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BayAreaShooter
11-30-2012, 8:55 PM
Just wondering what the legality of shipping "high capacity" or over 10 round magazines (disassembled) to yourself from another state. These would obviously be sen't as rebuild kits and disassembled before shipping. Is there any legal issues here? Thank you in advance.

bruss01
11-30-2012, 9:14 PM
If you were sending intact hi-caps you would be responsible for importing hi-caps which you indicate you already know is not legal.

If you were buying them in Nevada (which is legal) and disassembling them there prior to shipping them to yourself in CA (still legal) it would be no different than you buying a rebuild kit from any out-of-state mfr and having them shipped in to yourself.

Bottom line - yes it's legal. Question is, why would you bother when you can have them shipped in as rebuild kits legally and save yourself gas money and possibly meals and a motel?

Not seeing a point, unless you're at a gun show in Reno and catch a once-in-a-lifetime deal on hi-cap mags at a gun show there. Impulse buy sort of thing. Yes, it's legal. Very limited application IMHO unless there's a scenario I haven't considered.

vintagearms
11-30-2012, 10:24 PM
Just wondering what the legality of shipping "high capacity" or over 10 round magazines (disassembled) to yourself from another state. These would obviously be sen't as rebuild kits and disassembled before shipping. Is there any legal issues here? Thank you in advance.

No, but you couldn't assemble them into functional mags unless you were actually rebuilding a mag that you owned legally before the ban.

BayAreaShooter
11-30-2012, 10:24 PM
If you were sending intact hi-caps you would be responsible for importing hi-caps which you indicate you already know is not legal.

If you were buying them in Nevada (which is legal) and disassembling them there prior to shipping them to yourself in CA (still legal) it would be no different than you buying a rebuild kit from any out-of-state mfr and having them shipped in to yourself.

Bottom line - yes it's legal. Question is, why would you bother when you can have them shipped in as rebuild kits legally and save yourself gas money and possibly meals and a motel?

Not seeing a point, unless you're at a gun show in Reno and catch a once-in-a-lifetime deal on hi-cap mags at a gun show there. Impulse buy sort of thing. Yes, it's legal. Very limited application IMHO unless there's a scenario I haven't considered.


I am going on vacation in another state already so I will not be going out of the way. I will already be there. Just making sure i'm good to ship them back. (disassembled)

Thank you for the quick answer.

BayAreaShooter
11-30-2012, 10:26 PM
No, but you couldn't assemble them into functional mags unless you were actually rebuilding a mag that you owned legally before the ban.

Yes. I am clear about this. Thank you.

SMR510
11-30-2012, 11:47 PM
Could you not just put them in your luggage? Why the need to ship them?

Disassembled of course.

BayAreaShooter
12-01-2012, 12:19 AM
Could you not just put them in your luggage? Why the need to ship them?

Disassembled of course.


I suppose I could, but honestly I rather not deal with TSA on this one as a personal preference.

kaligaran
12-01-2012, 10:34 AM
I suppose I could, but honestly I rather not deal with TSA on this one as a personal preference.

Can't blame you there. I did the same thing when I moved here.

Just bought some magblocks for cheap and reassembled them into permanently modified 10 round mags when they arrived in CA.

Saym14
12-01-2012, 10:47 AM
No, but you couldn't assemble them into functional mags unless you were actually rebuilding a mag that you owned legally before the ban.

or permanantly modifying to limit to 10 rounds

morfeeis
12-01-2012, 3:55 PM
maybe i'm missing something, but if you already legally owned standard cap mags and you took them out of state, how would you commit a crime if you shipped them back to CA?

ie
Lets say i own a few legal 30 rounders and i drive to AZ with them. then once in AZ i decide i'm going to fly back and dont want to pay the extra baggage fee so i ship them Home. What PC did i violate?

Sir Stunna Lot
12-01-2012, 5:24 PM
maybe i'm missing something, but if you already legally owned standard cap mags and you took them out of state, how would you commit a crime if you shipped them back to CA?

ie
Lets say i own a few legal 30 rounders and i drive to AZ with them. then once in AZ i decide i'm going to fly back and dont want to pay the extra baggage fee so i ship them Home. What PC did i violate?

what you describe above is legal because those are legally owned high cap mags.

but the OP is referring mag kits, and that he legally doesnt own high cap mags already

remember, per PC, legal to own high cap mags, and you can take it out of state and bring it back for use. the op just didnt want to commit an import crime

rromeo
12-01-2012, 5:44 PM
I know the op is asking about something different, and that's been answered.
To clarify the last post, it is only legal to take large capacity mags out of state and bring back if you owned them prior to January 2000.
If you bought magazines as an LEO in 2005, and are now non-exempt, you do not have the same freedoms.

Sir Stunna Lot
12-01-2012, 11:48 PM
If you bought magazines as an LEO in 2005, and are now non-exempt, you do not have the same freedoms.

i think you are incorrect on this matter. in the situation you mentioned, he would have legally acquired the high cap mags in 2005, that means all of those high cap maps are legal to be possessed and since those are legally possessed, they can be taken out of state and brought back. once legal, always legal. theres no such penal code that would expire the legality of a high cap mags.

Decoligny
12-02-2012, 12:26 AM
i think you are incorrect on this matter. in the situation you mentioned, he would have legally acquired the high cap mags in 2005, that means all of those high cap maps are legal to be possessed and since those are legally possessed, they can be taken out of state and brought back. once legal, always legal. theres no such penal code that would expire the legality of a high cap mags.

