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proraptor
08-13-2007, 8:14 AM
The next meet will be at a private 800 Yard ranch in techachapi California! We will have special guest Timberwolf there which will put on a clinic for all of us free of charge!

There is Camping available for the weekend. This shoot is limited to precision shootin only no plinking or rapid fire(maybe some pistols).

When: Sept 8th, 9th
Where: techachapi California (cmon people up north you need to come down and join us!)
Time: Still being worked out...

If you want to come PM pistolpete and ask about specifics...

This just might be the best shoot yet the SCPRC has had....Its not often you we get invited to a private ranch to shoot on. I would like to thank pistolpete for setting this up and really think with people like tiomberwolf and rksimple this shoot will be very very informative!

now a list of who is coming so far:

timberwolf
rksimple
pistolpete
proraptor
wildcard
prc329
fjold
awheelman 357
epiphany
caduckgunner
Rhys898
cypriss32
jicko

here is a list of the maybes:

elarski
DJDACE

PistolPete75
08-13-2007, 8:21 AM
i have a great freaken idea! let's do my dad's ranch in techachapi. we can go the distance to 800yards! private ranch + bunnies to shoot at. only thing i ask is that everyone practive safety procedures, and must sign a waiver. i don't want any blasters coming. only precision shooting only, and mayby some pistols are okay too. no ar or ak multi, speed blasting allowed! we can make it like an annual meet or something. bbq, food, etc.

Prc329
08-13-2007, 8:24 AM
The 25th and 26th are out for me. I'll be in hell, Palm Springs.

Maybe we can talk the guys at Angeles to put the plates back up at 7 and 800 yards.

Prc329
08-13-2007, 8:25 AM
i have a great freaken idea! let's do my dad's ranch in techachapi. we can go the distance to 800yards! private ranch + bunnies to shoot at. only thing i ask is that everyone practive safety procedures, and must sign a waiver. i don't want any blasters coming. only precision shooting only, and mayby some pistols are okay too. no ar or ak multi, speed blasting allowed! we can make it like an annual meet or something. bbq, food, etc.

That does sound cool. Time to buy a range finder :D

wildcard
08-13-2007, 8:26 AM
I vote for August 26th! While I know you hate Burro.. you may want to reconsider to make use of their 500 yd range. Yes..Angeles goes out further.. but you can't put paper out that far. Besides.. just like how you don't like Burro staff.. I don't like Angeles staff :D

PistolPete75
08-13-2007, 8:27 AM
rksimple is local to it. wildcard like it too! i would love to shoot with proraptor and nawt, and pick up some tips too!

PistolPete75
08-13-2007, 8:28 AM
funny everyone posted at the same time. it's always us posting at the same time. don't you guys have to work or something?!! j/k

wildcard
08-13-2007, 8:30 AM
That does sound cool. Time to buy a range finder :D

It's already ranged out to 100 yd increments :)

PistolPete75
08-13-2007, 8:32 AM
plus rksimple has some real nice steel to shoot at.

Prc329
08-13-2007, 8:35 AM
Where in the blue hell is techachapi?

PistolPete75
08-13-2007, 8:39 AM
Where in the blue hell is techachapi?

best thing nawt, is meet up at my house or my mom's house and caravan up. my mom's house is next to angeles.

100 miles north of the san fernando valley. all the way up the 14 freeway. we can carpool up in two or three cars.

Prc329
08-13-2007, 8:40 AM
Why not do the Burro shoot on the 500 yard range. We can setup steel (if rk will bring it) and some fruit at the 500 yard line. It will be interesting popping a Cantaloupe at 500 yards.

PistolPete75
08-13-2007, 8:41 AM
ya burro is real nice too. i like the 500yard shooting! we can put little potatoes along the 400yard and 500yard crestline.

PistolPete75
08-13-2007, 8:42 AM
mayby we can find old wheel rims, and shoot it up~! their gong is way too big. might as well hit a refrigerator.

Prc329
08-13-2007, 8:46 AM
There is a place by me that sells used hub caps. They have some steel ones. Maybe I should pick some up cheap and build some frames and hang them.

PistolPete75
08-13-2007, 8:47 AM
There is a place by me that sells used hub caps. They have some steel ones. Maybe I should pick some up cheap and build some frames and hang them.

sounds like a plan.

what would be real nice if we had a welder in calguns!

Prc329
08-13-2007, 8:49 AM
I bet we do.

proraptor
08-13-2007, 8:52 AM
that ranch idea sounds awesome....I'd love to shoot some rabbits! that's a trip that needs some planning though....can we camp overnight and make it a 2 day event? maybe some of the guys from up north can come down and meet up with us. sounds like a lot of fun...

sorry guys but after the way I was treated at burro last time I won't be going back anytime soon. I'd rather go anywhere but there

Prc329
08-13-2007, 8:59 AM
I had fun this weekend making the little ram at 300 spin. I would hit him in his leg and he would spin almost completely around. Gotta love the facility at Angeles. Plus they have a reloading store.

rksimple
08-13-2007, 9:02 AM
Where in the hell is techachapi?

There is actually a bumper sticker they sell up here that says that. I like it that way! Fewer people who know where it is, more private shooting spots for me!:D

Pete's parents place is pretty cool. Its always windy up here but the way his place is setup, you usually shoot into the direction of the prevailing wind. Its also in a lower spot with a little protection from the wind. With a 4x4, you can drive right to the targets out to 800 yards. I'm pretty jealous!

I'm working on some more steel targets this week. The thing with hubcaps, brake drums, and other thin, cast metal, is the bullet passes right on through without too much noise. Its hard to sometimes tell a hit or miss.

I'll have the Leica Geovids for rangefinding and my Kestrell for monitoring conditions. Should have about 5 or 6 steel targets by weeks end.

I'm not available on Sundays, and the 25th of this month is the APS match. Any other Saturday should be good.

Timberwolf
08-13-2007, 9:04 AM
techachapi sounds cool to me . . . I have targets, frames and steel (fixed and reactive). Not often we get invited to a private ranch, we should all take advantage - thanks - I don't know what my schedule is for Sept yet but know I'm working the weekend of 8/25 - thats the match day at APS.

PistolPete75
08-13-2007, 9:05 AM
that ranch idea sounds awesome....I'd love to shoot some rabbits! that's a trip that needs some planning though....can we camp overnight and make it a 2 day event? maybe some of the guys from up north can come down and meet up with us. sounds like a lot of fun...

sorry guys but after the way I was treated at burro last time I won't be going back anytime soon. I'd rather go anywhere but there

most definitely, i'm totally down with it. if everyone else is game, i'm good to go.

PistolPete75
08-13-2007, 9:06 AM
techachapi sounds cool to me . . . I have targets, frames and steel (fixed and reactive). Not often we get invited to a private ranch, we should all take advantage - thanks - I don't know what my schedule is for Sept yet but know I'm working the weekend of 8/25 - thats the match day at APS.

for you anything! you have the most skills out of all of us! i would LOVE it if you came! wohoo, i could bug you all weekend!

PistolPete75
08-13-2007, 9:11 AM
mayby we shoud rethread this to a 1st Annual Calguns Precision Meet (North and South)

Prc329
08-13-2007, 9:16 AM
I gotta give the wife the heads up if we are gonna do the ranch. I dought I could camp out but I will definitely be there. I just gotta buy a mini-van soon :(

I wonder how much somethig like that would run. I would love to own some land to set up a private range. All I would need is a small house with a bathroom in it.

PistolPete75
08-13-2007, 9:19 AM
I gotta give the wife the heads up if we are gonna do the ranch. I dought I could camp out but I will definitely be there. I just gotta buy a mini-van soon :(

I wonder how much somethig like that would run. I would love to own some land to set up a private range. All I would need is a small house with a bathroom in it.

ask rksimple, he knows the pricing out there.

oh if you do buy, use me as your Realtor! free gun or scope or reloading stuff!

proraptor
08-13-2007, 9:20 AM
I say if we are going to do it we should give at least a month notice to make sure everyone gets a chance to see this thread. I'd like people from the north to come down so we could all meet...that would be awesome.

Is there any way we can camp overnight there? that's quite a drive for a one day event....I think we should make it a weekend event...that would be a lot of fun...if camping isn't available I'm still game though.

PistolPete75
08-13-2007, 9:22 AM
I say if we are going to do it we should give at least a month notice to make sure everyone gets a chance to see this thread. I'd like people from the north to come down so we could all meet...that would be awesome.

