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HHGT
03-26-2013, 1:09 PM
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TahoeTim
03-26-2013, 1:16 PM
Listen from 1:45 on. So from the manufacturer's mouth, it's the second market gougers that are driving up the prices. If I see one more post how I should have bought before the panic I am gonna lose it. YOU ARE CREATING THE PANIC.

I wanna say thank you to fellow gunners who are bending me over daily. I hope you choke on your ammo.

OlderThanDirt
03-26-2013, 1:23 PM
Listen from 1:45 on. So from the manufacturer's mouth, it's the second market gougers that are driving up the prices. If I see one more post how I should have bought before the panic I am gonna lose it. YOU ARE CREATING THE PANIC.

I wanna say thank you to fellow gunners who are bending me over daily. I hope you choke on your ammo.

Just keep holding your ankles. We're not done with you yet. Like most things in life, ammo prices are cyclic. The price will eventually come down and then you can stock up so you don't have to take it in the keester the next time there is a run on ammo.

shooter777
03-26-2013, 1:24 PM
You should have bought before the panic....

That being said, the caller blames high demand as well as government meddling with ammo importers. The secondary market can be overpriced but there are good deals to be had. Prices fluctuate. That's life. Our way of life is being attacked. Now is not the time to blame other shooters.

Kingofthehill
03-26-2013, 1:44 PM
Yeah, its the people buying ammo now, its their fault...

come on, its going to get made and sold regardless.

Want ammo prices to come down? Stop buying it at exploited prices and then the guy buying it and upping the price will have nobody to sell it to and in turn will stop buying it since he's not reselling it. EASY.

People just love to complain though.

-hanko
03-26-2013, 2:14 PM
Listen from 1:45 on. So from the manufacturer's mouth, it's the second market gougers that are driving up the prices. If I see one more post how I should have bought before the panic I am gonna lose it. YOU ARE CREATING THE PANIC.

I wanna say thank you to fellow gunners who are bending me over daily. I hope you choke on your ammo.
You apparently contributing as you "are bending me over daily".

Apparently decades of the same rise and fall of ammo around elections or when people get nervous about new legislation were ignored. ;)

-hanko

ZombieTactics
03-26-2013, 2:15 PM
In economics, complaining is not an expression of effective power.

Buying is. Selling is. Prices will always rise/fall to "market clearance" levels. This is as close to a 100% immutable law of economics as anyone can get. When supply increases or demand falls to the point where the ammo does not fly off the shelves ("clear the market") fast enough ... prices fall. When ammo flies off the shelf faster than it can be restocked ... prices rise.

There is no conspiracy. There is no mystery. It's just economics. This is predictable for anyone paying attention. If you can't bother yourself to pay attention, then you have no one to blame but yourself for not knowing when to buy and when to sell.

advocatusdiaboli
03-26-2013, 3:30 PM
In economics, complaining is not an expression of effective power.

Buying is. Selling is. Prices will always rise/fall to "market clearance" levels. This is as close to a 100% immutable law of economics as anyone can get. When supply increases or demand falls to the point where the ammo does not fly off the shelves ("clear the market") fast enough ... prices fall. When ammo flies off the shelf faster than it can be restocked ... prices rise.

There is no conspiracy. There is no mystery. It's just economics. This is predictable for anyone paying attention. If you can't bother yourself to pay attention, then you have no one to blame but yourself for not knowing when to buy and when to sell.

Yep. Basic economics: the market clearing price. Speculators are hoping to pay on gun law change fears and buy now and sell higher later. Some will make good profits but eventually, just as with the housing bubble when it burst, most will lose most of what they gained when they have to dump ammo at far less than they paid. I laid in a good supply and I shoot all I want and smile and smile and smile.

SonoftheRepublic
03-26-2013, 8:59 PM
[QUOTE=TahoeTim;10921579]Listen from 1:45 on. So from the manufacturer's mouth, it's the second market gougers that are driving up the prices.

I disagree. Yes secondary market gougers are a "part" of the problem. But what the manufacturer said prior to this is THE BIG NEWS HERE ---- AND THIS HAS NEVER HAPPENED BEFORE to my knowledge.

The manufacturer told the nationally syndicated Savage Nation radio show that the Department of Homeland Security’s huge ammo purchases were an attempt to dry up supplies as part of an end run around the second amendment.

The caller, who described himself as a defense contractor and a licensed weapons manufacturer, said the goal was to “control the amount of market that’s available on the commercial market at any time,” by forcing manufacturers to hold back stock.

“If they periodically do this in increments, they’re going to control how much ammo is available on the commercial market,” said the caller, adding that the contracts with bullet manufacturers stipulate that everything made goes to the government as the number one priority before it is allowed to enter the commercial market.

