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-G-
12-17-2012, 12:26 PM
I have a single 9mm handgun. I recently became a gun owner after seeing the devastation after Hurricane Sandy, and seeing the political climate our country is in.

I'm seeing more and more politicians coming out discussing bans, etc.

If you're me - with a single gun, what would you be buying?

toyotaguy
12-17-2012, 12:35 PM
Ar15

Curley Red
12-17-2012, 12:54 PM
Buy the firearm that you want, do not go and buy an AR just for the reason that it might get banned.

madjack956
12-17-2012, 12:56 PM
Semi autos like the AR, an AK, a M1A, an SKS, Ruger mini14, an any other rifle that strikes my fancy at this time, would be what I would get. But it depends on what you like, think you need and have to have.

frankm
12-17-2012, 12:58 PM
Semi-auto rifle of your choosing. Then a shotgun.

jdmcgee
12-17-2012, 1:00 PM
Buy the firearm that you want, do not go and buy an AR just for the reason that it might get banned.

I agree with Curley Red. You need to assess what your specific expected needs are for a firearm & then purchase based on your needs. If you're wanting a firearm for self-defense, it might be different than your need if you would like to get involved with competitions or cheap target practice.

JD

NotEnufGarage
12-17-2012, 1:03 PM
at least 2 rifles and 1 pistol... 1 each rifle and pistol in .22lr so that you can practice shooting regularly without breaking the bank, and 1 rifle in 5.56, .308, .30-06 or any other hunting caliber.

Beelzy
12-17-2012, 1:13 PM
Ammo.

IPSICK
12-17-2012, 1:20 PM
Ammo.

and at least 1 semi-automatic long gun.

glbtrottr
12-17-2012, 1:25 PM
Pistol? Best value and durability goes to Glocks for $500 or so. Spartan and reliable.
Rifle? AR15's are the most widely available semi-autos in .223.
A $200-300 shotgun, like a Mossberg 500 for home defense if you're on a budget.

ScottsBad
12-17-2012, 1:43 PM
Don't listen to the guy with the fish in his signature above. He reminds me of the guy in Animal House who runs around telling everyone to be calm when the whole street is in chaos, so no-one listens to him.

My guess is that it is not likely that an assault weapons ban will be passed. But it could be accomplished by Obama in other ways.

I finished my buying months ago in preparation for an Obama re-election (The fish guy was telling everyone to be calm then too). So it is hard for me to say what is right for you.

In any case, if you decide to get something now an AR maybe (A Daniel Defense M4V7 is a good value). A Mini-14 if you like a more traditional profile. An AK-47 is a good rifle as well. Try to get as many magazines as possible. And of course, lots of ammo.

I think I read that Feinstein has Mini-14s on her list as well.

smogcity
12-17-2012, 1:50 PM
If you feel the need to do anything, just go to Turners and pick up Mega AR lowers for $110. each.

http://www.turners.com/engage/displayads.php

Buy several, and build your rifle(s) when you want to.

dodge
12-17-2012, 1:56 PM
Here's what everyone reading this topic needs to do:

Find out who your House Representative and Senators are.
http://www.house.gov/
http://www.senate.gov/

Write them. Tell them that you expect them to defend your natural rights that are guaranteed to you under the second amendment to the Constitution. Tell them that any vote that impinges upon your rights as a law-abiding citizen will result in your support of a candidate that will fight for your rights. Further, if an attempt to recall said incumbent is made, you will support it fully.

Then, call them. You may get direct office numbers from the links above, or you can call the Congressional switchboard. That number is (202) 224-3121.

Then, use snail mail to put paper in their hands. Again, express to them what your expectations are when it comes to the second amendment, and what the ramifications to their political career are should they fail you.

It's time to make it known in no uncertain terms that we expect them to protect our rights.

also, educate yourself so you know the percentages etc. (2-4% of all violent crime is carried out the the illicit black rifles/ar type platform)
also, once carrying was legalized where it wasn't, those areas all saw decreases in crime across the board
http://www.justfacts.com/guncontrol.asp#background

dodge
12-17-2012, 1:56 PM
Here's what everyone reading this topic needs to do:

Find out who your House Representative and Senators are.
http://www.house.gov/
http://www.senate.gov/

Write them. Tell them that you expect them to defend your natural rights that are guaranteed to you under the second amendment to the Constitution. Tell them that any vote that impinges upon your rights as a law-abiding citizen will result in your support of a candidate that will fight for your rights. Further, if an attempt to recall said incumbent is made, you will support it fully.