Is there any way we can camp overnight there? that's quite a drive for a one day event....I think we should make it a weekend event...that would be a lot of fun...if camping isn't available I'm still game though.

yes camping is available! it can get cold though. a good sleeping bag is necessary, unless you sleep in your car.

how about if we set it up for Sept. 14th (night)-16th!

proraptor
08-13-2007, 9:36 AM
man this sounds like a lot of fun....my vote goes towards the ranch....I think we should do it mid to late september so we have some planning time...

PistolPete75
08-13-2007, 9:37 AM
man this sounds like a lot of fun....my vote goes towards the ranch....I think we should do it mid to late september so we have some planning time...


i'm flexible, so whatever other people want is cool with me. we should have it pretty organized with food, drinks, camping stuff, etc.

PistolPete75
08-13-2007, 9:39 AM
i better get started with work, i'll be back in a few hours.

Prc329
08-13-2007, 9:44 AM
cool. We should do it the end of September that way we all have time to plan it and get things in order.

BTW, I am at work but it is real slow.

Timberwolf
08-13-2007, 9:47 AM
The weekend of 9/15 - 16 is iffy for me, its my birthday so I'll be doing the family thing, other than that just decide what weekend in Sept or Oct so I can make sure I'm not working at APS.

Prc329
08-13-2007, 9:51 AM
The 22nd of September is a good day for me if we are doing the ranch thing. That would give me more then enough time to find a place to stash the wife and kids.

rksimple
08-13-2007, 9:56 AM
I gotta give the wife the heads up if we are gonna do the ranch. I dought I could camp out but I will definitely be there. I just gotta buy a mini-van soon :(

I wonder how much somethig like that would run. I would love to own some land to set up a private range. All I would need is a small house with a bathroom in it.

Some of the land out there is relatively inaccessable unless you have 4wd. There was a big land selloff a couple years back where they were auctioning off big sections from 20ac to 1200 ac. Its growing more and more and prices are still up there. The more people that move in, the more chance you run of hippie neighbors calling the cops because you're shooting all the time. Pete's parents place is nice because its right on the other side of the mountain from a shooting range. People are used to hearing gunshots so its no big deal.

There is a lot of flat space on his place for camping. Also, town is only 7 miles away for those that wanted to stay in a motel.

Here are the only pics I have from last weekend at Petes place:

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b82/rksimple/0811070908.jpg

Results from 800 yards:

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b82/rksimple/0811071503.jpg

proraptor
08-13-2007, 10:04 AM
so can you access the ranch with a 2wd? lets start planning this guys....

rksimple
08-13-2007, 10:21 AM
so can you access the ranch with a 2wd? lets start planning this guys....

Yep. The road that goes up is easily passable with 2wd. We went off the road, up the hillside so we didn't have to cary 50 lbs of steel a 1/4 mile or more. For that, 4wd is a good idea.

The ranch is right off of the paved road. 2wd is no problem.

PistolPete75
08-13-2007, 12:08 PM
let's do it, how about sept 21st (friday night)-23rd (afternoon)?

PistolPete75
08-13-2007, 12:25 PM
so can you access the ranch with a 2wd? lets start planning this guys....


i wouldn't try it on the last 200-300yards.

Timberwolf
08-13-2007, 1:42 PM
let's do it, how about sept 21st (friday night)-23rd (afternoon)?

APS match will be on the 22nd (4th Sat) unless I reschedule it. How about the last weekend of the month?

rksimple
08-13-2007, 1:47 PM
APS match will be on the 22nd (4th Sat) unless I reschedule it. How about the last weekend of the month?

Dang! I leave that weekend (29th) for a precision rifle class in Texas. Anybody for the 8th of Sept.?

Timberwolf
08-13-2007, 1:49 PM
I'm up for the 8th

rksimple
08-13-2007, 1:52 PM
OK then. I change my vote from the 22nd to the 8th!:D

Timberwolf
08-13-2007, 1:56 PM
Ditto for the 8th

Budd
08-13-2007, 1:58 PM
what would be real nice if we had a welder in calguns!



I am.:)

I have a portable mig welder I can run off two car batteries - if needed I could bring two deep cell marine batteries.

How thick is the steel?:D

caduckgunner
08-13-2007, 2:02 PM
I have a Miller 140 that runs off of 110 if someone has a generator.

caduckgunner
08-13-2007, 2:03 PM
I am.:)

I have a portable mig welder I can run off two car batteries - if needed I could bring two deep cell marine batteries.

How thick is the steel?:D

Oh no, not the jumper cables and stick :eek:

rksimple
08-13-2007, 2:05 PM
How thick is the steel?:D

I'll try to take some pics tonight. I have some tie plates from the railroad of different thicknesses with the thickest being around 3/8-1/2". Its softer steel, not like the armor plate of the LV steel target I have. The tie plates have some holes in them where the spikes would go through. I was thinking of welding up most of the holes and using the remaining ones for hanging with a chain.

Budd
08-13-2007, 2:06 PM
Oh no, not the jumper cables and stick :eek:

Nope - what part of MIG don't you understand............

PistolPete75
08-13-2007, 2:07 PM
APS match will be on the 22nd (4th Sat) unless I reschedule it. How about the last weekend of the month?

alright, sounds good. 8th

this should be plenty of time to get organized.

remember everyone, safety first. it's going to be typically how it is at your local outdoor range. bolts back, and no fiddling with the guns untill everyone is back.

revised date.

it's time to reload like a mad man!

wildcard
08-13-2007, 2:21 PM
Due to the potential size of the group.. I would suggest eliminating the "bunny hunting" aspect of of the trip unless one crosses the designated shooting range.

Those that have hunted or hunted with another person know.. you really have to trust the person you're hunting with especially when firearms aren't always pointing in one direction and there's free movement.

Don't mean to kill the mood.. but we've all met that one person that we really wouldn't want to shoot next to.

PistolPete75
08-13-2007, 2:27 PM
Due to the potential size of the group.. I would suggest eliminating the "bunny hunting" aspect of of the trip unless one crosses the designated shooting range.

Those that have hunted or hunted with another person know.. you really have to trust the person you're hunting with especially when firearms aren't always pointing in one direction and there's free movement.

Don't mean to kill the mood.. but we've all met that one person that we really wouldn't want to shoot next to.

good thinking. no varmint hunting unless we run into one which we will. we can take turns. also no drinking of any alcoholic beverages unless you are done for the day. i need to make sure everyone get's home safely. anyone else want to help RO? plus food arrangements. what do you guys want to do? everyone just bring your own stuff or community food and drinks? plus anyone got any canopy's? it can get real hot out there!

proraptor
08-13-2007, 2:28 PM
sept 8th is good for me....I'm in....ill modify the thread later tonight...

PistolPete75
08-13-2007, 2:33 PM
jason can you help me RO? i know you very personally, so please help a brother out.

Timberwolf
08-13-2007, 2:33 PM
I can help RO if needed

PistolPete75
08-13-2007, 2:34 PM
I can help RO if needed

if you can, you would be the best fit! thanks!

sorry to do this to you on your day off.

rksimple
08-13-2007, 2:36 PM
I can help RO if needed

Me too. T-wolf, you gotta get some trigger time in too! We could put on a type of clinic for some of the newer shooters. It has potential.

PistolPete75
08-13-2007, 2:36 PM
Me too. T-wolf, you gotta get some trigger time in too! We could put on a type of clinic for some of the newer shooters. It has potential.


cool thanks Ryan!

wildcard
08-13-2007, 2:38 PM
jason can you help me RO? i know you very personally, so please help a brother out.

From what I've been able to tell at the last two meets, the people that show up are pretty good about safety. Sure somebody may get overly excited here and there.. but no biggie. You can pretty much tell who'll be trouble in the first 15 mins. I'll help RO of course.. I'll be Timberwolf's apprentice :D

PistolPete75
08-13-2007, 2:40 PM
From what I've been able to tell at the last two meets, the people that show up are pretty good about safety. Sure somebody may get overly excited here and there.. but no biggie. You can pretty much tell who'll be trouble in the first 15 mins. I'll help RO of course.. I'll be Timberwolf's apprentice :D

cool, we got four ROs now. That'll be just fine, super!

caduckgunner
08-13-2007, 2:41 PM
Nope - what part of MIG don't you understand............

Sorry I jumped the gun.... I saw welder and 2 batteries and thought oh no :o

wildcard
08-13-2007, 2:42 PM
Me too. T-wolf, you gotta get some trigger time in too! We could put on a type of clinic for some of the newer shooters. It has potential.

