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View Full Version : Challenge to the LEXIPOL CCW policy


Glock22Fan
10-16-2007, 5:31 PM
Investigation and PRAs have determined that LEXIPOL LLC is the provider of CCW Policies to PDs and SOs throughout California. This Policy is in use by Santa Maria PD who is currently in litigation in Federal Court for misapplication of this policy.

The outcome of this Federal suit may affect the viability and marketability of this Policy wherever it is in use and change the CCW landscape across California.

We have identified 7 departments currently using this policy and 5 others that require verification. The 7 departments are: Santa Maria PD, Santa Cruz PD, San Anselmo PD, Santa Barbara Sheriff, Pomona PD, Desert Hot Springs PD, Cathedral City PD.

We know there are others and urge all to contact their local departments and pass along any information on departments using the LEXIPOL CCW Policy.

We will maintain an updated list here (http://www.CaliforniaConcealedCarry.com/lexipol.html).

Glock22Fan
10-18-2007, 9:03 AM
Please guys, we need help.

TBJ has one case in the Federal courts, several more in preparation and we have recently signed yet another client. This activity should benefit ALL who believe that CCW's should be more readily available in ALL areas.

A common thread in these cases is the LEXIPOL CCW policy, which appears to be designed to allow CLEO's to deny permits while appearing to operate according to the law. THIS POLICY IS DEEPLY FLAWED. The more we know about it, and the departments who use it, the better able we will be to prepare cases.

TBJ can not make promises because cases are in court but it is our hope that one or more courts will share our position about the LEXIPOL Policy and it will will have to modified or discarded by the many departments using it. We have identified and verified the following departments using the policy: Santa Maria PD, Santa Barbara County SO, Pomona PD, Desert Hot Springs PD, Cathedral City PD, Santa Cruz PD and San Anselmo PD. LEXIPOL claims over 100 departments using its policies nationwide. It is important that we identify as many of these California departments as possible.

Departments suspected of using the policy, but not confirmed:
Anaheim PD, Anderson PD, Folsom PD, Murrieta PD, Yuba County SO, and Sonoma County SO. These departments are under investigation and pending verification.

All you need to do is pick a difficult department (you need not live there), post it here to avoid duplicate effort, and phone/email/write them to ask "Do you use the LEXIPOL CCW Policy? Nice and innocuous, five minutes work, nothing they can take offense at, and you have helped the cause.

There are people on this, and other, sites bewailing that people won't get involved. How about some of them taking the lead here and showing the rest how it is done?

Who is going to be first up on the plate?

Thanks

vandal
10-18-2007, 12:55 PM
If a local PD has an agreement with the sheriff that they will refer all CCW applicants to the sheriff, is the local PD still a target for this survey?

Glock22Fan
10-18-2007, 1:06 PM
If a local PD has an agreement with the sheriff that they will refer all CCW applicants to the sheriff, is the local PD still a target for this survey?

Thanks for the question - good point.

As long as they have "Declared G" What does "Declaring G" mean? (http://www.californiaconcealedcarry.com/faq.html#f250) and really do defer ALL applications to the sheriff, then that is their policy, and LEXIPOL is not relevant.

However, there are believed to be a few Chiefs who say that they refer all applicants to the sheriff, but haven't formally "Declared G," and still issue to certain favored residents. This is illegal.

Swirvin
10-18-2007, 2:58 PM
I called Newark PD, and the Lt. I was transferred to won't be back until next Tuesday. I'll call again at that time.

I called Alameda Co. Sheriff and was transferred to IA. The person with whom I needed to speak, apparently, was out. I left a message for him to call me back.

Bizcuits
10-18-2007, 5:48 PM
Sent you a pm on Sacramento, dunno if it'll help at all.

CCWFacts
10-18-2007, 6:06 PM
If you find a distinctive phrase in the policy, type it in to Google, in quotes, and see what turns up. Also google "copyright lexipol" and you'll get some ideas from that.

artherd
10-18-2007, 10:48 PM
I can confirm Sonoma County SO does use LEXIPOL.

Glock22Fan
10-19-2007, 8:49 AM
I can confirm Sonoma County SO does use LEXIPOL.

Sonoma added to "Confirmed" list.

Thanks.

And thanks to the others who have posted. Look forward to hearing more from you.

stingray4540
10-19-2007, 9:40 AM
Was going to call my local PD and sheriff, but looks like Swirvin beat me to it.

