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Buckeye Dan
12-21-2012, 4:14 PM
If every pro gun organization follows suit we can arm a lot of teachers.

Armed Teacher Pilot Program to Provide Free Training to Educators

Submitted by cbaus on Thu, 12/20/2012 - 19:00.



DELAWARE, OH - Buckeye Firearms Association (BFA) announced they have launched a pilot program to provide firearm training to teachers free of charge.

The announcement was made at a Town Hall Meeting at Ohio State University Thursday evening where participants debated the gun control issue in light of the recent mass murder at Sandy Hook Elementary School in Connecticut.

Ken Hanson, BFA's Legal Chair, made the announcement, saying, "Teachers and school board members have been asking us for years about training to prepare for an incident like Sandy Hook. So our educational Foundation will sponsor an Armed Teacher Pilot Program for a comprehensive 3-day training class at Tactical Defense Institute in West Union, Ohio. Based on the response to this pilot program, we will roll out classes to other training facilities."

The program will begin by accepting 24 teachers. All expenses, including class tuition, ammunition, and lodging (which are expected to total approximately $1,000 per teacher), will be paid by Buckeye Firearms Foundation and outside donations. Officials will be invited to attend the class at no cost to help develop appropriate training guidelines.

"The long-term goal is to develop a standard Armed Teacher curriculum and make the training available to any teacher or school official," said Hanson. "To begin, we will use funds from our educational foundation and solicit donations from corporations to pay for the pilot program. Going forward, we will seek funding from a variety of sources to expand the program."

BFA's educational foundation is finalizing details of the Armed Teacher Pilot Program and will provide further details as the program takes shape.

Media Coverage:
Gannett News Service - Group offers free firearm training for Ohio teachers

A few Ohio teachers will be given free gun training, and at least one firearm instructor said arming select educators could work to deter violence if done by the right people with the right training.

The Buckeye Firearms Association on Thursday announced a pilot program to give firearms training to two dozen educators for free. The announcement came at a town hall sponsored by the state gun lobby at which participants debated gun control in the wake of the mass shooting at Sandy Hook Elementary School in Connecticut.

"Teachers and school board members have been asking us for years about training to prepare for an incident like Sandy Hook," Ken Hanson, BFA's legal chairman, said in a statement. "Based on the response to this pilot program, we will roll out classes to other training facilities."

The initial Armed Teacher Pilot Program will offer 24 teachers a three-day training class at the Tactical Defense Institute in West Union. All expenses, including tuition, ammunition and lodging, will be paid by the foundation and outside donations. It is expected to cost about $1,000 per teacher.

Having an armed staffer at school makes sense to Sgt. Scott Wagner, a Central Ohio police officer, firearms instructor and former SWAT team leader and sniper. Having someone trained to handle a shooter could prevent or reduce a tragedy, especially because assailants typically aren't expecting any resistance.

"They don't tend to hold up well when someone points a gun back at them," he said. "They can inflict a lot of pain on other people, but they canít take it themselves."

Wagner said numerous precautions would have to be taken before giving any educator a weapon at school, however. He suggested starting with the pool of employees who have a concealed carry permit because they already have gone through some training. Volunteers from that pool then would have to undergo intensive interviews with police to ensure they have the proper mental makeup to handle a weapon in a crisis.

Finally, the person would need to undergo intensive firearms training and be recertified annually.

For such a program to work, Wagner said which educators are carrying a weapon must be kept a secret. To make them public would make them targets, he said. He said he thinks ordinary educators interested in the subject could make a difference if given the tools.

"It has to be someone who is competent and capable and volunteers to do this," Wagner said. "It takes the right the person and the right training."

However, the legality of even allowing teachers to be armed is in question. Hollie Reedy, chief legal counsel for the Ohio School Boards Association, said doing so would require a change in state law.

Although Ohio law has a couple of sections that relate to who is allowed to bring weapons within school buildings, Reedy cited ORC 109.78, which states no public or private educational institution may employ an individual as a special police officer, security guard or other position in which they are armed on duty, unless they have a certificate proving they have completed basic peace officer training or have 20 years of active duty experience as a police officer.

"Those are the only people right now that can be armed while on duty at a school," she said.

Peace officer training is 1,500 hours, Reedy said.

"It's not like your weekend personal security classes," she said.

Reedy said the law goes back at least to 2000, and probably as far back as the 1970s in some form, since a court case exists involving a school security guard in Columbus who accidentally shot a student after using a loaded gun to prod the teenager in the back and the gun fired.

"One of the issues was that he did not have the 1,500 hours of basic peace officer training," she said.

A separate section, ORC 2923.122, allows school boards to give written authorization to a person to possess a weapon in a school.