Teach me! In my defense for my newbie-like shooting.. my windage knob was busted on Saturday. There I go making excuses for myself :p

caduckgunner
08-13-2007, 2:42 PM
Is there room for a tent trailer?

PistolPete75
08-13-2007, 2:42 PM
Is there room for a tent trailer?

yes, bring it all in..rv's, trucks, cars, tanks, whatever that is legal bring it in!

Budd
08-13-2007, 2:45 PM
Sorry I jumped the gun.... I saw welder and 2 batteries and thought oh no :o

Just giving you a hard time - no biggie. I will probably leave the gas at home - and just run flux core. Welding outdoors usually doean't provid ethe best environment for clean welds anyways..........

And wha is wrong with ARC welding???:43:

PistolPete75
08-13-2007, 2:52 PM
One Thing Also. I Never Had A Single Issue With Any Calgunner, Well I Did With Just One. Calgunners In My Experience Have Always Been Courteous, Honest, And Respectful. Please Respect The People Around You. I Will Not Tolerate A-holes, Please Leave Your Ego At Home And Come Join Us For An Awesome Day Of Long Range Shooting! All Is Welcome Whether Of Race, Age, Sex, Or Religion.

PistolPete75
08-13-2007, 2:56 PM
Teach me! In my defense for my newbie-like shooting.. my windage knob was busted on Saturday. There I go making excuses for myself :p

if your a newbie, then i'm a newbie's apprentice! naw, your good! you always get me on paper or steel!

a clinic by T-wolf(bill) would be just awesome!

rksimple
08-13-2007, 3:00 PM
Teach me! In my defense for my newbie-like shooting.. my windage knob was busted on Saturday. There I go making excuses for myself :p

Thats what happens when you get a super sniper...just bustin ya up a little:D Time for some loc-tite!

You guys did very well. It was a fun time!

proraptor
08-13-2007, 4:42 PM
Pistol pete you wont have to worry about RO ing the SCPRC guys as they all pretty much know what they are doing....We sure as heck dont need 4 RO's....Just one guy to call cease fires...

Timberwolf
08-13-2007, 4:48 PM
Me too. T-wolf, you gotta get some trigger time in too! We could put on a type of clinic for some of the newer shooters. It has potential.

I'm up for it

proraptor
08-13-2007, 4:50 PM
I love th idea of a clinic and wouldnt mind paying some money for your time....Im sure the other club members would be up for it also....

Prc329
08-13-2007, 5:01 PM
Of course a clinic would be awesome. Just remember some of us are married with kids so we may not be able to stay the whole weekend. I'll also offer up a 6 pack. To be drank at your leisure and not at the ranch of course. :D

Timberwolf
08-13-2007, 8:41 PM
Alright so what type of "clinic", per se, is needed or wanted. Basic marksmanship (basic positions, BRASS, sling shooting, etc.) or tactical application (field positions such as side prone, using a bipod, shooting off a ruck, range estimation with mils, wind doping etc.) or . . .

I know a few from here who have come to my matches but don't know all so I don't really know everyone's experience.

Also do you want a formal type class with some lecture then field application or informal?

Let me know what y'all are thinking?

Prc329
08-13-2007, 8:44 PM
I'm thinking tactical since that is what most of us will be doing with our rifles.

proraptor
08-13-2007, 8:53 PM
Ill take whatever you can give to tell you the truth...Even if its something I already know Ill be more than happy to listen

Timberwolf
08-13-2007, 9:50 PM
Well I've always found a little touch of the basics is always good followed by the advanced stuff, that way if we get into an improvised sitting position to shoot over some sage everyone will know that the sling can be used for more than just carrying the rifle and that locking your elbow into the pocket on the side of your knee is more stable that on top of your knee cap.

That said I've got handouts regarding rangeing with mildots etc as well as a few other things regarding balistics, wind, various sizes of common objects, etc. I also have a couple of mildot masters for demonstration etc.

I would estimate a four hour or so duration, a little less or a little more depending on number of people, set up and shooting time.

As for the generous offer re payment for my services . . . no charge. Truth be known I enjoy teaching and believe in "passing it on" especially in a group such as this. If it'll make y'all feel better I'll leave the lid open on my ammo can so you can tip the Wolf if you feel so inclined afterward.

Elarski
08-13-2007, 11:34 PM
This shoot sounds great! Haven't met a lot of you, but it will be cool to meet other CalGunners. I don't know my schedule as of yet, but I'm gonna try like heck to make it. TWolf's class will be cool as well; lots to learn from him.

I'll keep watch for changes in this thread.

rksimple
08-14-2007, 5:43 AM
Well I've always found a little touch of the basics is always good followed by the advanced stuff, that way if we get into an improvised sitting position to shoot over some sage everyone will know that the sling can be used for more than just carrying the rifle and that locking your elbow into the pocket on the side of your knee is more stable that on top of your knee cap.

That said I've got handouts regarding rangeing with mildots etc as well as a few other things regarding balistics, wind, various sizes of common objects, etc. I also have a couple of mildot masters for demonstration etc.

I would estimate a four hour or so duration, a little less or a little more depending on number of people, set up and shooting time.

As for the generous offer re payment for my services . . . no charge. Truth be known I enjoy teaching and believe in "passing it on" especially in a group such as this. If it'll make y'all feel better I'll leave the lid open on my ammo can so you can tip the Wolf if you feel so inclined afterward.

It seems most of the questions here revolve around comeups, doping for wind, etc. I think it would be helpful to go over things like:

Trajectory/Dope cards
Effects of temperature (both on internal ballistics and atmospheric effects)
Wind
Reading mirage
Angle shooting
Milling
Moving targets (theory)
Coverting MOA to mils
Holdoffs for multiple targets at different distances

For a lot of the above topics, it would be helpful if each shooter had at least a JBM printout for standard conditions at 3850 ft elevation.

Having some info at hand in a log book would also be a good idea. Check out: http://www.oregonshooter.com/wordpress/?p=92 Scroll down to the log book. There is a lot of info there that would be helpful to have with you that you could use as a starting point.

Let me know if you want/need any help with it Twolf. I'll see if I can't put together a mover by the time the 8th rolls around.

PistolPete75
08-14-2007, 8:08 AM
Pistol pete you wont have to worry about RO ing the SCPRC guys as they all pretty much know what they are doing....We sure as heck dont need 4 RO's....Just one guy to call cease fires...

i know you are good, and nawt is good, but i'm worried about the people that i don't know. i just want extra pair of eyes watching people.

PistolPete75
08-14-2007, 8:10 AM
i do look forward to the clinic also! i can finally learn how to use my mildot recticle.

PistolPete75
08-14-2007, 8:19 AM
proraptor, mayby we can put up a confirmed list of who is going so we can get an idea of how many people are definitely going.

rksimple
08-14-2007, 8:21 AM
proraptor, mayby we can put up a confirmed list of who is going so we can get an idea of how many people are definitely going.

Since its only about 10 minutes from my place, you know I'll be there!:D

wildcard
08-14-2007, 8:42 AM
i know you are good, and nawt is good, but i'm worried about the people that i don't know. i just want extra pair of eyes watching people.

Yup.. it's an open invite on a public forum.. ANYBODY can potentially show up. Sure Pete here can kick people out.. but you need some extra eyes especially during that initially period when everyone starts shooting to make sure they are actually safe. Anybody can nod their head and acknowledge the rules.. but being able to follow directions is a different thing.. just look at all the people that get yelled at when you're at the range.

Safety is a concern.. but so is liability.

wildcard
08-14-2007, 8:45 AM
You know i'm there! Heck.. I already have all my camping gear in my car!

PistolPete75
08-14-2007, 8:50 AM
wouldn't it be nice, if someone had an rv? man that would be just awesome!

proraptor
08-14-2007, 8:57 AM
yeah that would be awesome if someone had an rv...I don't mind sleeping in my truck though

wildcard
08-14-2007, 9:07 AM
spoiled. all you need is a shooting mat to lay on.. tarp over your head.. and a sleeping bag (or emergency blanket if you're hard core) to keep you warm.

With that said.. dibs on Big Jon's trailer if he goes :)

Timberwolf
08-14-2007, 9:10 AM
Someone has been reading my playbook LOL . . . as to the "clinic" I'll put together the same type of session that I would teach during a Prec. I class which covers the items listed by rksimple. I would suggest if all are serious about this to bring the following:

Rifle - zeroed at 100 (at your local AO is fine as we'll adjust for there) with 100 rounds of ammo. If possible know the velocity of your ammo before hand and try to make a print of a ballistics chart with your ammo.

