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View Full Version : CAL NRA needs help now, today! AB1471 and more!


6172crew
08-26-2007, 12:16 PM
I just got this email and Im passing it along for some help from CalGunners.

NRA
Members'
Councils
of
California

<< Please cross-post & distribute this CAL-ERT >>
<< Please cross-post & distribute this CAL-ERT >>
<< Please cross-post & distribute this CAL-ERT >>

CAL-ERT 08/26/07 -- 10:30 A. M.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
CALIFORNIA LEGISLATIVE UPDATE
This information is accurate at the time this CAL-ERT was written and originally distributed. The scheduled times and dates for hearings are subject to change, by the legislature, with little or no advance notice. The NRA Members' Councils of California will keep you informed as the legislative situation changes in Sacramento.

LEGISLATION PENDING: (Votes could come at any time!)

AB1471 (Feuer) MICROSTAMPING - This bill would, commencing January 1, 2010, expand the definition of "unsafe handgun" to include semiautomatic pistols that are not designed and equipped with the unproven technology of a microscopic array of characters that identify the make, model, and serial number of the pistol, etched into the interior surface or internal working parts of the pistol, and that are transferred by imprinting on each cartridge case when the firearm is fired. This is the notorious Fix your gun -- face a felony bill!
STATUS: On the Senate Floor -- OPPOSE

AB821 (Nava) LEAD AMMO BAN - Although there is no sound scientific data that the use of lead ammunition for hunting is a serious threat to the condor, this bill would enact the Ridley-Tree Condor Preservation Act to require the use of non-lead centerfire rifle and pistol ammunition when taking big game and coyote within specified areas. The act would require the commission to establish, by regulation, by January 1, 2008, a public process to certify centerfire rifle and pistol ammunition as non-lead ammunition, and to define non-lead ammunition by regulation. Under the act, a person who violates those requirements would be guilty of an infraction punishable by a $500 fine for the first offense. Because the act would create a new crime, this bill would create a state-mandated local program.

Supposedly, AB821 would declare the Legislature's intent to protect vulnerable wildlife species, including the California condor, from the threat of lead poisoning. The fact is that AB 821 and similar regulatory restrictions are not designed to protect the California condor. Instead, they are designed to cripple hunting by pretending that ammunition containing lead is the problem.
STATUS: On the Senate Floor -- OPPOSE

AB334 (Levine) MANDATORY LOSS/THEFT REPORTING - This bill would make it an infraction for any person whose handgun is stolen or irretrievably lost to, within 5 working days after his or her discovery or knowledge of, or within 5 working days after the date he or she reasonably "should have known" of, the theft or loss, fail to report the theft or loss to a local law enforcement agency of the jurisdiction in which the theft or loss occurred or in which the person resides. This ridiculous Victimize the victim bill is similar to a bill that the Governor vetoed last year!
STATUS: On the Senate Floor -- OPPOSE

ACTION REQUESTED:
KEEP UP THE PRESSURE!!! Your voice is being heard in the Capitol. Please continue to CALL, FAX, and EMAIL the legislators. All three methods of communication are effective and we must keep up the broad-based effort. Refer to Contact Information below.

Contact Information:
State Senate: A complete listing of all of the State Senators including phone/fax/email information can be found HERE . Also, you can send a single email to each of the State Senators by using the special "ONE CLICK" email address that you can find HERE . By sending one email to the special "ONE CLICK" address, each one of the State Senators will receive a copy of your message (so it is probably a good idea to address your messages with: Dear Senator,).

Please call the following legislators and urge them to OPPOSE the three bills listed above:
(Note -- since one or more of these bills might be required to return to the Assembly for a concurrence vote, we are asking you to call specified legislators in both houses)

District Legislator Capitol Phone Number
SD 02 Wiggins 916-651-4002
SD 05 Machado 916-651-4005
SD 11 Simitian 916-651-4011
SD 15 Maldonado 916-651-4015
SD 16 Florez 916-651-4016
SD 30 Calderon 916-651-4030
SD 32 Negrete McLeod 916-651-4032
SD 34 Correa 916-651-4034
AD 08 Wolk 916-319-2008
AD 09 Huffman 916-319-2009
AD 17 Galgiani 916-319-2017
AD 30 Parra 916-319-2030
AD 31 Arambula 916-319-2031
AD 62 Carter 916-319-2062
AD 69 Solorio 916-319-2069

chunger
08-26-2007, 3:19 PM
Time to fire up the faxes again. . . I hope we get a good concerted effort again on these and send a clear message.

bwiese
08-26-2007, 3:23 PM
Politeness counts.