Reedy said the OSBA will be "at the table" in discussion of how schools deal with security issues in the wake of the Connecticut shooting. The association has taken no position pro or con, on changes in the law to allow teachers to be armed on school premises. However, it would work to ensure that laws are written flexibly so school boards retain local control for policies that fit their communities, she said.

Hanson said the long-term goal of his organization's training program is to develop a standard course for all teachers and school officials. The first class is to be announced in early January. The group promised to keep identities of the participants confidential.

This reproduction is authorized.
Source: http://www.buckeyefirearms.org/node/8694

NightOwl
12-21-2012, 4:29 PM
That's excellent. Go BFA!

EXTREMEOPS1
12-21-2012, 4:35 PM
I'd be willing to help sponsor "buy a gun for a teacher program" and maybe frontsight would donate a training program to train them

pHredd9mm
12-21-2012, 9:15 PM
Frontsight has a standing offer to train, for free, three personnel from any school in the country.

acegunnr
12-23-2012, 1:06 PM
Frontsight has a standing offer to train, for free, three personnel from any school in the country.


Here is the link:

tp://www.ignatius-piazza-front-sig...ry-year-since/ (http://www.ignatius-piazza-front-sight.com/2012/12/16/front-sights-monday-blog-i-told-you-so-in-1999-and-every-year-since/)


"Front Sight will once again offer free firearms training to any school administrator, teachers, or full time staff members designated as school Safety Monitors.
Front Sight will accept for training up to three staff members from each school, college or university.
Applicants must submit a letter requesting training on school letterhead signed by the top school district official and designating the applicant as the schoolís Safety Monitor.
Please forward this e-mail to your state and federal legislators, local law enforcement departments and your childís school administrator, as well as your friends and family, asking them to do the same."

call-in
12-23-2012, 1:17 PM
If my child's school would allow teachers to CCW, I will buy one of the the volunteer carrier a lifetime membership to Front Sight.

BroncoBob
12-23-2012, 1:26 PM
Really don't see anything like that happening in CA.

Tubbie
12-23-2012, 1:31 PM
Reminiscing back to my days in school, I shuddered at the prospect of having some of my former teachers armed. I would not have trusted them to take care of my dog. While this looks good on paper, teachers are not equipped to handle stresses as well as our police officers. My fear is that one day one of these 'trained' educators suffered a personal crises and taken a whole class hostage. Scenario may sound absurd but personally, I believe having armed police officers assigned to schools may be more effective in preventing such atrocity from occurring. The question of cost is quite frankly another absurd notion as school districts and local counties have plenty of money to support such program. It time for us to spend our tax money on a more pressing matter.

donw
12-23-2012, 3:10 PM
i have no heartburn with armed teachers that have undergone proper training and accreditation.

it makes sense to me.

i, for one, am tired of having our children being trained to be victims...if they cannot defend themselves, it is incumbent on US to defend them! if it takes an armed teacher or armed cop in every school or even a TRAINED, licensed, CCW holder ...be it so!

why is everyone so afraid of the trained, licensed CCW holder?

Cato
12-23-2012, 10:23 PM
Really don't see anything like that happening in CA.

I'm a public school teacher in CA and I don't know if I'd want to carry a gun in class. I'm probably a better marksman and safer than most LEOs, but I didn't sign a contract to provide security for my school site. If I'm going to be depended on to jump into a gunfight, I had better get a whole lot supplimental pay, which I'm sure the district wouldn't authorize anyway.

I don't even like seeing the city police on campus. Of course the cops aren't on campus to protect the students from bad guys in the community, but to protect the students from other violent students. Why can't the district keep the violent students out of school in the first place?!

I'm in the camp that supports locking up the crazies instead of allowing them to bum change on freeway off ramps, walk around in parkas in August, and shoot up kindergardens.

MattyB
12-23-2012, 10:48 PM
I'm a public school teacher in CA and I don't know if I'd want to carry a gun in class. I'm probably a better marksman and safer than most LEOs, but I didn't sign a contract to provide security for my school site. If I'm going to be depended on to jump into a gunfight, I had better get a whole lot supplimental pay, which I'm sure the district wouldn't authorize anyway.

I don't even like seeing the city police on campus. Of course the cops aren't on campus to protect the students from bad guys in the community, but to protect the students from other violent students. Why can't the district keep the violent students out of school in the first place?!

I'm in the camp that supports locking up the crazies instead of allowing them to bum change on freeway off ramps, walk around in parkas in August, and shoot up kindergardens.

So the only way youd protect a 5 year old from a lunatic shooter is if you got...

PAID EXTRA???

You are DEFINITELY the problem and most CERTAINTLY not the solution.

I'd hope a person in the position to save a child would do so, no questions asked.

CABilly
12-23-2012, 10:58 PM
So the only way youd protect a 5 year old from a lunatic shooter is if you got...

PAID EXTRA???

You are DEFINITELY the problem and most CERTAINTLY not the solution.

