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View Full Version : Why I am no longer a CRPA member.


Sam Hainn
11-04-2007, 11:19 AM
I was going to post this in another thread, but I feel it stands well on it's own -- and should, maybe as a message to CRPA if any of their top-brass ever visit Calguns.

Why I am no longer a CRPA member / Why I never joined GOC.

I've been an NRA member for 22 years. I'm quite proud of that. Especially over the last 2 years. The NRA has proven themselves in the past 2 years -- they've listened to us here in CA, put their money where their members were, and have made CA a priority.

I've been an FCSA member since 2001 and quite proud of that. FCSA has proven how a small gun-rights organization should operate, and have done it so well, they make the CRPA look incompetent.

I was a CRPA member for 12 years (I came to CA 13 years ago and joined - it sounded good at the time). I was proud of that. Then I started to see what CRPA was about. It didn't take anyone else to show me that the CRPA was a bunch of talking heads with wallets for vacuum machines. They were intangible. I realized too often they were never to be found at important 2nd amendment rights events. I've only seen the CRPA at gun shows, signing up new members and asking for donations. Their own advice on anti-gun legislation always seems late to the game. Their website is lousy. Their monthly magazine is usually several months behind what is happening in Sacramento.

After joining FCSA in 2001 and seeing how that small organization operated, with meetings, active gatherings, open communication among members, transparency of expenses, a great members' magazine, vocal participation with board elections, and a great website -- I realized how little CRPA actually does. CRPA's indifference to SB15, AB50, and some of the ammo-fee bills bugged me, but their lack of appearance at the 8/16/06 DOJ regulatory hearing last year on the OLL/detachable magazine issue clinched it. I did not renew my CRPA membership in October 2006. This latest turn makes me feel good that the money and participation I was giving CRPA before, now goes double to the NRA.

I've never been impressed by GOC. My first examination of GOC said to me it was run by a single guy for personal profit. that's how poorly presented it was. I've never seen GOC at any legislation events or 2nd amendment forums. I've never seen a single accomplishment by GOC. It appears to me I've done more to stop anti-gun legislation on my own in one month's time than GOC ever has in its whole existence.

I was a GOA member for a while but saw in them some of the similar things that could be seen in GOC, and did not renew.

I don't think I would ever blindly sign on to be a life-member of anything. I hold my membership as a way to express my opinion. If the NRA started using a Swastika tomorrow in their advertising, or supported Microstamping, I certainly would not want to be a member anymore. I can now express to CRPA that they lost me as a member through their own inaction. I could not have done that as a 'life member'. Life memberships are for cults.

xYourLocalAR15x
11-04-2007, 11:54 AM
very nice write up :)

God Bless The Mauser
11-04-2007, 12:05 PM
If the NRA started using a Swastika tomorrow in their advertising, or supported Microstamping, I certainly would not want to be a member anymore.

Just remember, the Swastika has been around way longer than the Nazis have, the Nazis just hijacked it and gave it a bad name. I have seen the Chinese, Romans and American Indians use it.

Back the the subject, I considered joining the CRPA so I could buy from the CMP but never did. Looking at what they have done I'm glad I didn't.

Sam Hainn
11-04-2007, 1:15 PM
Just remember, the Swastika has been around way longer than the Nazis have, the Nazis just hijacked it and gave it a bad name. I have seen the Chinese, Romans and American Indians use it.

Actually, I was trying to compare Microstamping to something the Nazis might do. - ;)

Yes, yes, fully known. Noting the ancient history is so often repeated as a 'Hey, did you know...' that everyone knows it. Use of it now in the Western world brings up only one connotation - and should. I've seen people include it in contemporary folk-art and it seems more like a stunt. I don't think modern western use is 'cool' just for the chance to appear irreverent and impress people one is a history buff. If I see it on a rug from India or in ancient Hindu weaves it's expected. Using it now in our current America has little purpose than to coyly get a rise in people including in folk-art. It doesn't soften the connotation.

