start to wobble from supporting the weight of my arms/rifle. Any suggestions?
Thanks,
Nic

Fjold
11-06-2007, 1:00 PM
The more you do it the easier it gets. I have a bad knee and can't kneel at all so I only used the sitting position for years.

30Cal
11-06-2007, 1:51 PM
I don't have that problem. The sitting rapidfire stage is only 60 seconds long.

Cross legged doesn't work for me. I shoot cross -ankled.

http://webpages.charter.net/tyoberg/upload/DSCN3287.JPG

nic
11-06-2007, 2:11 PM
I don't have that problem. The sitting rapidfire stage is only 60 seconds long.

No wonder I'm getting wobbles! When I practice I do it for ten, fifteen minutes or something at a stretch. I've never actually shot a highpower match before, I just practice the position shooting, so I have no idea what the stages are like in terms of length etc.

-Nic

Fjold
11-06-2007, 2:14 PM
No wonder I'm getting wobbles! When I practice I do it for ten, fifteen minutes or something at a stretch. I've never actually shot a highpower match before, I just practice the position shooting, so I have no idea what the stages are like in terms of length etc.

-Nic

Courses of Fire
There are 4 strings of fire which are the basic building blocks of any NRA high power rifle course of fire or tournament. These are:

1. Slow Fire, standing - 10 rounds at 200 yards in 10 minutes.
2. Rapid Fire, sitting or kneeling - 10 rounds at 200 yards in 60 seconds.
3. Rapid Fire, 10 rounds prone - 300 yards in 70 seconds.
4. Slow Fire, 10 rounds prone - 500 or 600 yards in 10 minutes.

ocabj
11-06-2007, 2:22 PM
You really shouldn't get tense and wobbly in cross legged. If you are, I believe that you are using leg muscles to get your knees higher, which isn't a good thing. But if you can maintain a stable cross legged position without issues for at least 2 minutes, you should be fine as is.

I use cross ankle and I do sometimes stay in position for a long time (10 mins) when practicing at the range. My only problem if I do stay in position for a long time is that my legs fall asleep.

nic
11-06-2007, 8:33 PM
Thanks for the info, guys. OK, just another quick question. In the cross-ankled position (which works much better for me, thanks for the suggestion) how do you control the elevation? I can lift my sights OK by moving my left knee, but is this the correct way to do it?

-Nic

4 Brigada
11-06-2007, 8:40 PM
I can lift my sights OK by moving my left knee, but is this the correct way to do it?


Are you comfortable? Does it work good for you? Then its not the correct way. No seriously now, there is no wrong way unless do dont meet the position criteria

ocabj
11-06-2007, 9:19 PM
Speaking as a right handed shooter:

You can make some adjustments to your elevation in cross ankle by varying where your left ankle rests with respects to the right ankle. Your right leg position is usually the 'fixed' leg which won't move. You can slightly move the left leg forward or backward, varying what part of your lower leg/ankle area is resting on the right ankle area.

After you find an elevation that allows for a (fairly) comfortable and stable (as possible) hold, then you can make minor adjustments by varying where on the stock your support hand is positioned. Most people I know choke up on the forearm in sitting. On the AR15, the support hand is often at the middle of the handguard, and sometimes even closer to the magazine well.

I started with cross legged by switched to cross ankle because my own personal sitting scores were very inconsistent. Cross ankle resulted in me increasing my consistently. But, amazingly enough, I have never cleaned sitting in an official NRA approved/registered match or EIC match. I always shoot 98-99%. Looking back in the data book, I haven't shot less than 98 on a single string ever since I switched to cross ankle.

But, this is what I found works for me personally. Lots of people shoot cross legged and they shoot cleans. So neither position is better than the other. Do a lot of experimenting at the range. Live fire in either range practice drills and in matches are the only way to really figure it all out.

M. Sage
11-07-2007, 6:07 AM
Good info. For some reason, I've never been able to sit cross-legged without falling over backwards. :confused:

30Cal
11-07-2007, 8:46 AM
Thanks for the info, guys. OK, just another quick question. In the cross-ankled position (which works much better for me, thanks for the suggestion) how do you control the elevation? I can lift my sights OK by moving my left knee, but is this the correct way to do it?

-Nic

Make sure you've got the sling in action. You can change elevation by moving that bottom foot forward or back and you can also choke up on the rifle (grasp it closer to the magazine). If you see the sight bounce due to pulse, try unbuckling your pants (seriously).

If I don't have a sling, I shoot sitting with my legs out in front of me.


I had the same inconsistent scores (more like zeros) with the cross legged position. It put a lot of cant on the rifle which varied from one day to the next and also forced my head into a terribly unnatural position. I've since decided that having a comfortable head position (where the eye naturally falls behind the sight without effort) is paramount. If you're muscling your eye into position, then something is badly wrong and the position is fundamentally flawed.

For target shooting/competition, a little cant is OK. A lot of cant (20 or more) can be troublesome. For field use, I'd shoot with the rifle straight up (it generally doesn't have to hold up for multiple shots).

Ty