I'd hope a person in the position to save a child would do so, no questions asked.

And what about all the training and extra BS one would have to undergo to do it in California?

Unless you think anyone can just strap on a gun, show up to a school and with a wink and an "I got this" just take up a post?

I think the volunteer teachers should be compensated. But, I also think it's got less than a snowball's chance in hell of happening here so this is all just talk.

MattyB
12-23-2012, 11:12 PM
And what about all the training and extra BS one would have to undergo to do it in California?

Unless you think anyone can just strap on a gun, show up to a school and with a wink and an "I got this" just take up a post?

I think the volunteer teachers should be compensated. But, I also think it's got less than a snowball's chance in hell of happening here so this is all just talk.

What about the training? Its being offered for free!

Cato, being the top shot marksmen that he claims to be would be more than capable, RIGHT?

Well if all he has to do is CC at work and protect his kids in class then whats the problem?

If you need additional pay to save a life, especially an innocent child, in the very small chance a crazy shooter comes to your school then I have zero respect for you.

You arent being tasked with responding to crimes in progress with a very real chance you will be killed. No, you are teaching math, science, PE, english or art. That doesnt constitute hazard pay, I don;t care what you say. All you are doing is making sure you and your kids are safe in the 1 in 10 million chance an armed gunman bust through the door while youre teaching the ABCs or times tables.

CABilly
12-24-2012, 12:00 AM
What about the training? Its being offered for free!

Cato, being the top shot marksmen that he claims to be would be more than capable, RIGHT?

Well if all he has to do is CC at work and protect his kids in class then whats the problem?

If you need additional pay to save a life, especially an innocent child, in the very small chance a crazy shooter comes to your school then I have zero respect for you.

You arent being tasked with responding to crimes in progress with a very real chance you will be killed. No, you are teaching math, science, PE, english or art. That doesnt constitute hazard pay, I don;t care what you say. All you are doing is making sure you and your kids are safe in the 1 in 10 million chance an armed gunman bust through the door while youre teaching the ABCs or times tables.


...until you are...

The training will still take time. You can bet that whatever program the NRA or other outfits offer won't satisfy California - they'd likely require full POST training and recertification and classes and piss and psych tests every year and whatever else to make it as unappealing as possible.

This isn't a good Samaritan deal, we are talking about adding more responsibilities to teachers' roles. CC at a school adds stress by itself - you're fooling yourself if you think the kids won't know who's carrying and when. At the very least, the teachers who carry should be offered a separate insurance program that would protect them from lawsuits (excepting cases of gross negligence, etc.) and additional life insurance. You're asking teachers to stick their necks out in lawsuit-crazy CA - they should be compensated for that.

It's not about needing money up front to respond in the moment :rolleyes:. Like you said, one in 10 million chance, so all that rigamarole and headache would not really be for anything. Your emotional braying sounds similar to the antis'.

SgtMerc
12-24-2012, 12:40 AM
You guys are missing the point.

Like the article said, the people trained will be kept secret. It's not for them to start playing Rambo, clearing rooms and looking for bad guys. The point of this project is so that the schools have an unquantifiable amount of resistance.

If a bad guy wants to shoot up a school, i would bet money that they won't pick the school with the CCW/Firearms-Trained teachers.

MattyB
12-24-2012, 12:46 AM
...until you are...

The opportunity is there for those that want to, sounds like you and Cato aren'y all that willing

The training will still take time

Everyone here trains on their own time, so it is paid for and you are paid for going.. Sounds like a win/win

. You can bet that whatever program the NRA or other outfits offer won't satisfy California - they'd likely require full POST training and recertification and classes and piss and psych tests every year and whatever else to make it as unappealing as possible.

I'll leave the kids out for the moment.. YOUR life isnt worth that if it came to those prerequisites?

This isn't a good Samaritan deal, we are talking about adding more responsibilities to teachers' roles.

Again, if you aren't willing to step up, who will? You are making the argument that it is too much trouble to protect you and yours, in this case your students.

CC at a school adds stress by itself

Then DONT SIGN UP!

- you're fooling yourself if you think the kids won't know who's carrying and when.

Depending on the school, that may very well be a good thing. Otherwise, CONCEALED means that it is unseen.

At the very least, the teachers who carry should be offered a separate insurance program that would protect them from lawsuits (excepting cases of gross negligence, etc.) and additional life insurance.

I would argue that all states should follow Texas in alleviating a CCW shooter from legal actions resulting from a CCW involved shooting

You're asking teachers to stick their necks out in lawsuit-crazy CA - they should be compensated for that.

I think being immune from lawsuit should be good enough

It's not about needing money up front to respond in the moment :rolleyes:

It most obviously seems to be, it was the basic tenant of Cato's argument of what would compel him to carry in school

. Like you said, one in 10 million chance, so all that rigamarole and headache would not really be for anything.