Calling a separate time (with appropriate spacing) for each item to be addressed can help.

Backing your calls with faxes or letters can help.

RRangel
08-27-2007, 8:07 AM
Don't forget to contact your reps. They need to get plenty of faxes and phone calls.

chris
08-27-2007, 9:05 AM
Get off your butts people and e-mail, or call the legslature. this is no time to be laxed. this bill is a defacto gun ban when and if the handguns fall off teh approved list.

GET INVOLVED NOW OR LOSE ALL TOMMORROW!!!!!!

one click e-mails sent. Guys come one. we beat them last year we can do it again. don't get lazy and wait for someone else to do it for you!!!!!!!!!!

Piper
08-27-2007, 9:05 AM
We have two great pro-2A reps in the Rancho Cucamonga area. Bob Dutton (state senator) and Bill Emmerson (state assembly) are opponents of the ridiculous gun laws.

Can'thavenuthingood
08-27-2007, 9:27 AM
Called Senator Florez office a few minutes ago and the lady wrote down my opposition to the Bills. Said he will see this.

I had to wait on hold about 1 minute or so. She was in a hurry.

Vick

Centurion_D
08-27-2007, 10:12 AM
Who should we contact? Our Assembly members or our state senators? I've already called my state senator and voiced my opposition to these bills.

Kestryll
08-27-2007, 10:15 AM
Who should we contact? Our Assembly members or our state senators? I've already called my state senator and voiced my opposition to these bills.

It looks like it's the State Senators right now.

Contact Information:
State Senate: A complete listing of all of the State Senators including phone/fax/email information can be found HERE . Also, you can send a single email to each of the State Senators by using the special "ONE CLICK" email address that you can find HERE . By sending one email to the special "ONE CLICK" address, each one of the State Senators will receive a copy of your message (so it is probably a good idea to address your messages with: Dear Senator,).

Please call the following legislators and urge them to OPPOSE the three bills listed above:
(Note -- since one or more of these bills might be required to return to the Assembly for a concurrence vote, we are asking you to call specified legislators in both houses)

District Legislator Capitol Phone Number
SD 02 Wiggins 916-651-4002
SD 05 Machado 916-651-4005
SD 11 Simitian 916-651-4011
SD 15 Maldonado 916-651-4015
SD 16 Florez 916-651-4016
SD 30 Calderon 916-651-4030
SD 32 Negrete McLeod 916-651-4032
SD 34 Correa 916-651-4034
AD 08 Wolk 916-319-2008
AD 09 Huffman 916-319-2009
AD 17 Galgiani 916-319-2017
AD 30 Parra 916-319-2030
AD 31 Arambula 916-319-2031
AD 62 Carter 916-319-2062
AD 69 Solorio 916-319-2069

JOEKILLA
08-27-2007, 1:53 PM
Making calls every chance I get while I am at work (in between calguns new posts check :D).

chunger
08-27-2007, 2:24 PM
Agreement with the NRA is beside the point for the task at hand. If you don't agree with them, cool. . . don't give them any money AND make some calls.

I agree with them because they've done a ton particularly this last year four our cause on many fronts. . . . so I give them money . . . . AND made some calls.

CalNRA
08-27-2007, 2:27 PM
Agreement with the NRA is beside the point for the task at hand. If you don't agree with them, cool. . . don't give them any money AND make some calls.

I agree with them because they've done a ton particularly this last year four our cause on many fronts. . . . so I give them money . . . . AND made some calls.

agreed.

making calls is the main topic here.

Kestryll
08-29-2007, 1:35 PM
This thread has been cleaned up and all the off topic stuff removed.

Now, there is some commentary gong around that this may come up on Thursday the 31st.

So let's make Wednesday the day we ring the phones off the wall and clog email boxes.

We know how to do this and we know it can be effective so let's make it happen.

