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WALDSCHRAT
12-17-2012, 8:10 PM
Here's the law. My question is at the bottom and pertains to CA's take on what is and what is not an antique (specifically in red print, followed by question):

Penal Code 16170
(a) As used in Sections 30515 and 30530, "antique firearm"
means any firearm manufactured before January 1, 1899.
(b) As used in Section 16520, Section 16650, subdivision (a) of
Section 23630, paragraph (1) of subdivision (b) of Section 27505, and
subdivision (a) of Section 31615, "antique firearm" has the same
meaning as in Section 921(a)(16) of Title 18 of the United States
Code.
(c) As used in Section 17700, "antique firearm" means either of
the following:
(1) Any firearm not designed or redesigned for using rimfire or
conventional center fire ignition with fixed ammunition and
manufactured in or before 1898. This includes any matchlock,
flintlock, percussion cap, or similar type of ignition system or
replica thereof, whether actually manufactured before or after the
year 1898.
(2) Any firearm using fixed ammunition manufactured in or before
1898, for which ammunition is no longer manufactured in the United
States and is not readily available in the ordinary channels of
commercial trade.

Let's say that I own a model 1891 Mosin Nagant that was manufactured in 1898. The rifle can fire ammo that is still being manufactured in the U.S. and is available commercially. Is my rifle classed as an antique or not in California?

rolo
12-17-2012, 8:44 PM
The term "either" means choose one, not both. Your rifle is an antique under 16170(c)1.

Dutch3
12-18-2012, 5:27 AM
There is a minor difference in Federal vs California law in regard to what is considered an Antique Firearm.

Fed states anything manufactured before 1899 is an antique, regardless of whether it uses centerfire ammunition.

CA states pre-1899 is an antique, unless "designed or redesigned" to use centerfire ammunition that is "readily available" in normal trade.

So if your rifle was made prior to 1899, but uses centerfire ammunition that is readily available, it is not an antique under CA law.

Consider an old .32 S&W topbreak revolver manufactured in 1896. 32 S&W is still manufactured, but you are not going to find it on the shelf at your LGS. Does that mean it is not readily available? It can be found online through a couple of vendors, but what if you happen to live in a locality that does not allow ammunition delivery? I would consider 32 S&W to not be "readily available".

You can buy 7.62x54R at Big 5, so I would consider it to be readily available.

Librarian
12-18-2012, 11:52 AM
The only place where it is NOT an antique is for PC 17700 "The provisions listed in Section 16590 do not apply to any antique firearm. " and PC 16590, probably these partsAs used in this part, "generally prohibited weapon" means
any of the following: ....
(k) A firearm that is not immediately recognizable as a firearm,
as prohibited by Section 24510.
...
(t) A short-barreled rifle or short-barreled shotgun, as
prohibited by Section 33215.
...
(v) An unconventional pistol, as prohibited by Section 31500.
(w) An undetectable firearm, as prohibited by Section 24610.
(x) A wallet gun, as prohibited by Section 24710.

WALDSCHRAT
12-18-2012, 12:18 PM
There is a minor difference in Federal vs California law in regard to what is considered an Antique Firearm.

Fed states anything manufactured before 1899 is an antique, regardless of whether it uses centerfire ammunition.

CA states pre-1899 is an antique, unless "designed or redesigned" to use centerfire ammunition that is "readily available" in normal trade.

So if your rifle was made prior to 1899, but uses centerfire ammunition that is readily available, it is not an antique under CA law.

Consider an old .32 S&W topbreak revolver manufactured in 1896. 32 S&W is still manufactured, but you are not going to find it on the shelf at your LGS. Does that mean it is not readily available? It can be found online through a couple of vendors, but what if you happen to live in a locality that does not allow ammunition delivery? I would consider 32 S&W to not be "readily available".

You can buy 7.62x54R at Big 5, so I would consider it to be readily available.

So an old trapdoor Springfield would not be considered an antique if it is chambered for 45-70?