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Grouch
09-16-2007, 6:11 PM
The info I have is taken from here, so I assume it is up to date.

http://calgunlaws.com/modules.php?name=FAQ&myfaq=yes&id_cat=4&categories=Buying+and+Selling+Firearms#3


Q: Can I legally transfer ownership of a firearm to another family member without the waiting period, without processing the transfer through a firearms dealer or without registration?


A: Yes, providing the transfer is to a person=s parent, child, grandparent or grandchild who is not a person prohibited from possessing firearms, and the firearms being transferred is a rifle or a shotgun. There is no waiting period and in this case, no forms are required to be filed with the State Department of Justice. However, if the transfer of a firearms is from one spouse to the other, or if the firearm is a handgun, there is no waiting period, but a report of the transfer must be mailed to the Department of Justice within 30 days using forms which can be obtained by contacting the department (916) 227 3703. If the firearm is a handgun, the person taking title must first obtain a "Basic Firearm Safety Certificate". (Section 12078 P.C.) This section also applies to gifts, bequests, and inheritances. There is no exemption from the waiting period or the "through dealer" transaction requirement for transfers between siblings; aunts, uncles, or friends. Handguns that are classified as curio/relics are subject to the same handgun provisions as described above. Antique firearms are not subject to any waiting period or requirement to file forms. An "assault weapon" cannot legally be transferred, except between spouses or to a child and then only if the firearm was originally registered in both their names under the family joint registration provision of Penal Code Section 12285(e).



Ok, so my uncle is in charge of my grandfathers firearms now that my grandfather has had a stroke and has lost all sense of reality, is bedridden and hasn't left the hospital in 3 years. He has decided to have me inherit an M1 Garand and M1 Carbine. For some reason my uncle thinks that congress will try and pass another assault weapons ban and that on this ban both of these 2 rifles will be listed and as such will not be able to be transfer to anyone after. (I don’t know anything about that or how grounded in fact it may be). That being, he wants to do the inheritance asap and get the guns in my name.

From my reading of the above law it doesn’t sound like there is any paper work that has to be done for the exchange from direct line of decent (grandfather to grandson). Should I still fill out a report of the transfer and mail it in. My grandfather is not in any capacity to go to an FFL let alone fill out any paper work. If possible I would like to do the transfer over the course of a single day as my uncle and grandfather both live 300 miles away.

What course of action should I take?

DedEye
09-16-2007, 6:52 PM
The info I have is taken from here, so I assume it is up to date.

http://calgunlaws.com/modules.php?name=FAQ&myfaq=yes&id_cat=4&categories=Buying+and+Selling+Firearms#3





Ok, so my uncle is in charge of my grandfathers firearms now that my grandfather has had a stroke and has lost all sense of reality, is bedridden and hasn't left the hospital in 3 years. He has decided to have me inherit an M1 Garand and M1 Carbine. For some reason my uncle thinks that congress will try and pass another assault weapons ban and that on this ban both of these 2 rifles will be listed and as such will not be able to be transfer to anyone after. (I don’t know anything about that or how grounded in fact it may be). That being, he wants to do the inheritance asap and get the guns in my name.

From my reading of the above law it doesn’t sound like there is any paper work that has to be done for the exchange from direct line of decent (grandfather to grandson). Should I still fill out a report of the transfer and mail it in. My grandfather is not in any capacity to go to an FFL let alone fill out any paper work. If possible I would like to do the transfer over the course of a single day as my uncle and grandfather both live 300 miles away.

What course of action should I take?

From my reading of what you posted (I'm not a lawyer), there's no paperwork to fill out. Your uncle was the custodian of your grandfather's firearms but all he has to do is give them to you and they're yours.

Grouch
09-16-2007, 7:05 PM
From my reading of what you posted (I'm not a lawyer), there's no paperwork to fill out. Your uncle was the custodian of your grandfather's firearms but all he has to do is give them to you and they're yours.


That's what I thought too. I guess my issue is whether his fears of a Clinton era like gun ban coming back actually have any weight behind them.

I guess I could do that mail a report of the transfer and pay the fee just to cover my butt though.

Zhukov
09-16-2007, 7:31 PM
You know, I was just going to make a post similar to this. My grandfather has worsening alzheimer's and we no longer want his .22 revolver and .22 rifle in their house. Since I'm the defacto gun owner in the family, they would go to me.

Basically, from what this says, I don't have to worry about paperwork at all on the rifle, but the revolver needs to have something filled out? I just want to clarify the situation to be 100% legit. I do have an HSC. The gun is fairly old as my grandfather is in his upper 80's and he's had it for a loooong time, but I don't think that's relevant.

bwiese
09-16-2007, 7:32 PM
Ok, so my uncle is in charge of my grandfathers firearms now that my grandfather has had a stroke and has lost all sense of reality, is bedridden and hasn't left the hospital in 3 years.

Things vary whether or not your uncle and/or your grandfather are inside or outside CA. Don't screw your uncle into illegal activity, either.

Your uncle isn't a valid entity for an 'interfamiliar transfer' to you. And your grandfather can't really (in CA) transfer firearms to your uncle w/o FFL unless your uncle happens to be his son, or if he has special custodial rights/ power-of-attorney.

He has decided to have me inherit an M1 Garand and M1 Carbine.

Your use of 'inherit' term is extremely questionable. Gramps is still alive and so it's a transfer.

As long as 'inherit' means "wait til granddad dies and then you get the guns, and those guns are still gramps'", OK. If he's giving them to you ahead of time, that may or may not be a legal interfamiliar transfer depending on the nature of your uncle's relationship w/grandfather (son? power of attorney?)