Then, call them. You may get direct office numbers from the links above, or you can call the Congressional switchboard. That number is (202) 224-3121.

Then, use snail mail to put paper in their hands. Again, express to them what your expectations are when it comes to the second amendment, and what the ramifications to their political career are should they fail you.

It's time to make it known in no uncertain terms that we expect them to protect our rights.

also, educate yourself so you know the percentages etc. (2-4% of all violent crime is carried out w/the illicit black rifle/ar type platform)
also, once carrying was legalized where it wasn't, those areas all saw decreases in crime across the board
http://www.justfacts.com/guncontrol.asp#background

durandal
12-17-2012, 2:35 PM
We should get more guns, because we may not be able to in the future, sure.

We should also donate to pro 2a groups. I just renewed my NRA, CRPA membership, donated to CGF and 2AF today after seeing the degeneracy of the political debate after this most recent mass killing.

edit: also donated to NRA ILA.

krazz
12-17-2012, 3:13 PM
Get all you can...always....regardless of who is trying to do what.

I'll never forget when I was younger and I'd go to the gunshops all around LA (there were an assload of them) and wish for all the cool-*** UZI's, MAC, AK's, Mini-14's, etc... that I wanted to buy, but never did. Then what happened...Clinton. I didn't have jack, and still wanted them all. Now I set aside money and buy a certain amount of guns every year, just cause. One thing is ABSOLUTELY CERTAIN...they WILL get them one day, and I want my kids/grandkids/great-grandkids to have all mine when they won't be able to buy them for themselves.

skyscraper
12-17-2012, 3:20 PM
We should be starting as many threads as possible because there aren't enough of them on this subject that can be found performing a 10 second search

Lone_Gunman
12-17-2012, 3:33 PM
If it was me in your place I'd buy 2 or 3 stripped AR lowers, An AK, and a CMP Garand. Actually, with the exception of the AK, which I already have, that's exactly what I'm buying.

Grumpy-old-man
12-17-2012, 3:49 PM
I have a single 9mm handgun. I recently became a gun owner after seeing the devastation after Hurricane Sandy, and seeing the political climate our country is in.

I'm seeing more and more politicians coming out discussing bans, etc.

If you're me - with a single gun, what would you be buying?

1. Semi auto rifle
Here's the breakdown by caliber
.223/5.56 - flat shooting, about 40 cents a pop, least powerful of the major centerfire calibers. Recommended weapons - AR15 pattern rifle, Mini14, Ruger Ranch Rifle. The Rugers don't have the scary looks of the AR, but may well be on a ban list. Worse, they are hard to get parts for, which could be a Very Bad Thing if a general ban passes.
7.62x39 - ballistics similar to a 30-30, about 25 cents a pop, good deer rifle cartridge for say 200 yds. Recommended weapons - AK series. Parts are easy to source, and almost nothing ever goes wrong. Bad part of the deal is that a lot of the AK's I've seen lately are a bit 'junky' - canted front sights, lousy rivet jobs, etc. If you know your way around AK's, great. If you don't, stick with the AR or M1A platform.
.308/7.62x51 - ballistics similar to a 30-06. Hits like a freight train to way out past fort mudge (same ctg the Marines use for 900 yd kills in sniper rifles). About 80 cents to a buck twenty five a pop (OUCH). Recommended weapons - M1A, DS Arms 58 (FN FAL clone), PT91 (HK G3 clone). All are pricey, but the M1A (M14 equivalent) is my personal favorite; get checkmate mags from 44mag.com for a best buy. Expect to pay cadillac prices for everything on a .308 battle rifle. That's the reason militaries largely dropped 'em outside of elite forces - it was a cost cutter.

Basically, you have to decide based on your wallet, the range of shots you expect to take, and what you want your rifle to be.

For someone in your spot, I would strongly advise the AR15, since it is a. common, b. easy to get parts for, c. easy to find ammo for, and d. easy to learn on (very light recoil and very flat shooting = good for the beginner). Buy at least 10 GOOD magazines (that gives you a full combat load out of 7 plus 3 spares) and more is better. I like Magpul mags FWIW.

2. Pump action shotgun, 12ga. Two choices here - Remington 870 and Mossberg 500. The Mossie is usually a little cheaper, but I have seen 7 shot 870's on sale at Wally World for $350ish locally. I have an 870 7 shooter and its fine, but if a Mossie would have been at the same shop I wouldn't have hesitated to go with it either.

