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PIRATE14
10-17-2007, 10:39 AM
Come on over to the darkside brother..........:43:

Glad to have you onboard........r/:chris:

Tweak338
10-17-2007, 11:05 AM
does this mean you will be shipping lowers to CA now?

DIG
10-17-2007, 12:44 PM
does this mean you will be shipping lowers to CA now?

good question. I received attitude when asking this same question a year ago. That is alright though. I know it wasn't personal. ;)
Too bad they missed out on truck-loads of revenue from OLL sales during the first year or so of the OLL craze. it pays to look into things, CA is a big market.
That aside, :gunsmilie: Welcome aboard!:gunsmilie:

Steyr_223
10-17-2007, 3:13 PM
Welcome!

RainierArms
10-17-2007, 5:49 PM
Unfortunately, we are still not shipping lowers to CA. Please don't take it as attitude as that's not our intention. It's a perceived gray area that I'm personally not comfortable dealing with. Gun people should know best at how paranoid we can be :wacko:

We've always shipped other CA legal items and have many customers who frequent this website.

Thank you for the welcome and let me know if we can help.

Outlaw
10-17-2007, 7:17 PM
Welcome to CalGuns.

kicker72
10-17-2007, 11:33 PM
I've bought from John and company for a few years now, glad to see them aboard.:cool:

NSR500
10-18-2007, 11:23 AM
Welcome to the Board John & Team!

Bagger
10-18-2007, 3:21 PM
NO worries there are plenty of venders Here selling Lowers Recievers To Cali :)


Unfortunately, we are still not shipping lowers to CA. Please don't take it as attitude as that's not our intention. It's a perceived gray area that I'm personally not comfortable dealing with. Gun people should know best at how paranoid we can be :wacko:

We've always shipped other CA legal items and have many customers who frequent this website.

Thank you for the welcome and let me know if we can help.

Mr. Joshua
10-18-2007, 6:08 PM
John and Stick are GTG. Excellent company to deal with. Welcome to CGN!

arfan66
10-18-2007, 7:04 PM
I noticed the Rainier Arms banner yesterday! Great company with awesome service. Hell, they sold me 95% of the parts for my 6.8mm SPC build. Welcome to calguns.net!

Jeff S.

DDs Ranch
10-19-2007, 3:55 AM
WELCOME ABOARD!!!

RainierArms
10-19-2007, 9:34 AM
Thanks for the warm welcome. I receive a lot of business from this site and I'm proud to be a partner of CALGUNS.

wildcard
10-19-2007, 10:18 AM
I've spent quite a few dollars with Rainier Arms and they're a great company to deal with. Fast and free shipping (still available?)! Their selection may not be extensive as other vendors, but it's like they've pre-selected the good stuff for those that can't decide :) And if you find what you're looking for on their site, rest assured that you're going to get a great product with excellent customer service.

fsy1230
10-20-2007, 8:02 PM
Rainier Arms!!! Surprise to see you in here! It's nice to have such a highly reputable and honest vendor added amongst other great vendors/retailers here, such as DD's, CWS, Entreprise, and 10%. I'm sure there may be more but I've personally dealt with you along with these guys many times and I have to say that I've always been a satisfied shopaholic, I mean customer! Anyways, welcome! :)

Okami
10-21-2007, 2:40 PM
Welcome aboard!:chris:

proraptor
10-22-2007, 11:46 AM
Unfortunately, we are still not shipping lowers to CA. Please don't take it as attitude as that's not our intention. It's a perceived gray area that I'm personally not comfortable dealing with. Gun people should know best at how paranoid we can be :wacko:

We've always shipped other CA legal items and have many customers who frequent this website.

Thank you for the welcome and let me know if we can help.

if you aren't with us then you are against us....

you won't see any of my money sorry

bwiese
10-23-2007, 2:42 AM
Welcome, of course.

However, there is NO 'gray area' with off-list receivers. Harrott is a very clear decision from CA Supreme Court - whose specific goal was to have things not be 'gray'. [There are a still couple of borderline-worded make/model combos but there are tons of receivers that are clearly legal.]

Otherwise we'd all be in jail, and they'd be digging a hole in the desert for the Pirate (as well as a few other Calgunners).

