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View Full Version : 9/19/2013 CGF Files New Federal Civil Rights Lawsuit to Stop DOJ's DROS Delay Policy


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JDay
02-06-2013, 1:54 PM
Does the letters state the firearm might be stolen or other wise?

Or simple it is delayed.

The letters all say the same thing, and that is one of the possible reasons listed.

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2

metasys
02-06-2013, 2:20 PM
This is what they look like.

http://i1302.photobucket.com/albums/ag124/playxm/DOJ_zps2f76419e.jpg

sl0re10
02-06-2013, 4:58 PM
Picked up today / had no delay

mud99
02-06-2013, 6:24 PM
FWIW I had a CPC 404.6a misdemeanor arrest 10 years ago in San Francisco which was dropped before my first court date.

I have not received any delays, my latest rifle was picked up last weekend. I pick up another next Wed.

JDay
02-06-2013, 11:24 PM
FWIW I had a CPC 404.6a misdemeanor arrest 10 years ago in San Francisco which was dropped before my first court date.

I have not received any delays, my latest rifle was picked up last weekend. I pick up another next Wed.

So, did you incite a riot?

mud99
02-07-2013, 10:11 AM
So, did you incite a riot?

I was protesting with a group of a few hundred people, some of whom decided it would be fun to start vandalizing crap, kicking in car doors.

Police in riot gear swarmed in, contained us to one block, forced us back with clubs, and then they drove us all down to the wharf in buses.

Everyone got charged with that, a court date set for 6 months or so out, had to post a few hundred dollars bail, and then a month later or so we all got a check back from San Francisco for the bail.

HowardW56
02-07-2013, 10:16 AM
I was protesting with a group of a few hundred people, some of whom decided it would be fun to start vandalizing crap, kicking in car doors.

Police in riot gear swarmed in, contained us to one block, forced us back with clubs, and then they drove us all down to the wharf in buses.

Everyone got charged with that, a court date set for 6 months or so out, had to post a few hundred dollars bail, and then a month later or so we all got a check back from San Francisco for the bail.

So they will revoke your LTC for an arrest, where even if there had been a conviction, you wouldn't be disqualified... Interesting....

JDay
02-07-2013, 10:22 AM
So they will revoke your LTC for an arrest, where even if there had been a conviction, you wouldn't be disqualified... Interesting....

That's exactly what they are doing. No deposition, non-disqualifier and they still delay. I have yet to find out why I'm delayed.

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2

EDIT: Noticed you said LTC, we're talking about the DROS.

mud99
02-07-2013, 11:27 AM
So they will revoke your LTC for an arrest, where even if there had been a conviction, you wouldn't be disqualified... Interesting....

No, I have NOT been denied.

I'm just providing this information in case it's useful to figure out the scope of the DROS issue.

RED (Y)
02-07-2013, 1:51 PM
I'm 30 days in delay now,still no luck with finding any details why i'm delayed and when i can get my gun.

mud99
02-07-2013, 1:52 PM
I'm 30 days in delay now,still no luck with finding any details why i'm delayed and when i can get my gun.

Have you ever been arrested for any reason?

metasys
02-07-2013, 2:10 PM
I'm 30 days delayed as well, never been arrested and last purchase was in nov 2012 with no problems. I just talked to DOJ and they still couldnt give me any information but said that they where working on it 7 days a week for whatever thats worth...

RED (Y)
02-07-2013, 2:16 PM
Have you ever been arrested for any reason?
Nope,never been arrested,no parking or traffic tickets,clear and clean record.That's why i can't understand why.

JDay
02-07-2013, 2:38 PM
Nope,never been arrested,no parking or traffic tickets,clear and clean record.That's why i can't understand why.

It would be interesting to know if it's the same person at DOJ delaying people for no apparent reason.

mud99
02-07-2013, 2:57 PM
Nope,never been arrested,no parking or traffic tickets,clear and clean record.That's why i can't understand why.

So no citations of any sort, ever? Even for something minor?

Are you a US citizen, or green card?

JDay
02-07-2013, 3:09 PM
For reference here is the full list of prohibiting convictions and other things that can cause a prohibition. Some of these are only 10 years and others only last while you are under indictment or have a restraining order.

http://oag.ca.gov/sites/all/files/pdfs/firearms/forms/prohibcatmisd.pdf

RED (Y)
02-07-2013, 4:26 PM
So no citations of any sort, ever? Even for something minor?

Are you a US citizen, or green card?
Hmmm,had a red light ticket in SF,4 years ago.Ticket paid,traffic school completed.Never had problems with cops or any court orders.
And i got a Green Card (which allows me to buy a gun),i got even a copy of my GC attached to application.:confused:

It would be interesting to know if it's the same person at DOJ delaying people for no apparent reason.
May be,look very random.Some people are first time buyers like me,some are not, but they are delayed.

sl0re10
02-07-2013, 5:46 PM
It would be interesting to know if it's the same person at DOJ delaying people for no apparent reason.

I wonder if it has anything to do with other people with the same name.

I had no problems (I picked up a rifle yesterday) but my last name is rare. No one else in the country has my same first + last.

gigglemonkee
02-07-2013, 6:22 PM
I wonder if it has anything to do with other people with the same name.

I had no problems (I picked up a rifle yesterday) but my last name is rare. No one else in the country has my same first + last.

I have a very rare name and got delayed for a month.

scsurfer
02-07-2013, 6:35 PM
I had one in delay for a month.I called every day and talk to different people. I would call 10 to 15 times and would get the recording and sometimes someone would pick up. They saw that one had cleared and another one was on delay. I had one guy actual email the person the was doing the one on delay to tell them that i had one cleared .Some told me that they could not acces anything and just to wait. When I purchased another firearm and it went through within the 10 days. So there is hope call just keep calling and it will go through.

JDay
02-07-2013, 8:16 PM
I wonder if it has anything to do with other people with the same name.

There's no reason for that. DOJ has your full name, CADL number, SS#, Address, DOB, description, and picture.

JDay
02-07-2013, 8:18 PM
I had one in delay for a month.I called every day and talk to different people. I would call 10 to 15 times and would get the recording and sometimes someone would pick up. They saw that one had cleared and another one was on delay. I had one guy actual email the person the was doing the one on delay to tell them that i had one cleared .Some told me that they could not acces anything and just to wait. When I purchased another firearm and it went through within the 10 days. So there is hope call just keep calling and it will go through.

When you do get a person to answer they just tell you that there is nothing they can tell you and to call back in a week or two. Things have changed since you got delayed.

mud99
02-07-2013, 10:12 PM
Hmmm,had a red light ticket in SF,4 years ago.Ticket paid,traffic school completed.Never had problems with cops or any court orders.
And i got a Green Card (which allows me to buy a gun),i got even a copy of my GC attached to application.:confused:

May be,look very random.Some people are first time buyers like me,some are not, but they are delayed.

Hmm. I wonder if they are trying to match up green card records or something, or maybe the system needs to find some sort of record of you to be able to clear you. I'm assuming it's a computer doing this, and the whole DROS system is scary broken, so the reason would likely be something stupid. I can't image it is completely random.

Is this your first purchase?

I have a coworker who is in the 10 day wait, he has a green card, but he has bought firearms before, I think he has another 5 days or so, i'll find out what happens with him.

RED (Y)
02-08-2013, 6:26 AM
Hmm. I wonder if they are trying to match up green card records or something, or maybe the system needs to find some sort of record of you to be able to clear you. I'm assuming it's a computer doing this, and the whole DROS system is scary broken, so the reason would likely be something stupid. I can't image it is completely random.

Is this your first purchase?

I have a coworker who is in the 10 day wait, he has a green card, but he has bought firearms before, I think he has another 5 days or so, i'll find out what happens with him.
Can't imagine what might be wrong on that side.I got my GC about 3 years ago,i have car loan,bank accounts,same job for 2 years.Who knows what is going on with this system. And YES this is my first purchase.

sl0re10
02-08-2013, 8:29 AM
There's no reason for that. DOJ has your full name, CADL number, SS#, Address, DOB, description, and picture.

I know but there seems to be no reason for some of the people delayed... so there must be some reason; some reason we don't know yet... and when we do there is a chance it will be a bad / stupid reason that should not have been a reason.

This is government we are talking about.

JoeyJ
02-08-2013, 12:37 PM
39 days and counting...my new holster and laser aren't happy, I'm still trying to be realistic. I've lived in 7 states in my lifetime, had some run ins 40 yrs ago but no convictions or charges were dismissed (soldiers weren't well liked during Viet Nam, lol) and I have a rare name. What frustrates me the most is with this system that I was cleared with on a previous purchase in 2012 but it all has to be done all over again from scratch. Not that I'm surprised just ranting a little. Just a ton of wasted time and money. OK I'm done for this week, lol.

Mikearfifteen83
02-08-2013, 2:37 PM
Well I just got delayed today man I hope I don't have to wait months if it does take months will they have to re do the dros? And can I just get a refund and make the purchase somewhere else if it is a hit and miss thing with the doj

JDay
02-08-2013, 2:46 PM
Well I just got delayed today man I hope I don't have to wait months if it does take months will they have to re do the dros?

The 30 days to pickup starts the day it's released.

And can I just get a refund and make the purchase somewhere else if it is a hit and miss thing with the doj

Once you're flagged you can't buy anything until it's cleared up.

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2

JDay
02-09-2013, 8:25 AM
Well I went down to the shop to get copies of my paperwork and talked to one of the guys there about these delays. He said none of them have been getting released and he has a bunch of pissed off customers who cannot get anything out of DOJ. So it looks like DOJ is not even looking at the delayed DROS'.

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wildhawker
02-09-2013, 10:11 AM
Well I went down to the shop to get copies of my paperwork and talked to one of the guys there about these delays. He said none of them have been getting released and he has a bunch of pissed off customers who cannot get anything out of DOJ. So it looks like DOJ is not even looking at the delayed DROS'.

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2

Please print out the text and links in my OP and get them to that gunshop!

-Brandon

JDay
02-09-2013, 10:20 AM
Please print out the text and links in my OP and get them to that gunshop!

-Brandon

I don't have a printer. You can always contact them if you wish, it is Just Guns in Sacramento.

http://justgunsstore.com/
3530 Auburn Blvd
Sacramento, CA 95821
(916) 486-4867

mr big bear
02-09-2013, 10:37 AM
hello. this just happened to my wife. she owns several other fire arms and just got denied by doj for a measly lil 10-22. no arrests, no tickets, nothing! baffled!:facepalm:

JDay
02-09-2013, 11:43 AM
hello. this just happened to my wife. she owns several other fire arms and just got denied by doj for a measly lil 10-22. no arrests, no tickets, nothing! baffled!:facepalm:

Denied or delayed? There is a difference.

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HowardW56
02-09-2013, 11:46 AM
hello. this just happened to my wife. she owns several other fire arms and just got denied by doj for a measly lil 10-22. no arrests, no tickets, nothing! baffled!:facepalm:

Has she dompleted this form? http://www.calgunsfoundation.org/get-help/report-ca-doj.html

wildhawker
02-09-2013, 11:49 AM
Perhaps some other Calgunner could make this happen. I can't really chase issues right now.

-Brandon

I don't have a printer. You can always contact them if you wish, it is Just Guns in Sacramento.

http://justgunsstore.com/
3530 Auburn Blvd
Sacramento, CA 95821
(916) 486-4867

ROAD_DOG
02-09-2013, 3:50 PM
Well today I picked up my Glock 30 without any problems and this my first purchase, sucks and doesnt seem fair that while others are picking up firearms others are being delayed but I wish the best to everyone waiting to pick up thier firearms

Mikearfifteen83
02-11-2013, 8:17 AM
So can an old dead unregistered car sitting in my backyard cause a delay since doj works with DMV? Haven't paid for that registration since it died 2 years ago wonder if that can cause a delay? Oh and my drivers license is good not suspended if that helps.

ROAD_DOG
02-11-2013, 8:26 AM
So can an old dead unregistered car sitting in my backyard cause a delay since doj works with DMV? Haven't paid for that registration since it died 2 years ago wonder if that can cause a delay? Oh and my drivers license is good not suspended if that helps.

unless it was on non-op they probably won't make a big deal out of it but i don't so as far as im aware of they check to see if you got DUI, suspended license

JDay
02-11-2013, 8:37 AM
So can an old dead unregistered car sitting in my backyard cause a delay since doj works with DMV? Haven't paid for that registration since it died 2 years ago wonder if that can cause a delay? Oh and my drivers license is good not suspended if that helps.

I think it's only a problem if your license is suspended and you don't have a valid I'D.

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JDay
02-11-2013, 8:38 AM
I think they only check with DMV to see if your license is suspended and you don't have a valid I'D.

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2



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RED (Y)
02-11-2013, 9:01 AM
Called my gun dealer today,he said i'm not alone on this problem.He got about 10 customer with exact same issue and even dealer can't reach DOJ,he left couple of VM and never heard back from them.

JDay
02-11-2013, 10:23 AM
Called my gun dealer today,he said i'm not alone on this problem.He got about 10 customer with exact same issue and even dealer can't reach DOJ,he left couple of VM and never heard back from them.

That's because DOJ is refusing to give any answers and likely aren't even looking at delayed DROS'.

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Carlsbad rookie
02-11-2013, 10:48 AM
I'll add my name to the list of others that just received their DELAY Letter. I've never been in trouble and have no legal issues so not sure why there is a delay. Was very disappointed and was told to call the number on the letter, however after reading hundreds of posts about calling it seems they cant tell you anything over the phone anyway so I dont really see the point in calling. Im new to this but sucks that they make is so difficult. Since the gun shop didnt call me to tell me i was delayed and I drove down there for nothing im sure they wont tell me when im apoproved either so should i just keep calling the gun shop every few days asking them if they received the letter yet???

JDay
02-11-2013, 10:58 AM
I'll add my name to the list of others that just received their DELAY Letter. I've never been in trouble and have no legal issues so not sure why there is a delay. Was very disappointed and was told to call the number on the letter, however after reading hundreds of posts about calling it seems they cant tell you anything over the phone anyway so I dont really see the point in calling. Im new to this but sucks that they make is so difficult. Since the gun shop didnt call me to tell me i was delayed and I drove down there for nothing im sure they wont tell me when im apoproved either so should i just keep calling the gun shop every few days asking them if they received the letter yet???