The caller noted how this process had caused prices to shoot up at gun shows, while in the commercial market ammunition was very limited and on back order as a result and that “supply cannot keep up with demand.” He also noted how the State Department and the ATF were making it harder to import ammunition from overseas.

Host Michael Savage stated that the DHS’ commitment to purchase 1.6 billion bullets over the past year was, “obviously an attempt to dry up the ammunition market, to control the ammunition market.”

The weapons manufacturer agreed, adding that the contracts the DHS is making with manufacturers are based on, “indefinite delivery, indefinite quantity,” allowing the feds to monopolize the supply on ammo by preventing companies from selling the bullets to the commercial market.:mad:

MustangSteveGT
03-27-2013, 1:18 PM
Sounds like we need more ammunition manufacturers that don't sell to the federal government. I don't know how likely that is, since those gov defense contracts make up a majority of the demand/manufacturing capacity for many firearms or ammunition manufacturers who's goal is obviously sell as much as they can to be successful like any business.

PHOSCHEKER
03-27-2013, 1:20 PM
genius?

=Mike=
03-27-2013, 4:11 PM
Listen from 1:45 on. So from the manufacturer's mouth, it's the second market gougers that are driving up the prices. If I see one more post how I should have bought before the panic I am gonna lose it. YOU ARE CREATING THE PANIC.

I wanna say thank you to fellow gunners who are bending me over daily. I hope you choke on your ammo.

You may want to delete this incriminating post and read the the link I provided before assuming that california has gone 100% liberal.

http://corporate.findlaw.com/litigation-disputes/california-prostitution-charges.html

To all those who got a piece, :thumbsup:, hope you wore a mask and a condom. Have a feeling this guy gets around.

OleCuss
03-27-2013, 4:30 PM
I'd not doubt that DHS and other governmental agencies would try to make the market more difficult/expensive for us to access.

The thing is, even if they are successful in the short-term, I doubt it will work out for them in the long-term.

Eventually the manufacturers will meet the demand one way or another and the prices will come down.

manny
03-27-2013, 4:32 PM
I love the way people who didn't, wouldn't, couldn't (pick one) prepare for this (BECAUSE ITS NEVER HAPPENED BEFORE, RIGHT???) blame everyone who were prepared. Let this be a hard lesson, life sucks, toughen up and learn from it.
Lack of preparation on your part doesn't constitute an emergency on mine.
dang novices.

Edwood
03-27-2013, 4:35 PM
Looking forward to the huge DHS surplus ammo discount sales in the future.

pHredd9mm
03-27-2013, 4:46 PM
I do not think the US guv'ment buys much .22LR ammo. Purely speculators have driven the price up from a few cents per round to 50 cents per round. Eventually the market will catch up and the speculators will sell at lower prices.

stag6.8
03-27-2013, 5:29 PM
I love the way people who didn't, wouldn't, couldn't (pick one) prepare for this (BECAUSE ITS NEVER HAPPENED BEFORE, RIGHT???) blame everyone who were prepared. Let this be a hard lesson, life sucks, toughen up and learn from it.
Lack of preparation on your part doesn't constitute an emergency on mine.
dang novices.

I agree with you to a point. There`s people out there nationwide that are really struggling right now (the economy is still pretty bad and will be for the next several years) and cant afford the luxury of buying ammo or anything for that reason. I feel for them. Its the ones with money who are lazy thinking, "2008 wont happen again". Well guess what, it did. They are the reason why there`s not only a shortage of ammo, but rifles, pistols and parts.

majtom94
03-27-2013, 5:34 PM
Its called a DX Rating that is assigned to purchase orders or contracts for supplies. With a DX-1 rating it is the highest and circumvents the commercial sales/delivery. The rating must be approved by Congress and in the interest of national security. DX-1 means any time DHS wants the ammo they step to the head of the line.

Congress needs to withdraw/change the rating, so DHS doesn't interfere with supply.

Yes, this is Obama's make it hurt policy...

majtom94
03-27-2013, 5:36 PM
I do not think the US guv'ment buys much .22LR ammo. Purely speculators have driven the price up from a few cents per round to 50 cents per round. Eventually the market will catch up and the speculators will sell at lower prices.


