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cheet
10-20-2007, 4:02 PM
I know it is a felony to posess a suppressor. What about making your own (for a bolt action rifle) from homemade materials?

How does the law work regarding silencers? Is there a banned list? A minimum decible level?

Wizard99
10-20-2007, 4:14 PM
All suppressors regardless of design or manufacture are class 3 devices and are regulated. Even a suppressor made from a 2 liter bottle and rags is a controlled device and will send you to prison.

cheet
10-20-2007, 4:15 PM
Ok, just curious

Liberty1
10-20-2007, 4:36 PM
Mufflers save ears!

wilit
10-20-2007, 5:03 PM
You can technically legally purchase a suppressor (or any regulated NFA item for that matter) in CA if you get the approval from the CADOJ (good luck with that). But once you have their blessing, you fill out the NFA paperwork, pay your $200 tax stamp and buy a suppressor.

hoffmang
10-20-2007, 6:34 PM
If you read ATF's regulations closely one should not keep empty 2 or 3 liter cola bottles too near your guns - or pillows for that matter.

-Gene

metalhead357
10-20-2007, 6:39 PM
You can technically legally purchase a suppressor (or any regulated NFA item for that matter) in CA if you get the approval from the CADOJ (good luck with that). But once you have their blessing, you fill out the NFA paperwork, pay your $200 tax stamp and buy a suppressor.


unfortunately aint gonna happen here in cali unless you're LEO or in the movie production biz with a LOT of credentials..............

CSACANNONEER
10-20-2007, 6:40 PM
If you read ATF's regulations closely one should not keep empty 2 or 3 liter cola bottles too near your guns - or pillows for that matter.

-Gene

Another reason that one should not keep a gun under their pillow.

SemiAutoSam
10-20-2007, 6:42 PM
Not to correct but the Suppressors themselves are title II weapons / NFA weapons

The only thing that would be called Class 3 are the dealers that sell them.

Suppressors just like Short barrelled rifles and short barreled shotguns and Machine guns are registered to the person with a 200.00 tax stamp through the Dept of Treasury .






All suppressors regardless of design or manufacture are class 3 devices and are regulated. Even a suppressor made from a 2 liter bottle and rags is a controlled device and will send you to prison.

supersonic
10-20-2007, 8:06 PM
While we know the "cool/experimental"-factor involved here, we ALL know what they are for So, if you are going to buy one of the "for informational purposes only" books and actually put it to use, then I don't think we should be aware of it. Right?;)

AJAX22
10-20-2007, 8:10 PM
If you read ATF's regulations closely one should not keep empty 2 or 3 liter cola bottles too near your guns - or pillows for that matter.

-Gene

On the topic of alternate use pillows ... Did you know that some types of old 60's-70's household upholstry material is really really flamable?

I didn't

Wizard99
10-20-2007, 9:22 PM
Not to correct but the Suppressors themselves are title II weapons / NFA weapons

Suppressors just like Short barrelled rifles and short barreled shotguns and Machine guns are registered to the person with a 200.00 tax stamp through the Dept of Treasury .

Of course you ment to correct me otherwise you wouldn't have posted.;)
I don't mind being corrected as long as its to inform.
I'm used to being corrected, I've been married for awhile.:D

SemiAutoSam
10-20-2007, 9:32 PM
OK yes this is true.

It was to inform.


Of course you ment to correct me otherwise you wouldn't have posted.;)
I don't mind being corrected as long as its to inform.
I'm used to being corrected, I've been married for awhile.:D

tiki
10-21-2007, 5:04 AM
Not to correct but the Suppressors themselves are title II weapons / NFA weapons

The only thing that would be called Class 3 are the dealers that sell them.

Suppressors just like Short barrelled rifles and short barreled shotguns and Machine guns are registered to the person with a 200.00 tax stamp through the Dept of Treasury .

Well, actually, suppressors are Title II devices. The machine guns, short barreled shotguns and rifles are Title II firearms, and the only time anything is a weapon, is when it is used as one. :-)

EOD Guy
10-21-2007, 9:01 AM
Not to correct but the Suppressors themselves are title II weapons / NFA weapons

The only thing that would be called Class 3 are the dealers that sell them.

Suppressors just like Short barrelled rifles and short barreled shotguns and Machine guns are registered to the person with a 200.00 tax stamp through the Dept of Treasury .


Actually, it is handled through the Department of Justice, even though the NFA is part of the Internal Revenue Code. When BATF was transferred to the Department of Justice, all references to the Secretary of Treasury in the NFA were changed to read the Attorney General.

SemiAutoSam
10-21-2007, 9:03 AM
While you see it that way the Federal Government still calls them Title II / NFA Weapons.