RainierArms
10-23-2007, 7:02 AM
I'll do some reading and see what I can find out. I have a close friend who is an attorney and he advised me against it when this loop hole was first discovered. Obviously now, there has been 1000's of lowers that have been shipped to CA so it must be okay? I honestly haven't looked at it since it first got started so I'll do some honest studying about the subject. Thanks for pointing me in the right direction.

bwiese
10-23-2007, 8:14 AM
I'll do some reading and see what I can find out. I have a close friend who is an attorney and he advised me against it when this loop hole was first discovered. Obviously now, there has been 1000's of lowers that have been shipped to CA so it must be okay? I honestly haven't looked at it since it first got started so I'll do some honest studying about the subject. Thanks for pointing me in the right direction.

There have probably been 70,000 lowers shipped into CA. Certainly at least 50K by December of last year, and the count is probably unmanageable now.

Quite a few CA FFLs sell them as standard stocked items. These shops get by DOJ and BATF audits. Off-list receivers are "on the shelf" at these shops.

They would not be there if they were (1) illegal, and (2) if this would risk their business (other than DOJ displeasure). Again, "listed" vs. "not listed" is the criteria: if it's make/model combination is not listed in 12276PC ("Roberti-Roos"), or if it's not listed in regulatory code (11 CCR 5495, the echo of Roberti-Roos, or 11 CCR 5499, the Kasler list of formally-identified AR/AK "series" members) it's not banned by name and is only considerable as a plain-Jane rifle receiver.

You can avoid the nuances of how rifles are assembled to be compliant per 12276.1PC (the generic features ban) and let us worry about it - just send in stripped receivers or receivers stuffed w/LPKs to CA FFLs, and we can handle the rest of the details. ("Constructive possession" does NOT apply to CA AW matters, just SBR/SBS/machinegun issues at both CA and Fed levels.)

This is obviously displeasing to the CA DOJ Bureau of Firearms, but screw 'em: we have a mound of documents indicating they're, in essence, led by the Brady campaign and are not an impartial/unbiased agency. They thought we were trailer-park rednecks who couldn't read (and for the 5 years since Harrott, we kinda were, 'til we kicked things into gear).

I'd also encourage you to not talk to your local non-CA attorney who likely won't be familiar with CA nuances. We've seen this before - DSA's guys were unclear on some nuances for quite some time and appear to have exercised caution in the wrong areas. Talk to one of the CA gun attorneys - Trutanich-Michel LLP who advertises here, or Don Kilmer in San Jose.

Outlaw
10-23-2007, 12:13 PM
There have probably been 70,000 lowers shipped into CA. Certainly at least 50K by December of last year, and the count is probably unmanageable now.

Quite a few CA FFLs sell them as standard stocked items. These shops get by DOJ and BATF audits. Off-list receivers are "on the shelf" at these shops.

They would not be there if they were (1) illegal, and (2) if this would risk their business (other than DOJ displeasure). Again, "listed" vs. "not listed" is the criteria: if it's make/model combination is not listed in 12276PC ("Roberti-Roos"), or if it's not listed in regulatory code (11 CCR 5495, the echo of Roberti-Roos, or 11 CCR 5499, the Kasler list of formally-identified AR/AK "series" members) it's not banned by name and is only considerable as a plain-Jane rifle receiver.

You can avoid the nuances of how rifles are assembled to be compliant per 12276.1PC (the generic features ban) and let us worry about it - just send in stripped receivers or receivers stuffed w/LPKs to CA FFLs, and we can handle the rest of the details. ("Constructive possession" does NOT apply to CA AW matters, just SBR/SBS/machinegun issues at both CA and Fed levels.)

This is obviously displeasing to the CA DOJ Bureau of Firearms, but screw 'em: we have a mound of documents indicating they're, in essence, led by the Brady campaign and are not an impartial/unbiased agency. They thought we were trailer-park rednecks who couldn't read (and for the 5 years since Harrott, we kinda were, 'til we kicked things into gear).

I'd also encourage you to not talk to your local non-CA attorney who likely won't be familiar with CA nuances. We've seen this before - DSA's guys were unclear on some nuances for quite some time and appear to have exercised caution in the wrong areas. Talk to one of the CA gun attorneys - Trutanich-Michel LLP who advertises here, or Don Kilmer in San Jose.