RRangel
08-29-2007, 4:05 PM
If you haven't already please make sure your voice is heard. We cannot let these bills become law. Do not let up.

Lets make sure you tell your friends and family to let their voices be heard regarding these bills. Even if you call make sure you send a fax to.

Californio
08-31-2007, 5:04 PM
Any Newz?

CCWFacts
09-03-2007, 1:58 PM
This is one of the cases where I disagree with the NRA. And so when I disagree with the NRA, what I do is, a) I'm still an NRA member and supporter and will be for the foreseeable future and b) if I disagree with them on some particular issue, I just let that issue go by without calling / writing, and I write / call twice as much on the next issue where I do agree with them (which is about 90% of the time).

rivviepop
09-06-2007, 12:13 PM
Can anyone help discuss why AB334 has an OPPOSE position? From my viewpoint I think this - on face value - seems like a good thing, and don't consider it victimizing the victim. Regardless of AB334's success it's already ingrained in my mind that if I have a weapon lost/stolen the first thing I will do is report it to the proper authorities. I consider this part & parcel of being a legal gun owner and a responsible citizen of the US - I have my rights and freedoms but they come with responsibility. (I liken this to free speech and yelling 'fire!' in a crowded theatre)

What reasoning is there for not reporting the loss/theft as outlined in this bill? Is there some small print I'm missing?

Kestryll
09-06-2007, 12:35 PM
I think the concern is that you're liable/guilty whether you know it was stolen or not.
If this is the legislation I'm thinking of if your weapon is stolen and the Police recover it before you know it's gone you're still hosed.

As I recall it's has to do with requiring a report within a time frame of it being stolen not the discovery of the theft.

I may be thinking of a different bill however, they try so many it's like trying to keep track of each pellet as it comes out of the shotgun.

bwiese
09-06-2007, 1:31 PM
Even if AB334 had the tiniest bit of merit, it criminalizes *passive* lack of action. If you don't know you've lost a gun (which can logically happen in several ways) how can you report it?

Do you have all your gun info accurately recorded? If your house burned down, how could you report your lost guns - do you remember every one of 'em and there serial #s?

AB334 must be opposed because IT IS A FRAMEWORK LAW THAT CAN HAVE MORE ANTI-GUN CRAP GLUED ONTO IT EVERY YEAR.

Passing an initial law is generally harder for legislators than passing "glue-on" add-on laws for legislation already passed in the year or two before.

rivviepop
09-06-2007, 2:07 PM
Even if AB334 had the tiniest bit of merit, it criminalizes *passive* lack of action. If you don't know you've lost a gun (which can logically happen in several ways) how can you report it?

I gotcha -- this was the part I was missing. Preaching to the choir, I hate passive laws (or anything really - Wells Fargo just tried a "passive VISA upgrade" on me and I've been fighting with them ever since).

Kestryll
09-06-2007, 3:55 PM
CRAP!!

We HAVE to get Arnie to veto it!!

RRangel
09-06-2007, 4:10 PM
Can anyone help discuss why AB334 has an OPPOSE position? From my viewpoint I think this - on face value - seems like a good thing, and don't consider it victimizing the victim. Regardless of AB334's success it's already ingrained in my mind that if I have a weapon lost/stolen the first thing I will do is report it to the proper authorities. I consider this part & parcel of being a legal gun owner and a responsible citizen of the US - I have my rights and freedoms but they come with responsibility. (I liken this to free speech and yelling 'fire!' in a crowded theatre)

What reasoning is there for not reporting the loss/theft as outlined in this bill? Is there some small print I'm missing?

Are you for real? Do you realize what this bill means? I'm shocked that someone doesn't think this isn't a huge affront to gun owners. You are a problem waiting to happen to the elite who created this law. You will be guilty as charged for being a victim. Is that clear enough?

How is it that this is a good thing? Can you please answer that? Why should a person who is a gun owner be persecuted like a second class citizen because followers of Marxism don't like gun owners or those who are independent minded? Laws like this belong in totalitarian regimes not the United States of America.


Folks you need to get hot on this. The governor needs to know this isn't going to fly.