Bipod, Ruck, etc for front rest (please try to avoid the benchrest type front rests) and rear sand sock, monopod etc if desired.

Sling for your rifle

Log Book and pen - I suggest and use the type that are in the link above though if you simply want to use a small spiral note book that’s fine as long as you take and keep accurate notes of your shooting sessions for future reference.

Mil-Dot Master or calculator

ACI, or slope doper to use in determining the angle of your rifle when taking a shot up or downhill. If you don’t have either that’s fine bring a basic protractor about a foot or so of fishing line and a small slip shot weight and I’ll show you how to make a poor man’s slope doper.

I’ll also need an approximate count on people so I can make sure to have enough handouts etc.

PistolPete75
08-14-2007, 9:27 AM
spoiled. all you need is a shooting mat to lay on.. tarp over your head.. and a sleeping bag (or emergency blanket if you're hard core) to keep you warm.

With that said.. dibs on Big Jon's trailer if he goes :)

dude your are funny! hey any more space left?

PistolPete75
08-14-2007, 9:34 AM
Someone has been reading my playbook LOL . . . as to the "clinic" I'll put together the same type of session that I would teach during a Prec. I class which covers the items listed by rksimple. I would suggest if all are serious about this to bring the following:

Rifle - zeroed at 100 (at your local AO is fine as we'll adjust for there) with 100 rounds of ammo. If possible know the velocity of your ammo before hand and try to make a print of a ballistics chart with your ammo.

Bipod, Ruck, etc for front rest (please try to avoid the benchrest type front rests) and rear sand sock, monopod etc if desired.

Sling for your rifle

Log Book and pen - I suggest and use the type that are in the link above though if you simply want to use a small spiral note book thatís fine as long as you take and keep accurate notes of your shooting sessions for future reference.

Mil-Dot Master or calculator

ACI, or slope doper to use in determining the angle of your rifle when taking a shot up or downhill. If you donít have either thatís fine bring a basic protractor about a foot or so of fishing line and a small slip shot weight and Iíll show you how to make a poor manís slope doper.

Iíll also need an approximate count on people so I can make sure to have enough handouts etc.

wow, if we master this. we don't need a range finder!

Mute
08-14-2007, 10:46 AM
A rangefinder will always be more accurate, especially at extended distances, but you can be less dependent on it.

PistolPete75
08-14-2007, 10:50 AM
A rangefinder will always be more accurate, especially at extended distances, but you can be less dependent on it.

but still, hitting a long distance target without a range finder takes alot more skill then using a rangefinder, and then looking it up on your jbm ballistics chart.

Prc329
08-14-2007, 11:03 AM
I just can't wait to see the collection we assemble there :D

I'm running an MP8 reticule. I wonder how that will translate.

wildcard
08-14-2007, 11:08 AM
Use a laser range finder if you have it.. use the mil-dot to range find if you don't or can't.

Anyone want to bust out some land surveying equipment?

Timberwolf
08-14-2007, 11:08 AM
A rangefinder will always be more accurate, especially at extended distances, but you can be less dependent on it.

True to some extent but LRF require batteries and are electronic hence subject to failure (Murphy's Rule). Further you can get false readings especially in bright sunlight, in snow, fog or rain.

Just like a GPS should never be a substitute for the ability to use a good compass a LRF should never replace the ability to manually range a target.

rksimple
08-14-2007, 11:10 AM
but still, hitting a long distance target without a range finder takes alot more skill then using a rangefinder, and then looking it up on your jbm ballistics chart.

Hitting the target with a rock would require much more skill, too.:D That shouldn't have much to do with it. Knowing how to range is a valuable asset, especially when your batteries go dead in the LRF. But that doesn't mean a LRF shouldn't be used.

When working on other aspects of precision rifllery (besides milling targets) its nice to have the exact range as given by a LRF. It eliminates a variable that you have to account for when you miss and want to figure out what went wrong.

Timberwolf
08-14-2007, 11:42 AM
I just can't wait to see the collection we assemble there :D

I'm running an MP8 reticule. I wonder how that will translate.

MP8 are in mils and actually more accurate than mil-dot in estimating range because of their .5 mil graduation.

I'll also cover range estimation with MOA graduations, which is less match than for mils.

rksimple
08-14-2007, 11:47 AM
I'll also cover range estimation with MOA graduations, which is less match than for mils.

Better let them know which MOA reticles are in TMOA and which are SMOA. That 5% can getcha!:D

Timberwolf
08-14-2007, 11:53 AM
Now that's getting deep LOL

Prc329
08-14-2007, 12:06 PM
****, just reading this post is making my head hurt :D

proraptor
08-14-2007, 12:52 PM
I'm already lost lol

rksimple
08-14-2007, 1:14 PM
Don't worry guys, its not that hard once you see it, and T-wolf is a great teacher.

Prc-I'll be running an A5 reticle in my IOR. Its like a modified mp8 so it won't be too different. You can cheat off of my paper:D Looks like this.

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b82/rksimple/A5-1.jpg

Timberwolf
08-14-2007, 1:39 PM
It just looks complicated but once applied its relatively easy.

PistolPete75
08-14-2007, 2:13 PM
i have the Leupold TMR recticle which I believe is the TMOA with .5 mils

rksimple
08-14-2007, 2:20 PM
i have the Leupold TMR recticle which I believe is the TMOA with .5 mils

I should've explained that better. TMOA, or true MOA, is 1.047 inches at 100 yards. SMOA, or shooters MOA is 1" at 100 yards. While that difference seems miniscule, when it is compounded 30-40 times while dialing elevation to 1000 yards it can cause 15 inches difference or more.

Some MOA reticles are in SMOA and some in TMOA. It will only make a 4.7% difference in the result if you're off one way or the other. That should be the least of anyone's worries, though. If I could range to with in 5% consistenly, every time, I'd be ahead of the game. It gets much harder at longer ranges.

PistolPete75
08-14-2007, 2:35 PM
i just called Leupold. the guy on the phone didn't know if it was a tmoa or a smoa, but from what i heard it's based on the original military mildot which should be the tmoa. right thinking?

PistolPete75
08-14-2007, 2:42 PM
yes, just got my eagle shooting mat in. can't wait till i get to use it at the calguns precision meet!

rksimple
08-14-2007, 2:45 PM
i just called Leupold. the guy on the phone didn't know if it was a tmoa or a smoa, but from what i heard it's based on the original military mildot which should be the tmoa. right thinking?

Your reticle is fine. Its in mils, which is totally different than MOA. 1 mil subtends 3.6 inches at 100 yards, or 10 cm at 100 meters. Your knobs are in MOA, be it shooters MOA or true MOA. Best way to check is to run a test at 100 yards. Use a large piece of paper (about 40" top to bottom) with a small dot down toward the bottom. Shoot a few rounds at it with your rifle zeroed. Then dial 36 MOA up elevation. Aim at the same dot and fire a few rounds. Measure the distance between the 2 groups. If its closer to 36 inches, you're in SMOA. If it's closer to 37.7 inches, you're in true MOA. Most ballistics programs will give you MOA adjustments in TMOA, so its helpful to know what your adjustments are.

I didn't want to mess around with different scope manufacturers using TMOA and SMOA interchangeably. Thats why I'm going to mil adjustments/mil reticle for my precision stuff.

Mute
08-14-2007, 4:40 PM
Never gotten a consistent response from Leupold regarding the MOA adjustments. Best to measure it yourself. Mil reticles are consistent for everyone. At least if they do it right.

proraptor
08-14-2007, 5:08 PM
Mute you better show up to this shoot!

rksimple
08-14-2007, 5:51 PM
Mute you better show up to this shoot!

Yeah, Mute. I've seen that stick of yours. I'd love to, with your permission, try out that AICS. Haven't spent a lot of time behind one. I have a 700 long action that I've been thinking of putting together in 6.5x55 and drop it in an AICS.

Mute
08-14-2007, 6:55 PM
Yeah, Mute. I've seen that stick of yours. I'd love to, with your permission, try out that AICS. Haven't spent a lot of time behind one. I have a 700 long action that I've been thinking of putting together in 6.5x55 and drop it in an AICS.


Love to have you try it out. It's going to depend on the date though. It sounds like this one is going to be great with Timberwolf doing some teaching.

rksimple
08-15-2007, 9:17 AM
There is a private shooting range less than a mile away from the ranch. It has target stands at 50, 100, 200, and 300 yards. I'm a member there and if anyone wants to zero their rifle on Friday evening, I'll be available.