+1000
Thanks bwiese for the information I hope it'll be the decision breaker that Rainier Arms needs to clear up the "gray area" concerns.
Honestly last year I wanted to purchase lower receivers, parts and equipment from Rainer Arms but when I read "won't ship to CA" I said forget it I won't buy anything.

I still welcome Rainier Arms, but please rethink your decision to ship lowers to Ca.

RainierArms
10-23-2007, 2:37 PM
This is very good information. I really appreciate you taking the time to inform me. It wasn't only speaking with my attorney that discouraged me but I sent 2 letters to the DOJs office in CA asking if could ship these lowers into CA and I didn't get a response. That along with my attorney was what discouraged me from shipping lowers. Trust me, I wanted to be a part of the big CA boom. It's not that I dislike money or dislike CA, it was just uneducated fear. We'll change our store policy immediately.

stator
10-23-2007, 3:55 PM
Good to see you here Stickman. I think I first found you on the EE section in ARFCOM several years ago and have been pleased with the first rate service.

Of course, my wife would have opposite words regarding Rainer due to the CC statements she observes.

Outlaw
10-24-2007, 7:33 AM
We'll change our store policy immediately.
Am I reading this right? If so :D:D:D:D:D:D! Now I can add your link to my bookmarks again.

arfan66
10-24-2007, 7:44 PM
Knowledge is power.......I'll be placing another order with Rainier Arms soon!

Jeff S.

tenpercentfirearms
10-26-2007, 11:15 AM
You will find your sales will increase ten fold if you fully support the CA customer. You will not get busted for importing perfectly legal AR15 lowers. You don't have to send in rifles if you don't want (but you would benefit from sending in CA compliant rifles as well), but you will find that businesses that support us get the sales. Businesses who don't won't.

Send in lowers, it will only increase your sales (and decrease mine! :eek: ).

Mr. Joshua
10-27-2007, 7:33 AM
We'll change our store policy immediately.

Muah-ha-ha-ha-ha!!! Ordered my Noveske lower last night!

8200rpm
10-27-2007, 12:27 PM
We'll change our store policy immediately.



Will you ship AR-15 Lowers to CA?
We will ship "Off-List" stripped AR-15 lowers to CA. However, we will not ship any lowers that have full auto markings like the POF P416 series.


Welcome to California, and thanks for your support!

<s>I just ordered a Noveske N4 upper w/ DD Omega rail.</s> :D

EDIT: I requested an upgrade to a Noveske N4 Low Profile instead. :o

Time to go clean out the safe...

quagmiles
05-09-2008, 10:05 PM
???

novanryder
06-02-2008, 8:35 PM
yeah well even with you guys not shipping lowers out here (BOOO!!) i still think you have great stuff on your website, especially the pneumatic buffers and Vltor semi-monolithic uppers. but seriously... you have really bad problems with keeping colors of products in stock like magpul black rail covers or flat dark earth other stuff... please try harder. i've turned away several many times from your site because of that. OH and before i forget... you don't carry bolt carrier group parts like bolt cam pins, firing pins, or firing pin retainer pins!!!! what's up with that? i would like rainier to be a one stop shop. furthermore, those press-on magazine grip things SUCK sometimes. i know it says the harder you squeeze the better they stick, but i would spend 10 minutes straight squeezing as hard as i could *OUCH* those things onto my pmags and yet a month later they're still peeling up. you guys need to do something about that. and while i'm on a roll with my whining (lol) how's about hooking me up with a .308? lol

JeffM
06-02-2008, 9:02 PM
Welcome to the California money wave. Riding on the coattails of others is fun!

Unfortunately there are other companies that were not afraid of fairytale "gray areas" that will see my piece of the pie.

cooper669
06-03-2008, 2:48 PM
+1000 for Rainier. They DO ship lowers to Ca, I got one myself. They do not send lowers with full auto markings like the POF 416 models. If you keep tabs on their site Rainier does stock alot of stuff although it may not be in stock for long. John is all about service, and Rainier Arms is at the top. They ship same day and I usually receive my order within three days. Thanks John:cool2: