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View Full Version : Gun laws circa 2020


Cato
08-02-2007, 9:34 PM
What do you guys predict gun laws will be like in 15 or 20 years? We have a relatively conservative Supreme Court, but a population that is growing more uncomfortable with firearms. Will the whole state look like DC or Vermont?

Pulsar
08-02-2007, 9:59 PM
I think it will look much like it does now. Younger generations don't seem to care about gun control, and if they do, they are usually against gun control. Really it's the baby boomers that are keeping the gun control issue alive. And i think you will see the anti gun crowd start to disappear as the boomers disappear.

gazzavc
08-02-2007, 10:03 PM
I hope youre right mate !!

hoffmang
08-02-2007, 10:04 PM
Heh...

There will be very few gun laws - only a few shall issue licensing regimes at most. The pro gun voting block has remained strong through a trying period while experiments in radical gun control have shown to clearly be massive failures. Add that to the return of the Bill of Rights over the next 2 to 5 years and things will be headed back to the 1900's with HSC cards.

-Gene

Liberty1
08-02-2007, 10:17 PM
I'll be able to walk over to the local Ace Hardware Store. Plop down some cash for a good old fashioned Colt 1911 and good old American .45 cal. ammo and some .22 for my kids cricket(oops I left my ID at home, no problemo none needed!). Load up the mags, chamber a round, and put it in my strong side openly worn belt holster and walk to the local public range that was just opened by funds approved by the State of California Militia and Police Committee in cooperation with the CMP to encourage national & self defense shooting skills. Ahhh....I can see it now!

CRTguns
08-02-2007, 10:20 PM
less lethal everything. Noise guns and bright flashing green lights and maybe even whistles like the bobbies have in the UK. That's personal defense of the future. Sport shooting will only be on the Playstation 4.

Maybe wars will be fought by a country's best video jockeys on an inter-continental Halo match.

tiki
08-03-2007, 6:42 AM
If someone breaks into your house or tries to commit a violent crime, you will give them state issued gift cards to convince them to stop.
Conspiracy to commit a crime will be dealt with quickly. Police will routinely walk through IKEA, Best Buy and Krispy Kreme and arrest the criminals standing in line with thier gift cards.

EastBayRidge
08-03-2007, 6:54 AM
Irrelevant. With the Singularity (http://www.kurzweilai.net/articles/art0134.html?printable=1) approaching, all you'll have to do is think of a gun, and a minute later it'll pop out of the microwave/nanotech assembler (http://nanosingularity.wordpress.com/2007/06/03/nanotech-assembler-animation/) in the kitchen !

Visualize Ma Deuce ! Cheap ammo for all !

:36:

bulgron
08-03-2007, 7:44 AM
I think Parker is going to represent a watershed event for gun rights in much the same way that Brown v. Board of Education and Roe v. Wade did for their respective causes. This is going to force all states to eventually (not all at once!) to support the original intent of the 2A at least in a grudging way. I believe that all bans against open carry will become illegal on constitutional grounds, but it'll take at least one more case beyond Parker. I also think that constitutionally-protected open carry will drive "shall issue" CCW in those states where it is not already available.

In places like CA, we'll be "shall issue" on CCW but we won't ever get back to a time where carry and possession of firearms will be done casually and without government oversight. Unfortunately, once powers of that nature are assumed by a government body, they are not so easily released again.

I expect Parker to cause CA's AW ban to be declared unconstitutional. But the state will work to come up with a new AW ban that will meet constitutional muster under a "reasonable regulation" theory. An eagerly compliant 9th circuit will go along with the new ban, only to have SCOTUS strike it down, only to have the state try again. That'll ping pong for the next decade at least until the current 9th circuit judges are replaced by old age.

In their next majority, the Dems will try for a national AW ban and other forms of gun control, only to run into Parker. But the attempt will drive a second conservative sweep into office, with, once again, disastrous results for the nation. This time the Dems will get the message, especially as the baby boomers are forced out of the DLC by time and public pressure. After that, the Dems will never again make gun control a major platform plank.