Californio
09-06-2007, 4:15 PM
AB 1471 just passed the CA State Senate with 21 "aye" votes.

it will do an easy cruise through the Assembly for "concurrence in amendments"

then it will be to the Governor early next week.

I cannot believe the stupidity of these guys:confused:

RRangel
09-06-2007, 4:28 PM
Let there be no doubt of the disdain leftists have for guns and gun owners. You're seeing it right here yourself. If you're new here or you haven't contacted your reps or know someone who hasn't this is why we need all the pro gun people we know to contact the right reps in a timely manner. Get ready to call the governor.

chris
09-06-2007, 4:45 PM
has anyone recieved a call from the NRA. they have called me to call my senator.

OK FOLKS IT'S TIME TO ACT NOW OR LOSE IT ALL. I think it's safe to say that this is the one that will take it all away for handguns in this state!

EVERYONE HERE GET OFF YOUR BUTTS AND CALL, E-MAIL, FAX, OR WHATEVER AND GET INVOLVED NOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

peepshowal
09-06-2007, 4:57 PM
AB 1471 just passed the CA State Senate with 21 "aye" votes.

it will do an easy cruise through the Assembly for "concurrence in amendments"

then it will be to the Governor early next week.

Feeling angry and a little sick to your stomach like I am? Well, like it has been said, now is the time to contact the Governor about vetoing this. Call, fax, e-mail now!

chris
09-06-2007, 5:01 PM
There are 249 people on now. I hope you guys are e-mailing and going to call these people tommorrow. lets get hot now!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

rivviepop
09-06-2007, 5:31 PM
Are you for real? Do you realize what this bill means? I'm shocked that someone doesn't think this isn't a huge affront to gun owners. You are a problem waiting to happen to the elite who created this law. You will be guilty as charged for being a victim. Is that clear enough?

Calm down and discuss things rationally, ok? Not everyone here believes what you do, lives like you do, and wants what you do. I am a layman gun owner, I don't live and breathe these things and simply read the bill at face value and think it's a good thing. If you'll note the followup post by another member pointed out what I was missing, to which I replied.

As pointed out the problem is in it's passive stance - I happen to think that if it were rewritten to be more gun rights friendly (not even gun rights - just plain average citizen rights) that you have to report it once discovering it's been lost/stolen, this would be a good thing for everyone. No time limit, etc. - just making it the law you have to report it. I consider this a fair and acceptable responsibility to be on my shoulders as a gun owner -- and I'll admit I *thought* it was already law until I read this thread and that bill.

How is it that this is a good thing? Can you please answer that? Why should a person who is a gun owner be persecuted like a second class citizen because followers of Marxism don't like gun owners or those who are independent minded? Laws like this belong in totalitarian regimes not the United States of America.

I can't decide which of the billion logical debate fallacies this whole paragraph falls under, you're just letting your emotions run rampant. I happen to think - as stated above - in a rewritten form this bill would be perfectly acceptable. A firearm is a dangerous item and should be accounted for at all times (not on paper or in some database, but realistically where it's at, who could use it, etc.) as a matter of being a good citizen. The 5-day thing, ok that's way over the line and is enough to veto this bill for sure.

Folks you need to get hot on this. The governor needs to know this isn't going to fly.

...and you need to present logical, good solid arguments to your leaders in a clear manner without resorting to ad hominem and spewing about Marxism and Totalitarian regimes. The people who write these bills believe in their own mind they are protecting the public - it is our task to calmly and intelligently inform them of the other side of the issue(s) and bring about change in the system.

EDIT: I might add that I've been a member of the EFF, AMA (Motorcyclist not Medical :) ) and other similar organizations for many years. Gun rights/control issues are not unique and are mirrored by the other groups for their defense of citizens rights against the establishment creating unfair and unjust laws. Tempers and fuming solves nothing and goes nowhere, intelligent and thoughtful arguments/rebuttals/etc. are what foster change.

bwiese
09-06-2007, 5:49 PM
As pointed out the problem is in it's passive stance - I happen to think that if it were rewritten to be more gun rights friendly (not even gun rights - just plain average citizen rights) ..

Your naivete is astounding.

#1, this bill ain't gonna get rewritten further. It's at its do-or-die point right now.