Same could be said for a certain N-word that many black youth have taken to use 'affectionately' among themselves then note pre-American history or 'taking back the word' to justify it. I don't buy it. It's crap. I don't want to take back the Swastika - the Nazis can have it and all that it has come to mean. I don't want it to go back to its old connotation and meaning. I don't want Nazi stuff destroyed or forgotten either. I want the latest memory to continue to remind people of Hitler, fascism, genocide, and how many people died under red & white flags emblazoned with it. I don't want history to repeat itself because teen-age girls start buying Gucci-like purses with Swastika 'power' symbols and think nothing of it.

thmpr
11-04-2007, 2:02 PM
The money I gave to CRPA is now funneling through NRA. I don't even read their newsletter anymore. Off to the shredder! What a waste of money!!!!

dwtt
11-04-2007, 3:42 PM
Sam Hainn has said everything there needs to be said. I used to be a CRPA and GOC member, but now only support the NRA.

magsnubby
11-04-2007, 5:39 PM
I considered joining the CRPA so I could buy from the CMP.

That was the reason i joined.

Looking at what they have done I'm glad I didn't.

Or what they haven't done. Back when we were gathering signatures for the RKBA initiative, i sent then a couple of e-mails. Never did receive a reply.

While i might not agree with the NRA on every issue, i've been a life member since around 1974.

fairfaxjim
11-04-2007, 5:57 PM
I too quit supporting CRPA when they were absent at the DOJ detachable magazine hearings.

I think Sam has pretty much said it all and said it well.

NRAhighpowershooter
11-04-2007, 6:53 PM
Unfortunately.. those of us that shoot NRA HighPower matches and shoot the state and regional matches HAVE to belong to the CRPA :mad: to be able to shoot the matches....

bwiese
11-04-2007, 7:14 PM
Unfortunately.. those of us that shoot NRA HighPower matches and shoot the state and regional matches HAVE to belong to the CRPA :mad: to be able to shoot the matches....

I think this is an area that could be readily reorganized.

There is no specific reason CRPA has to be the sanctioning body and it's just been "traditoin". In fact, a sanctioning body created expressly for match shooting, and nothing else, and reporting directly to NRA could readily be created.

chris
11-04-2007, 11:00 PM
this may be off topic. but if you are in the NRA. can you still get a rifle from the CMP?

i too left the CRPA due to the lack of their presence at the hearings and what this board did last year and will continue to do so in the future for as long as we can.

AKman
11-05-2007, 7:51 AM
Just remember, the Swastika has been around way longer than the Nazis have, the Nazis just hijacked it and gave it a bad name. I have seen the Chinese, Romans and American Indians use it.

Back the the subject, I considered joining the CRPA so I could buy from the CMP but never did. Looking at what they have done I'm glad I didn't.

I don't know about the Chinese and Roman "Swastika", but the American Indian symbol is not the same. If you look closely, the tail ends of the cross are drawn in the opposite direction (I think of it as anti-cyclonic versus cyclonic).

slowfire
11-05-2007, 7:57 AM
Thank you one and all for the information and points of views. I was mulling over some of the issues that were previously mentioned. :)

CSDGuy
11-05-2007, 8:08 AM
this may be off topic. but if you are in the NRA. can you still get a rifle from the CMP?

i too left the CRPA due to the lack of their presence at the hearings and what this board did last year and will continue to do so in the future for as long as we can.

No. The NRA is not currently affiliated with the CMP. From what I can tell, there are a lot of local clubs that are and a club that you might be a member of may actually be a CMP affiliated club and membership might just satisfy one requirement of the CMP. The club that I joined isn't a CMP affiliate though... :(

MudCamper
11-05-2007, 11:45 AM
It is my opinion that all this divisive talk amongst different pro-gun groups is hurting us far more than any anti-gun group could ever do. We are dividing so that they may conquer us.

There are far more CRPA members in the state than there are CalGunners. If new people come to the CalGuns sight, and find multiple threads bashing the CRPA, they'll immediately get turned off and leave, and never come back.

I joined the CRPA because the NRA recommended that I do so. I became a life CRPA member long before the world wide web existed. At the time it was the only way I could keep up with what the California legislature was up to.

bwiese
11-05-2007, 11:51 AM
It is my opinion that all this divisive talk amongst different pro-gun groups is hurting us far more than any anti-gun group could ever do. We are dividing so that they may conquer us.

Unfortuantely, we were already divided by the organizations in question. The *membership* wasn't divided, the leadership/lobbyists were!

It's indeed time to move on because politics is about the future, as next year will likely see some bad ammo bills (purchase controls of varying levels, etc.) come up.

But we need to make sure we are unified and hold those who say they (as opposed to those who actually do) work for us in Sacramento to Not Screw Things Up for personal agendas or doing trade-offs that benefit large retailers at cost to Calif RKBA.