Well, actually, suppressors are Title II devices. The machine guns, short barreled shotguns and rifles are Title II firearms, and the only time anything is a weapon, is when it is used as one. :-)


Payment for my SOT still is made out to and addresses to dept of treasury.

Actually, it is handled through the Department of Justice, even though the NFA is part of the Internal Revenue Code. When BATF was transferred to the Department of Justice, all references to the Secretary of Treasury in the NFA were changed to read the Attorney General.

XDshooter
10-21-2007, 10:59 AM
I have a question and the ATF has yet to e-mail me back about it after a month.

What are the provisions for making a fake suppressor? I mean if you have a .223 round what is the maximum size of the hole through the fake suppressor?

What if it is 3/4" opening?

Anyone know if that would constitute a suppressor?


Thanks.

metalhead357
10-21-2007, 11:27 AM
I have a question and the ATF has yet to e-mail me back about it after a month.

What are the provisions for making a fake suppressor? I mean if you have a .223 round what is the maximum size of the hole through the fake suppressor?

What if it is 3/4" opening?

Anyone know if that would constitute a suppressor?


Thanks.

there's plenty of "dummy" ones out there...usually they're called barrel shrouds from what I remember; was a bunch in Shotgun news for years and years for the MACs the UZI's etc....... but they in no way reduce sound to the best of my knowlege and/or understanding..........

WokMaster1
10-21-2007, 5:19 PM
If you read ATF's regulations closely one should not keep empty 2 or 3 liter cola bottles too near your guns - or pillows for that matter.
-Gene

Has anyone tried letting one loose while sitting on a pillow? That would be an effective way of waking up a snoring spouse & evacuation of the bedroom.

DedEye
10-21-2007, 5:46 PM
If you read ATF's regulations closely one should not keep empty 2 or 3 liter cola bottles too near your guns - or pillows for that matter.

-Gene

Neither pillows or empty bottles do a thing to reduce the report of a firearm.

metalhead357
10-21-2007, 5:54 PM
Neither pillows or empty bottles do a thing to reduce the report of a firearm.


yes....they do, but its a matter of policy to not talk of such things as we can never get, do, buy, sell, or trade Class II items.....so the soda bottle and/or pillow will soon be added to the list:p

SemiAutoSam
10-21-2007, 6:14 PM
Fixed it for you.

yes....they do, but its a matter of policy to not talk of such things as we can never get, do, buy, sell, or trade Title II items.....so the soda bottle and/or pillow will soon be added to the list:p

elsolo
10-22-2007, 6:54 AM
What about suppressors integral to, or permanently attached to airguns?

AJAX22
10-22-2007, 8:51 AM
What about suppressors integral to, or permanently attached to airguns?

I believe this is an BATFE grey area... because some airsoft silencers had metalic baffles and had a standard soviet lefthand thread they were interperated to be firearm silencers, since they reduced the muzzle report by at least one decibil for one shot.. (probably exploded on that one shot, but thats beside the point)

Since any part which is designed for use in a silencer or can be used to assemble a silencer is according to Fed law a silencer in and of itself, any piece of the airsoft silencer which could be adapted puts you in violation of the NFA.

I know that some of the beeman guns which come with integral silencers have holes drilled in the can to make it a muzzlebreak instead of a silencer, but to me even that is pushing it really close to federal NFA violation.

We can work around CA laws all we want to, staying strictly legal to the letter of the law.

But Fed Law is much more vague, and they have a tremendous amount of funding and power. Don't F with this stuff, Period end of statement.

duenor
10-22-2007, 10:03 AM
contrary to popular belief, most of the time suppressors are used to make guns more managable and pleasant to shoot, especially indoors.

in other states lots of folks have them. a friend of mine has a whole bunch (all legally acquired of course) in TN. his newest addition is an integrally silenced 10/22.

metalhead357
10-22-2007, 6:07 PM
contrary to popular belief, most of the time suppressors are used to make guns more managable and pleasant to shoot, especially indoors.

in other states lots of folks have them. a friend of mine has a whole bunch (all legally acquired of course) in TN. his newest addition is an integrally silenced 10/22.


Yep. And twuz a time in England IIRC it was considered Gentlmanly to use one as the noise from an UNmuffled concussion was seen as disrepectful to many another shooter on the line.......

Oh how far we have fallen & how we've let the ridiculous Hollywood crowd portray only evil doers using these things:mad:

RideIcon
10-22-2007, 6:14 PM
MOST AIRGUN SUPPRESSORS ARE ACTUALLY EXTENDED BARRELS:cool:

m24armorer
10-22-2007, 6:44 PM
I am soooo keeping my mouth shut.........

Tweak338
10-22-2007, 6:46 PM
I am soooo keeping my mouth shut.........