Hey Swirvin, we're neighbors.:cheers2:

Glock22Fan
10-19-2007, 9:58 AM
Was going to call my local PD and sheriff, but looks like Swirvin beat me to it.


There's still some 590 departments unaccounted for, if Swirven beat you to two, there's still a lot to choose from. You don't have to live there. :)

stingray4540
10-19-2007, 10:18 AM
There's still some 590 departments unaccounted for, if Swirven beat you to two, there's still a lot to choose from. You don't have to live there. :)

Aawww MAN! And I thought Swirvin just gave me an excuse to sit on my lazy ars and do nothing. Dang it!

Ok, called the Santa Clara County Sheriff's dep. and left a message, will report back later.

Glock22Fan
10-19-2007, 10:35 AM
Ok, called the Santa Clara County Sheriff's dep. and left a message, will report back later.

Attaboy!

Mute
10-19-2007, 10:36 AM
Do you need help with LAPD or LASD?

Glock22Fan
10-19-2007, 10:40 AM
Do you need help with LAPD or LASD?

I believe that neither of these use LEXIPOL. Perhaps I should add an additional section in the list for these departments.

Thanks anyway.

stingray4540
10-19-2007, 10:42 AM
Yes, you should, so people don't tell you what you already know.

Glock22Fan
10-19-2007, 10:46 AM
Yes, you should, so people don't tell you what you already know.

Done.
http://www.californiaconcealedcarry.com/lexipol.html

Matt640h
10-19-2007, 1:51 PM
I just got off the phone with the Walnut Creek PD and the Contra Costa SD. Walnut Creek PD referred me to the SD. SD said they have their own policy, but they kind of hurried past the question.

The conversations were kind of interesting though. WC PD said they let the SD handle CCWs. I then asked if they refer all applicants or if they selectively refer some or most applicants? They then stated "I think we refer all apps to the SD". When I called the SD, they thought I wanted to apply and asked me where I live, along with a few other questions. They then stated that I needed to apply at the PD first, then provide the PD denial letter to the SD before they would consider my app. I then said that I had heard that a denial letter could be a detriment to getting a CCW, but they said it would not. They are going to send me an app. and I believe they said a copy of their policy as well.

Glock22Fan
10-19-2007, 2:51 PM
I just got off the phone with the Walnut Creek PD and the Contra Costa SD. Walnut Creek PD referred me to the SD. SD said they have their own policy, but they kind of hurried past the question.

The conversations were kind of interesting though. WC PD said they let the SD handle CCWs. I then asked if they refer all applicants or if they selectively refer some or most applicants? They then stated "I think we refer all apps to the SD". When I called the SD, they thought I wanted to apply and asked me where I live, along with a few other questions. They then stated that I needed to apply at the PD first, then provide the PD denial letter to the SD before they would consider my app. I then said that I had heard that a denial letter could be a detriment to getting a CCW, but they said it would not. They are going to send me an app. and I believe they said a copy of their policy as well.

A very common policy, even if it is illegal.

The best way to deal with departments who do not want to give you verbal information is to ask in writing, certified mail. They are required to give you a copy of their policy, in writing.

In this case, let's see what the post brings in the form of a policy.

Police departments have two options under p.c. 12050. They can delegate ALL applicants to the S.O. (a written M.O.U. aka "Declaring G"), or they can process ALL applicants fairly. They are not allowed to process some and not others.

Keep us in touch with your findings.

Paladin
10-19-2007, 3:18 PM
I just got off the phone with the Walnut Creek PD and the Contra Costa SD. Walnut Creek PD referred me to the SD. SD said they have their own policy, but they kind of hurried past the question.

The conversations were kind of interesting though. WC PD said they let the SD handle CCWs. I then asked if they refer all applicants or if they selectively refer some or most applicants? They then stated "I think we refer all apps to the SD". When I called the SD, they thought I wanted to apply and asked me where I live, along with a few other questions. They then stated that I needed to apply at the PD first, then provide the PD denial letter to the SD before they would consider my app. I then said that I had heard that a denial letter could be a detriment to getting a CCW, but they said it would not. They are going to send me an app. and I believe they said a copy of their policy as well.I noticed that your sheriff's office still does not have any CCW info or an application online. A CoCoCo resident needs to call them up and ask where that info is, and if it's not online, why not and when will it be online. Note all names, titles and phone numbers of persons you speak to as well as the times and dates.