#2, this is the the camel's nose in the tent, creating an infrastructure for hanging future bad law. Look what happened with SB15 'drop testing' morphing into microstamping.

Understand that the people writing these laws DO NOT CARE ABOUT SAFETY AT ALL. They are merely using it to harrass gun owners to score points with their base.

If you're not bothered, you're not reading/thinking.

rivviepop
09-06-2007, 6:04 PM
Your naivete is astounding.

Thanks. Your conceit is fantastic! Your grammar isn't half bad as well, kudos.


#1, this bill ain't gonna get rewritten further. It's at its do-or-die point right now.


Did I say it was? I made the comment if it were to be -- you read into the statement way more than is there. I also did not say anything about it's urgent status, to which I agree what you've said. You're just looking to pick a fight, it looks like.


Understand that the people writing these laws DO NOT CARE ABOUT SAFETY AT ALL. They are merely using it to harrass gun owners to score points with their base.


Prove it, show me (well us) some memos where said persons are discussing their intent to harass owners. You're just expressing what you happen to think, which is not what I happen to think. A lot of folks forget that not everyone is like them, and to some people they truly believe they are doing the right thing, doing good, etc. These are their beliefs, and they make the basis for the laws they try and write.

Just like you're screaming at "the other side" to see your point, you need to stop and walk a mile in their shoes to understand their point of view. While there're bad apples in every group, I truly believe a lot of lawmakers are - in their own viewpoints - doing the right thing for their constituents. Unfortunately things tend to get mucked up along the way and bad things come out of good intents.

(insert Bush versus Anti-Bush arguments here)

If you're not bothered, you're not reading/thinking.

I call BS. I read and think quite a lot, thank you, and may not be bothered by the same things you are. This 5-day thing bothers me (or any time limit), but the idea that you have to report a stolen weapon does not. We could have the same discussion about.... SUVs and it would be identical to any gun rights issue - two camps of believers who think they're both in the right.

RRangel
09-06-2007, 6:05 PM
Calm down and discuss things rationally, ok? Not everyone here believes what you do, lives like you do, and wants what you do. I am a layman gun owner, I don't live and breathe these things and simply read the bill at face value and think it's a good thing. If you'll note the followup post by another member pointed out what I was missing, to which I replied.

As pointed out the problem is in it's passive stance - I happen to think that if it were rewritten to be more gun rights friendly (not even gun rights - just plain average citizen rights) that you have to report it once discovering it's been lost/stolen, this would be a good thing for everyone. No time limit, etc. - just making it the law you have to report it. I consider this a fair and acceptable responsibility to be on my shoulders as a gun owner -- and I'll admit I *thought* it was already law until I read this thread and that bill.



I can't decide which of the billion logical debate fallacies this whole paragraph falls under, you're just letting your emotions run rampant. I happen to think - as stated above - in a rewritten form this bill would be perfectly acceptable. A firearm is a dangerous item and should be accounted for at all times (not on paper or in some database, but realistically where it's at, who could use it, etc.) as a matter of being a good citizen. The 5-day thing, ok that's way over the line and is enough to veto this bill for sure.



...and you need to present logical, good solid arguments to your leaders in a clear manner without resorting to ad hominem and spewing about Marxism and Totalitarian regimes. The people who write these bills believe in their own mind they are protecting the public - it is our task to calmly and intelligently inform them of the other side of the issue(s) and bring about change in the system.

Calm down? Really? So you suppose I just discovered this law yesterday and by chance just happened to decide it came from extreme leftists?

Well fool me once shame on them. Fool me twice shame on me.

You do not have to explain why these laws have come about. Many of us here are well versed on the why.

You need say no more. Oh thank you wise one for imparting your great wisdom upon me.

Gee what was I thinking?

rivviepop
09-06-2007, 6:16 PM
Calm down? Really? So you suppose I just discovered this law yesterday and by chance just happened to decide it came from extreme leftists?

Well fool me once shame on them. Fool me twice shame on me.

You do not have to explain why these laws have come about. Many of us here are well versed on the why.

You need say no more. Oh thank you wise one for imparting your great wisdom upon me.

Gee what was I thinking?