This is shaping up to be a great shoot!

theEpiphany
08-15-2007, 11:29 AM
Room for a new guy?


This is going to come off as though I'm a loner...but I have NOBODY to shoot with. It's a personal hobby that nobody except my fiancee (on occasion). I'm self taught with the exception of my father in law who's an avid hunter.

I'm really starting to get interested in LD precision shooting and would love to get all of the guidance I can.

wildcard
08-15-2007, 11:32 AM
Room for a new guy?


This is going to come off as though I'm a loner...but I have NOBODY to shoot with. It's a personal hobby that nobody except my fiancee (on occasion). I'm self taught with the exception of my father in law who's an avid hunter.

I'm really starting to get interested in LD precision shooting and would love to get all of the guidance I can.

Haha. Where you located dude? I shoot every weekend.. with Calgunners.. girlfriend.. and by myself.

And there's nothing wrong with shooting by yourself.. I sometimes prefer that.

theEpiphany
08-15-2007, 11:44 AM
Haha. Where you located dude? I shoot every weekend.. with Calgunners.. girlfriend.. and by myself.

And there's nothing wrong with shooting by yourself.. I sometimes prefer that.


Fullerton area...though I work in Santa Monica....sooo Drivign isn't an issue for me ;).

Timberwolf
08-15-2007, 11:48 AM
Come up to A Place to Shoot in Santa Clarita - I'm a part time RO there on the weekends and if I'm not working that weekend I'm there shooting.

wildcard
08-15-2007, 11:49 AM
Fullerton area...though I work in Santa Monica....sooo Drivign isn't an issue for me ;).

I go to shoot at Burro Canyon almost every Saturday. You can put paper out there from 0 - 500 yds. You can meet me up there and we can get some shooting done if you're interested. I usually end up shooting potatoes at 300 yds to keep things entertaining :)

theEpiphany
08-15-2007, 12:53 PM
I go to shoot at Burro Canyon almost every Saturday. You can put paper out there from 0 - 500 yds. You can meet me up there and we can get some shooting done if you're interested. I usually end up shooting potatoes at 300 yds to keep things entertaining :)


Yeah I head up to BC a few times a month....Where are you shooting to 500 yards..is that the newer range that they opened recently?

Normally I'm sitting at the 200 yard range...My lack of skills keep me from going further ;). Then again, I'm a perfectionist so I'll let others be the judge.

proraptor
08-15-2007, 1:10 PM
I'm not a fan of burro canyon so I usually go to angeles

theEpiphany
08-15-2007, 1:18 PM
I've heard a lot of awesome things about Angeles...I'm really looking forward to heading up there sometime.

PistolPete75
08-15-2007, 3:29 PM
Angeles = has alot of steel, but has limited yardage. also possibility of theives lurking around.
Burro = paper, fruit, etc up to 500yards (new range) , but hot as hell!
APS = relaxed atmosphere with knowledgable staff on hand, but limited yardage.
My dad's place = relaxed atmoshpere with paper, steel, frut up to 800yards!, but the drive is 100 miles from LA.

PistolPete75
08-15-2007, 3:34 PM
Come up to A Place to Shoot in Santa Clarita - I'm a part time RO there on the weekends and if I'm not working that weekend I'm there shooting.

+1, ROs (the double BBs, Bill and Bob are great guys~!)

proraptor
08-15-2007, 7:05 PM
I just changed the first post....Pistol pete or anyone else please let me know if I should change or add anything...Thanks

PistolPete75
08-15-2007, 10:45 PM
people could bring autos also. i don't mind, as long as they have precision in mind and not blasting like there is no tomorrow.

proraptor, can we put up a guest list on the first posting? this will help us organize. tnx Peter

proraptor
08-16-2007, 7:35 AM
I went ahead and made a list of people that are coming and a list for maybes....if I forgot anyone I'm sorry as I'm modifying everything from my palm treo and sometimes its gets a little hard...

Mute
08-16-2007, 8:41 AM
Oh man, you guys are going to have a hell of a time.

wildcard
08-16-2007, 8:49 AM
You going too Mute? It'll be even better if we get to drool looking at your rifle and scope. Plus I get to pick up your brass :)

I know/ met 7 out of the 9 on the list right now and all are cool. Should be fun.

So.. is participation in the clinic mandatory or will some be attending while others are shooting?

rksimple
08-16-2007, 9:02 AM
So.. is participation in the clinic mandatory or will some be attending while others are shooting?

Might be hard to hear or be a little distracting if others are shooting while instruction is going on.

We should really have a great turnout. With a class put on by Twolf, anyone even remotely interested should really think about coming. Precsion rifle classes aren't cheap and you usually have to travel to other states. This is an excellent opportunity to get some training at a great price...FREE!

Fjold
08-16-2007, 9:06 AM
OK, I'm in for one day of shooting, as I'm local and it would be disloyal not to show up.

What's the schedule for instruction/shooting?

Besides the long range stuff, should we bring up any OLL rifles and oddball rifles for people to see/try?

proraptor
08-16-2007, 9:32 AM
we need to come up with a time to meet up there....I myself wouldn't mind meeting up with pistol pete near his place and caravanning out there...

I'm sure timberwolf will have an agenda made up for us....

I also agree that everyone should participate in the clinic as I don't think he should be interrupted by shooting in the background

Prc329
08-16-2007, 9:32 AM
I'll be there, I may not stay the whole weekend though. I will be there saturday.

rksimple
08-16-2007, 9:34 AM
Besides the long range stuff, should we bring up any OLL rifles and oddball rifles for people to see/try?

Might be kinda cool to see that .375! Don't you have a 6.5-284 for long range stuff? That thing ought to be a laser at 800 yards!

proraptor
08-16-2007, 9:41 AM
I updated the who is coming list on the first page

Jicko
08-16-2007, 9:58 AM
ANYONE FROM SAN DIEGO??

I would like to carpool..... it is freaking FAR for me.....

wildcard
08-16-2007, 10:09 AM
ANYONE FROM SAN DIEGO??

I would like to carpool..... it is freaking FAR for me.....

It's only 3 hours :)

Jicko
08-16-2007, 10:17 AM
It's only 3 hours :)

No way.... unless u are flying a plane...

232 mi Ė about 3 hours 51 mins
up to 5 hours 20 mins in traffic

http://maps.google.com/maps?saddr=Tehachapi,+CA&geocode=&daddr=San+Diego,+CA&f=d&hl=en&sll=35.13177,-118.4492&sspn=0.085919,0.103683&ie=UTF8&z=8&om=1

Timberwolf
08-16-2007, 10:21 AM
Let me clear up some things re the “clinic” - first as far as I’m concerned it is not mandatory though I would ask that if there are those that are not attending and just shooting that we be separated so that the noise is not an interference or that those taking the clinic will not be disturbed when we break to the line to practice what has just been discussed.

The clinic will be a combination of theory and practice, as are most classes of this type. In fact this “clinic” per se will be basically the same type class that you would get if you hired me to give you private instruction in Prec Rifle at APS or took one of the precision rifle classes put on by Shooter’s Edge or others.

It will run about 3 - 4 hours depending on the number of people and set up time, and I would like to plan to run it on Saturday. There is a distinct possibility that I will be scheduled to work that weekend and if I am its easier to take a Sat off than Sunday, as Sunday is busier at APS.

I will plan to start the clinic around 9:30 - 10:00 a.m. and it will proceed as follows: hit the range for about 1/2 - 3/4 hour to check everyone’s 100 yard zero, then go into an hour or so discussion re theory etc., break for lunch, and then hit the range for the remainder of the class with group then individual instruction.

The clinic will cover various things such as field positions, equipment, ranging, ballistics, etc.

Because I will be providing handouts and materials, I will need a rough headcount of who’ll be attending by the first of Sept so I can plan accordingly.

theEpiphany
08-16-2007, 11:24 AM
Hey Proraptor...Definitly count me in......You mind if I follow you up?


Yeha I'm friggin high maintenance ;)

Mute
08-16-2007, 11:35 AM
You going too Mute? It'll be even better if we get to drool looking at your rifle and scope. Plus I get to pick up your brass :)

I know/ met 7 out of the 9 on the list right now and all are cool. Should be fun.

So.. is participation in the clinic mandatory or will some be attending while others are shooting?

If it were on 9/22 I could make it, but 9/8 my daughter is having a birthday party so it's a no go.

proraptor
08-16-2007, 11:36 AM
didn't you say you live in fullerton? if so we can probably carpool...its up to you

theEpiphany
08-16-2007, 12:04 PM
I'm all for it...Anyone who digs Sid Haig/Captain Spalding is cool with me :).