It's not that they can't, it's that they are refusing to.

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2

Carlsbad rookie
02-11-2013, 11:15 AM
Well that sucks.... this seems like an issue that the NRA should be involved in. AS this was my first firearm purchase I thought i did everything necessary and waited my 10 days, if I had known ahead of time that it could potential take months to clear I wouldnt have even bought a gun. This is definitely a serious issue that the NRA should be very actively trying to resolve. Just my thoughts. Sucks so many others are also going through the same thing expecially when they have been good lawabiding citizens.

JDay
02-11-2013, 12:58 PM
Well that sucks.... this seems like an issue that the NRA should be involved in. AS this was my first firearm purchase I thought i did everything necessary and waited my 10 days, if I had known ahead of time that it could potential take months to clear I wouldnt have even bought a gun. This is definitely a serious issue that the NRA should be very actively trying to resolve. Just my thoughts. Sucks so many others are also going through the same thing expecially when they have been good lawabiding citizens.

The NRA only cares about national issues. There is a link in the first post that you should report your delay at.

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2

HowardW56
02-11-2013, 1:09 PM
Well that sucks.... this seems like an issue that the NRA should be involved in. AS this was my first firearm purchase I thought i did everything necessary and waited my 10 days, if I had known ahead of time that it could potential take months to clear I wouldnt have even bought a gun. This is definitely a serious issue that the NRA should be very actively trying to resolve. Just my thoughts. Sucks so many others are also going through the same thing expecially when they have been good lawabiding citizens.

REPORT HERE (http://calgunsfoundation.org/get-help/report-ca-doj.html)

JDay
02-11-2013, 3:28 PM
Well I've been delayed for 17 days now and still no word from the DOJ.

metasys
02-11-2013, 3:36 PM
been waiting 42 days here, I spoke with them on the phone again today, nothing new...

"Its either an arrest in your past, dmv issue, or you have a common name"

I told the lady its none of the above, that I have a recent purchase that went through ok without delay and that I even have a CCW, she told me that just means I was ok at that time and that it has probably changed because they wouldnt delay me for no reason.

I asked how this could be legal to not allow me to purchase a firearm without a reason, she said there was a reason they just cant tell me what it is....


*#@$&^@%#$

morrierudy
02-11-2013, 3:59 PM
I’ll get my first hand gun tomorrow 2/12/13 after 1:00 pm. No issues that I know of, so wait and see. Purchased a Shotgun 3 years ago with no issues.

Today 2/12/13, 10 days after purchasing my 9mm, I got it "No issues".

JDay
02-11-2013, 5:26 PM
been waiting 42 days here, I spoke with them on the phone again today, nothing new...

"Its either an arrest in your past, dmv issue, or you have a common name"

I told the lady its none of the above, that I have a recent purchase that went through ok without delay and that I even have a CCW, she told me that just means I was ok at that time and that it has probably changed because they wouldnt delay me for no reason.

I asked how this could be legal to not allow me to purchase a firearm without a reason, she said there was a reason they just cant tell me what it is....


*#@$&^@%#$

Sounds like Obamacare.

wildhawker
02-11-2013, 10:06 PM
Please make sure you reported your matter at http://calgunsfoundation.org/doj.

-Brandon

been waiting 42 days here, I spoke with them on the phone again today, nothing new...

"Its either an arrest in your past, dmv issue, or you have a common name"

I told the lady its none of the above, that I have a recent purchase that went through ok without delay and that I even have a CCW, she told me that just means I was ok at that time and that it has probably changed because they wouldnt delay me for no reason.

I asked how this could be legal to not allow me to purchase a firearm without a reason, she said there was a reason they just cant tell me what it is....


*#@$&^@%#$

JDay
02-11-2013, 10:38 PM
Please make sure you reported your matter at http://calgunsfoundation.org/doj.

-Brandon

Just out of curiosity, how many delays have been reported so far?

Mikearfifteen83
02-11-2013, 11:16 PM
+1 I would like to know as well

mrrabbit
02-11-2013, 11:55 PM
I've been sitting here thinking about reasons outside of normal that would cause these delays:

1. Identity theft by illegal aliens causing them to spend inordinate amounts of time trying to determine who the real person is - and who isn't - and then creating a distinction between the illegal AND yourself that works - just as our public schools constantly have to do.

(Are any of you who are experiencing delays "mandatory reporters" as defined under the penal code? Cause if an illegal alien has entered into the LiveScan database in order to hold a job considered under those requirements and stole an ID - that'll muck up the criminal background check system big time. Instead of one person key in the database, and multiple location keys - it would represent an attempt to have two person keys and multiple location keys - instantly creating a flag! Since the current political effort is to protect the illegal alien - you get screwed while they try to create a distinction between you and the illegal alien that let's the system work as designed.)

If you don't understand what I mean by keys, a database administrator here on Calguns can explain in detail.

2. An employee with an agenda is currently under disciplinary action with union protection. In other words, while their case in being reviewed administratively - they must be allowed to work and must be allowed to handle their normal case load. This may be why you can have two purchases in the queue - going through separate processors - and have one telling the other after a phone call to go ahead and clear.

3. DHS is sticking their nose into DOJ's / AGO's business and imposing the "no fly" list as a basis for delay or denial. Is anyone here on the "no fly" list or regulary harassed by DHS at airports?

4. The entire staff has filed a grievance for overload work wise - and is currently being addressed privately.

I think everyone here should try to think really hard about anything odd or unusual that has occurred the past 10 years outside arrests, convictions, etc...even it you don't think it matter...consider it.

I bet when everyone here trades 'em, a pattern will emerge.

=8-)

JDay
02-12-2013, 8:30 AM
I seriously doubt it has anything to do with my background check, I held a security clearance until late last year when I let it lapse. Most likely there's a few people at DOJ who are tossing every DROS they come by into the delayed pile. That would explain why some people have no problems picking up a firearm but get delayed on their next purchase.

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2

Eddy's Shooting Sports
02-12-2013, 10:29 AM
I'm still sitting on two delays. One is over a month old!

I got an interesting call from DOJ yesterday morning. She was calling to verify if my customer, a non-immigrant alien, had a hunting license. I'm thinking to myself, she shouldn't give two ****s since that is a fed requirement. Regardless, I informed her that he presented me with a non-resident Virginia hunting license. She thanked me and that was the end of the call.

I had never received a call like this before and I had a few regulars that must present a hunting license.

By the way, for the FFL's reading this, if you have a non-immigrant alien customer that wants to buy a gun, the hunting license can be from any state. There are several states that issue non-resident licenses on the web with no requirement to take a class.

Cheers!


Greg David
Eddy's Shooting Sports
400 Moffett Blvd.,Suite F
Mountain View, CA 94043
(660)969-GUNS

T-F 12-7 W 12-9 Sat 11-5
Closed Sun/Mon

cuat_420
02-12-2013, 10:42 AM
I've been sitting here thinking about reasons outside of normal that would cause these delays:

1. Identity theft by illegal aliens causing them to spend inordinate amounts of time trying to determine who the real person is - and who isn't - and then creating a distinction between the illegal AND yourself that works - just as our public schools constantly have to do.

(Are any of you who are experiencing delays "mandatory reporters" as defined under the penal code? Cause if an illegal alien has entered into the LiveScan database in order to hold a job considered under those requirements and stole an ID - that'll muck up the criminal background check system big time. Instead of one person key in the database, and multiple location keys - it would represent an attempt to have two person keys and multiple location keys - instantly creating a flag! Since the current political effort is to protect the illegal alien - you get screwed while they try to create a distinction between you and the illegal alien that let's the system work as designed.)

If you don't understand what I mean by keys, a database administrator here on Calguns can explain in detail.

2. An employee with an agenda is currently under disciplinary action with union protection. In other words, while their case in being reviewed administratively - they must be allowed to work and must be allowed to handle their normal case load. This may be why you can have two purchases in the queue - going through separate processors - and have one telling the other after a phone call to go ahead and clear.

3. DHS is sticking their nose into DOJ's / AGO's business and imposing the "no fly" list as a basis for delay or denial. Is anyone here on the "no fly" list or regulary harassed by DHS at airports?

4. The entire staff has filed a grievance for overload work wise - and is currently being addressed privately.

I think everyone here should try to think really hard about anything odd or unusual that has occurred the past 10 years outside arrests, convictions, etc...even it you don't think it matter...consider it.

I bet when everyone here trades 'em, a pattern will emerge.

=8-)

Ten years is not the cutoff. I was told on Dec 12th when I was delayed that it was for an arrest in TN in 1995 that had no disposition. They have had the certified disposition paperwork in their custody since Dec 17th, yet I still do not have my gun.

Carlsbad rookie
02-12-2013, 11:08 AM
Mine has been only 17 days so far, i guess i should feel lucky after reading everyone else's waits are much much longer. Still waiting and I got no answers when I called DOJ. So this is the first gun purchase, do i jsut wait forever or call the gun shop or what? I dont want to wait for 6 months and all the while nothing was even happening and needed my action. Does it help to keep calling the DOJ, it seems like it doesnt help at all after reading all these posts.

JoeyJ
02-12-2013, 11:14 AM
day 43 and counting, not a blip on my record in over 30 years and nothing delayed my last check in July 2012, it took 8 days on that one. Been calling all morning but no human yet. Previous calls resulted in "call back after the 14th or the 12th or the 11th". Pretty piss poor that they can't even make some kind of statement on their website to inform we, their bosses! Seems like some media contacts need to be involved to more publicize this "unusual" situation.

JDay
02-12-2013, 11:36 AM
Mine has been only 17 days so far, i guess i should feel lucky after reading everyone else's waits are much much longer. Still waiting and I got no answers when I called DOJ. So this is the first gun purchase, do i jsut wait forever or call the gun shop or what? I dont want to wait for 6 months and all the while nothing was even happening and needed my action. Does it help to keep calling the DOJ, it seems like it doesnt help at all after reading all these posts.

Don't call the gun shop, you'll just annoy them and there is nothing they can do. I'd just keep calling DOJ at least once a week until they give you answers.

day 43 and counting, not a blip on my record in over 30 years and nothing delayed my last check in July 2012, it took 8 days on that one. Been calling all morning but no human yet. Previous calls resulted in "call back after the 14th or the 12th or the 11th". Pretty piss poor that they can't even make some kind of statement on their website to inform we, their bosses! Seems like some media contacts need to be involved to more publicize this "unusual" situation.

Have you reported your delay to the Calguns Foundation?

http://calgunsfoundation.org/doj

JoeyJ
02-12-2013, 1:42 PM
Have you reported your delay to the Calguns Foundation?

http://calgunsfoundation.org/doj

I have thank you!

flip4292
02-12-2013, 10:26 PM
Ive have been delayed since Dec. 19,2012. I got delayed because I got arrested back in 2006 but I was never convicted. My charges were never filed. The DOJ is requesting a disposition from the county I got arrested. The part Im confused about is that since my charges were never filed and I never got a trial how would there be a disposition and will I still be able to get my firearm?

Carlsbad rookie
02-13-2013, 8:20 AM
My delay letter says to call 916--227-3752 however i have called it about 30 times a day for a week and every time i call i get a recording that says the mailbox is full. Does anyne know of another number to call instead. I am getting nowhere fast, lol.

metasys
02-13-2013, 8:40 AM
You have to just keep calling that number, they will pickup eventually.

Carlsbad rookie
02-13-2013, 8:57 AM
ok thanks!! i appreciate the feedback. i'll keep at it.

cuat_420
02-13-2013, 9:46 AM
Can someone who has gotten the info from PlayHard please pass that info on by posting it in here? If there is a reason it is not posted, could you PLEASE send me a PM with the info? Thanks!!!

JoeyJ
02-13-2013, 10:10 AM
day 43 and counting, not a blip on my record in over 30 years and nothing delayed my last check in July 2012, it took 8 days on that one. Been calling all morning but no human yet. Previous calls resulted in "call back after the 14th or the 12th or the 11th". Pretty piss poor that they can't even make some kind of statement on their website to inform we, their bosses! Seems like some media contacts need to be involved to more publicize this "unusual" situation.

OK so I'm actually on hold after speaking briefly with someone. So far I've been told that they can only see that I'm still on delay, no reason why other than "we're probably waiting on some documentation and we're at the mercy of that jurisdiction". OK so after the hold I was able to get some interesting general information. Based on what I've read on the forum, there have been some issues going back to March of last year. I was told that as of Feb 2012 DOJ is required to confirm ALL arrest whether charges were filed or not! Can you imagine what that means? Any of my run ins will not be in computer format but rather microfiche or hard copies stored in some state warehouse, if I'm lucky. This still doesn't answer why I cleared in 8 days under the current requirements but am at 44 days on this one OTHER than the 120K BGC they received in Dec alone. They seem as frustrated with their inability to use previous BGCs as a "from this point forward" checks as I am. Typical political decision without any regard to the repercussions of a new process. They did say that they are working on a website response to better inform us but that the attorneys are working on it and have not cleared it yet. They are also under additional pressure to insure that they don't make any mistakes on BGCs, all of which is completely understandable but show little forward thinking. "Gee what would happen if we had a run on gun sales????" "How would this affect our ability to best serve our citizens?" I just can't wait for government health care, lol. BTW I called 916-227-3752 on speed dial until I finally got an answer.

RED (Y)
02-13-2013, 11:07 AM
Can someone who has gotten the info from PlayHard please pass that info on by posting it in here? If there is a reason it is not posted, could you PLEASE send me a PM with the info? Thanks!!!

I tried his suggestion but they send me back to DOJ hot line #. It's up to him if he want to publish it.I guess you can PM him directly

mrrabbit
02-13-2013, 11:17 AM
1. Jurisdiction. CA AG and DOJ is the jurisdiction. Counties are agents for the state carrying out administrative functions for the state. So their jurisdiction does not trump state.

So the jurisdiction interference is coming from Federal.