Sweet baby jesus. I stated an opinion and asked for clarification about what I was missing, and get attacked by yourself and bwiese by metric boatloads of fury and temper but not a whole lot of good honest discussion. I am then (somewhat, I could walk away) forced to "defend" myself from your verbal abuse and sarcastic comment that really has nothing to do with logically debating the AB334 issue.

You two have codified the difference between a "gun owner" and a "gun nut" and reminded me why I don't talk politics with people who can't discuss things calmly. Last post, I'm out of this thread and probably this whole sub-forum thanks to your and bwiese's verbal slaughter.

Way to go, you just confirmed the stereotype everyone has of gun owners and chased someone out of a forum. Have a cookie.

Kestryll
09-06-2007, 6:18 PM
Calm down and discuss things rationally, ok? Not everyone here believes what you do, lives like you do, and wants what you do.
Actually, probably 90% of the members here DO agree with him and want what he wants, that's why we're here.
I am a layman gun owner, I don't live and breathe these things and simply read the bill at face value and think it's a good thing. If you'll note the followup post by another member pointed out what I was missing, to which I replied.
A large percentage of the membership here DO live and breathe these proposed laws, regulations and documents. I'd hazard to say several members here are more versed in the language of legislation than most of our State politicians.

As pointed out the problem is in it's passive stance - I happen to think that if it were rewritten to be more gun rights friendly (not even gun rights - just plain average citizen rights) that you have to report it once discovering it's been lost/stolen, this would be a good thing for everyone. No time limit, etc. - just making it the law you have to report it. I consider this a fair and acceptable responsibility to be on my shoulders as a gun owner -- and I'll admit I *thought* it was already law until I read this thread and that bill.


I can't decide which of the billion logical debate fallacies this whole paragraph falls under, you're just letting your emotions run rampant. I happen to think - as stated above - in a rewritten form this bill would be perfectly acceptable. A firearm is a dangerous item and should be accounted for at all times (not on paper or in some database, but realistically where it's at, who could use it, etc.) as a matter of being a good citizen. The 5-day thing, ok that's way over the line and is enough to veto this bill for sure.
You are mistaking dedication for emotional outbursts.
This is not a new fight to many of us and the longevity of the fight is means either you are commited to seeing it through or you walk fairly quickly.


...and you need to present logical, good solid arguments to your leaders in a clear manner without resorting to ad hominem and spewing about Marxism and Totalitarian regimes. The people who write these bills believe in their own mind they are protecting the public - it is our task to calmly and intelligently inform them of the other side of the issue(s) and bring about change in the system.
We have spent the last two years presenting arguments in hearings, by phone, fax, emails and letters. We have worked with the Cal-NRA and the top firearms law firm in California to stop both bad laws and unnecessary incarcerations.
This is not our first time at the rodeo nor have we been absent in the fight to bring change.


EDIT: I might add that I've been a member of the EFF, AMA (Motorcyclist not Medical :) ) and other similar organizations for many years. Gun rights/control issues are not unique and are mirrored by the other groups for their defense of citizens rights against the establishment creating unfair and unjust laws. Tempers and fuming solves nothing and goes nowhere, intelligent and thoughtful arguments/rebuttals/etc. are what foster change.

Members here have been threatened, arrested, harassed in their place of business and even had legal personal property taken from them because of their willingness to stand up and be counted and resolve not to back down.
If you see a mention or two about Marxist Totalitarian actions it's because several here have lived through them and other are doing so still.

Having been a rider for over 20 years the two battles are worlds apart.
Not to diminish other riders and their issues but they don't tie directly in to a fundamental Constitutional right that secures all the others.


By all means, call, write, fax, make your voice heard.
Join the discussion and debate and share your views and insights.
But first look around a bit and learn about those you're fighting with before you engage them on their methods and tactics.

bwiese
09-06-2007, 6:19 PM
Thanks. Your conceit is fantastic! Your grammar isn't half bad as well, kudos.

What's wrong with my grammar? It's usually pretty good, along with spelling, unless I'm typing quickly.


Did I say it was? I made the comment if it were to be -- you read into the statement way more than is there.

I also did not say anything about it's urgent status, to which I agree what you've said. You're just looking to pick a fight, it looks like.