3. Ammo, ammo, ammo.

4. What's your 9mm pistol? Depending on concealability, you may want a smaller version of the same thing (Glock 26 to go with a full sized Glock 17, for example).

Just some suggestions.
Good luck and all the best,
Grumpy

-G-
12-17-2012, 3:54 PM
4. What's your 9mm pistol? Depending on concealability, you may want a smaller version of the same thing (Glock 26 to go with a full sized Glock 27, for example).


Thanks very much for all your suggestions!

I have a Springfield XD9 Subcompact

acolytes
12-17-2012, 3:57 PM
I think everyone should have atleast one handgun, shot gun, "battle rifle", and 22LR.

tima
12-17-2012, 4:05 PM
Here's what everyone reading this topic needs to do:

Find out who your House Representative and Senators are.
http://www.house.gov/
http://www.senate.gov/

Write them. Tell them that you expect them to defend your natural rights that are guaranteed to you under the second amendment to the Constitution. Tell them that any vote that impinges upon your rights as a law-abiding citizen will result in your support of a candidate that will fight for your rights. Further, if an attempt to recall said incumbent is made, you will support it fully.

Then, call them. You may get direct office numbers from the links above, or you can call the Congressional switchboard. That number is (202) 224-3121.

Then, use snail mail to put paper in their hands. Again, express to them what your expectations are when it comes to the second amendment, and what the ramifications to their political career are should they fail you.

It's time to make it known in no uncertain terms that we expect them to protect our rights.

also, educate yourself so you know the percentages etc. (2-4% of all violent crime is carried out the the illicit black rifles/ar type platform)
also, once carrying was legalized where it wasn't, those areas all saw decreases in crime across the board
http://www.justfacts.com/guncontrol.asp#background

Do this. Then go buy as many AR's, AK's, M1A's, any other "evil" rifle, mags, and ammo as you see fit.

mcmikeblues7
12-17-2012, 4:09 PM
I would recommend you a mini 14, mini 30, saiga rifle, or SOMETHING that does not have a pistol grip, or other evil features (collapsible stock, flash hider etc.) You could get an AR without a collapsable stock, or flash hider, or other evil features and a customized grip (hammerhead)
This gives you the ability to have a detachable magazine.

mcmikeblues7
12-17-2012, 4:11 PM
I would recommend you a mini 14, mini 30, saiga rifle, or SOMETHING that does not have a pistol grip, or other evil features (collapsible stock, flash hider etc.) You could get an AR without a collapsable stock, or flash hider, or other evil features and a customized grip (hammerhead)
This gives you the ability to have a detachable magazine.

Skidmark
12-17-2012, 4:35 PM
wrong forum.

myk
12-17-2012, 4:38 PM
Buy what you want, and if you can afford it. If you have no clue what you want then it isn't time for you to buy yet...

-G-
12-17-2012, 4:52 PM
If you have no clue what you want then it isn't time for you to buy yet...

My question had to do with the fact that over the last 72 hours the airwaves have been filled with politicians stating that they'd like to ban certain firearms.

I have a good-sized budget, which is why I'm looking at recommended options - it's not that I'm clueless about guns...

acolytes
12-17-2012, 5:16 PM
If you are asking about what we think is on the endangered list, it would be AR/Ak types.

GunnerB
12-17-2012, 5:37 PM
We should also donate to pro 2a groups. I just renewed my NRA, CRPA membership, donated to CGF and 2AF today after seeing the degeneracy of the political debate after this most recent mass killing.

^^^^^

We need to grow the membership of those organizations, I think the NRA is around 4 million?? That number should be quadrupled, same with the others.

Grumpy-old-man
12-17-2012, 6:20 PM
Thanks very much for all your suggestions!

I have a Springfield XD9 Subcompact

Good choice. Won't need a compact model then, got 'er covered.

On the rifles, I really think you just need to do some soul searching and decide what you really want the rifle to be. I pretty much have what I want (though there's always one more - gawd I WANT a retro AR and a retro G3 clone, like in the movie "The Thing"!) but it took years. If you have the $$ knock yourself out while you still can.

One thought is that "options" like $$ optics can probably wait. A nice iron sighted AR to get you started, lots of mags and ammo now, and pick up an optic later. Or get a medium dollar optic, like the Millet DMS with Burris PEPR mount on mine. But something like an ELCAN will cost more than the rifle, so probably no point right now.