Probably more of an issue of what the manufacturing margin is on the other calibers...just a guess as 22LR SHOULD be available.

chris
03-27-2013, 5:49 PM
You may want to delete this incriminating post and read the the link I provided before assuming that california has gone 100% liberal.

http://corporate.findlaw.com/litigation-disputes/california-prostitution-charges.html

To all those who got a piece, :thumbsup:, hope you wore a mask and a condom. Have a feeling this guy gets around.

it may not be full liberal. but the voters have gone beyond full idiot. the last election proved that point.

pitbull30
03-27-2013, 5:54 PM
I think the supply will catch up. In my opinion though its the people with money who didn't prepare who are going nuts ruining the market. Just do a search on gunbot. Before you only had a couple items around a .50-1.00. Now it's 1-2 bucks. However, I have noticed there is more on there lately so maybe the buys are slowing.

I dont stockpile for range time, but You should always have enough ammo to defend your family.

I agree with the others here though. If you are buying from these companies at 1-2 bucks you aren't helping the market any and are getting ripped off. Range time for me will wait.

Cobrafreak
03-27-2013, 7:42 PM
Good point. Never use your what-if ammo supply for range time. Don't touch the reserve.

manny
03-27-2013, 7:51 PM
Looking forward to the huge DHS surplus ammo discount sales in the future.


+++1:D

OleCuss
03-27-2013, 8:00 PM
I mostly shoot .40. I stockpiled and am not hurting - but until the situation eases I'm going to be shooting a bit less anyway.

I've not seen .223 for months however, so I'm not shooting any of that at all.

Some rounds are still somewhat available, so I've actually got more .30-06 than I've ever had. I don't shoot that very often so I probably won't buy more for at least months even if it is on the shelf begging to be bought.

And do remember something. If the government is pumping money into the pockets of the manufacturers, that means they have more money to put into ramping up production to meet the non-governmental demand.

Realistically, however, they aren't going to increase their tooling all that much because the current demand is driven more by politics and panic than it is by increased shooting. Oh, there does need to be more production, but probably not a dramatic increase.

Edit: One other thing. I went to a local gunshow about a month ago. There was a guy there trying to sell .40 ammo at about twice what I've historically paid. I was there on the last day and within hours of the show shutting down - and he hadn't sold it yet. The suggestion is that maybe people are showing some good sense and don't always buy stupidly priced stuff?

JonVP_76
03-27-2013, 8:23 PM
Just keep holding your ankles. We're not done with you yet. Like most things in life, ammo prices are cyclic. The price will eventually come down and then you can stock up so you don't have to take it in the keester the next time there is a run on ammo.

LOL

That is the funniest thing I've read all day

TurboChrisB
03-27-2013, 8:31 PM
Listen from 1:45 on. So from the manufacturer's mouth, it's the second market gougers that are driving up the prices. If I see one more post how I should have bought before the panic I am gonna lose it. YOU ARE CREATING THE PANIC.

I wanna say thank you to fellow gunners who are bending me over daily. I hope you choke on your ammo.


You're late to the party and now all the cake is gone.

:facepalm:

mud99
03-27-2013, 8:48 PM
It's hard to believe in a government conspiracy to dry up ammo supply, when I just received 2000 rounds of 30-06 direct from the CMP.

Our government can't even keep the most basic things secret, which makes a conspiracy laughable.

The elephant in the room is that the US government has been buying ammo in huge quantities for years, stockpiles lots of it, then scraps it years down the road when it is too old or they want a new formula, so this isn't some sort of new genocide plan.

And even if the government wanted to dispose of all of us, do you really think they would tell the soldiers to wander around and shoot us all with 40 caliber handguns?

This is the same kind of distraction that the birthers gave us...everyone is so wrapped up in one nutjob theory that they forget the whole economy is going down the ****ter.

In more important news, the Europeans are seizing funds out of bank accounts to pay for their own bailout. Could easily destabilize major currencies and create a global bank run. If I had money in the EU I would be pulling the rip cord right now.

But who cares about that!! Lets get back to the topic at hand!! We need to uncover all these government conspiracies!!!

morfeeis
03-28-2013, 12:02 AM
Listen from 1:45 on. So from the manufacturer's mouth, it's the second market gougers that are driving up the prices. If I see one more post how I should have bought before the panic I am gonna lose it. YOU ARE CREATING THE PANIC.

I wanna say thank you to fellow gunners who are bending me over daily. I hope you choke on your ammo.
I always buy in bulk with my tax refund, so i'm screed.

kimber_ss
03-28-2013, 1:39 AM
As the video mentioned, copper prices which have gone up markedly in recent years reflects the availability of raw material. A wiki result shows that cartridge brass is about 70% copper and 30% zinc...

"Cartridge brass is a 30% zinc brass with good cold working properties. Used for ammunition cases."

So an increased demand for ammo, as well as the reduced availability for raw materials. Therefore reloading/recycling brass is an important issue of coarse considering it's high copper content alone.