2. Arrests can be used as a basis for further investigation - a delay - but not denial.

The above plus the extra care and waiting on attorney (obviously for wording) on a website response raises the following possibilities:

1. People who had arrests - but not convictions - weren't getting flagged for follow-up questioning when purchasing firewarms. AG is in panic mode over this because this is what can allow someone like Adam Lanza to fall through the cracks...mental cases get arrested all the time - but not convicted - largely due to the intervention of social case workers.

Sandy Hook, Aurora and the Congresswoman shooting anyone?


2. Kamala Harris is doing the FedGov's bidding to use administrative tactics as a means to slow down gun sales. "Extra scrutiny" is the excuse that covers this...

3. During the conversion to digital formats over the last 2 decades - part of city, county and state conversion operations included taking all previously stored papers and microfiches and making digital copies. It has been a very very costly operation. The CBG system has fallen behind in this regard - so they are relying on your requests as a means to identify which old documents are active and need immediate conversion. I can see this taking weeks. Several days to find...several days to verify, a day to copy if paper, several days if microfiche, and then modified OCR conversion to the current digital system plus subsequent data entry for summarizing the document. In other words, you may be waiting for them to do a job that was supposed to have been done already - that you have already paid for with your taxes.

What's scary about his one is that i means that the criminal background check system as it is digitally operated is behind records-wise...not up to date as it is supposed to be. It is only up to date on live real-time digital submissions for the past decade or so...

So that brings up the question:

Most of you folks experiencing long term delays - how old are you?

Under 40?
Over 40?


Just throwing out theories...that's all...

=8-)

gigglemonkee
02-13-2013, 11:31 AM
i got off mine after 30 days on delay. 38 day wait total. No arrests, uncommon name, multiple purchases all fine and no explanation.

JDay
02-13-2013, 1:05 PM
OK so I'm actually on hold after speaking briefly with someone. So far I've been told that they can only see that I'm still on delay, no reason why other than "we're probably waiting on some documentation and we're at the mercy of that jurisdiction". OK so after the hold I was able to get some interesting general information. Based on what I've read on the forum, there have been some issues going back to March of last year. I was told that as of Feb 2012 DOJ is required to confirm ALL arrest whether charges were filed or not! Can you imagine what that means? Any of my run ins will not be in computer format but rather microfiche or hard copies stored in some state warehouse, if I'm lucky. This still doesn't answer why I cleared in 8 days under the current requirements but am at 44 days on this one OTHER than the 120K BGC they received in Dec alone. They seem as frustrated with their inability to use previous BGCs as a "from this point forward" checks as I am. Typical political decision without any regard to the repercussions of a new process. They did say that they are working on a website response to better inform us but that the attorneys are working on it and have not cleared it yet. They are also under additional pressure to insure that they don't make any mistakes on BGCs, all of which is completely understandable but show little forward thinking. "Gee what would happen if we had a run on gun sales????" "How would this affect our ability to best serve our citizens?" I just can't wait for government health care, lol. BTW I called 916-227-3752 on speed dial until I finally got an answer.

Did you ever find anything else out or did you get disconnected while on hold?

Carlsbad rookie
02-13-2013, 2:36 PM
cant figure out why if so many people just in this one forum alone are experiencing so many long delays i can only imagine the thousands of others that also are in the same situation. I have now collected 3 different numbers to DOJ and have called them all 20 times a day for the last few days and havent gotten one person. I was able to leave a VM a few days ago but who knows if they'll ever call back and what happens if I miss their call will i have to start over again. What a hassle! Is their some organization for gun owners to utilize to help administer our rights to purchase firearms??? Do we have any kind of recourse or do we just have to sit here like fools and wait until whenver they may happen to do something with app. Is there an office that you can go to to do this in person? Hard to imagine this is what all gun owners have to go through. For a first gun purchase this is a terrible experience.

JoeyJ
02-13-2013, 2:36 PM
1. Jurisdiction. CA AG and DOJ is the jurisdiction. Counties are agents for the state carrying out administrative functions for the state. So their jurisdiction does not trump state.

So the jurisdiction interference is coming from Federal.

2. Arrests can be used as a basis for further investigation - a delay - but not denial.

The above plus the extra care and waiting on attorney (obviously for wording) on a website response raises the following possibilities:

1. People who had arrests - but not convictions - weren't getting flagged for follow-up questioning when purchasing firewarms. AG is in panic mode over this because this is what can allow someone like Adam Lanza to fall through the cracks...mental cases get arrested all the time - but not convicted - largely due to the intervention of social case workers.

Sandy Hook, Aurora and the Congresswoman shooting anyone?


2. Kamala Harris is doing the FedGov's bidding to use administrative tactics as a means to slow down gun sales. "Extra scrutiny" is the excuse that covers this...

3. During the conversion to digital formats over the last 2 decades - part of city, county and state conversion operations included taking all previously stored papers and microfiches and making digital copies. It has been a very very costly operation. The CBG system has fallen behind in this regard - so they are relying on your requests as a means to identify which old documents are active and need immediate conversion. I can see this taking weeks. Several days to find...several days to verify, a day to copy if paper, several days if microfiche, and then modified OCR conversion to the current digital system plus subsequent data entry for summarizing the document. In other words, you may be waiting for them to do a job that was supposed to have been done already - that you have already paid for with your taxes.

What's scary about his one is that i means that the criminal background check system as it is digitally operated is behind records-wise...not up to date as it is supposed to be. It is only up to date on live real-time digital submissions for the past decade or so...

So that brings up the question:

Most of you folks experiencing long term delays - how old are you?

Under 40?
Over 40?


Just throwing out theories...that's all...

=8-)

In my case 58 years old this month so I couldn't agree more with your points. All the more reason to fight any further checks as this system is clearly flawed at multiple levels. Now add the fact that I have lived/stationed in 7 states and multiple counties and the few blips are 35 plus yrs old. Obviously, it could be argued that this current system discriminates or does not serve those of us that are pre-digital (I prefer this over OLD) and is just one more example of government to the rescue. I'll say it again, this needs some public exposure by anyone who has some good solid media contacts.

prometa
02-13-2013, 2:37 PM
Just throwing out theories...that's all...

=8-)

My theory is much simpler: too many DROS requests, not enough trained employees.

They are taking the most recent requests off the pile when they come in. If they get to yours before 10 days, they respond within 10 days. If they don't, you go in a huge heap of delayed DROS, and you sit there until gun sales go down far enough that the DOJ employees can start clearing the backlog.

Why they aren't starting with the oldest DROSes and working forward, I don't know. Maybe they want as many as possible to finish within 10 days rather than let every single one take 19.

mud99
02-13-2013, 2:39 PM
So when does this turn into a lawsuit?

metasys
02-13-2013, 2:41 PM
Is there an office that you can go to to do this in person?.

I was told that there is no public counter by the lady who spoke with me

metasys
02-13-2013, 2:43 PM
Is their some organization for gun owners to utilize to help administer our rights to purchase firearms???.

Calguns Foundation is working on it, make sure you fill out this form http://calgunsfoundation.org/get-help/report-ca-doj.html

JDay
02-13-2013, 2:47 PM
Why they aren't starting with the oldest DROSes and working forward, I don't know. Maybe they want as many as possible to finish within 10 days rather than let every single one take 19.

That's what I want to know. Afaik nobody even looks at your DROS unless it is flagged by the system. So all of these delayed DROS' should be handled in order.

Carlsbad rookie
02-13-2013, 2:50 PM
I was told that there is no public counter by the lady who spoke with me

Thanks for the info!

mrrabbit
02-13-2013, 4:15 PM
My theory is much simpler: too many DROS requests, not enough trained employees.

They are taking the most recent requests off the pile when they come in. If they get to yours before 10 days, they respond within 10 days. If they don't, you go in a huge heap of delayed DROS, and you sit there until gun sales go down far enough that the DOJ employees can start clearing the backlog.

Why they aren't starting with the oldest DROSes and working forward, I don't know. Maybe they want as many as possible to finish within 10 days rather than let every single one take 19.

Not if the requests are or for older people whom records still exist on a piece by piece basis in paper/microfiche form.

Example:

Let's say you are a background check processor for AG/DOJ. Normally, your caseload as one employee is 50 cases per day.

Let's say that on a given day, 49 are for relatively younger folks where pretty much each document has already been digitized - or was digitized the moment it was created.

Let's say that on that same given day, 1 is for an older person where one or two pieces of documentation got missed over the last 2 decades during the expensive conversion stuff that has been going on.

So average day = 49 easy and straightforward - 1 not so.

Result: 49 done - 1 you call state archive on - request coversion - 1 delay.


Now...all of a sudden...everyone is on a panic buy...including a lot more older folks who are worried, see the obvious...and aren't going to sit idle unarmed anymore.

You go to work, see 50 jobs in the queue---but discover, "HOLY CRAP!!! 29 easy - and 21 requiring and archive search and conversion - and possibly request for papers from another state or federal gov't.

So you get 21 easy, done, 1 delayed one done, and 28 left on a pile at the end of your shift.

You walk in the next day, and literally crap in your pants. 30 easy, 20 more requiring archive search or out-of-state requests.

So you get 30 easy done, 1 delayed one done, 19 more added to pile of 28 from yesterday. And each day, it gets worse.


The real problem:

Where's the budget for numerous new hires to take on the sudden rush of folks who are older and whose documents haven't been completed converted over?

Supposedly, the fees we already pay are supposed to cover it - but have those funds been release to AG/DOJ?

I bet not...


Once again, this is a theory.


It would be nice to know how many are experiencing this are:

Over 40
Under 40


=8-)

metasys
02-13-2013, 6:17 PM
30 here

Mikearfifteen83
02-13-2013, 6:43 PM
30 in two months

PlayHard
02-13-2013, 6:48 PM
As far as I can tell, I am one of a handful that have gotten off delay (at least in this forum). I got handshakes and congrats from employees of the gun shop when I picked up my firearms . . . no other customer from their shop had gotten an approval, after a delay. Since, I have put (4) others in DROS, due for pickup on Monday (so, we'll see) . . . but since I was recently approved, a new background check shouldn't be necessary.

A couple of things:

I didn't post all the phone numbers I called because they were for other departments, that I knew had a hand in getting information updated with the DOJ . . . I knew why I was delayed. I had been working with someone at the DOJ before the frenzy. Week after week, my info had not been updated. Then panic buying happened and my file got tossed to the side. I was able to get ahold of someone, every so often, but I always got the same response. I found out why . . . If you get on delay, they are tossing the file to the side to handle straight forward DROS's. If your delay goes passed 20 days (the 10 + 20) then a new background check has to be run and they've been told to table those ones, for later review.

I've replied to all those who have asked for the phone numbers.

If it weren't for my attorney getting the local courts to directly contact the DOJ or my persistence with emails, calls and getting my info in front of a bunch of noses, I would probably still be on delay. I now have certified copies of my "clean" record, if this ever happens again.

If you don't know why you are on delay, you can find out with a live scan, then refute the errors . . . all I can say is the process is available to everyone . . . If you DO know why you're on delay, get what you need fixed and get those "certified" records to the Records and Review Dept, with a note of pending DROS. If you DON'T know why, request your RAP sheet, as this is the info the DROS Dept uses to deny, delay or approve.

I hope this helps.

RED (Y)
02-14-2013, 8:59 AM
It would be nice to know how many are experiencing this are:

Over 40
Under 40

25

As far as I can tell, I am one of a handful that have gotten off delay (at least in this forum).
I didn't post all the phone numbers I called because they were for other departments, that I knew had a hand in getting information updated with the DOJ . . .

I hope this helps.
As i said-i tried your way and was told that they don't have any reasons why i can be delayed and i need to keep calling DOJ

tcrpe
02-14-2013, 9:57 AM
Riddle me this:

Say you are denied on a DROS. Does that make you a prohibited person? :shrug:

JDay
02-14-2013, 10:26 AM
Riddle me this:

Say you are denied on a DROS. Does that make you a prohibited person? :shrug:

Depends on the reason. You can be denied for back child support but you won't be prohibited.

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2

tcrpe
02-14-2013, 10:37 AM
Depends on the reason. You can be denied for back child support but you won't be prohibited.

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2

Thanks, that makes sense.

I guess some guys should be sending money to their kids instead of buying guns.

I also sense here, though, a deliberate bureaucratic effort to slow down gun sales.

RED (Y)
02-14-2013, 10:49 AM
Calling (916) 227-3749 today-it's busy tone now or no answer and no VM.Is it a good sign?They are answering the phone again may be?

Mikearfifteen83
02-14-2013, 1:40 PM
So I just got my glock 27 out of jail today have some juvenile past no adult record original pick up was on 2/8/13 got delayed till today so wait was about 6 extra days on top of the 10 good luck to everyone on here hope you all get your guns soon

Carlsbad rookie
02-14-2013, 2:16 PM
As far as I can tell, I am one of a handful that have gotten off delay (at least in this forum). I got handshakes and congrats from employees of the gun shop when I picked up my firearms . . . no other customer from their shop had gotten an approval, after a delay. Since, I have put (4) others in DROS, due for pickup on Monday (so, we'll see) . . . but since I was recently approved, a new background check shouldn't be necessary.

A couple of things:

I didn't post all the phone numbers I called because they were for other departments, that I knew had a hand in getting information updated with the DOJ . . . I knew why I was delayed. I had been working with someone at the DOJ before the frenzy. Week after week, my info had not been updated. Then panic buying happened and my file got tossed to the side. I was able to get ahold of someone, every so often, but I always got the same response. I found out why . . . If you get on delay, they are tossing the file to the side to handle straight forward DROS's. If your delay goes passed 20 days (the 10 + 20) then a new background check has to be run and they've been told to table those ones, for later review.

I've replied to all those who have asked for the phone numbers.

If it weren't for my attorney getting the local courts to directly contact the DOJ or my persistence with emails, calls and getting my info in front of a bunch of noses, I would probably still be on delay. I now have certified copies of my "clean" record, if this ever happens again.

If you don't know why you are on delay, you can find out with a live scan, then refute the errors . . . all I can say is the process is available to everyone . . . If you DO know why you're on delay, get what you need fixed and get those "certified" records to the Records and Review Dept, with a note of pending DROS. If you DON'T know why, request your RAP sheet, as this is the info the DROS Dept uses to deny, delay or approve.