San Francisco, Chicago, New York, and other anti-gun havens will never actually comply with constitutionally-mandated gun rights, and we'll all still be sitting around in 20 years time talking about what horrible people reside in government in those cities.

How's my crystal ball looking to you today? :D

schizrade2
08-03-2007, 8:21 AM
I think Parker is going to represent a watershed event for gun rights in much the same way that Brown v. Board of Education and Roe v. Wade did for their respective causes. This is going to force all states to eventually (not all at once!) to support the original intent of the 2A at least in a grudging way. I believe that all bans against open carry will become illegal on constitutional grounds, but it'll take at least one more case beyond Parker. I also think that constitutionally-protected open carry will drive "shall issue" CCW in those states where it is not already available.

In places like CA, we'll be "shall issue" on CCW but we won't ever get back to a time where carry and possession of firearms will be done casually and without government oversight. Unfortunately, once powers of that nature are assumed by a government body, they are not so easily released again.

I expect Parker to cause CA's AW ban to be declared unconstitutional. But the state will work to come up with a new AW ban that will meet constitutional muster under a "reasonable regulation" theory. An eagerly compliant 9th circuit will go along with the new ban, only to have SCOTUS strike it down, only to have the state try again. That'll ping pong for the next decade at least until the current 9th circuit judges are replaced by old age.

In their next majority, the Dems will try for a national AW ban and other forms of gun control, only to run into Parker. But the attempt will drive a second conservative sweep into office, with, once again, disastrous results for the nation. This time the Dems will get the message, especially as the baby boomers are forced out of the DLC by time and public pressure. After that, the Dems will never again make gun control a major platform plank.

San Francisco, Chicago, New York, and other anti-gun havens will never actually comply with constitutionally-mandated gun rights, and we'll all still be sitting around in 20 years time talking about what horrible people reside in government in those cities.

How's my crystal ball looking to you today? :D

Pretty damn clear. :D

hoffmang
08-03-2007, 8:56 AM
My only quibble is that I think courts are going to say that states can choose either open carry or shall issue CCW or both, but that banning open carry in favor of shall issue will pass muster. The Antis will be forced to make the argument that shall issue is a better crime deterrent to keep people from open carrying in the alternative.

It would be better long term for gun rights for people to be able to open carry. I want to cause conversation by taking my AR to the mall.

-Gene

ghettoshecky
08-03-2007, 9:20 AM
less lethal everything. Noise guns and bright flashing green lights and maybe even whistles like the bobbies have in the UK. That's personal defense of the future. Sport shooting will only be on the Playstation 4.

Maybe wars will be fought by a country's best video jockeys on an inter-continental Halo match.

I'm not too up for the "Future Weapons" (although I wouldn't mind having them to screw around with, like unsuccessful incident where I was trying to get Pepperballs) an intercontinental Halo match sounds pretty damn TIGHT!

bulgron
08-03-2007, 9:35 AM
My only quibble is that I think courts are going to say that states can choose either open carry or shall issue CCW or both, but that banning open carry in favor of shall issue will pass muster. The Antis will be forced to make the argument that shall issue is a better crime deterrent to keep people from open carrying in the alternative.

It would be better long term for gun rights for people to be able to open carry. I want to cause conversation by taking my AR to the mall.

-Gene

I think there's a number of reasons why I think open carry bans will never pass constitutional muster. First is the infamous problem with a coat flapping open in the breeze, thereby allowing a passer-by to see a firearm. If that sort of thing is illegal, then we're effectively back to a ban on carrying.

Second, while I'm sure CC is something you might do as a member of a militia, open carry is clearly the more common practice for that kind of an exercise. If the 2A becomes interpreted broadly, as has the rest of the bill of rights, then open carry ought to become a specially protected 2A exercise due to the prefatory clause. (I don't think I said this very well so I hope I got my meaning across.)

Third, in order to use a firearm, it must be handled openly; that is, carried openly. What good is a firearm that must be concealed at all times, even when you need to use it? If I'm approaching a hostile situation, and I pull my firearm a minute or two in preparation for that, might I not be in violation of open carry bans?