No, I was trying to refute your apparent undertheme that this bill wasn't much to worry about, that it was a good thing, etc.

Given that the whole subject of this thread involves legislative deadlines, governor's signatures, etc. your post sure had the tenor of supporting the exact proposed law. At this crisis time, discussion of alternatives, etc. is moot since amendments difficult and major rewrite likely impossible, esp for a low-on-the-radar (compared to budget, schools, canals, etc.) bill.
[/quote]


Prove it, show me (well us) some memos where said persons are discussing their intent to harass owners. You're just expressing what you happen to think, which is not what I happen to think.

Harrass gun owners? We've lived thru some strange times last year. FFLs being bugged, members getting legal property seized, servers taken down (?) for dumping, etc. Several folks here are on DOJ radar, and we KNOW (from PRAR requests) that DOJ is essentially directed by the Brady Campaign thru the Deputy AG: an argument could well be made that she's doing so much work & communicating with them, the Bradys should pay her salary instead of CA taxpayers.

I have been informed by some CA politicos that (fairly direct quotes): "No new crime bills due to budget constraints will come about since new crimes = more arrests and prison sentences. When we discussed that new gun laws have same results, the word came back down that 'no one cares about gun owners' regardless of budget issues, and 'guns are bad'."

A further example: we KNOW (from PRAR requests) our Deputy AG for Firearms intentionally wanted CA gunnies to buy off list receivers because she could not comprehend that they could be built into legal rifles. She intentionally wanted us to waste our money in buying 'paperweights'.

The antigun agenda in legislature and bureacracy is huge, but it's a thin layer and with persistence we can burn thru it.

The antigun politicos do not care about true gun safety because it would involve reality and putting baddies in jail for huge terms (which has budget effects). (Actually it appears our Attorney General Jerry Brown shares some of our sentiments at least in this regard with his proposed statewide violent criminal apprehension program and statewide DNA lab upgrade.)



A lot of folks forget that not everyone is like them, and to some people they truly believe they are doing the right thing, doing good, etc. These are their beliefs, and they make the basis for the laws they try and write.

Consider your locale, this forum.

Also understand that many politicos run against the NRA just to get credit in their districts (Mark Leno vs Carole Midgen in SF, for example). That totally distorts any crimefighting credibility.

The loss/theft reporting matter is produced and directed by Brady/LCAV types. In case it doesn't pass statewide initially, they're trying to get it shopped around on a local basis from municipality to municipality to create a patchwork quilt that then requires a 'statewide fix'.

Also, again, you appear to fail to understand that a bill is not a one-time thing: any CA gun law coming forth now will be amended in future with accoutrements only peripherally related. It's always easier to pass an amendation to an existing law than a whole new one.

In fact, it's gotten to the point that even pro-gun bills have this as a worry and sometimes it may make sense to not push progun bills unless they're fixups to antigun bills.

Centurion_D
09-06-2007, 6:28 PM
OK...I'm sorta thinking of contacting my assembly member but I figure it's just a waste of time since it's that loser Torrico. He has never voted once in favor of gun owners and I know he's gonna give his blessing on this bill. I figure bypass that sorry excuse of a assembly member and go contact the Gov. to veto this insane bill. Best not waste my time and go straight to the gov.

bwiese
09-06-2007, 6:32 PM
OK...I'm sorta thinking of contacting my assembly member but I figure it's just a waste of time since it's that loser Torrico. He has never voted once in favor of gun owners and I know he's gonna give his blessing on this bill. I figure bypass that sorry excuse of a assembly member and go contact the Gov. to veto this insane bill. Best not waste my time and go straight to the gov.

It can't hurt. Let 'em know you're there, but things are unlikely to change in assembly.

But save your powder and ball for the Gov's office: we're gonna need ALL Calgunners and NRA members and pro-liberty folks to call, write, fax and email multiple times to hammer our view in.

We have more boots on the ground than the Brady types and we need to show it!!

Centurion_D
09-06-2007, 6:34 PM
It can't hurt. Let 'em know you're there, but things are unlikely to change in assembly.

But save your powder and ball for the Gov's office: we're gonna need ALL Calgunners and NRA members and pro-liberty folks to call, write, fax and email multiple times to hammer our view in.