I hope this helps.

Calling (916) 227-3749 today-it's busy tone now or no answer and no VM.Is it a good sign?They are answering the phone again may be?



This was a good number "3749" it was one of the numbers i had been calling every hour this week. Someone finally answered, they were very personable and explained to me that they do not have any information for me at this time except to tell me that if you receive a delay then it will most likely be 2-3 months backlogged because they are so busy. Not really the answer i was looking for but at least i was able to talk to a person and i'll jsut be wait'in it out. good luck to everyone who's also waiting for theres!

cuat_420
02-14-2013, 2:48 PM
As far as I can tell, I am one of a handful that have gotten off delay (at least in this forum). I got handshakes and congrats from employees of the gun shop when I picked up my firearms . . . no other customer from their shop had gotten an approval, after a delay. Since, I have put (4) others in DROS, due for pickup on Monday (so, we'll see) . . . but since I was recently approved, a new background check shouldn't be necessary.

A couple of things:

I didn't post all the phone numbers I called because they were for other departments, that I knew had a hand in getting information updated with the DOJ . . . I knew why I was delayed. I had been working with someone at the DOJ before the frenzy. Week after week, my info had not been updated. Then panic buying happened and my file got tossed to the side. I was able to get ahold of someone, every so often, but I always got the same response. I found out why . . . If you get on delay, they are tossing the file to the side to handle straight forward DROS's. If your delay goes passed 20 days (the 10 + 20) then a new background check has to be run and they've been told to table those ones, for later review.

I've replied to all those who have asked for the phone numbers.

If it weren't for my attorney getting the local courts to directly contact the DOJ or my persistence with emails, calls and getting my info in front of a bunch of noses, I would probably still be on delay. I now have certified copies of my "clean" record, if this ever happens again.

If you don't know why you are on delay, you can find out with a live scan, then refute the errors . . . all I can say is the process is available to everyone . . . If you DO know why you're on delay, get what you need fixed and get those "certified" records to the Records and Review Dept, with a note of pending DROS. If you DON'T know why, request your RAP sheet, as this is the info the DROS Dept uses to deny, delay or approve.

I hope this helps.


Got through to one of the numbers provided by PlayHard yesterday and left a message. Today they returned my call. I explained my situation, and they were very helpful. Ran my DL number, confirmed I was delayed and who had it. He then tried to find the person with my file. She was not in today, but will return tomorrow and he is leaving a message for her to call me. I asked what the odds were she would call, he said that he expected she would call, but could make no guarantees. He said if I didn't hear from her tomorrow, to call him back on Tuesday (Monday is a holiday) and he would try again. I will let you guys know how this goes, but it is closer than I have been since I was delayed on December 12th. Keep in mind, I do know exactly what caused my delay, and I have had the courts provide the required documents to their fax number, attention to the person handling my case. If you do not have this info, and you are not sure it has already been provided, I don't know how far you will get. I am hoping she calls tomorrow and I can get her to pull my file and verify it...same as PlayHard did. I will post any updates.

mrrabbit
02-14-2013, 4:26 PM
...with all the 30s and a 25, not likely an age thing then...

Oh well...

...but there's still that money issue for for delays without cause other than backlogs...

=8-)

clbshooter
02-14-2013, 4:41 PM
OK Ladies and Gentlemen here we go, If you have followed this from the beginning you will see that I was delayed after I bought a 10-22 on black friday but finallay OK'ed on 1-18:13 to pick up. This was my 5th gun I bought in the last 3 years so WTF but I degress. I have been away for the last few weeks but as I said I am going to TEST the system again. I called my FFL today which is Turner's in San Diego and asked if they would give me the Moss. .20 guage Persuader on sale last week and guess what they said YES. I have worked with many FFL's from the east coast to the west coast and I have to say that Beto and his crew in San Diego is the best. I will keep you informed if I am delayed again or not. I can tell you that this is the last gun I will buy in Ca., because I see the the writing on the wall.

JDay
02-14-2013, 5:25 PM
So I just got my glock 27 out of jail today have some juvenile past no adult record original pick up was on 2/8/13 got delayed till today so wait was about 6 extra days on top of the 10 good luck to everyone on here hope you all get your guns soon

Lucky you, I've been delayed for 20 days. Maybe this means they're getting to the stack now?

Mikearfifteen83
02-14-2013, 7:34 PM
Lucky you, I've been delayed for 20 days. Maybe this means they're getting to the stack now?

Thanks man yeah guy at the store said I must of got lucky the agent must of been on his job I never found out what the delay was for but I think might be some juvenile offenses I had that needed to be cleared since no adult record mine delay was easy just a guess though but good luck jday hopefully you pick up soon

cuat_420
02-15-2013, 6:59 AM
Lucky you, I've been delayed for 20 days. Maybe this means they're getting to the stack now?

I am 86 days delayed and nothing yet.......

RED (Y)
02-15-2013, 7:05 AM
I am 86 days delayed and nothing yet.......
Look like you got a delay way before all this madness started,did you ever call DOJ?I know they were answering the phone in December.

cuat_420
02-15-2013, 7:09 AM
I did. They told me why I was delayed and how to fix it...which was done on dec 17th and again mid January, but still nothing. I actually talked to someone yesterday and he said the person handling my case would call me today...we will see

JDay
02-15-2013, 7:07 PM
I did. They told me why I was delayed and how to fix it...which was done on dec 17th and again mid January, but still nothing. I actually talked to someone yesterday and he said the person handling my case would call me today...we will see

Did they ever call you?

cuat_420
02-15-2013, 7:24 PM
Nope...kind of what I expected. I do have the name and number for the guy I spoke to yesterday, so I will call him Tuesday. He is retired military, so I have a little faith. I did call my FFL, who is a friend of mine, this afternoon and had him check anyway, but nothing. I will keep everyone posted on Tuesday (or sooner if I hear something).

MMStevens
02-15-2013, 7:36 PM
I purchased my very first gun on December 6th, 2012. (a Stevens 320 at Big)

It has been delayed ever since.

I was arrested in 2011, in Washington DC on a misdemeanor charge. The case was dismissed completely.

The DOJ clearance section never picks up when I call and the general information line cannot provide any details.

How long can such a delay legally last?

And do I have any legal recourse to request information or expediate the process.

At nearly three months I feel like my Second Amendment rights have been violated without cause.

cuat_420
02-15-2013, 7:58 PM
I purchased my very first gun on December 6th, 2012. (a Stevens 320 at Big)

It has been delayed ever since.

I was arrested in 2011, in Washington DC on a misdemeanor charge. The case was dismissed completely.

The DOJ clearance section never picks up when I call and the general information line cannot provide any details.

How long can such a delay legally last?

And do I have any legal recourse to request information or expediate the process.

At nearly three months I feel like my Second Amendment rights have been violated without cause.


That is the same day I made my purchase that is currently delayed. If you want to take it any further, you can hire a lawyer and see if they can get it to move faster. The problem is, if you can't get anyone to give you information, I doubt an attorney is going to get much further. They can assist you with getting the proper documentation submitted to the DOJ, but they can't make them do anything with it.

Trust me, I feel your pain...my arrest was in 1995 in Tennessee and it never went to court, as it was dropped by the person who filed them. I have been active duty military since 1997 and I currently have a Top Secret clearance (I know, so did Christopher Dorner). I have provided the documentation, and had it submitted by the courthouse in TN, but I have gotten nowhere. After speaking to someone yesterday, I had a little more hope that I might get somewhere today, but as I suspected, they never called me back.

Make sure you get your information to Brandon at Calguns Foundation, and let them work the case for us!

MMStevens
02-15-2013, 8:07 PM
Thanks, sorry your in the same spot as me, even though I'm glad I'm not the only one.

I faxed them a copy of the case's disposition but I never got a response.

I'll share my infortmation with the Calguns foundation and try to be patient.

cuat_420
02-15-2013, 8:17 PM
Thanks, sorry your in the same spot as me, even though I'm glad I'm not the only one.

I faxed them a copy of the case's disposition but I never got a response.

I'll share my infortmation with the Calguns foundation and try to be patient.

I am not saying be patient by any means. If you find a way in, be the squeaky wheel! I was lucky enough to be told early in December why I was delayed and who was handling my case. I was given a fax number and to fax it to her attention. Same issue as you, I can't get anyone to confirm that it was received for either time it was sent (once by me and once by the TN courthouse). I continue to look for ways to get someone on the phone. I have called other CA DOJ BOF departments and been able to speak to people. Dependent upon who you get, some of them will tell you to call the information hotline, but every once in a while you can get someone willing to help. I have confirmed that once the delay is put in place, the agent who delays it owns it until it is cleared....so if you can get THAT person on the phone and you know the paperwork was sent, you may be able to get somewhere.

Like I said, as soon as I find that way in, I will be sure to share any and all info with personnel here. Feeling like a criminal because a state process is so screwed up really sucks! Good luck, and keep us posted!

jeffme
02-15-2013, 9:26 PM
I hate to be the one to point this out, and do not in any way wish to offend.............but you probably complain about State employees and the need to shrink state government? Seems we never really get what we want or need.......choices. :D



Not if the requests are or for older people whom records still exist on a piece by piece basis in paper/microfiche form.

Example:

Let's say you are a background check processor for AG/DOJ. Normally, your caseload as one employee is 50 cases per day.

Let's say that on a given day, 49 are for relatively younger folks where pretty much each document has already been digitized - or was digitized the moment it was created.

Let's say that on that same given day, 1 is for an older person where one or two pieces of documentation got missed over the last 2 decades during the expensive conversion stuff that has been going on.

So average day = 49 easy and straightforward - 1 not so.

Result: 49 done - 1 you call state archive on - request coversion - 1 delay.


Now...all of a sudden...everyone is on a panic buy...including a lot more older folks who are worried, see the obvious...and aren't going to sit idle unarmed anymore.

You go to work, see 50 jobs in the queue---but discover, "HOLY CRAP!!! 29 easy - and 21 requiring and archive search and conversion - and possibly request for papers from another state or federal gov't.

So you get 21 easy, done, 1 delayed one done, and 28 left on a pile at the end of your shift.

You walk in the next day, and literally crap in your pants. 30 easy, 20 more requiring archive search or out-of-state requests.

So you get 30 easy done, 1 delayed one done, 19 more added to pile of 28 from yesterday. And each day, it gets worse.


The real problem:

Where's the budget for numerous new hires to take on the sudden rush of folks who are older and whose documents haven't been completed converted over?

Supposedly, the fees we already pay are supposed to cover it - but have those funds been release to AG/DOJ?

I bet not...


Once again, this is a theory.


It would be nice to know how many are experiencing this are:

Over 40
Under 40


=8-)

JDay
02-16-2013, 11:29 AM
Well I've been delayed since the 25th of last month with no end in sight. And apparently since it's been delayed over 20 days DOJ has to start over, which means my DROS is sitting somewhere in a quite large pile waiting for DOJ to get caught up on the ones that require no effort to process. Looks like we'll be lucky to get our release approvals before the state bans our weapons.

ACLU hero
02-16-2013, 7:10 PM
If you want to take it any further, you can hire a lawyer and see if they can get it to move faster. The problem is, if you can't get anyone to give you information, I doubt an attorney is going to get much further. They can assist you with getting the proper documentation submitted to the DOJ, but they can't make them do anything with it.



no disrespect to the quoted author: i do believe that the approval or denial of a DROS application is a ministerial act, and therefore an appropriate target of a writ of mandamus.

an attorney may well accelerate this process for anyone who is struggling to lawfully possess a firearm.

if i am right (an if, for sure,) this is a simple litigation option to accelerate this process for all of you who feel like you are in limbo. consider it.

BTWP i'm 35~, bought a benelli super 90 m4 and experienced no delay from january 20th to delivery (and had dealt with a 2011 DROS denial.)

just my opinion. call your lawyer, please.

cuat_420
02-16-2013, 8:03 PM
no disrespect to the quoted author: i do believe that the approval or denial of a DROS application is a ministerial act, and therefore an appropriate target of a writ of mandamus.

an attorney may well accelerate this process for anyone who is struggling to lawfully possess a firearm.

if i am right (an if, for sure,) this is a simple litigation option to accelerate this process for all of you who feel like you are in limbo. consider it.

BTWP i'm 35~, bought a benelli super 90 m4 and experienced no delay from january 20th to delivery (and had dealt with a 2011 DROS denial.)

just my opinion. call your lawyer, please.

No disrespect taken. If an attorney is the answer, then I recommend it as well...anything that can accelerate the process for someone who is not a criminal is a godsend at this point. My understanding to this point (which is limited to what I have seen in this forum) is that the attorney can help you ensure the proper documentation is presented to the CA DOJ, but not a lot beyond that. If there is more, please let us know. Like I said, I am in the same boat...all of my documentation has been presented to DOJ, but I can't get anything beyond that. I would gladly pay an attorney if I knew they had a way forward, but I don't want to pay someone based on assumptions. If a PM is a better way to discuss this, please send one my way...I am all ears

cuat_420
02-16-2013, 8:05 PM
Well I've been delayed since the 25th of last month with no end in sight. And apparently since it's been delayed over 20 days DOJ has to start over, which means my DROS is sitting somewhere in a quite large pile waiting for DOJ to get caught up on the ones that require no effort to process. Looks like we'll be lucky to get our release approvals before the state bans our weapons.

My only real concern at this point. I am about a week out of just having it shipped out of state.

JDay
02-16-2013, 10:11 PM
Getting an attorney isn't going to do anything for you if DOJ will not even tell you why you are on delay. It will however get the attorney paid for hours on the phone getting the same answers you already have.

scsurfer
02-17-2013, 11:19 AM
Keep calling back. I had one in delay for 30 days and I would call a few times a day. Sometimes u I would get a recording and sometimes someone would answer. The ones that would answer would tell me nothing and had some look my case up and tell me why it was in delay. Don't give up it will happen.

JDay
02-17-2013, 11:40 AM
Keep calling back. I had one in delay for 30 days and I would call a few times a day. Sometimes u I would get a recording and sometimes someone would answer. The ones that would answer would tell me nothing and had some look my case up and tell me why it was in delay. Don't give up it will happen.