If you get stonewalled, then you'll need to call your County Supervisor (http://www.co.contra-costa.ca.us/BOS/) and tell them the problem and emphasize that this is a question of "Open Government" and "public access to government" and that all permits that the public can apply for should be available online and not hidden. The whole process took me about 10 minutes to do w/my county. My supervisor's chief of staff agreed re the open government argument and said he'd get back to me in 2-3 days. By the end of next week, hopefully things will have changed.

Everybody on CGN should make sure that CCW information is on their SO's website. This can and should also be done with all cities that issue CCWs (have their own PDs and haven't "Declared G"), using your city council member and/or mayor to pressure the police department to add CCW info to the PD's website.

Even if they won't issue (e.g., SF), just getting the permit applications online (Can anyone find the CCW application at SF PD's "Permits" webpage? :rolleyes: http://www.sfgov.org/site/police_index.asp?id=20147) will help our cause.

If someone living in SF wants to do this, they might want to contact the SF Sunshine Ordinance Task Force (http://www.sfgov.org/site/sunshine_index.asp) before their supervisor.

Swirvin
10-19-2007, 8:48 PM
Was going to call my local PD and sheriff, but looks like Swirvin beat me to it.

Hey Swirvin, we're neighbors.:cheers2:

Howdy, neighbor. :seeya:

Yeah, didn't get a chance to call back today. I'll call again Monday or Tuesday at the latest.

Swirvin
10-24-2007, 2:05 PM
Called again today and left messages for both. One officer at the Newark PD indicated they do not defer issuance to the Sheriff, though.

Python2
10-24-2007, 4:38 PM
How can I tell if the written policy I received from San Mateo County is a Lexipol CCW policy?

zok
10-25-2007, 10:57 AM
How can I tell if the written policy I received from San Mateo County is a Lexipol CCW policy?

You can tell by looking at the bottom of pages and it should have Lexipol LLC printed on each page or last.

Python2
10-25-2007, 4:12 PM
You can tell by looking at the bottom of pages and it should have Lexipol LLC printed on each page or last.

I checked and nothing about Lexipol LLC.

Swirvin
10-25-2007, 8:13 PM
A very nice Lt. from the Newark PD called me back tonight and confirmed that they do use the Lexipol policy. I tried Alameda SD CCW division again, but no one answered, and I have left 2 messages with them already.

Glock22Fan
10-26-2007, 12:38 PM
A very nice Lt. from the Newark PD called me back tonight and confirmed that they do use the Lexipol policy. I tried Alameda SD CCW division again, but no one answered, and I have left 2 messages with them already.

Thanks, Swirvin, I have updated http://www.californiaconcealedcarry.com/lexipol.html

Would you like a credit for information that on our page?

Swirvin
10-26-2007, 7:08 PM
Would you like a credit for information that on our page?

It's not necessary. I'm just happy to lend a hand. I'll keep working on Alameda Co.

patsline74
01-17-2010, 10:45 AM
Necropost, I know. I'm trying to avoid doing homework.

Do you still need people to get info for other counties not on this list (http://www.californiaconcealedcarry.com/lexipol.html)? I live in Yolo and you might have it already from the Sykes case, idk.

M1A Rifleman
01-17-2010, 11:46 AM
FYI, Lexipol LLC, is simply a company that is hired to make Fire and Police policies uniform accross the State. As I undertsand it, they don't make policy or law.

D-Man
01-17-2010, 12:12 PM
La Verne Police Department uses Lexipol policy.

GoodEyeSniper
01-17-2010, 12:18 PM
Got all ramped up to contact Napa PD, and Napa County SD, didn't realize this was a 3 year old thread :D

Probably going to just inquire about their CCW policy anyways...

yellowfin
01-17-2010, 1:49 PM
I'm wondering if these people are doing anything on the East Coast...hmm...

FreeFlyFreak
06-03-2011, 10:42 PM
Old thread I know.........

But what the hell is LEXIPOL policy?
I see numerous threads but no definition.

wildhawker
06-03-2011, 10:59 PM
Old thread I know.........

But what the hell is LEXIPOL policy?
I see numerous threads but no definition.

Lexipol is a company who offers boilerplate policies and other services to the law enforcement community.