We have more boots on the ground than the Brady types and we need to show it!!

Anyone know where we can find that study that UC Davis did on microstamping online. I figure to add some quotes to my emails and letters to the gov. but time is of the essence.

RRangel
09-06-2007, 6:37 PM
Sweet baby jesus. I stated an opinion and asked for clarification about what I was missing, and get attacked by yourself and bwiese by metric boatloads of fury and temper but not a whole lot of good honest discussion. I am then (somewhat, I could walk away) forced to "defend" myself from your verbal abuse and sarcastic comment that really has nothing to do with logically debating the AB334 issue.

You two have codified the difference between a "gun owner" and a "gun nut" and reminded me why I don't talk politics with people who can't discuss things calmly. Last post, I'm out of this thread and probably this whole sub-forum thanks to your and bwiese's verbal slaughter.

Way to go, you just confirmed the stereotype everyone has of gun owners and chased someone out of a forum. Have a cookie.

That's great. Glad to be of service.

If Kestryll wants you around that's ok with me, but you know what they say? If you can't handle the heat, stay out of the kitchen.

;)

chris
09-06-2007, 7:29 PM
If anyone here is not going to help in defeating this bill. Then you are the gun owners who want someone else to do it for you. I'm gonna tell you if this stupid bill becomes law there won't be anyone else. Like Mr. Weise said this is the camels nose in the tent. If we don't stomp on that nose we will LOSE it all. These legislators "vermin" I call them get this passed who knows what they will think of next.

It's time all members get off their preverbial butts and act. This is only directed to those members who sit by idle and let others do the fight for them. This is the start of no more handguns in this state. Heck these vermin might think this microstamping for rilfes and shotguns next.

IMO this is TREASON on the highest order and these vermin need to be tried for it. It's not about safety it's about harrassment and a de-facto gun ban without saying it is. I'm so disgusted by the arrogance of the vermin sacramento it makes me sick to think these people consider themselves public servents.

If this becomes law we only can blame ourselves for it. If does not we have won another huge victory only to fight is again year after year etc. This legislation will not die it only goes to sleep until some idiot brings it up again.

So again guys and gals GET INVOLVED IN THIS WHETHER YOU OWN A HANDGUN OR NOT THIS IS THE FIGHT WE CANNOT LOSE WE MUST WIN. IF NOT IT'S ALL OVER FOR HANDGUNS HERE.

I think I will abbrieviate this state with KA instead of CA since it's more of a communist/socialist state!!!!!

I hope we can do what we did last year. Defeat this crap and put it in the trash!!!!!

bulgron
09-06-2007, 7:54 PM
What are the chances that Arnie will veto this thing?

ETA:

Actually, what are the chances that we can get a friendly pro to somehow tie this thing up for a week? Don't they want to wrap things up by 9/11?

Librarian
09-06-2007, 8:03 PM
Anyone know where we can find that study that UC Davis did on microstamping online. I figure to add some quotes to my emails and letters to the gov. but time is of the essence.
This (http://media.www.californiaaggie.com/media/storage/paper981/news/2007/05/09/ScienceTech/Uc.Davis.Researchers.Study.Gun.Identification-2898075.shtml) is about it. Another (http://www.news.ucdavis.edu/search/news_detail.lasso?id=8148) version. Third (http://www.physorg.com/news97430920.html%5Dwww.physorg.com/news97430920.html), similar version.

elenius
09-06-2007, 8:39 PM
If you want to watch the governator as you're writing to him, a younger version of him is on channel 4 right now (in the bay area at least). "Raw Deal" :)

Post 88
09-20-2007, 11:56 AM
HI,

I get a message that help me go through the procedure easily. It is foreward by NRA members. Please see for yourself:

Below are a few simple steps you can take to register your vote against the proposed bill regarding the microstamping of handgun ammunition. A quick phone call is all it takes. Do it before you shred this message:

CALL the Governor's Sacramento number (916-445-2841)

Press 1 - for English
Press 2 - for Voice your opinion on Assembly Bills
Press 1 - for Micro Stamping Bill (AB1471)
Press 2 to OPPOSE the gun control bill.

That's it! You do not need to speak to anyone and it only takes about 20 seconds. Call now!

Brenda