When were you delayed and when was the release?

gigglemonkee
02-17-2013, 12:00 PM
I was delayed 8 days in on dec 21 and able to pick up on January 27

prometa
02-17-2013, 12:10 PM
My theory about what is going on has evolved slightly, given what PlayHard posted.

1. There are absolutely too few agents to handle the case load. If you end up delayed, you are likely in a holding pattern for a while as they can't even get to the new DROSes.
2. For some reason they really do seem to be trying to clear as many as possible in 10 days, which makes you a low priority once you've been delayed. This is why people with completely clean records end up in endless delay--you were unlucky and they didn't get to you at first, and now they are ignoring you in favor of newer submissions.
3. If you have an arrest outside of California or prior to digitizing, you will inevitably be delayed. It takes so long to get records, the whole process must start all over again and your file is not kept open. What you submit may end up attached to your file, but it is still being set aside in favor of newer applications.

If I am right (and I'm just speculating), I wouldn't attempt DROS with a prior arrest with no charges filed right now because you usually have to pay in full at the time DROS starts and you'll just have that money taken from you indefinitely. The net effect is your 2nd amendment rights are violated, but you have no easy legal recourse at this time.

If you have a clean slate, it's a dice roll, but I bet purchasing mid week vs weekend is helpful because the incoming pile you're part of that day is smaller.

The only solution to this is going to NICS and clearing most people immediately.

I am still of the opinion that arrest records should be inaccessible. Delaying you and forcing you to submit certified paperwork is a de facto requirement of proof of innocence.

JDay
02-17-2013, 3:14 PM
The only solution to this is going to NICS and clearing most people immediately.

California does the NICS check because it is a federal requirement but they do not go by what NICS says.

I am still of the opinion that arrest records should be inaccessible. Delaying you and forcing you to submit certified paperwork is a de facto requirement of proof of innocence.

Ever hear the phrase "Innocent until proven guilty"? If there are no arrest records to be seen they would no know about an arrest. What they are doing is delaying people when there is an arrest and no charges have been filed. That goes against our countries legal principals.

sl0re10
02-17-2013, 5:54 PM
3. DHS is sticking their nose into DOJ's / AGO's business and imposing the "no fly" list as a basis for delay or denial. Is anyone here on the "no fly" list or regulary harassed by DHS at airports?

For what it is worth, DHS never expunges anything... regardless.

HunterSwift
02-17-2013, 7:25 PM
I purchased a AR15 and on the 9th day my ffl said I was put on delay. He gave me DOJ number and after multiple attempts of busy signal I finally reached someone who didnt ask for my info and just said I dont have your info in front of me but that I just had to wait. I asked how long usually and she said 4-6 weeks.

HunterSwift
02-17-2013, 7:26 PM
What should I do?

JDay
02-17-2013, 8:50 PM
I purchased a AR15 and on the 9th day my ffl said I was put on delay. He gave me DOJ number and after multiple attempts of busy signal I finally reached someone who didnt ask for my info and just said I dont have your info in front of me but that I just had to wait. I asked how long usually and she said 4-6 weeks.

What should I do?

About the only thing you can do is wait. DOJ is delaying people for non-prohibiting offences. A delay is not a denial. You should report this delay to the Calguns Foundation at the link in the first post.

cuat_420
02-18-2013, 4:47 AM
Update to my situation: after not receiving a phone call on Friday from the person who delayed my case as promised, I called Saturday and left a message for the guy I originally spoke to. He called me back at 5:00 PM last night and told me that he had spoken to her, but there had been some restructuring and relocating of personnel, which messed up the phone system as well. Not sure how much truth their is in it, but like I said, the guy is prior military, plus he has called me back every time I call, so I still have faith. He said she would contact me by Wednesday, and to please give her that long.

The one thing this confirms is that they are working 7 days a week. I hope the "movement" he was referring to was them plusing up their staff. Only time will tell, but I will keep everyone up to date.

JDay
02-18-2013, 9:27 AM
Hopefully that means they're getting caught up now.

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2

JoeyJ
02-18-2013, 1:07 PM
49 days and counting....starting to feel like a mushroom, lol. I'm trying to do a private party purchase now, as well, so I'm curious. Will the current BGC/DROS cover this purchase also and potentially vise versa?

JDay
02-18-2013, 2:04 PM
49 days and counting....starting to feel like a mushroom, lol. I'm trying to do a private party purchase now, as well, so I'm curious. Will the current BGC/DROS cover this purchase also and potentially vise versa?

You'll get delayed again and it's a separate DROS.

JoeyJ
02-18-2013, 2:10 PM
You'll get delayed again and it's a separate DROS.

Then I'm really confused based on what I've read here regarding my current background check having to be run again after 30 days in delay. Aren't background checks good for 30 days? Or does that mean it's good for 30 days for one specific gun purchase? I understand that I'll have to file again just thought it would cover more than one purchase in that 30 day window especially if the FFL is the same. Current delay is for a pistol and the private party is a shotgun.
Thanks

JDay
02-18-2013, 3:16 PM
Then I'm really confused based on what I've read here regarding my current background check having to be run again after 30 days in delay. Aren't background checks good for 30 days? Or does that mean it's good for 30 days for one specific gun purchase? I understand that I'll have to file again just thought it would cover more than one purchase in that 30 day window especially if the FFL is the same. Current delay is for a pistol and the private party is a shotgun.
Thanks

It's per DROS. The good news is that once your delay is lifted you shouldn't have problems in the future.

scsurfer
02-18-2013, 3:24 PM
When were you delayed and when was the release?

I bought the gun on dec. 28. Delay notice was sent on jan. 4.
I picked it up on jan. 28. Funny thing about it was I bought another on jan. 8 and that one went through in the 10 days. People that I got on the phone I told them that I had another in and it was cleared. They emailed the person working on my case and told them that I was cleared on one already.

JDay
02-18-2013, 4:11 PM
I bought the gun on dec. 28. Delay notice was sent on jan. 4.
I picked it up on jan. 28. Funny thing about it was I bought another on jan. 8 and that one went through in the 10 days. People that I got on the phone I told them that I had another in and it was cleared. They emailed the person working on my case and told them that I was cleared on one already.

Well then I guess that confirms my suspicion that a person or persons at the DOJ BOF are purposely delaying people without cause. You should report this to the Calguns Foundation at the link in the first post so that they know about this.

mrrabbit
02-19-2013, 9:16 AM
http://standwitharizona.com/blog/2013/02/18/mexico-asks-u-s-senate-to-create-registry-of-american-gun-owners-in-border-states/

This was linked to in another thread this morning.

Earlier, I raised the possibility that DHS/BATF was imposing on CA-DOJ and CA-AG and causing some of the delays in a back door manner.

Perhaps that list is already being created per request of DHS/BATF in expectation that the US Senate will authorize information sharing with Mexico.

=8-)

JDay
02-19-2013, 12:10 PM
http://standwitharizona.com/blog/2013/02/18/mexico-asks-u-s-senate-to-create-registry-of-american-gun-owners-in-border-states/

This was linked to in another thread this morning.

Earlier, I raised the possibility that DHS/BATF was imposing on CA-DOJ and CA-AG and causing some of the delays in a back door manner.

Perhaps that list is already being created per request of DHS/BATF in expectation that the US Senate will authorize information sharing with Mexico.

=8-)

And how exactly would that have anything to do with the DOJ delaying DROS'? It doesn't.

JDay
02-19-2013, 12:21 PM
Has anyone been able to get through to the DOJ BOF? All I get when I call is a busy signal.

Firearm Transaction Denials and Delays
Phone: (916) 227-3749

RED (Y)
02-19-2013, 12:54 PM
Busy all day long today.

mrrabbit
02-19-2013, 1:05 PM
And how exactly would that have anything to do with the DOJ delaying DROS'? It doesn't.

Another poster earlier mentioned being told that folks at AG / DOJ getting moved around with phone numbers getting messed up in the process.

Just theories...that's all. Maintaining a second database for a third party would certainly causes delays in a fixed resource environment.

=8-)

JDay
02-19-2013, 1:16 PM
Anyone know if the DOJ looks at the 4473? I just noticed I mixed up two of the numbers on my zip code on that form. Dunno if that could cause a delay.

metasys
02-19-2013, 1:17 PM
I've tried a couple hundred times today, either busy signal or it rings for awhile then disconnects

kemasa
02-19-2013, 1:35 PM
Anyone know if the DOJ looks at the 4473? I just noticed I mixed up two of the numbers on my zip code on that form. Dunno if that could cause a delay.

The DOJ does not look at the 4473, except perhaps during an inspection of the FFL.

Did the FFL give you a copy of the 4473? Otherwise how can you see that? Are you looking at the DROS printout?

JDay
02-19-2013, 1:43 PM
The DOJ does not look at the 4473, except perhaps during an inspection of the FFL.

Did the FFL give you a copy of the 4473? Otherwise how can you see that? Are you looking at the DROS printout?

I have copies of all my paperwork, DROS and the 4473.

kemasa
02-19-2013, 2:06 PM
I have copies of all my paperwork, DROS and the 4473.

Strange. Most places don't give out copies of the 4473, but that is not an issue with the CA DROS. You might want to correct it before the transfer is completed though.

JDay
02-19-2013, 2:21 PM
Strange. Most places don't give out copies of the 4473, but that is not an issue with the CA DROS. You might want to correct it before the transfer is completed though.

It depends on the FFL. Dunno why some refuse to give you the 4473.

tcrpe
02-19-2013, 2:22 PM
Picked up pistol, no DROS issues.

Carlsbad rookie
02-20-2013, 9:00 AM
I am currently 20 days past my ten day waiting period. I have called the DOJ a few hundred times and was lucky to speak to someone once, they just said to keep waiting. I have no criminal history so im chaulking it up to them just being busy and me having a similar name to someone else. Sucks waiting a month so far from my purchase date but i'm not alone in my frustration but i've contracted that calguns link to let them know of my issue, i've left voicemails w the DOJ and i've even emailed the DOJ. I guess this just gives me more time to stock up on ammunition.

Question though....I want to buy another gun, can I go buy a gun and start the DROS process over w a new purchase or do i need to wait until the first one is complete? Just curious.

JDay
02-20-2013, 9:05 AM
Question though....I want to buy another gun, can I go buy a gun and start the DROS process over w a new purchase or do i need to wait until the first one is complete? Just curious.

Someone else on here did that and the second one wasn't delayed. They were then able to get the first one released. You might want to use a different FFL for the second one though.

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2

Carlsbad rookie
02-20-2013, 9:33 AM
Someone else on here did that and the second one wasn't delayed. They were then able to get the first one released. You might want to use a different FFL for the second one though.

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2

Yeah, what can it hurt; worst case is a few months down the road I have two guns. Thanks for the advice!

turbohatch
02-20-2013, 10:22 AM
Hey guys, bought my AR on feb 1 got a call on feb 8 notifying me of a delay. still waiting......

JDay
02-20-2013, 10:48 AM
Hey guys, bought my AR on feb 1 got a call on feb 8 notifying me of a delay. still waiting......

Report it, links in first post.

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2

darkhorse714
02-20-2013, 11:45 AM
Hello All,

I'm new to CalGuns but I have been following this tread since Nov 2012. I'm in the same situation as some of the other posters. I have been on delay since Sept 26 2012. Before this purchase I had purchased several guns from Turners. Only my first purchase was delayed due to an arrest in 1995 that had no disposition. The court had to fax over a letter stating those records no longer existed. Once that was done my gun was releaased and thought everything was resolved. In Sept I decided to buy a Colt 6920. On my ninth day I get a call from Turners telling me I was put on delay. I figured I would just go back to the court house and ask them to fax them another letter. After getting that done I waited about two days before calling the DOJ. The person I spoke to told me that she had received the fax but that due to a new regulation cases like mine would be left on delay until my arrest was removed from my record. That same day I hired a lawyer and began the process of clearing and destroying my arrest from 1995. Just to inform anyone that want to go down this path. You have to be very patient. There are some long waiting periods before the next step can happen. My lawyer is set to go to a hearing on March 1st at which point the judge will decide if my record can be cleared. If it is approved I believe there are a couple more step before I can notify the DOJ of the outcome.

Feel free to ask any questions regarding the process. I will help in any way possible.

FYI, Even though I was going through the process of cleaning my record I was still calling the DOJ on a regular bases. I finally got someone on the phone today. She told me that the delay phone line has been turned off and will remain like that until they are caught up with their back log.

JDay
02-20-2013, 1:03 PM
Hello All,

I'm new to CalGuns but I have been following this tread since Nov 2012. I'm in the same situation as some of the other posters. I have been on delay since Sept 26 2012. Before this purchase I had purchased several guns from Turners. Only my first purchase was delayed due to an arrest in 1995 that had no disposition. The court had to fax over a letter stating those records no longer existed. Once that was done my gun was releaased and thought everything was resolved. In Sept I decided to buy a Colt 6920. On my ninth day I get a call from Turners telling me I was put on delay. I figured I would just go back to the court house and ask them to fax them another letter. After getting that done I waited about two days before calling the DOJ. The person I spoke to told me that she had received the fax but that due to a new regulation cases like mine would be left on delay until my arrest was removed from my record. That same day I hired a lawyer and began the process of clearing and destroying my arrest from 1995. Just to inform anyone that want to go down this path. You have to be very patient. There are some long waiting periods before the next step can happen. My lawyer is set to go to a hearing on March 1st at which point the judge will decide if my record can be cleared. If it is approved I believe there are a couple more step before I can notify the DOJ of the outcome.

Feel free to ask any questions regarding the process. I will help in any way possible.

FYI, Even though I was going through the process of cleaning my record I was still calling the DOJ on a regular bases. I finally got someone on the phone today. She told me that the delay phone line has been turned off and will remain like that until they are caught up with their back log.

If you were never convicted or if the charges were dropped this is a clear violation of your civil rights. Have you contacted the Calguns Foundation about this? This is exactly the sort of thing they handle.