All the best,
Grumpy

dodge
12-17-2012, 6:21 PM
Do this. Then go buy as many AR's, AK's, M1A's, any other "evil" rifle, mags, and ammo as you see fit.

put in an order for laupa 338 & really decent optics. will be my long range rifle. my battle rifle is an sks & am pretty quick a reloading w/stripper clips that i wouldn't be 'that' far behind anyone w/30 rnd magazine. ie i can reload in 10ths of a second.
i'm also lucky that i'm an oregon resident where you can buy & walk out the day your kit is available :cool2:

let's get pro-active while there's still something to 'fight' for

bruss01
12-17-2012, 6:42 PM
I would have to say get an ar in 5.56.

If you don't want one now, trust me, someday you will. And if you find that's not true they're still a great investmet.

I would also put a full-size handgun on the list... maybe an XD service model. And I wouldn't want to be without a 12 gauge shotgun, a mossy 500/590 or Remmy 870.

lilro
12-17-2012, 6:42 PM
Buy whatever you actually want, and if you have money to spare, buy an AR or just an AR lower. If there IS a ban, you will be able to sell it for a large profit about 2 weeks before the ban takes effect. Then you can buy another gun you want, still be in the clear after the 10-day waiting period, and enjoy the arms they "allow" you to have.

jdmcgee
12-17-2012, 10:55 PM
Here's what everyone reading this topic needs to do:

Find out who your House Representative and Senators are.
http://www.house.gov/
http://www.senate.gov/

Write them. Tell them that you expect them to defend your natural rights that are guaranteed to you under the second amendment to the Constitution. Tell them that any vote that impinges upon your rights as a law-abiding citizen will result in your support of a candidate that will fight for your rights. Further, if an attempt to recall said incumbent is made, you will support it fully.

Then, call them. You may get direct office numbers from the links above, or you can call the Congressional switchboard. That number is (202) 224-3121.

Then, use snail mail to put paper in their hands. Again, express to them what your expectations are when it comes to the second amendment, and what the ramifications to their political career are should they fail you.

It's time to make it known in no uncertain terms that we expect them to protect our rights.

YES, YES, YES!!! The more voices that are heard, the harder it is for us to be ignored. Taking the above steps is far more important than rushing out to purchase more firearms due only to a fear of some sort of ban. If every single proponent of the 2A followed the above steps, we would never have to worry about any sort of new ineffective firearm bans or laws.

If you do nothing on a personal level to ensure your freedom, you can never expect to be a free person.

also, educate yourself so you know the percentages etc. (2-4% of all violent crime is carried out w/the illicit black rifle/ar type platform)
also, once carrying was legalized where it wasn't, those areas all saw decreases in crime across the board
http://www.justfacts.com/guncontrol.asp#background

Again, YES, YES, YES!!! The largest majority of people for more "gun control" or any sort of firearm ban only have this position due to sheer ignorance on the matter or even worse, they've been indoctrinated with inaccurate facts, scare tactics or blatant lies about the clear benefits of the right to keep & bear arms. Nothing fights ignorance, hypocrisy & lies better than a factual education. The key to combatting this is educating yourself and then educating everyone else... and I mean literally everyone else.

dodge,Thanks so much for this post, JD

tcrpe
12-17-2012, 10:59 PM
I have a single 9mm handgun. I recently became a gun owner after seeing the devastation after Hurricane Sandy, and seeing the political climate our country is in.

I'm seeing more and more politicians coming out discussing bans, etc.

If you're me - with a single gun, what would you be buying?

Ammo

Sublime_AC
12-17-2012, 11:03 PM
If I were you I'd be getting an 80% lower, or three, going to a build party with a nice lower parts kit and a good quality upper and assembling it in to a rifle. I'd make it Kalifornia compliant, but i'd buy a LOT of magazine rebuild kits and plenty of ammo to go in them.

They are going to make a move on "Assault Rifles" and high capacity magazines. Also if your 9 is capable of high capacity (>10 rounds) I'd purchase a few rebuild kits for it as well. They will be going away soon.

I have more than enough guns, but not enough magazines / ammo... I am working on it.