Fjold
08-16-2007, 12:26 PM
Might be kinda cool to see that .375! Don't you have a 6.5-284 for long range stuff? That thing ought to be a laser at 800 yards!

I'll bring the 375 H&H, the 6.5x284 and at least one OLL.

I'll have to check how much ammo I have loaded up for each as my reloading room is disassembled because we are selling the house. Dang, I also have to find my front rest, sandbags, etc. in the storage unit.

Prc329
08-16-2007, 12:43 PM
I got the wife's approval. I'll be there saturday for sure. I may be able to stay till sunday, but all day saturday is a definate.

I'll bring my M14 and most likely a pair of savages in 308 and 223.

Gotta start loading. I just ordered a 1000 308 brass to load for the M14. I'm going to try and bring at least 500 of 223 and 308.

proraptor
08-16-2007, 12:52 PM
I also have to start loading up some .308....what load are you going to make for your savage nate?

I also need a sling for my savage....anyone have any reccomendations?

Jicko
08-16-2007, 12:54 PM
If no one is carpooling with me from San Diego, can I try to get up to u guys in OC or Riverside, and then carpool up?

I probably will be there with my Rem700PSS & my Mk12Mod1SPR.

Maybe I should haul my reloading gears too.... so I can make rounds @ the site.... heh hee.... (if all the case prep is done and are primed, just measuring powder, and seating the bullet isn't that big of a deal, even out on the range....)

Mute
08-16-2007, 1:02 PM
Proraptor, if you plan on actually using your sling to help shoot in various field position, the best is Mike Miller's TIS Sling (http://triadtactical.com/?mainURL=/store/category/8mgq/Tactical_Intervention_Specialists.html). Expensive but worth every penny. I haven't found a more effective sling for supported shooting positions. If you just need one for portage, there are number of good ones. I recommend you get one that's at least 1.25" wide.

Prc329
08-16-2007, 1:11 PM
I need to learn to use mine the correct way but I love my TIS. I have been using it when shooting from a bench or prone and it really helps me control the bipod during recoil and steady the rifle. I got mine from Brownell's. Hey Pro, if you want one I can order it using my 03 and get it for $56.67 plus shipping.

wildcard
08-16-2007, 1:13 PM
I also have to start loading up some .308....what load are you going to make for your savage nate?

I also need a sling for my savage....anyone have any reccomendations?

Can't go wrong with a Turner Saddlery sling. I recommend it: http://turnersling.com/miva/merchant.mvc

wildcard
08-16-2007, 1:18 PM
Perhaps we should clear the poll and have everyone revote on the date since the location is determined. Or is the date set in stone now? I'm cool with the weekend of Sep 8th or any other weekend for that matter.. just a suggestion.

proraptor
08-16-2007, 1:28 PM
I already pmed kestryll to close the poll as we are doing this sept 8th

Prc329
08-17-2007, 8:27 AM
O.K., everything is ordered for the 223 savage. I am putting the green stock I have on it and a black one I just ordered on my 308. Got a Nikon Buckmaster mil-dot scope, warne base and burris xtreme tactical rings. Ordering my tactical bolt knob and sling today :D

I also ordered my log book and just need to get my mil-dot master and cosign indicator for my 308.

Should be fin :)

caduckgunner
08-17-2007, 8:37 AM
I should be able to make it. If I do, I have 2 extra beds in the tent trailer.

PistolPete75
08-17-2007, 9:06 AM
I should be able to make it. If I do, I have 2 extra beds in the tent trailer.


woohoo! if you come, can i claim one bed?

proraptor
08-17-2007, 9:11 AM
caduckgunner will be there....he loves the club too much to not come :) I added you to the coming list

I'd ask for a bed but I don't think I can camp out...I'm in for saturday for sure though

nate you have way too much money...I think you need to send some my way! lol

caduckgunner
08-17-2007, 9:12 AM
woohoo! if you come, can i claim one bed?

Sure. By the way what is the temp in Tahachapi in September?

rksimple
08-17-2007, 9:43 AM
Sure. By the way what is the temp in Tahachapi in September?

Warm during the day, around 85-90 degress or so. Night can be cold. The weather is VERY unpredictable here. There have been 40 degree nights in June.:eek:

Prc329
08-17-2007, 11:27 AM
Got all my gear ordered. I was going to order a shooting mat but I think I am going to stick with my U Haul blanket for now.

FYI Triad Tactical had the best price on a cosign indicator if you are looking for one. It is $125 though.

Timberwolf
08-17-2007, 11:31 AM
I have a spare ACI if anyone is interested.

rksimple
08-17-2007, 11:32 AM
I have a spare ACI if anyone is interested.


You selling it? I'm interested.

Timberwolf
08-17-2007, 12:03 PM
Yes - its just the ACI though no base, its the cosine one that gives the percentages as opposed to the angle degrees, it was mounted for about 6 months on my spare rifle until I switched to the one with degrees to match my watch.

It can be mounted to your scope via a scope ring or to your rail via a base. I've mounted them both ways and find no difference in their performance between to two methods of mounting.

caduckgunner
08-17-2007, 12:07 PM
I forgot the disclaimer for sleeping in the tent trailer. I snore like a grizzly bear

Fjold
08-17-2007, 12:09 PM
Just a suggestion;

Start a new post titled something like:

"Precision Rifle Shoot/Clinic -Tehachapi Sept 8th-9th"

That way new people will see all the important info in the title and you might get even more participation.

caduckgunner
08-17-2007, 12:20 PM
How many rounds do I need for the clinic?

Timberwolf
08-17-2007, 12:28 PM
No more than 100 probably closer to 50.

Prc329
08-19-2007, 8:01 PM
Got the brake installed. I am so looking forward to this shoot. Gotta finish working up my load.

proraptor
08-19-2007, 8:02 PM
Me and budd need to work on some more reloading for this...

Prc329
08-19-2007, 8:15 PM
I plan on loading about 100 rounds and bringing a lot more. Well 100 308 and 100 223 plus a bunch of wolf gold 75g 223 and a bunch of 308 for my m14. It should be fun. I will probably bring along my 45s just in case.

rksimple
08-19-2007, 8:55 PM
I've got about 600 rounds of 308 loaded. But 500 of it has to get sent to Texas for a course, and there are 2 matches between now and then. That means I got to get my *** in gear and do some loading!

Fjold
08-20-2007, 12:59 PM
Have we settled on a time and schedule for the weekend's festivities?

I have my whole gun room disassembled so I can't reload anymore ammo but I have about 50 rounds of 6.5x284, a few hundred varmint rounds for the AR and enough 260 grain Partitions loaded up to let everyone try the 375 H&H if they want.

PistolPete75
08-20-2007, 7:51 PM
i'm heading out as soon as i get off work that friday, hopefully in the late afternoon. i will post directions to everyone 1 week prior to all confirmed shooters. you guys are welcome to caravan with me or carpool. i might have an extra seat in my car.

basically friday night = camp over, drink a few beers, etc.

saturday morning = set up and start shooting around 6:30ish (clinic), around noon mayby RK can show us a place where we can get some good grub, then go back and shoot some more! then go eat dinner, drink some more beer, and (dawn time = excellent time to get some varmint shooting!)

sunday = shoot for about 1/2 day till 11ish, and then head out home.

(I recommend you guys reload like a mad man before arriving to the ranch) Also it can get pretty hot out there. You guys should bring sun sreen.

anotherted
08-21-2007, 3:41 AM
My girl doesnt want to go:rolleyes:, but I do. Can you put me down as a "maby"? When do you need a 100% confirmation?

Thanks,

Ted

rksimple
08-21-2007, 6:01 AM
mayby RK can show us a place where we can get some good grub,

You got it!

PistolPete75
08-21-2007, 8:11 AM
My girl doesnt want to go:rolleyes:, but I do. Can you put me down as a "maby"? When do you need a 100% confirmation?

Thanks,

Ted

24-28 hours before the 7th should be fine. i just don't want to post the address all over the web. i rather send it out privately.

Prc329
08-21-2007, 8:18 AM
You get my confirmation now. I'll be there really early Saturday though.

Mute
08-21-2007, 8:35 AM
Man, I wish I could make it.

proraptor
08-21-2007, 9:06 AM
Man, I wish I could make it.

you are going to miss out on a fun shoot....

ill update the list and add one more maybe...