RED (Y)
02-20-2013, 7:04 PM
I was calling DOJ general line all day long,no answer,VM only.Delays&Denials # is still busy/no answer/no VM.Someone mention that there is some phone # changes are going on.Any new numbers to call?

wildhawker
02-20-2013, 7:11 PM
Please please please email me your information to bcombs@calgunsfoundation.org.

-Brandon

Hello All,

I'm new to CalGuns but I have been following this tread since Nov 2012. I'm in the same situation as some of the other posters. I have been on delay since Sept 26 2012. Before this purchase I had purchased several guns from Turners. Only my first purchase was delayed due to an arrest in 1995 that had no disposition. The court had to fax over a letter stating those records no longer existed. Once that was done my gun was releaased and thought everything was resolved. In Sept I decided to buy a Colt 6920. On my ninth day I get a call from Turners telling me I was put on delay. I figured I would just go back to the court house and ask them to fax them another letter. After getting that done I waited about two days before calling the DOJ. The person I spoke to told me that she had received the fax but that due to a new regulation cases like mine would be left on delay until my arrest was removed from my record. That same day I hired a lawyer and began the process of clearing and destroying my arrest from 1995. Just to inform anyone that want to go down this path. You have to be very patient. There are some long waiting periods before the next step can happen. My lawyer is set to go to a hearing on March 1st at which point the judge will decide if my record can be cleared. If it is approved I believe there are a couple more step before I can notify the DOJ of the outcome.

Feel free to ask any questions regarding the process. I will help in any way possible.

FYI, Even though I was going through the process of cleaning my record I was still calling the DOJ on a regular bases. I finally got someone on the phone today. She told me that the delay phone line has been turned off and will remain like that until they are caught up with their back log.

CoreNobody
02-20-2013, 7:49 PM
Apparently the answer to no one,and can make it take as long as they want.

ITS JUST A SIMPLE SHOTGUN!!!

Rediculous,really putting a damper on getting into guns.......there's always inherated weapons ;)

wildhawker
02-20-2013, 8:47 PM
People, keep your chins up. There's lots to look forward to...

-Brandon

Dustyzz
02-20-2013, 9:05 PM
People, keep your chins up. There's lots to look forward to...

-Brandon

I've been on delay since December 24th and still have not been able to get ANY info out of CA DOJ... I could use a little good info, got any details about what we have to look forward to?

JDay
02-20-2013, 9:27 PM
People, keep your chins up. There's lots to look forward to...

-Brandon

I'll take this as a sign the right people are handling this and continue to wait patiently. I'd like to thank you and everyone else who is working on this.

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2

JoeyJ
02-21-2013, 7:55 AM
People, keep your chins up. There's lots to look forward to...

-Brandon

Thank you Brandon for all that you and ALL of Calguns' do for us, I'm on my way to make a donation to the Calguns Foundation!
51 days and counting.
Joey

RED (Y)
02-21-2013, 8:06 AM
Please please please email me your information to bcombs@calgunsfoundation.org.

-Brandon

I filed a report on calgunsfoundation.org,do you need this info re-send to your e-mail?

JDay
02-21-2013, 8:52 AM
I filed a report on calgunsfoundation.org,do you need this info re-send to your e-mail?

I don't think he does.

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2

PlayHard
02-21-2013, 5:06 PM
Update: After finally getting my guns from the 100 day delay, I put several others in DROS. Contacted my FFL and picked up another gun and some lowers on exactly 10 days.

If you were put on delay, it's probably going to stay that way for quite a while. Each DROS is it's own separate file. When put on delay, that file is being tossed into a "holding bin" until they are able to handle them, while handling an unprecedented number of DROS's that are clearly approvals and denials.

If you know why you are on delay and believe this information has been provided and possibly updated with the DOJ (different department than the DROS department), then a new or different DROS will open a new file and possibly an approval (or denial). Once approved with the new DROS and if you can get ahold of somebody, the second DROS may get the original one approved.

If you don't know why your are on delay, DO A LIVESCAN, then refute the information on your RAP sheet with the Records and Review Dept. I started this process and finally got approved. $25 bucks and some fingerprints may get you some answers.

Again, just my take and good luck to all those on delay.

-PH

wildhawker
02-21-2013, 5:42 PM
I filed a report on calgunsfoundation.org,do you need this info re-send to your e-mail?

No, if you reported it at CGF/doj then we'll be in touch.

-Brandon

JDay
02-21-2013, 8:08 PM
If you don't know why your are on delay, DO A LIVESCAN, then refute the information on your RAP sheet with the Records and Review Dept. I started this process and finally got approved. $25 bucks and some fingerprints may get you some answers.

What Livescan service is this? All I see listed at the places that do this is Livescan for employment by certain agencies, and it is a lot more than $25.

JDay
02-21-2013, 8:59 PM
Huh?

Maybe you should re-word that.

It's 100% legal to buy a gun and give it to your son.

tcrpe
02-21-2013, 9:04 PM
It's 100% legal to buy a gun and give it to your son.

Are you obsessing? Were you denied? Delayed? Why?

JDay
02-22-2013, 7:02 AM
Are you obsessing?

Are you trying to imply something? If so you're as bad as the antis.

Were you denied? Delayed? Why?

Were you? If not what are you doing in this thread?

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2

PlayHard
02-22-2013, 7:13 AM
What Livescan service is this? All I see listed at the places that do this is Livescan for employment by certain agencies, and it is a lot more than $25.

Simple to fill out. I put "Record Review - Delayed DROS" as the "Reason for Application"

This link (http://www.shouselaw.com/rap-sheets.html) describes the process.

This link (http://oag.ca.gov/fingerprints/security) is where you can get the form with some description on how to fill it out. At the bottom of the page, it tells you what to do after you have received your RAP sheet ("Claim of Alleged Inaccuracy or Incompleteness" (form BCIA 8706)) . . . I got form BCIA 8706 from one of the CalGuns Foundation recommended attorneys.

At the very least, you'll know what's on your record . . . Best case, you'll get your information updated and know that there is nothing making you a "prohibited person". Try another DROS as you now know, for sure, there is NOTHING that should DELAY or DENY your application.

JDay
02-22-2013, 7:22 AM
Simple to fill out. I put "Record Review - Delayed DROS" as the "Reason for Application"

This link (http://www.shouselaw.com/rap-sheets.html) describes the process.

This link (http://oag.ca.gov/fingerprints/security) is where you can get the form with some description on how to fill it out. At the bottom of the page, it tells you what to do after you have received your RAP sheet ("Claim of Alleged Inaccuracy or Incompleteness" (form BCIA 8706)) . . . I got form BCIA 8706 from one of the CalGuns Foundation recommended attorneys.

At the very least, you'll know what's on your record . . . Best case, you'll get your information updated and know that there is nothing making you a "prohibited person". Try another DROS as you now know, for sure, there is NOTHING that should DELAY or DENY your application.

Thank you. I'm going to do this later today so I can find out what the hold up is. Somethings not adding up because my record is clean. I've had to pass several FBI background checks for security clearance purposes even.

tcrpe
02-22-2013, 7:24 AM
It's 100% legal to buy a gun and give it to your son.


OK, then, it is not as simple as you claim.

Check the law. It needs to be followed.

For example:

12078(c)

(1) Subdivision (d) of Section 12072 shall not apply to the infrequent transfer of a firearm that is not a handgun by gift, bequest, intestate succession, or other means by one individual to another if both individuals are members of the same immediate family.

(2) Subdivision (d) of Section 12072 shall not apply to the infrequent transfer of a handgun by gift, bequest, intestate succession, or other means by one individual to another if both individuals are members of the same immediate family and all of the following conditions are met:

(A) The person to whom the firearm is transferred shall, within 30 days of taking possession of the firearm, forward by prepaid mail or deliver in person to the Department of Justice, a report that includes information concerning the individual taking possession of the firearm, how title was obtained and from whom, and a description of the firearm in question. The report forms that individuals complete pursuant to this paragraph shall be provided to them by the Department of Justice.

(B) The person taking title to the firearm shall first obtain a basic firearms safety certificate. If taking possession on or after January 1, 2003, the person taking title to the firearm shall first obtain a handgun safety certificate.

(C) The person receiving the firearm is 18 years of age or older.

(3) As used in this subdivision, "immediate family member" means any one of the following relationships

(A) Parent and child.

(B) Grandparent and grandchild.

Agree or not, the law must be followed.

Please stop giving legal advice.

repub1mom
02-22-2013, 8:48 AM
Just to add to the conversation. I've read everything here, and advised my boyfriend (his work schedule doesn't afford him the time to do all the research). He's filed his problem with the OP links. He successfully purchased and picked up a PPT of a handgun in January 2013. When picking up the handgun, he noticed a 30.06 in the shop he was interested in. Went back a couple weeks later and purchased it (somewhere around 2/2/13) On day 10 of the 10 day waiting period he got a call from the gun shop that he was 'on delay' and they couldn't release the gun to him. Makes no sense. He's been calling the DOJ every afternoon. Finally reached a flunky yesterday, who said she doesn't have access to why he was delayed and the people who DO aren't taking calls until the back log is cleared up. He was so pi$$ed he forgot to get her name/info/etc. He's over 50, for that person that asked, has lived in California his entire life, and like I said, had recently purchased a handgun. Why the problem with a hunting rifle? I'm just adding to the conversation. I know it's going to be a wait, as does he, we're just both irritated, as we're both law abiding gun owners who've never been delayed or denied before. We ARE however, worried that they could come and try to take his newly, very legally, purchased handgun. Should we be? And thanks to all of you out there working hard to ensure our rights aren't completely trampled! :/

JoeyJ
02-22-2013, 9:00 AM
Simple to fill out. I put "Record Review - Delayed DROS" as the "Reason for Application"

This link (http://www.shouselaw.com/rap-sheets.html) describes the process.

This link (http://oag.ca.gov/fingerprints/security) is where you can get the form with some description on how to fill it out. At the bottom of the page, it tells you what to do after you have received your RAP sheet ("Claim of Alleged Inaccuracy or Incompleteness" (form BCIA 8706)) . . . I got form BCIA 8706 from one of the CalGuns Foundation recommended attorneys.

At the very least, you'll know what's on your record . . . Best case, you'll get your information updated and know that there is nothing making you a "prohibited person". Try another DROS as you now know, for sure, there is NOTHING that should DELAY or DENY your application.

Thanks for the links!. It appears that other than the FBI check this primarily is targeted more for CA records, correct?
If I have anything on my record it would be arrests only in other states and go back almost 40 years. I cleared for a purchase last July under the current more strict "follow up on ANY arrest" that DOJ told me they are required to do since Feb 2012.
So I still have the question of why was I ok then and not now? DOJ offered no answer to that one. Other than perhaps I just fell into "we'll get to it later" pile just because of my being from out of state. I've had multiple BGCs done for major jobs and never had even the slightest concerns from anyone. I am shopping for another long gun so maybe that might stir the pot just enough to get my Ruger SR22 out of jail in time to train my daughter before she moves out of state later this year, lol. Both of my kids have had enough of CA and are both leaving this year.

Carlsbad rookie
02-22-2013, 11:22 AM
Hello fellow poor soles still waiting on your DROS approval. I still am waiting for mine as well approx 32days so far and I was lucky enough to have someone answer when I called the DOJ today, couldnt believe it for a moment because i wasnt expecting anyone to answer. Anyway he explained to me that they are backed up for at least 90 days and that i just need to wait and be patient. He weas very polite and helpful although wouldnt get me in touch with the person in charge of my account but at least i got to talk to someone again and i'll just wait until May and call again. Good luck everyone!

RED (Y)
02-22-2013, 12:01 PM
Got the same answer-can take up to 90 days,and FIY the Delays and Denials number (916-227-3749)-they won't answer it anymore and the guy from DOJ General line (Mike) said that you can't talk to person who got your case anymore.They are short on stuff,so he can't look it up and meanwhile and i can't talk to someone from Delays and Denials dept. So general answer to all my questions is "I don't know,i can't look it up" and "YOu need to wait up to 90 days" Wondering what would happen then-another 90? This is crazy.

JDay
02-22-2013, 1:49 PM
Well I went and did the live scan today, should have a copy of my records by Tuesday. Guess I'll find out then if they're screwing with me or have some incorrect information on file.

BrokerB
02-22-2013, 2:12 PM
Received a Delay letter-

Spoke with DOJ today- Lady said 28,000 delay letters have been sent out since December where they had 400,000 checks down.

ANy checks that showed any sort of abnormality and it was thrown into Delay pile . She said they were still working through January Delays

RED (Y)
02-22-2013, 2:36 PM
I'm delayed since Jan 9th so if they are on January delays i might get my gun soon.

Pinoy11B
02-23-2013, 9:16 AM
I too got a call from shop that my dros was delayed yesterday. Today suppose to be pick up day. I called DOJ yesterday and left a message. DOJ called today but can't tell me anything of why for person says cant see my file. I ask if you need anything from me? DOJ says none but DOJ will just call shop when ready to be release. Funny thing is its the second FA (pistol) I purchase. 1st one cleared with no issues.that was 30 days before this purchase. Hopefully it's all good to go next week.

lakersandguns
02-23-2013, 6:47 PM
My dros was delay on my rifle. I was told to call doj, but I'm reading some post and feel like its more complicated then picking up the phone and calling them. What's the latest on this issue? What to do? I'm going to try calling Monday. Please help

wildhawker
02-23-2013, 8:07 PM
Start at post #1.

lakersandguns
02-23-2013, 8:33 PM
Done, will follow steps 1 and 2

JDay
02-24-2013, 3:58 PM
Has anyone who was delayed in January had their firearms released yet? Trying to figure out if DOJ is really on the January delays.

RED (Y)
02-24-2013, 4:19 PM
I'm still delayed.

Dustyzz
02-24-2013, 7:38 PM
Got my delay December 24... Still on delay.

lakersandguns
02-24-2013, 8:25 PM
Got my delay December 24... Still on delay.

Wow two months. Is doj doing this until something is voted in.

tcrpe
02-24-2013, 8:44 PM
Well, speaking as someone who wasn't delayed, it is curious that DOJ appears to have created a new class of prohibited persons through administrative process. I don't believe that the kick-outs are random, rather (as DOJ has stated) the result of some new revised criteria. I don't know what new database(s) they've brought in, but I assume they are state database(s). I would think that there would be some commonalities among those delayed.