Good idea, you're going to make me jealous..

m24armorer
10-23-2007, 7:17 AM
It aint airsoft.......

My bad.

http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb271/m24armorer/can1.jpg

SemiAutoSam
10-23-2007, 7:29 AM
Yew have a interesting CAN man.

Maybe yall can come over here some day and we can get that pesky fox thats been stealin ma chickens.

It aint airsoft.......

My bad.

http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb271/m24armorer/can1.jpg

elsolo
10-23-2007, 9:46 AM
I believe this is an BATFE grey area... because some airsoft silencers had metalic baffles and had a standard soviet lefthand thread they were interperated to be firearm silencers, since they reduced the muzzle report by at least one decibil for one shot.. (probably exploded on that one shot, but thats beside the point)

Since any part which is designed for use in a silencer or can be used to assemble a silencer is according to Fed law a silencer in and of itself, any piece of the airsoft silencer which could be adapted puts you in violation of the NFA.

I know that some of the beeman guns which come with integral silencers have holes drilled in the can to make it a muzzlebreak instead of a silencer, but to me even that is pushing it really close to federal NFA violation.

We can work around CA laws all we want to, staying strictly legal to the letter of the law.

But Fed Law is much more vague, and they have a tremendous amount of funding and power. Don't F with this stuff, Period end of statement.

What about the airguns that I see advertised that have integral silencers, such as the new Gamo I just saw in American Rifleman. (or the Talon SS)

AJAX22
10-23-2007, 10:27 AM
What about the airguns that I see advertised that have integral silencers, such as the new Gamo I just saw in American Rifleman. (or the Talon SS)

It all depends on how nice the BATFE is feeling that day.

It used to be relativly ok to have a .177 suppresor for your air rifle as there was no way it could be adapted to fit any conventional ammo, however now that they have .17HMR they are open to interperitation.

You're probably relativly safe if there is no way to remove the silencer from the airgun without destroying it... but then you get into.. what if the air rifle was converted to a firearm (MUCH easier to do than people realise)

In fact back in the early sixties they made a 'baracuda' attachment for several popular guns that injected ether into the piston cylinder which ignited through the desil effect and propelled the pellet at much higher velocity. I believe this was later determined to be a firearm...

So if you have a can of starting fluid and a pellet gun with an integral suppressor... it might just come down to how good is your lawyer and how much justice can you afford.

Its not something I am going to play with... as neat as it is, remember feds invented constructive posession.

Shotgun Man
11-10-2007, 11:25 AM
Neither pillows or empty bottles do a thing to reduce the report of a firearm.

I was watching the movie Payback just now, starring Mel Gibson and he just capped someone with a huge revolver by shoving a pillow against the shootee's head and pressing the revolver into the pillow and pulling the trigger.

The report of the gun was minimal. Seriously, will a pillow silence a gun?

DedEye
11-10-2007, 11:27 AM
I was watching the movie Payback just now, starring Mel Gibson and he just capped someone with a huge revolver by shoving a pillow against the shootee's head and pressing the revolver into the pillow and pulling the trigger.

The report of the gun was minimal. Seriously, will a pillow silence a gun?

Like I said, no.

Shotgun Man
11-10-2007, 11:30 AM
Like I said, no.

Have you ever tried it?

DedEye
11-10-2007, 12:00 PM
Have you ever tried it?

;).

CCWFacts
11-10-2007, 12:43 PM
But really, what's the deal on suppressors in this state? I understand at the Federal level. The NFA application / tax payment, all well-documented and easy stuff. But at the state level? I was looking on the CA DOJ website, and found forms for a permit for MG, SBR, etc, but it did not anywhere mention "suppressor". Is there an application form for it? I would like to apply. I have good cause: a) I don't want to damage my hearing b) I want to be able to shoot outdoors without disrupting sensitive wildlife. A suppressor will be the perfect complement to the new lead-free ammo to make for an outdoor shooting experience which is environmentally sensitive. I'm serious! If I shoot outdoors I don't want to make noise and I don't want to leave lead in the environment. I want a minimal environmental impact in everything I do.

CCWFacts
11-10-2007, 4:44 PM
Just looked at the DoJ page: http://ag.ca.gov/firearms/dwcl/12500.php and it looks like there is no provision for possession of a "silencer" except by certain military and law enforcement personnel and by certain dealers / manufacturers etc. Not like an MG where there is at least a theoretical possibility of a permit for an "ordinary" individual to possess one. I wonder what kind of legal challenges (if any) are possible on this.

metalhead357
11-11-2007, 6:19 AM
I wonder what kind of legal challenges (if any) are possible on this.


Short of summin' coming under Due process, equal protection under the law...yada yada...I dont forsee one happening; better luck changing the monds of the clueless in Sac.