I'm in for sure....I need to get a shooting mat....probably the movers blanket like nate uses...

are we really starting at 6:30 am on saturday? I'd have to get up around 3am to do that yikes! maybe me and my carpoolers should go up friday night and spend the night....

should we bring ez ups as it might get hot up there?

PistolPete75
08-21-2007, 9:11 AM
shooting is best in the morning. we don't have to do 6:30, but we should start at least like at 8 to 8:30.

bring what you can to stay cool. i like to stock up on drinks in my cooler.

PistolPete75
08-21-2007, 9:12 AM
also check out a work out mat for prone shooting. i used one before, and they work great.

also midway i believe has one on sale right now for like $25~!

Prc329
08-21-2007, 9:22 AM
Uhaul moving blanket.

wildcard
08-21-2007, 9:30 AM
As a rule of thumb, the earlier you start.. the more time you're going to get to spend shooting with minimum wind (0 - 5 MPH). I suggest starting no later than 6:00 AM but then I'm a morning person. Winds pick up to about 10 MPH by noon in that region. I'm not a meteorologist but that has been my observation in that area. Also.. you'll maximize your time shooting at the cooler teperature!

Besides.. there'll be more bunnies hopping around in the morning. You only need to wake up once this early.. it's a special occasion!

rksimple
08-21-2007, 10:50 AM
6am might be a little hard on the neighbors. I think the range starts up around 7 or so. That would be a safe bet.

Wind is somewhat unpredictable in that it can be blowin' 20+ all night long and stop at around 10 in the morning. Normally, however, by 10-11am, it picks up and continues for the rest of the day. They don't have those wind machines all over the hills for no reason!:D

wildcard
08-21-2007, 11:00 AM
6am might be a little hard on the neighbors. I think the range starts up around 7 or so. That would be a safe bet.

Wind is somewhat unpredictable in that it can be blowin' 20+ all night long and stop at around 10 in the morning. Normally, however, by 10-11am, it picks up and continues for the rest of the day. They don't have those wind machines all over the hills for no reason!:D

Yeah.. but if people got there at 6.. we probably won't start shooting until 7 anyways. Now if you say seven.. it'll probably be 8 before we started shooting! :)

Timberwolf
08-21-2007, 11:16 AM
Y'all are either very hardcore or just excited about being about to shoot. Just remember we need daylight to shoot by and a little wind is good.

wildcard
08-21-2007, 11:26 AM
Y'all are either very hardcore or just excited about being about to shoot. Just remember we need daylight to shoot by and a little wind is good.

A little of both :) I like to head out the door at 3:00 so I can get out to the desert (or the ranch when possible) by 5:15 so I'm all set up and ready to rock by the time the sun peeks out at 5:30. That gives me about 6 hours to shoot in cool temperatures with gradually increasing winds.

I may not be the best shooter.. but you gotta give me credit for trying!

Timberwolf
08-21-2007, 11:37 AM
Is there a Starbucks near the ranch??????? I'm going to need vast amounts of "bucks" . . .

proraptor
08-21-2007, 12:19 PM
hey timberwolf what time will the clinic start? what time should I be there ready to shoot and learn?

I might just drive up friday night and sleep in my truck

Prc329
08-21-2007, 12:26 PM
I'm going to leave about 4 to 5am saturday depending on when the clinic will starts. Maybe friday if I can find my sleeping bag.

rksimple
08-21-2007, 12:29 PM
Is there a Starbucks near the ranch??????? I'm going to need vast amounts of "bucks" . . .

About 8 miles down the freeway.

Timberwolf
08-21-2007, 1:20 PM
I planned on starting the clinic around 9:30 - hitting the range for about 1/2 - 3/4 hour to check everyone’s 100 yard zero, position etc, then go into a classroom discussion re theory, equipment, positions, etc., break for lunch, and then hit the range for field exercises for the remainder of the class with group then individual instruction as needed.

Do y'all want to start the clinic earlier?

rksimple
08-21-2007, 1:43 PM
Do y'all want to start the clinic earlier?

Probably. 8 oclock would probably be the best. That would allow for some trigger time in light wind. It can get up to 20+ mph in the afternoon. Might be kinda frustrating for some.

PistolPete75
08-21-2007, 2:05 PM
hopefully it will be calm like last time.

proraptor
08-21-2007, 2:12 PM
well I've decided I'm probably going to drive up friday and spend the night so I don't really care what time it will start now...I just didn't want to have to be up at 3:30 to get there to find out I'm way too tired to shoot lol....

Timberwolf
08-21-2007, 2:15 PM
Alright 0800 it is - I'm glad I live in Palmdale

rksimple
08-21-2007, 2:16 PM
hopefully it will be calm like last time.

It should be. Your place has a little more protection from the wind than the shooting range on the other side of the hill.

Jicko
08-21-2007, 2:25 PM
9:30........ :-(

That means i got to leave @ 5am.....

My 2 girls(my ex-gf & my new-gf) are willing to come with me.... but it would be tough for them... I need to figure out some place/things for them to do....













My new-gf is only 7mo. old.

My ex-gf is now my wife.

:D

rksimple
08-21-2007, 2:46 PM
Jicko-there aint much to do in Tehachapi. Its a small town with a lot of railroad history. There is the typical Starbucks/Que Pasa/Coldstone strip mall and a few others. There are also a few little shops downtown that have cutesy things for the ladies as well. There may even be some U-pick/We-pick apple orchards open by that time. Check it out:

http://www.tehachapi.com/chamber/visitorinfo.html

Mute
08-21-2007, 4:47 PM
9:30........ :-(

That means i got to leave @ 5am.....

My 2 girls(my ex-gf & my new-gf) are willing to come with me.... but it would be tough for them... I need to figure out some place/things for them to do....














My new-gf is only 7mo. old.

My ex-gf is now my wife.

:D


Have them go to the waterpark by Magic Mountain.

PistolPete75
08-21-2007, 4:52 PM
Have them go to the waterpark by Magic Mountain.

+1 great idea

proraptor
08-22-2007, 9:32 AM
I hope we finally get to meet you jicko....this next shoot is going to be awesome

PistolPete75
08-22-2007, 12:00 PM
hope you all voted

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=66827

we are losing right now.

proraptor
08-22-2007, 1:07 PM
I just saw that....I voted....

Budd
08-22-2007, 3:30 PM
I think I am a *doubtful* at this point.:(

Rhys898
08-22-2007, 5:34 PM
I'm definately down to go, what is the overnight camping situation, its only an hour and a half away for me but... I'd like to be able to sleep till 7 if we are firing up at 8am. I have tent, sleeping bag, camp stove, etc..

Jer

PistolPete75
08-22-2007, 5:48 PM
I'm definately down to go, what is the overnight camping situation, its only an hour and a half away for me but... I'd like to be able to sleep till 7 if we are firing up at 8am. I have tent, sleeping bag, camp stove, etc..

Jer

there are open areas to camp at my dad's place. i will be leaving as early as possible to prepare.

Rhys898
08-22-2007, 7:07 PM
Another question,

Will there be a chronograph there???

Jer

rksimple
08-22-2007, 7:36 PM
Another question,

Will there be a chronograph there???

Jer

I'll bring mine.

PistolPete75
08-22-2007, 7:46 PM
a few of the guys have one. there should be 1 there.

Prc329
08-22-2007, 8:21 PM
Got my mildot master and my ACI today :D

PistolPete75
08-23-2007, 8:00 AM
Got my mildot master and my ACI today :D

you are ready to go aren't ya?

:)

PistolPete75
08-23-2007, 8:42 AM
so what kind of sling should i get? turners or there was another option?

Timberwolf
08-23-2007, 8:54 AM
Turners or TIS. They are both great slings but TIS is way faster to get in and out of. You can get them at TriadTactical as I don't believe Mike (TIS) sells in CA directly.

Prc329
08-23-2007, 8:57 AM
I personally like the TIS sling but it is a little pricey ($60). Can be used with or without cuff. I need to use it properly but what I usually do when shooting prone is tighten up the sling and use my forearm threw the cuff and pull my arm back to my chest and then push forward a little with my trigger hand. This loads the bipod real nice.

Well for me at least.

Prc329
08-23-2007, 8:58 AM
Turners or TIS. They are both great slings but TIS is way faster to get in and out of. You can get them at TriadTactical as I don't believe Mike (TIS) sells in CA directly.

Triad Tactical and Brownell's has them.

PistolPete75
08-23-2007, 9:27 AM
yeah yeah, time to order more stuff. the neverending story of shooting.