Only they would know what they are.

JDay
02-24-2013, 9:35 PM
Well, speaking as someone who wasn't delayed, it is curious that DOJ appears to have created a new class of prohibited persons through administrative process. I don't believe that the kick-outs are random, rather (as DOJ has stated) the result of some new revised criteria. I don't know what new database(s) they've brought in, but I assume they are state database(s). I would think that there would be some commonalities among the delayed.

Only they would know what they are.

If that was the case explain how someone a page or so back made two purchases within days of each other and the first was delayed and the second had no issues. When DOJ was made aware of this they released the first one too. Personally I'm starting to suspect incompetence.

TRICKSTER
02-24-2013, 11:41 PM
If that was the case explain how someone a page or so back made two purchases within days of each other and the first was delayed and the second had no issues. When DOJ was made aware of this they released the first one too. Personally I'm starting to suspect incompetence.

Incompetence on the DOJ's part and past acts coming back to haunt some of those now purchasing a firearm.

jonzer77
02-25-2013, 5:09 AM
Incompetence on the DOJ's part and past acts coming back to haunt some of those now purchasing a firearm.

I wonder if they now have have access to the people that have MJ cards......

lakersandguns
02-25-2013, 12:30 PM
Are they dicking around? I've been calling all day, sounds busy every time. Wtf

Carlsbad rookie
02-25-2013, 12:54 PM
Are they dicking around? I've been calling all day, sounds busy every time. Wtf

Good luck getting through...I called about 30 times a day to 3 different numbers and finally got through after over a week of trying. They'll probably tell you the same thing as everyone else and that to be patient and wait at least 90 days. yes it sucks but unfortunately we are completely helpless and just have to wait.

lakersandguns
02-25-2013, 1:08 PM
Thanks. I sent them an email.

wildhawker
02-25-2013, 1:42 PM
To repeat: read post #1.

lakersandguns
02-25-2013, 1:51 PM
A few weeks ago(approx January 30) I was contacted by RSO CCW unit regarding my permit. I was told that CAL DOJ was inquiring with them as to why I was issued a permit. A permit renewed in Oct of 2012. They were told I needed to produce documents on an arrest in 1996 that had no disposition. I told the deputy that I had no documentation on this arrest.

For the next week I exhausted every avenue I could think of to track down info. The Riverside co District attorney , RSO, RSO records and the southwest detention center had no clue what I was talking about, let alone able to help with any documentation. In 96' I never went to court, so no court paperwork, the DA never even got the case, so no paperwork at the DA. The jail I was booked at had no record of me being there, and the records department has nothing, not even the police report. The absolutely only thing RSO records could dig up was a copy of a "certificate of detention" that is marked," did not make last day arraignment". I was there, I know, I was in custody. Come to find out, the arresting agency doesn't exist any longer, and hasn't since 1996. All records were micro filmed or destroyed by RSO when they took over the contract. I submitted the cert of detention to the CCW unit along with a court record search on me from 1995 to present.

Today I talked to the deputy at the CCW unit and was told the paperwork I submitted did not satisfy the CA DOJ. They want more proof of my innocence. He also told me that the DOJ is breathing down their neck about this and 5 other permit holders in the same situation. 1 of the other permit holders is dealing with a situation the same as mine from the mid 70's.

The deputy said he was sorry for the situation and it was BS that I have to do this since they already cleared me. He said there must have been some kind of rule change. I told him about some of the stories I've heard about on this thread and he was flabbergasted. I said if I went to buy a new gun I would probably be put on a "delay" as many of you have been. He said definitely. You have been red flagged and the DOJ Wants to pull my permit if I cant prove my case. The deputy gave me a number and I have been calling it all day so far with no luck. I know, I know, I'll keep trying.

I find this crazy. I renewed my permit in Oct. I put a Saiga through an undelayed DROS in DEC/JAN. I've bought multiple firearms since 2009, applied, received and renewed my CA permit, renewed my EMT and Paramedic license, and received a Nevada CCW. All with no delays or hiccups. WTF is the problem all of a sudden.

Rant over.
Just posting to have my case tallied and let everyone here know I hear ya. Although I don't have a gun in "delay" jail right now. If I try. I am positive it will be. So why try.

Well I think why my rifle got delay. I was involve in an incident on dec 31 were I was arrested for assult with deadly weapon. I was never charged, DA never charge me, case was thrown out.As I stated self defense.

RED (Y)
02-25-2013, 2:06 PM
Are they dicking around? I've been calling all day, sounds busy every time. Wtf

If you are calling (916) 227-3749-don't waste your time,they are not answering that phone.You can call (916) 227-7527 to hear that you have to wait at least 90 days,and they can't look up your case.

lakersandguns
02-25-2013, 2:27 PM
If you are calling (916) 227-3749-don't waste your time,they are not answering that phone.You can call (916) 227-7527 to hear that you have to wait at least 90 days,and they can't look up your case.

Thanks, I called and right away spoke to someone. It's just a waiting process now

RED (Y)
02-25-2013, 2:37 PM
Thanks, I called and right away spoke to someone. It's just a waiting process now
You're welcome.Hopefully this wait will bring us our guns.

tcrpe
02-25-2013, 2:39 PM
I wonder if they now have have access to the people that have MJ cards......

It's certainly a possibility. The state has a database.

SkyHawk
02-25-2013, 2:42 PM
Add me to the delay pile.

lakersandguns
02-25-2013, 5:11 PM
I was involve in an incident on dec 31 of last year. Was charged with assault with deadly weapon, but was out of self defense. The DA never file charges, the case was dismissed right away. I hope that i'm not denied. I was never found guilty of assaulting anyone.

wildhawker
02-25-2013, 5:18 PM
Stories here do nothing. Report your delays to http://calgunsfoundation.org/doj.

-Brandon

lakersandguns
02-25-2013, 5:24 PM
will do

M0RTAL_K0MBAT
02-25-2013, 6:06 PM
if you are not locked up in a jail or a mental ward, then you have passed the yearly background check.

I JUST PURCHASED AN AR15 AND GOT A CALL A DAY B4 THAT IT WAS PUT ON HOLD. I HAD A CASE AN GOT IT DISMISSED. BEEN TRYING TO GET AHOLD OF THE DOJ RELIGIOUSLY AND NOTHING. I KNOW IT CANT BE "ITS THE QUANITY OF THEM BEING SOLD" CAUSE I HAVE A BUDDY WHO GOT 2 OF THEM AFTER ME AND NEITHER GOT PUT ON HOLD. HOW DO I FIND OUT THE INFO TO FIX THE PROBLEM!?? PLEASE HELP

tallic68
02-25-2013, 7:46 PM
If you have not received a denial letter or been delayed during DROS. But you have been "notified" that you have been "flagged" only. Do you still fill out and report the "flagged" to http://calgunsfoundation.org/doj ?

JDay
02-25-2013, 8:27 PM
If you have not received a denial letter or been delayed during DROS. But you have been "notified" that you have been "flagged" only. Do you still fill out and report the "flagged" to http://calgunsfoundation.org/doj ?

Your FFL gets the letter then calls to notify you. They'll show it to you on request.

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2

cuat_420
02-26-2013, 5:03 AM
Update:

77 days into my delay, I received a phone call around 3:30 yesterday from an agent in regards to an ema I sent to them early in January. This may be the route to go, even though it took 45+ days to hear from them. She was very nice, pulled my record and confirmed I was on delay for an arrest in 1995 in TN. She then went and spoke to the agent who has my file. She asked me to resend the disposition paperwork again and she would let her know it was coming. She did confirm that you can send supporting documentation, it does not have to come from the courts. She gave me her direct line and told me to call her directly if I have any other questions or concerns. Unfortunately, I am deployed to the east coast until this weekend, so I may not have an update until next week. I am trying to get my wife to email them to me. I will continue to update as I get info.

M0RTAL_K0MBAT
02-26-2013, 7:18 AM
So after I get live scan and get my paperwork saying the issue I probably got flagged for was dismissed where do I send it???

cuat_420
02-26-2013, 7:22 AM
Livescan won't tell you that...if it did, you wouldn't be delayed. You will need to get supporting documentation from the court saying that the charges were dismissed. Once you have that, you can dispute the Livescan (form to do so will come with it in the mail) and send the documents to DOJ as well. PM me for the fax number if you need it.

tallic68
02-26-2013, 8:27 AM
I am not in DROS. I am not waiting on a gun. I'm not dealing with a FFL. I know I have been flagged by doj by being notified by the sheriff dept.

My question is dose this still qualify as a case that falls under the DROS denial criteria set forth in the op post #1 to fill out the form in the link in post #1.

cuat_420
02-26-2013, 8:54 AM
I am not in DROS. I am not waiting on a gun. I'm not dealing with a FFL. I know I have been flagged by doj by being notified by the sheriff dept.

My question is dose this still qualify as a case that falls under the DROS denial criteria set forth in the op post #1 to fill out the form in the link in post #1.

It depends. Why were you flagged? Is a pending case? Was it something that was dismissed and not documented? Your question is too vague to answer, but either way, if you have not been delayed or denied, there is no way to file with calguns foundation. They are attorneys who are trying to prevent the violation of people's 2nd amendment right...which you have not had violated yet. Hopefully this helps.

M0RTAL_K0MBAT
02-26-2013, 9:03 AM
I got live scanned at my current job and I have the documents from the court saying my case was dismissed and I have I think its the dross #. Now if I was to jus FAX them might that still help with my issue!?

cuat_420
02-26-2013, 9:04 AM
So I guess it doesn't depend...sorry. If you are looking to buy a gun, just try it and see. I would look for a shop that won't charge a restocking fee of you are denied or cancel due to delay. There are a lot of smaller shops that understand the current situation, and they also know they will not have a problem selling the gun (unless it is some ridiculous special order). Just ask them up front and take a shot...at least you will know for sure and go from there.

HowardW56
02-26-2013, 9:07 AM
I got live scanned at my current job and I have the documents from the court saying my case was dismissed and I have I think its the dross #. Now if I was to jus FAX them might that still help with my issue!?

It couldn't hurt, but there is no guarantee that it will help. If you were able to find out who is processing the delay, that may help, but there is no guarantee that it will help.

DOJ doesn't care how long the delay is...

cuat_420
02-26-2013, 9:07 AM
I got live scanned at my current job and I have the documents from the court saying my case was dismissed and I have I think its the dross #. Now if I was to jus FAX them might that still help with my issue!?

It may. I say that because I have had the documents faxed a couple times and they asked me to send them again. They have one fax machine and if the agent with your file does not get the fax (I know her name and addressed it to her) then there is no telling if it will help. If you fax it, make sure you include your name a drivers license number on the cover sheet, as your DL # is how they look you up. Good luck, and keep us posted.

M0RTAL_K0MBAT
02-26-2013, 9:21 AM
ya cuat_420 I haven't talked to anyone yet. should I try an keep calling?? if so which number??? dam this is so confusing

cuat_420
02-26-2013, 9:29 AM
ya cuat_420 I haven't talked to anyone yet. should I try an keep calling?? if so which number??? dam this is so confusing

You won't get anyone to give you any info now. I was delayed December 10th before things got out of hand. I was lucky enough to talk to someone then, but you won't get anywhere now. I would email them through the attorney general website and be very specific and polite (pretend to be understanding of their situation). A lot of the BOF agents are frustrated as well, and if you keep everything positive you will be a lot more likely to get help. Like I said, I now have a direct phone number and first and last name of an agent at BOF. It has taken nearly 3 months, but I am getting close. Stay positive...the wait sucks, but right now there is nothing we can do about it other than being a squeaky wheel in every way possible. Brandon and the Calguns Foundation will take care of the rest!

smak28
02-26-2013, 9:32 AM
Thanks for the info! People like you are needed and appreciated!

cuat_420
02-26-2013, 9:42 AM
Thanks for the info! People like you are needed and appreciated!

I try. I want everyone here who is dealing with this to have every bit of info possible. I have never liked the whole "misery loves company" attitude. Being delayed sucks...especially with 16 years active duty, multiple tours in Iraq and Afghanistan, and an active top secret clearance. If the information I share helps even one person get their gun sooner (regardless of my situation) then the time spent posting was worth it. I try to look at the employees of the BOF the same way I do when I call a credit card company...the people we talk to dont make the rules, but they are stuck talking to us and "supporting" their leadership whether they agree or not...wait, this sounds like the military! Anyway, I will continue to update as I learn anything new! Good luck to everyone!

JoeyJ
02-26-2013, 10:28 AM
57 days and counting..............
I put a long gun in jail on Saturday to see what happens, we'll see if that one gets delayed too.

JDay
02-26-2013, 10:59 AM
Who here has done the Live Scan and received their records? The status on mine has been "mailed" since Friday and I have yet to receive anything.

M0RTAL_K0MBAT
02-26-2013, 11:33 AM
Jday. I got live scanned for my job but never saw the results. but I'm now requesting it so I'll see how that works

JDay
02-26-2013, 12:06 PM
Jday. I got live scanned for my job but never saw the results. but I'm now requesting it so I'll see how that works

You only get them if you request your record.

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2

M0RTAL_K0MBAT
02-26-2013, 12:31 PM
what do u mean

cuat_420
02-26-2013, 2:45 PM
Update:

I finally received the call I have been waiting for. I had my wife fax the documents this morning, and then I called the lady I spoke with yesterday to let her know I faxed them. I just received a call from the person who has my file and she said she has released my rifle! So, if you do one thing, please email the BOF through the OAG website. That is what got me in direct contact with someone who was willing to help. You need to know what your delay is and have the supporting documentation ready to send when they call. It has been a long 3 months, but I finally made it. Thank you to everyone who has helped me to this point, and I will still be on here to help anyone else who wants it. PM is best. Thank you, and good luck everyone!