Antony06
12-18-2012, 3:37 AM
An ounce of gold.

jaxpc
12-18-2012, 10:43 AM
Several AR lowers, a shotgun, reloading tools, ammo components, a full size 9 MM or a 1911 .45, factory ammo and LOTS of mags for everything.

rp55
12-18-2012, 11:02 AM
Here's what everyone reading this topic needs to do:

Find out who your House Representative and Senators are.
http://www.house.gov/
http://www.senate.gov/

Write them. Tell them that you expect them to defend your natural rights that are guaranteed to you under the second amendment to the Constitution. Tell them that any vote that impinges upon your rights as a law-abiding citizen will result in your support of a candidate that will fight for your rights. Further, if an attempt to recall said incumbent is made, you will support it fully.

Let's see:
Congressman - Mike Honda D
Senators - Dianne Feinstein D, Barbara Boxer D

Yeah right. I cannot think of anything else that would be as big a waste of time and postage as writing those three. Sending money to CGF is what everyone reading this topic needs to do.

newbee1111
12-18-2012, 1:33 PM
I just gave $50 to CGF and $50 to SAF. That's what you should be doing right now.

dodge
12-18-2012, 2:46 PM
here's another persons letter to their congressperson & or senators, etc

felt it was worth sharing as it might help others write their own letters
hope this is helpful


" I wanted to post this in all of the forums, but thought the moderators might shoot that down. If they think this noteworthy, they can promulgate it as they see fit for maximum exposure. I just sent my Congressman this letter. I encourage each of you to do the same.

Dear Congress Ribble:

The purpose of this correspondence is to voice my opposition to any further ban on any particular type of weapon or on any high capacity magazine. Any new broad sweeping gun controls based on the current mass hysteria will not stop the carnage. Please excuse my rambling a bit. I'm fully aware that this is a very sensitive and emotional issue because of the tragedy at Sandy Hill School.

I have two daughters and 5 grandchildren. My deepest sympathies go out to all those who lost loved ones by the senseless act of an obviously crazed individual at the Sandy Hill School massacre. I can't even begin to comprehend the grief of those who lost children. Had I been there, I pray to God I would have the courage of those who gave their lives to save others.

I have a concealed carry permit and own many high capacity weapons. If I truly believed that turning in my so called assault weapons would save even one life, I would gladly do so in a heartbeat. But I know, that one single act on my part would have absolutely no effect on carnage such as Sandy Hill.

Guns are not the problem. People are the problem. And to counter that with "yes but these deranged people use guns," is a false and misleading premise. If there were, quite literally, absolutely no guns anywhere in the the world, carnage such as this would still take place, by some other means. Matthew 2:16 "Then Herod slew all the children that were in Bethlehem from two years old and under." Jeremiah 31:15 "Thus saith the LORD; A voice was heard in Ramah, lamentation, and bitter weeping; Rahel weeping for her children refused to be comforted for her children, because they were not."

I'm so tired of the emotionally filled diatribe by most of the national news networks calling for more gun control. And Dianne Feinstein's hysterical diatribe on Piers Morgan's broadcast was just as emotional and without merit. I don't doubt her sincerity, but she's sincerely wrong. Her hysterical diatribe merely fuels the fire for a totally ineffective solution. While legislating against evil is necessary, it does not "stop" evil. Just look at our over crowded prisons.

Deranged perpetrators simply slip through the cracks. How can we possibly know the thoughts and motivations of every single individual? I just heard one psychologist say that such people can appear perfectly "normal." Mass murderers such as the Boston strangler (Albert DeSalvo), TBK (Dennis Radner), the Hillside strangler (Kenneth Bianchi and Angelo Buono), and Ted Bundy, to name but a few, did not use guns to commit their mass murders. Around the world there are hundreds, if not thousands, of serial killers who did not use guns. And what about suicide bombers, Hitlers gas chambers, the Jonestown and Heaven's Gate suicides by poison, and Saddam Hussein's use of poison gas. And this list goes on and on of those who did not use guns to commit horrific acts. Try as we might, we simply can't stop all evil. That's not to say we can't take some measures to curtail it. But in this case, bans are not the answer.

Entire industries have been built around high capacity so called assault weapons and high capacity pistols. Any poorly thought-out legislation will have a huge and drastically negative economic impact, and will not stop the carnage. It will simply take a different form.

A very common handgun is the 8 shot 45 caliber Colt 1911 automatic pistol. It's been readily available for decades. Millions are in circulation. It can be quickly reloaded in the blink of an eye and is capable of the same type of carnage as occurred at Sandy Hill. Would you ban it? What about the high capacity Beretta 92 which is our armed forces current sidearm, and owned by millions of law abiding citizens. Would you ban it? I sincerely hope you can see that none of these bans will work. Where would the banning stop? Banning high capacity assault weapons and magazines would simply cause the use of other type of weapons, to accomplish the same dreadful end. Again, where would the banning end? I don't have the answer to the problem. I simply know that banning will not accomplish what we all want.