This is particularly true for ammo bills since Turners and Big 5 etc would love to stop milsurp deals at gunshows. Miwall, for example, is quite unpopular in some circles.

chris
11-05-2007, 11:56 AM
bill i'm not even gonna guess what those idiots in sacramento have in store for us. since they have 2 huge victories this year, one can only guess what the want to do. it makes me sick to think about it.

F the traitors in sacramento (Kalifornia Kremlin, and Politburo)

bwiese
11-05-2007, 11:57 AM
There are far more CRPA members in the state than there are CalGunners. If new people come to the CalGuns sight, and find multiple threads bashing the CRPA, they'll immediately get turned off and leave, and never come back.

Those membership numbers are dropping and appear to be, um, somewhat magnified.

This is why CRPA had a panicked response last year and GOC went haywire just last week: we affected their personal income/salary.

Calguns gets a lot of traction and views from nonmembers and via Google.
CRPA is not really web-aware and is run by some old-guard guys. GOC's website is fairly static. I would suggest Calguns is growing as fast as these other groups are on the decline.

Pthfndr
11-05-2007, 7:02 PM
I think this is an area that could be readily reorganized.

There is no specific reason CRPA has to be the sanctioning body and it's just been "traditoin". In fact, a sanctioning body created expressly for match shooting, and nothing else, and reporting directly to NRA could readily be created.

That is a LOT easier said than done. The CRPA sanctions a lot more competition than just HP. There are literally thousands of competitiors not in HP that fall under their sanction.

For me, I'm a CRPA member for the competition aspect only. The newsletter is something I give to those on the fence about gun ownership to read and become informed about the stupid laws. Kind of a "here, read this and then go search the internet," thing.

The NRA is the 10 ton elephant when it comes to gun rights stuff. They may be slow, they may need guidance from the handlers (us, the membership), but they can (slowly at times) get the job done.

Parag
11-05-2007, 8:20 PM
I don't know about the Chinese and Roman "Swastika", but the American Indian symbol is not the same. If you look closely, the tail ends of the cross are drawn in the opposite direction (I think of it as anti-cyclonic versus cyclonic).

The symbol is quite old in India, which I think is where the Germans got it. That's where they got the name - "swastik" in Sanskrit, I think. It's actually a symbol of good luck, if I recall correctly. Certainly it's used and seen all over India in all sorts of decorations - trim, weddings, etc.

The direction of the tails/spin is not important. Dunno if the Chinese got it from India or vice-versa or simultaneously invented. It is a fairly simple design after all.

-- Parag

Sam Hainn
11-05-2007, 8:30 PM
It is my opinion that all this divisive talk amongst different pro-gun groups is hurting us far more than any anti-gun group could ever do. We are dividing so that they may conquer us.

There are far more CRPA members in the state than there are CalGunners. If new people come to the CalGuns sight, and find multiple threads bashing the CRPA, they'll immediately get turned off and leave, and never come back.

I joined the CRPA because the NRA recommended that I do so. I became a life CRPA member long before the world wide web existed. At the time it was the only way I could keep up with what the California legislature was up to.

I don't think it's divisive to call out a lackluster group taking donations in perpetuity and then showing little done and few if any results with those funds. We've seen the lack of action first hand. it's time to call them on it, so they can do some soul-searching & improve their orgnaization. 12 years they got money from me and not just membership dues. A pro-gun group in name only hurts us more than it helps. It pulls funds & participation away from effective pro-gun groups. A cause-centric campaign, marketing to passionate people knowing they are more likely to donate money to a said cause than the general public, is deceitful.

Maybe CRPA needs to realize there now is a world-wide web? Sacramento anti-gunners and the Brady Campaign seem to realize it. What's CRPA's problem?

As far as numbers go, I am willing to bet that the Calguns membership matches or supersedes that of the CRPA. It's clear Calguns has had a bigger impact on gun rights in CA over the last 2 years than CRPA has had in the past 5 years. There currently is more measurable action against CA anti-gun legislation here than can be found from the CRPA. Hey - I'm starting the "Bear State Second Amendment Revolutionaries". We're a pro-gun group. Sounds good. Wanna donate? I'll PM you my PO Box address for a donation. :shrug:

MudCamper
11-05-2007, 9:19 PM
Well, you all make reasonable points. They already have my money as I'm a life member. I guess what I can do is start writing them letters asking about some of these things. I wonder if they'd print any of them in the newsletter...