M0RTAL_K0MBAT
02-26-2013, 5:13 PM
Update:

I finally received the call I have been waiting for. I had my wife fax the documents this morning, and then I called the lady I spoke with yesterday to let her know I faxed them. I just received a call from the person who has my file and she said she has released my rifle! So, if you do one thing, please email the BOF through the OAG website. That is what got me in direct contact with someone who was willing to help. You need to know what your delay is and have the supporting documentation ready to send when they call. It has been a long 3 months, but I finally made it. Thank you to everyone who has helped me to this point, and I will still be on here to help anyone else who wants it. PM is best. Thank you, and good luck everyone!

AWESOME PROPS!

JDay
02-27-2013, 7:02 AM
Update:

I finally received the call I have been waiting for. I had my wife fax the documents this morning, and then I called the lady I spoke with yesterday to let her know I faxed them. I just received a call from the person who has my file and she said she has released my rifle! So, if you do one thing, please email the BOF through the OAG website. That is what got me in direct contact with someone who was willing to help. You need to know what your delay is and have the supporting documentation ready to send when they call. It has been a long 3 months, but I finally made it. Thank you to everyone who has helped me to this point, and I will still be on here to help anyone else who wants it. PM is best. Thank you, and good luck everyone!

Did you get your gun?

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2

cuat_420
02-27-2013, 7:13 AM
Did you get your gun?

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2

Not yet. I have the release letter from the FFL and I talked to them yesterday as well confirming I was good to go. I am deployed to the east coast until Friday, so I will have it my hands Friday afternoon!

PlayHard
02-27-2013, 9:42 AM
Great Job - that's awesome!

JoeyJ
02-27-2013, 10:18 AM
Not yet. I have the release letter from the FFL and I talked to them yesterday as well confirming I was good to go. I am deployed to the east coast until Friday, so I will have it my hands Friday afternoon!

Awesome news! Congratulations on surviving the system, lol. :D

SkyHawk
02-27-2013, 10:43 AM
I got a call from DOJ just now. They acknowledged they had received my paper work by fax (I sent) regarding my out of state disposition and it would be reviewed. They said my last DROS for the handgun 'slipped through' so I was lucky.

MRAR15
02-27-2013, 1:41 PM
.

She said there was no time frame I should expect, and to 'enjoy the gun I have now'. I am going to start warming up my attorneys to fight this if it goes south, better to be prepared than not.

If it is goes anything like mine has you better start priming those attorneys….

Today I finally got a hold of Justin at DOJ after getting nowhere with Sherri and Ryan last week. He looked at my records to tell me the following:

I was denied on a handgun and rifle last week as a result of a felony in AZ back in 2004. After a denial in 2010 I went through the AZ courts per the instruction of DOJ to ensure it was reduced to a misdemeanor and also had my civil rights restored including right to possess firearms. I then successfully purchased two guns without incident (Yay for me right?)...no.

I have now been denied by the deputy attorney general that pursuant to 67-100 CA does not recognize AZ's reinstatement of civil rights and doesn't care that it is now a misdemeanor that since it was once a felony my rights in CA have not been restored.

Justin advised my only recourse would be to request a governor's pardon from AZ. I contacted the Arizona Board of Executive Clemency to find that pardons are only granted for felonies to which I no longer have.

So it would appear that as it stands I am in some purgatory state having a misdemeanor and no chance for pardon. It was only at the instruction from DOJ that I followed that route in the first place and they even granted 2 guns since I jumped through those hoops!

Is there anything that I can do short of moving out of state (even though it is in the cards)?
Confused in Commufornia
:confused:

JDay
02-27-2013, 1:57 PM
If it is goes anything like mine has you better start priming those attorneys….

Today I finally got a hold of Justin at DOJ after getting nowhere with Sherri and Ryan last week. He looked at my records to tell me the following:

I was denied on a handgun and rifle last week as a result of a felony in AZ back in 2004. After a denial in 2010 I went through the AZ courts per the instruction of DOJ to ensure it was reduced to a misdemeanor and also had my civil rights restored including right to possess firearms. I then successfully purchased two guns without incident (Yay for me right?)...no.

I have now been denied by the deputy attorney general that pursuant to 67-100 CA does not recognize AZ's reinstatement of civil rights and doesn't care that it is now a misdemeanor that since it was once a felony my rights in CA have not been restored.

Justin advised my only recourse would be to request a governor's pardon from AZ. I contacted the Arizona Board of Executive Clemency to find that pardons are only granted for felonies to which I no longer have.

So it would appear that as it stands I am in some purgatory state having a misdemeanor and no chance for pardon. It was only at the instruction from DOJ that I followed that route in the first place and they even granted 2 guns since I jumped through those hoops!

Is there anything that I can do short of moving out of state (even though it is in the cards)?
Confused in Commufornia
:confused:

You might want to contact the Calguns Foundation about this since I doubt it would hold up in court.

And what is this 67-100 you speak of? All I could find was a class action case involving a concert.

http://law.justia.com/cases/california/calapp3d/67/100.html

MRAR15
02-27-2013, 2:16 PM
You might want to contact the Calguns Foundation about this since I doubt it would hold up in court.

And what is this 67-100 you speak of? All I could find was a class action case involving a concert.

http://law.justia.com/cases/california/calapp3d/67/100.html

I have sent an email in so I hope to hear back soon. Or should I call someone?

As to the 67-100 I was just writing down what Justin rattled off in his reading of the notes on the deputy AGs decision in my file. I can't find anything on it either and am having an attorney friend try to find something on it...He also rattled off 3.4 17.b but then it sounded like his final decision was off opinion 67-100 (whatany of the meant relative to my situation is unknown). I was so caught off guard by what was coming out of his mouth that my notes were less than desirable...

JDay
02-27-2013, 2:37 PM
I have sent an email in so I hope to hear back soon. Or should I call someone?

You could try calling if you want. (800) 556-2109

SkyHawk
02-27-2013, 10:11 PM
If it is goes anything like mine has you better start priming those attorneys….

I have now been denied by the deputy attorney general that pursuant to 67-100 CA does not recognize AZ's reinstatement of civil rights and doesn't care that it is now a misdemeanor that since it was once a felony my rights in CA hav
:confused:

Man that really sucks.

MRAR15
02-28-2013, 11:12 AM
But yeah it sounds like I better get lawyer'ed up again to help get this cleared up.



I don't currently have a lawyer that I am confident can assist me in this matter as it isn't their specialty. Can anybody advise me to counsel that can represent me and get this handled quickly?

Thanks in advance!

SkyHawk
02-28-2013, 12:03 PM
Not sure where you are located, but in Norcal this is my guy.

Mr. Adam J. Richards
Rothschild Wishek·& Sands LLP
901 F Street, Suite 200
Sacramento, California, 95814
(916) 444-9845
(916) 444-2768 (Facsimile)


PS - Here is the attorney list from CalGuns: http://www.calgunsfoundation.org/get-help/report-ca-doj.html

PSS - a reminder to all to please donate to CalGuns Foundation, they are looking out for us: http://www.calgunsfoundation.org/donate.html

MRAR15
02-28-2013, 12:11 PM
Thanks Skyhawk.

I will contact him. I am in central CA so that might be close enough. Glad to hear your situation should work out well for you.
Thanks again for the information.

PS - I made a donation yesterday as I am so thankful to have these guys working on our side. The good guys shouldn't be denied their freedom!

metasys
02-28-2013, 6:23 PM
So I called today around 5:00pm and had Justin answer the phone on the second ring. I told him I was calling about a delay, he asked for my drivers liscense and he told me that I was ok but there was a problem with the gun they are trying to clear up. He couldnt tell me what the problem was but I talked to the person I bought the gun from and he claims to be the original owner of the gun, he bought it in 2005. Its been almost 2 months now.

Could this be that the FFL typed in the wrong serial number into the DROS form?

btw, this is the first time anyone from the DOJ has actually given my ANY information whatsover, I have called several times a week since the beginning of January.

JDay
03-01-2013, 12:42 AM
So I called today around 5:00pm and had Justin answer the phone on the second ring. I told him I was calling about a delay, he asked for my drivers liscense and he told me that I was ok but there was a problem with the gun they are trying to clear up. He couldnt tell me what the problem was but I talked to the person I bought the gun from and he claims to be the original owner of the gun, he bought it in 2005. Its been almost 2 months now.

Could this be that the FFL typed in the wrong serial number into the DROS form?

btw, this is the first time anyone from the DOJ has actually given my ANY information whatsover, I have called several times a week since the beginning of January.

Was it a handgun? If it was a long gun the DOJ doesn't even know the model. In any case have your FFL verify the information on the DROS.

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M0RTAL_K0MBAT
03-01-2013, 6:12 AM
So is the Doj answering Calls now or something? what # have anyone got through on?

RED (Y)
03-01-2013, 6:19 AM
(916) 227-3749-is disconnected and they won't answer it anymore (this used to be Delay and Denial department) .You can call (916) 227-7527 which is General DOJ line and they will answer it,but they don't have any info why you're delayed and when you gun will be released.If you know the reason for delay there is some workarounds when you can fax your info to them,but if you don't know why-you're stuck, like me on waiting. :-(

jonzer77
03-01-2013, 6:40 AM
So the moral of this thread is to not get arrested?

tcrpe
03-01-2013, 7:14 AM
That is good policy generally.

RED (Y)
03-01-2013, 8:17 AM
So the moral of this thread is to not get arrested?
:D
Yes, Captain Obvious!
:facepalm:

I never been arrested-delayed for 2 month. :confused:

JDay
03-01-2013, 8:38 AM
(916) 227-3749-is disconnected and they won't answer it anymore (this used to be Delay and Denial department).

It's not disconnected it's just getting hammered with calls. Call it after business hours and it'll ring.

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TRICKSTER
03-01-2013, 10:15 AM
From reading through this thread, it appears that DOJ has updated their background check process and are now applying anything someone may have done in the past, even if it didn't make them a prohibited person at the time of the incident, to todays more stringent standards. Past screw ups that may have been thought to be nothing and long forgotten are coming back to haunt people. Add to that the chances of DOJ confusing you with someone else that screwed up and a anti-gun bureaucracy and you get this mess.

JDay
03-01-2013, 11:09 AM
Well I called the hotline and got through after about 20 rings. The person who answered has a serious attitude problem. I explained to her that I did a live scan and have my record sitting in front of me and that there is nothing on it that would prohibit me from owning a firearm and she proceeded to tell me that I am wrong. What I do not understand is why when I call the number that the delay letter says to call to find out why I am delayed that they are claiming that they cannot tell me why? I am tired of this and say that we should all band together and sue the state for deprivation of civil rights with no explanation or recourse. The only thing I have on my record is a failure to appear for a traffic case that ended up getting dismissed back in 2001.

JoeyJ
03-01-2013, 11:15 AM
From reading through this thread, it appears that DOJ has updated their background check process and are now applying anything someone may have done in the past, even if it didn't make them a prohibited person at the time of the incident, to todays more stringent standards. Past screw ups that may have been thought to be nothing and long forgotten are coming back to haunt people. Add to that the chances of DOJ confusing you with someone else that screwed up and a anti-gun bureaucracy and you get this mess.

Last time I spoke to anyone at DOJ they explained to me that the law changed last Feb 2012 that ALL arrest had to be investigated regardless of disposition. They were not pleased by it as it only made their jobs more time consuming and less efficient. We're talking ALL arrest not just felonies. With that said I cleared on a previous sale under those "new" requirements so it appears most likely the scenario of if there is ANY blip on your record no matter how old or the disposition we get thrown in the too much work for now pile. Personally I believe that they should have initiated a first in first out policy and closed out any BGC by the date received before working on any following months, unless they would like to pay me interest on the money I paid 2 months ago for my jailed firearms. BTW I have a pickup date of Mar 6th on a second purchase with no delay notice yet....I'm holding my breath, lol. I'm heading out of the state for 2 weeks so I'm sure I'll get something while I'm 2000 miles away, lol. I think I need a range day tomorrow!

JDay
03-01-2013, 11:22 AM
Last time I spoke to anyone at DOJ they explained to me that the law changed last Feb 2012 that ALL arrest had to be investigated regardless of disposition.

The law didn't change, DOJ made a policy (illegal backdoor legislation) that made the change.

Pinoy11B
03-01-2013, 11:22 AM
Just an update: Delayed +6 days. Called again today in DOJ to inquire of why of my delay? Lady told me she can't see my file. But suggested that the delay might be the same name, past history, or just baglogged for DOJ just recieved 24,000 BG in the last 2 weeks. She informed me that it may take from 3 to 6 weeks to get approval etc from date of delay notice. She told me to look up in the DOJ site if what I had in the past was prohibited. I said, No Ma'am for nothing within the 10 years for the misdeameanor prohibitions. I guess I just have to wait. The number I called to get through was 916 227-3752 which was given to me by the Gun Store who recived my delay letter. 3749 is no answer, and the general line, is a NO GO too. I guess I just have to wait and hope it will be done soon.

TRICKSTER
03-01-2013, 12:25 PM
Well I called the hotline and got through after about 20 rings. The person who answered has a serious attitude problem. I explained to her that I did a live scan and have my record sitting in front of me and that there is nothing on it that would prohibit me from owning a firearm and she proceeded to tell me that I am wrong. What I do not understand is why when I call the number that the delay letter says to call to find out why I am delayed that they are claiming that they cannot tell me why? I am tired of this and say that we should all band together and sue the state for deprivation of civil rights with no explanation or recourse. The only thing I have on my record is a failure to appear for a traffic case that ended up getting dismissed back in 2001.

Is there nothing on it at all, or is there something on it that you believe shouldn't cause a problem? If there is nothing on it at all, you may have a point.

JDay
03-01-2013, 12:46 PM
Is there nothing on it at all, or is there something on it that you believe shouldn't cause a problem? If there is nothing on it at all, you may have a point.

Failure to appear and a juvenile arrest. Neither are prohibiting offenses.

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JoeyJ
03-01-2013, 1:04 PM
The law didn't change, DOJ made a policy (illegal backdoor legislation) that made the change.
For whatever it's worth...those were her words to me, she specifically said "law".
I know....believe nothing that you read or hear and half of what you see, lol.

TRICKSTER
03-01-2013, 1:59 PM
Failure to appear and a juvenile arrest. Neither are prohibiting offenses.

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That is probably what they are trying to confirm.