In this country millions die each year from cigarettes, alcohol, and abortion. Yet these are all legal activities. We've taken God out of our schools. Our military chaplains can't use the name of Jesus. The unfettered greed of Wall Street has brought us to the fiscal brink. The violence on TV has escalated dreadfully. The war on drugs has failed miserably. We have twelve million illegal immigrants. Gangs run rampant in major cities. And you wonder why we're having so many of these mass tragedies. Our culture has changed, and not in all instances for the better. Our core values have become polluted by liberalism and political correctness. Common sense and individual freedoms are being torn asunder. I will defend unto death, a persons right to hold and express an opposing view. But I don't have to like, condone, or agree with it. In fact, I have an obligation to speak out against it, in a civil manner, when it conflicts with my deeply held convictions.

Just because I own high capacity weapons, what happened at Sandy Hill was not my fault. Those of us "of sound mind" who own high capacity weapons are not the bad guys. Any further gun control will not stop this kind of carnage, all the gun control in the world notwithstanding.

I'm a retired teacher. I spent 8 years in the Marine Corps (Gunnery Sergeant E7) and am a Viet Nam veteran. I used the G.I. bill to go to college. I've served my country, worked all my life, paid my taxes, raised a family, and served on jury duty. Now, after being a responsible citizen who has owned high capacity weapons, including so called assault rifles, for many years, the Sandy Hill tragedy has somehow made it evil for me to own such weapons.

I admit to being a "gun nut". Since my Marine Corps days, I've thoroughly enjoyed all facets of the shooting sport. But my guns also serve a very useful purpose. I live in a very rural area with no local police force. I choose to own high capacity weapons for defensive purposes. And I practice with them on a regular basis. Who's to say I have no need for such weapons? Police have them. Why should I be deprived of them to protect myself and my loved ones just because a crazed individual used one to commit a horrific act? And I'm not just talking about assault weapons. Many, if not most, popular semi-auto pistols have a 15+ magazine capacity. A very popular Glock pistol can accommodate a 32 round magazine. Where do we draw the line? How much capacity is to much? God forbid I should ever have to use any of my weapons for self defense, but in such a scenario, one can not have "to much" capacity. Would you limit me to a six shot revolver for defense when evil perpetrators, who do not follow the law, will still surely have high capacity weapons? And semi auto pistols can be reloaded extremely fast, so any attempt to limit their capacity would be fruitless. Try as one might, further bans are not the answer. It's merely a panacea to calm the mass hysteria in the aftermath of the Sandy Hill tragedy.

I strongly urge you and your colleagues to resist any attempts to implement any new bans on any particular type of weapon or on high capacity magazines as such new bans will serve no purpose other than to further degrade my personal liberties and my ability to defend myself and my loved ones effectively. They will NOT stop or curtail the carnage such as occurred at Sandy Hill, popular opinion and mass hysteria notwithstanding.

Although a response would be nice, I really don't expect one. Surprise me.

Regretfully and respectfully submitted,"


more 'facts' to support our position

fact:there are 40,000 deaths annually due to doctors misdiagnosis. guess it's time to start banning these m.d.s that are failing @ their jobs; probably some 2-4% of the time :)
(sourced)
Misdiagnosis and Wrong Diagnosis by Doctors Cause 40,000 Deaths Each Year
http://honolulu.legalexaminer.com/medical-malpractice/deaths-by-wrong-diagnosis-exceed-40000year.aspx?googleid=268982


thought this might be beneficial
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_violence_in_the_United_States (sourced via wiki)
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/20/Ushomicidesbyweapon.svg/800px-Ushomicidesbyweapon.svg.png

Moonshine
12-18-2012, 3:09 PM
What we should be doing before anything else is donating to CGF and the NRA so they have the war chest they're going to need because as we speak our opponents who have traditionally had less funding and influence lately are now flush with cash and public support.

PhalSe
12-18-2012, 4:05 PM
I just joined SAF with a $150 donation and purchased all of my Christmas gifts through Shop42a.com to provide donations to CGF. That's what I've done. How about you?

stix213
12-18-2012, 5:05 PM
The first thing you should pick up is an NRA membership