Prc329
08-23-2007, 9:31 AM
I need to get a real shooters mat, but my UHaul blanket works so well :D

PistolPete75
08-23-2007, 9:32 AM
it's the model one right? just making sure before i buy.

http://www.brownells.com/aspx/NS/store/ProductDetail.aspx?p=1494&title=TACTICAL+INTERVENTION+QUICK+CUFF+PRECISION+S LING

PistolPete75
08-23-2007, 9:32 AM
I need to get a real shooters mat, but my UHaul blanket works so well :D

dude midway has one for $25!

Prc329
08-23-2007, 9:37 AM
That's the one.

I saw that mat at Midway but I think I am going to use my blanket a little loger.

PistolPete75
08-23-2007, 10:02 AM
are you gonna go with eagle?

i have one, it's nice but i don't really see the need to spend that kind of money. i think it was an instant gratification mood at the time of purchase.

Prc329
08-23-2007, 10:21 AM
I'm just looking for something I can use. That is the main reason I can't seem to justify buying one right now. My moving blanket works well. It was very comfy at Burro Canyon fruit shoot.

Timberwolf
08-23-2007, 11:25 AM
For what its worth guys, even though I have a TAB shooters mat that I keep attached to my pack for field use, my "range mat" is an old bath mat commonly referred to as my "prayer mat".

Eagle mats are good and when I had my LTR that's what I used to carry it around in . . . but you'll find they're a little over kill for actual field use.

Prc329
08-23-2007, 11:32 AM
What kind of pack would you recommend? I plan on doing some matches after we take the clinic. I also plan on getting some more advanced training in the future. Any school recommendations?

Hey, post number 223 in this thread :D

Timberwolf
08-23-2007, 11:54 AM
Packs are more of a personal preference thing and also depends on what you want it for. The one thing all my packs have in common is that I insist on them being hydration compatable - but hey I spend most of my time in a desert setting.

I presently have three packs that I use and it depends on what I'll be using it for as to which one I use.

The first is a Camelbak M.U.L.E. - a good all around light pack for when all I need to carry is the basics. Not really high enough to shoot off of.

My second is a Maxpedition Falcon II - this is my usual "go to" pack. Its a good lite to medium pack, can carry all that I need in a typical match, its confortable, hydration compat, and makes a good shooting platform.

Lastly I have an Eberlestock G3 "Phantom" - I use this mostly for those all day / night classes when I need the extra space - its everything my Falcon is and then some.

rksimple
08-23-2007, 12:02 PM
Any school recommendations?



I'm taking the Level II Precision Rifle course at Tiger Valley this October. I'll let you know how it is and if its worth the trip to Texas.

Rifles Only also gets a lot of praise, as well as Central Virginia Tactical. I don't know of many that are local.

Timberwolf
08-23-2007, 12:26 PM
There is one local that I'm aware of and have attended which is through Shooter's Edge - I've gone to both their Prec Rifle and Adv Prec Rifle courses and they're pretty good.

There are a couple of the better known ones such as Rifles Only which I've been to and its excellent; Tiger Valley; Central Virginia, and I believe Chandler has one in N.C.

DJDace
08-23-2007, 2:51 PM
Well my 6.5 Grendel Upper arrived today, so, barring a few tweaks here and there I have a servicable precision rifle to shoot with now.

Put me down as a maybe, as I'll be in Canada on vacation from the 24th till Sept 3rd. Hopefully I can go and see Randall to put a free float rail on the Upper so I can attach my bi-pod, otherwise I will be shooting off-hand or off a bag.

proraptor
08-23-2007, 4:26 PM
Nate did you get my pm? I want one of those slings! Help a bro out with your 03!!!!

Jicko
08-23-2007, 4:28 PM
I can get you that sling too. $57, i think.

proraptor
08-23-2007, 4:29 PM
I can get you that sling too. $57, i think.

Jicko are you coming to the clinic?

Jicko
08-23-2007, 4:30 PM
Very likely. Almost certain.

proraptor
08-23-2007, 4:33 PM
do you want me to add you to the coming list?

Rhys898
08-23-2007, 5:06 PM
Put me on the list! I'm there. Already cleared it with the little lady. In anticipation of the trip I ordered a TIS Slip Cuff Sling, Mildot Master, Slope Doper, Sniper Data Book, Redman Rear Bag, Midway Shooting Mat, and Sierra Infinity Ballistics Software. So as long as we have either AC Power or a AC Inverter to run off my car I will bring my laptop and printer and we can print ballistic cards there.

Jer

PistolPete75
08-23-2007, 5:56 PM
Put me on the list! I'm there. Already cleared it with the little lady. In anticipation of the trip I ordered a TIS Slip Cuff Sling, Mildot Master, Slope Doper, Sniper Data Book, Redman Rear Bag, Midway Shooting Mat, and Sierra Infinity Ballistics Software. So as long as we have either AC Power or a AC Inverter to run off my car I will bring my laptop and printer and we can print ballistic cards there.

Jer


i believe elevation is around 3500 ft. humidity ranges from about 30%-40%

temperature will range from 70-105 degrees.

wind can vary from 5-15mph.

btw..we are neighbors i live around mcbean and copper hill.

check out jmb ballistics.

Rhys898
08-23-2007, 6:41 PM
Sweet, I'm on caraway off grovepark and haskel.

you meant jbm right? :)

his tools are really good, but, if there is no cell service I can't pull it up.

Jer

Prc329
08-23-2007, 6:45 PM
http://www.eskimo.com/~jbm/calculations/calculations.html

rksimple
08-23-2007, 7:07 PM
his tools are really good, but, if there is no cell service I can't pull it up.


I have Verizon and get cell service out there.

Just got back this evening from sighting in the new IOR. This range is about 3/4 of a mile from the ranch. Elevation is about 3800'.

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b82/rksimple/0823071850.jpg

The ranch is just on the other side of that mountain.
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b82/rksimple/0823071852.jpg

Prc329
08-23-2007, 7:16 PM
Which range finder is that?

Rhys898
08-23-2007, 7:20 PM
I have Verizon and get cell service out there.

Sweet, then my cellular broadband card will work and we can print out the jbm cards there for anyone who needs one.

Jer

rksimple
08-23-2007, 8:06 PM
Which range finder is that?

Leica Geovids. They are AMAZING!

Prc329
08-23-2007, 8:44 PM
O.K., Savage 10fp in 223 is here, installed into B&C Medalist, tomorrow my base, rings, etc come and if Randall is free the Badger break will be installed. The twins will be ready for Saturday the 8th.

I think I have found a pack I want.

http://www.snipertools.com/eberle_backpacks_x1a1s.htm

Or something similar should fit my needs.

Prc329
08-23-2007, 8:46 PM
Leica Geovids. They are AMAZING!

Nice, just a tad outside of my budget right now.

rksimple
08-23-2007, 9:02 PM
Nice, just a tad outside of my budget right now.

Outta my budget, too. They're my father-in-law's!:D

PistolPete75
08-24-2007, 9:40 AM
O.K., Savage 10fp in 223 is here, installed into B&C Medalist, tomorrow my base, rings, etc come and if Randall is free the Badger break will be installed. The twins will be ready for Saturday the 8th.

I think I have found a pack I want.

http://www.snipertools.com/eberle_backpacks_x1a1s.htm

Or something similar should fit my needs.

that's a bad, azz pack.

Prc329
08-24-2007, 9:50 AM
Hey Timberwolf, out of curiosity, besides water what do you carry in your pack?

Cypriss32
08-24-2007, 12:29 PM
Count me and Rhys in!

Timberwolf
08-24-2007, 8:17 PM
Hey Timberwolf, out of curiosity, besides water what do you carry in your pack?

It depends on what I'm going to - the load for my last match was as follows:

Water - 3L; Ammo - 100 rds; knee pads; elbow pads; gloves (shooting and all purpose); hearing muffs; sunglasses & hard case; tool kit (including M-14 col rod); small binos; log book and cover with mildot master and small calc; food - energy gels, power bars & a piece of fruit; 1 pair socks; Tab shooting mat; Minimag w/ red lense & head lamp; first aid kit.

Rhys898
08-25-2007, 9:39 PM
Can we get an address? I'm trying to plan my route.

Jer

PistolPete75
08-27-2007, 9:56 AM
address will not be posted, but emailed to all confirmed shooters this weekend. it's off sand canyon though.

Jicko
08-27-2007, 9:59 AM
I have Verizon and get cell service out there.


Cool!!! I'll get internet out there then!!!

We can still check on calguns.net when we are out there!!!

PS. Please put me on the "COMING" list...... I still need to plan the logistics..... :-( 4hrs to drive out there...