UNTIL IT IS...

Your emotional braying sounds similar to the antis'.

Dont try to Strawman your way out of the argument using that as the basis



Matty B

CABilly
12-24-2012, 1:22 AM
Matty B...until you are...

The opportunity is there for those that want to, sounds like you and Cato aren'y all that willing
The training will still take time

Everyone here trains on their own time, so it is paid for and you are paid for going.. Sounds like a win/win
That's all I'm talking about
. You can bet that whatever program the NRA or other outfits offer won't satisfy California - they'd likely require full POST training and recertification and classes and piss and psych tests every year and whatever else to make it as unappealing as possible.

I'll leave the kids out for the moment.. YOUR life isnt worth that if it came to those prerequisites?
This isn't a good Samaritan deal, we are talking about adding more responsibilities to teachers' roles.

Again, if you aren't willing to step up, who will? You are making the argument that it is too much trouble to protect you and yours, in this case your students.
CC at a school adds stress by itself

Then DONT SIGN UP!
- you're fooling yourself if you think the kids won't know who's carrying and when.

Depending on the school, that may very well be a good thing. Otherwise, CONCEALED means that it is unseen.Ideally, yes. I still bet the kids would know within 5 minutes where the teacher was carrying.
At the very least, the teachers who carry should be offered a separate insurance program that would protect them from lawsuits (excepting cases of gross negligence, etc.) and additional life insurance.

I would argue that all states should follow Texas in alleviating a CCW shooter from legal actions resulting from a CCW involved shootingKids are crafty. They have 30-something hours/week to look for who carries. Those teachers could potentially become targets.
You're asking teachers to stick their necks out in lawsuit-crazy CA - they should be compensated for that.

I think being immune from lawsuit should be good enoughI think extra protections would entice more volunteers
It's not about needing money up front to respond in the moment

It most obviously seems to be, it was the basic tenant of Cato's argument of what would compel him to carry in school
. Like you said, one in 10 million chance, so all that rigamarole and headache would not really be for anything.

UNTIL IT IS...
Your emotional braying sounds similar to the antis'.

Dont try to Strawman your way out of the argument using that as the basis Only if you leave your emotional appeals at the door ;)
The only way it would ever fly in California would be with stricter controls and a lot of extra hoops compared to your casual CCW (or LTC or whatever). I'm not saying I wouldn't volunteer for it. I am saying those who do, should be compensated for stepping up and taking on the extra burden.

marcusrn
12-24-2012, 1:33 AM
Why not POST firearms training at a minimum.
It is not that involved.

LEO only spend 40 hrs or 1 week. That should be minimum.

Front Sight or Gunsite 4 day beginner classes are similar. (stressing civilian app more so than LEO powers of arrest)

I think that in the case of LEO they learn more on the job having to deal with out of control people and how to defuse these situations before gunfire.

If gunfire is happening then someone with a modicum of training will do. I say all this just because everyone will criticize a civilian even more than they criticize cops.

Carring CCW or exposed around kids is a very big responsibility. If it's high school and a kid can kick your *** he pretty much owns your gun. I went to a catholic high school and I know of a few students who would have pistol whipped teachers.

I'm a nurse and I used to work at a hospital in Orange County Ca. In one yr LEO had patients in ED that took cops guns two separate times, one of which led to a fatality.. A third instance a Fed Marshall took a dump in the bathroom and left his "semi auto assault pistol' on the toilet.It was found by a 12 yr old boy who fortunately did the Eddie Eagle thing. That particular hosp had a contract for county and federal prisoners. Obviously these three LEO had "POST"training.

I'm sure this would be easier in states where teachers and possible volunteers are used to carrying guns.

Hopefully there would so many volunteers that schools could pick the best bulleye/IDPA types and retired LEO and dress them like janitors or construction workers. Keep it anonymous until there is need.

Thank you for the post Nicki, hopefully P. Morgan is reading in on our part of "the discussion".

Marcus

marcusrn
12-24-2012, 1:38 AM
Merry Christmas to all.
Prayers for the tiny slain children and their families.

Whatisthis?
12-24-2012, 3:03 AM
People are way over thinking this IMO.

Teachers should be paid more to carry? Are citizens paid to carry? HELL ****IN NO! Get the **** over yourself and realize you're doing the right thing because you have the ability to.

I don't think a student beating up a teacher is that much of a worry... maybe include some of this defense into the required training? I understand what you're saying there for sure, but I feel there are ways to protect against this. Most/all students wouldn't want a fellow student taking a teachers firearm, so if a student sees that happening, they can let another teacher know. Most teachers at my high school would hang out or chat during longer breaks, so maybe almost like a teacher/buddy system. IDK... I gotta think about that more. It's 4am, so I feel I'm gonna think about it differently tomorrow.