Fourth, you can't conceal carry a long gun, and so total bans against open carry must be unconstitutional at least for long guns. States could then ban open carry for just pistols, but then I might have to start going everywhere with a shotgun slung on my shoulder.

At the end of the day, my assumption is that open carry will be the constitutionally-protected default exercise of "to bear arms." The fight will then center around concealed carry, because I can easily see SCOTUS saying that bans against CC are a reasonable regulation of 2A rights.

All of which brings up a point, and it is this: the fight in California should not be for "shall issue concealed carry" laws, but instead for "shall issue weapons carry" laws. If we must have a permit system, and I don't see any way around it at this time, then that system should allow either open or concealed carry of weapons, and the choice is up to the holder of the license. This is the only sort of a permit system that's guaranteed to pass constitutional muster once the 2nd is found to be an individual right that is incorporated under the 14th.

(Yes, I realize that I'm being a bit optimistic in that last sentence. :D )

aileron
08-03-2007, 11:11 AM
Heh...

There will be very few gun laws - only a few shall issue licensing regimes at most. The pro gun voting block has remained strong through a trying period while experiments in radical gun control have shown to clearly be massive failures. Add that to the return of the Bill of Rights over the next 2 to 5 years and things will be headed back to the 1900's with HSC cards.

-Gene

:) Gene your my hero sometimes.

I have seen a change since I was a child. I have put up with this banning crap right from my teenage years to now. It does feel as if now the tide is changing and people are noticing what the constitution is for.

For those that doubt it... you are a force to be reckoned with and they are feeling your presence. Get more folks involved. If all of us keep adding to our numbers they will squeal and go away.

xenophobe
08-03-2007, 11:36 AM
My only quibble is that I think courts are going to say that states can choose either open carry or shall issue CCW or both, but that banning open carry in favor of shall issue will pass muster. The Antis will be forced to make the argument that shall issue is a better crime deterrent to keep people from open carrying in the alternative.

I would agree with this.

I also think that while licensing and registration will become more an issue, overall freedom to own what you want will actually increase in states like California, e.g., shall-issue AW and MG permits.

EdinKali
08-03-2007, 12:45 PM
The terminators will have taken over by 2020 so the only people left will be the ones carrying firearms. Phased-plasma pulse rifle in 40-watt range will be the norm. ;)

Piper
08-03-2007, 7:10 PM
I am so looking forward to Parker v. D.C. finally giving us a definative response to the 2A once and for all. From everything I've read, Roberts and his band of men and woman in black can't deny that the 2A is an individual right to keep and most importantly BEAR arms. The anti's have had their moment of taking our right from us and now it is of the utmost importance for Chief Justice Roberts and his court to rule once and for all to what extent the 2A grants us this right.

It's obvious to anyone that can think and has even the minimum of intelligence that total bans don't work. People like Newsom in his cocaine fogged world are typical of those that lie and expect us to believe what they say if they say it long enough. We really need to deprogram those that have been indoctrinated into this hoplophobic cult of antigunners and show them that what they fear is a inantimate object.

Solidmch
08-03-2007, 7:22 PM
I think we will have a major war. It will be huge. Everyone will have guns to keep peace.

Bishop
08-03-2007, 7:26 PM
I believe strongly that everything happens in cycles similar to a sine wave. Right now we're just short of the extreme leftist/socialist part. Soon we'll max out and people will start to shift back to the right/libertarian side. I think 2020 is probably a good date that will see us to about the middle or just right of middle of the populace's thoughts on what purpose guns serve in society. It should be a good time for us. +20 years should be a GREAT time for us :chris:

ibanezfoo
08-04-2007, 8:55 PM
I think there will be no gun control. After 2012 whoever is left will be in mobs killing whoever you have to for survival. :eek: :gunsmilie: :leaving:

-Bryan

Liberty1
08-04-2007, 9:28 PM
Ha! I've been waiting for the 2012 stuff to come up.

ibanezfoo
08-06-2007, 7:02 AM
Ha! I've been waiting for the 2012 stuff to come up.

Well no one else was saying it so I was obligated :p

-Bryan

kilword
08-06-2007, 10:40 AM
off list laser guns *BEUUU BEUU BEUUUUUUUU*