For some reason my uncle thinks that congress will try and pass another assault weapons ban and that on this ban both of these 2 rifles will be listed and as such will not be able to be transfer to anyone after.


Sorry, he's dizzily politically naive and should be completely disregarded in these matters.


(I don’t know anything about that or how grounded in fact it may be). That being, he wants to do the inheritance asap and get the guns in my name.


Dude, sorry to say again, but it's not an inheritance UNTIL YOUR GRANDDAD IS DEAD. Period.

If your uncle has power-of-attorney for your granddad, then an interfamiliar transfer from gramps to you could be executed.

If your uncle has actually acquired the rifle(s) from your grandfather inside CA, and the uncle is not a son of your grandfather, then that's an invalid/illegal transfer inside CA and these guns were illegally transferred outside FFL channels.

And if your relatives are outside of California, interfamiliar transfers are moot since most all interstate firearms transfers must go thru an FFL. If your granddad were outside CA and does pass on and leave you the guns, you could indeed avoid an FFL since it's a probate/inheritance matter and not a transfer.

Good luck to your grandfather, perhaps things can improve.

Oh - filling out the transfer forms but doing an improper transfer doesn't erase a prior crime (invalid transfer, not going thru FFL dealer) from having occurred.

tenpercentfirearms
09-16-2007, 7:57 PM
Just get the guns and if anyone ever asks, your grandfather gave them to you, which is perfectly legal.

bwiese
09-16-2007, 8:02 PM
Just get the guns and if anyone ever asks, your grandfather gave them to you, which is perfectly legal.

Only if gramps is inside CA.

If outside, they have to go thru FFL (unless there's some antique/C&R exception, but I am not sure these guns would have it).

Grouch
09-16-2007, 8:55 PM
Thanks for the help.

Everyone lives in CA. My uncle is my grandfather’s son. My grandmother is my uncles’ mother and has power of attorney; it was her idea to have me “inherit” these. Again it is physically impossible to get my grandfather to an FFL anyways, let alone get him to sign anything. We are all blood relatives.

In this case inheritance vs. transfer is just an argument of semantics. Or inappropriate verb usage, whatever you want.

Knowing that my uncle is a might whimsical in the brainpan and despite whatever reassurances I may give him that these firearms are not in danger of being put on a banned list, I still have to do this in a manner in which he feels comfortable. Would there be any harm to notifying the DOJ of the transfer as one would with a hand gun? there is no waiting period, but a report of the transfer must be mailed to the Department of Justice within 30 days using forms which can be obtained by contacting the department (916) 227 3703.

Even if it is just to give my uncle peace of mind.

tenpercentfirearms
09-16-2007, 10:00 PM
Would there be any harm to notifying the DOJ of the transfer as one would with a hand gun?Yes. Telling the DOJ you have guns when you don't have to should be avoided at all costs. Just get the guns and if anyone asked, grandpa gave them to you. No one is going to ask.

Tell uncle it is perfectly legal for you to receive the long guns from grandpa. Show him the links you have found. It is that simple. If you want, tell him you will fill out and send the forms after you get them from him, but then forget to do it. Again, there is no requirement for long guns and registering your guns with the state when it is not necessary is just plain stupid in my opinion. It is none of their business.

Grouch
09-16-2007, 10:16 PM
Yes. Telling the DOJ you have guns when you don't have to should be avoided at all costs. Just get the guns and if anyone asked, grandpa gave them to you. No one is going to ask.

Tell uncle it is perfectly legal for you to receive the long guns from grandpa. Show him the links you have found. It is that simple. If you want, tell him you will fill out and send the forms after you get them from him, but then forget to do it. Again, there is no requirement for long guns and registering your guns with the state when it is not necessary is just plain stupid in my opinion. It is none of their business.



Good point.

Thanks.

Mssr. Eleganté
09-16-2007, 11:19 PM
Since everybody involved is a California resident and the firearms are C&R long guns over 50 years old then we don't even have to worry about "family" issues here.

They can be transfered from grandfather to uncle and then to the OP because of the California 50 year long gun exemption.

This only applies if we're talking about a USGI Garand and Carbine, since the commercial versions aren't 50 years old yet.

Grouch
09-16-2007, 11:31 PM
This only applies if we're talking about a USGI Garand and Carbine, since the commercial versions aren't 50 years old yet.

I'll have to find out on that. They may be vintage government issued ones. My Grandfather was in WWII. I really don't know though.

Thank you for that information.

tenpercentfirearms
09-17-2007, 6:05 AM
I'll have to find out on that. They may be vintage government issued ones. My Grandfather was in WWII. I really don't know though.

Thank you for that information.

No, you don't have to find out. Your grandfather gave them to you so that doesn't matter. Lets quit making this into a bigger deal than it is.

Still a good catch Amendment II, but lets keep him heading in the right direction. Grandfather gave them to him. That simple.

Fjold
09-17-2007, 7:04 AM
Thanks for the help.

Everyone lives in CA. My uncle is my grandfather’s son. My grandmother is my uncles’ mother and has power of attorney; it was her idea to have me “inherit” these.

Grandma has POA, she can give them to you, no paperwork, no problem.

Glock22Fan
09-17-2007, 3:34 PM
Grandma has POA, she can give them to you, no paperwork, no problem.

Does Grandma even need POA?

This is a community property state. If the rifles are Grandad's, surely they are also Grandma's.

So, why can't Grandma give her rifles to her grandson?