You need to re-read the actual law. It clearly states that the you can only bring large capacity magazines back into the state if they were possessed in CA PRIOR to 1 Jan 2000.

It does not say that you can do so if you simply legally possessed them. They must have been possessed in CA before 1 Jan 2000.

32420. Section 32310 does not apply to the importation of a
large-capacity magazine by a person who lawfully possessed the
large-capacity magazine in the state prior to January 1, 2000,
lawfully took it out of the state, and is returning to the state with
the same large-capacity magazine.

Saym14
12-02-2012, 12:29 AM
If I was LEO and bought high cap mags in 2005. I can still retain them right ? ( previously legally owned )

Decoligny
12-02-2012, 12:34 AM
If I was LEO and bought high cap mags in 2005. I can still retain them right ? ( previously legally owned )

Presumably so.

There is a part of the PC that states that Large Capacity Magazines are a nuiscance and are subject to confiscation and destruction.

So it depends on the LEO who sees you with them, and you ability to defend yourself in court from what may be illegal siezure of proprty.

Sir Stunna Lot
12-03-2012, 12:19 AM
You need to re-read the actual law. It clearly states that the you can only bring large capacity magazines back into the state if they were possessed in CA PRIOR to 1 Jan 2000.

It does not say that you can do so if you simply legally possessed them. They must have been possessed in CA before 1 Jan 2000.

32420. Section 32310 does not apply to the importation of a
large-capacity magazine by a person who lawfully possessed the
large-capacity magazine in the state prior to January 1, 2000,
lawfully took it out of the state, and is returning to the state with
the same large-capacity magazine.

i re-read, you are correct.

ap3572001
12-03-2012, 8:32 AM
Presumably so.

There is a part of the PC that states that Large Capacity Magazines are a nuiscance and are subject to confiscation and destruction.

So it depends on the LEO who sees you with them, and you ability to defend yourself in court from what may be illegal siezure of proprty.

Nuiscance?

WHEN do the magazines become a nuiscance?

I am an LEO and shoot at public ranges all the time. People use all kinds of magazines there.

How are they a nuiscance??????

Dirty dirt
12-03-2012, 4:55 PM
No, but you couldn't assemble them into functional mags unless you were actually rebuilding a mag that you owned legally before the ban. are the mags date stamped? How would one know if its new or not. Lets say you replace the housing cause of a dent or crack then change tje spring and follower a month.later then last the bottom piece. You have a preban mag with all new parts?

MattyB
12-03-2012, 5:04 PM
are the mags date stamped? How would one know if its new or not. Lets say you replace the housing cause of a dent or crack then change tje spring and follower a month.later then last the bottom piece. You have a preban mag with all new parts?

YEP. But I'm not a lawyer//


Bit of a hi jack, are pre ban hi caps legal to use on featured rifles? I understand it that only featureless or pistols are allowed pre-ban hi-caps but not quite certain now that I think about it.

stix213
12-03-2012, 5:15 PM
are the mags date stamped? How would one know if its new or not. Lets say you replace the housing cause of a dent or crack then change tje spring and follower a month.later then last the bottom piece. You have a preban mag with all new parts?

That's the reason why this law is largely unenforceable except under very obvious circumstances (left Reno gun show after observed buying them, busted on the CA freeway on the way back), where you talked yourself into a charge ("I haven't even used these mags yet officer, I just picked them up last week"), or just tagged on as a secondary charge to someone already in hot water for something bigger just to see what else will stick.

stator
12-03-2012, 7:07 PM
Nuiscance?

How are they a nuiscance??????

It's only a nuisance if I don't own it. :)

Librarian
12-03-2012, 7:29 PM
YEP. But I'm not a lawyer//


Bit of a hi jack, are pre ban hi caps legal to use on featured rifles? I understand it that only featureless or pistols are allowed pre-ban hi-caps but not quite certain now that I think about it.

See the Magazine Qs link, below

MattyB
12-03-2012, 8:34 PM
See the Magazine Qs link, below

Thanks, I second guessed myself for some odd reason, dunno why.

ap3572001
12-04-2012, 5:56 AM
Still did not get.....

How and WHEN do the magazines that hold more than 10 rounds become a nuiscance?

What about many thousands of magazines that people in Ca had BEFORE 2000. Are they a
nuiscance?

Are my duty 15 and 22 round Glock .40 magazines a nuiscance too?

This is some weird stuff.

MattyB
12-04-2012, 9:23 AM
By my understanding of the law, ALL hi caps are nuisance items and as such can be taken by an officer and destroyed. You won't go to jail or even be ticketed but you'll never get them back.

Now that may be FUD and misinformation on my part, but the way I understand it is that YOU can legally own them and THEY can legally sieze and destroy them without judicial intervention.

Welcome to Kalifornia, where gun laws are more screwy than the politics behind them.

ap3572001
12-04-2012, 12:05 PM
By my understanding of the law, ALL hi caps are nuisance items and as such can be taken by an officer and destroyed. You won't go to jail or even be ticketed but you'll never get them back.

Now that may be FUD and misinformation on my part, but the way I understand it is that YOU can legally own them and THEY can legally sieze and destroy them without judicial intervention.

Welcome to Kalifornia, where gun laws are more screwy than the politics behind them.

Sir.

I CAN NOT on or off duty , run around public ranges , take magazines from people and destroy them.

If I did , my administration will have a long talk with me.......

Decoligny
12-04-2012, 1:38 PM
Nuiscance?

WHEN do the magazines become a nuiscance?

I am an LEO and shoot at public ranges all the time. People use all kinds of magazines there.

How are they a nuiscance??????

How are they a nuisance???????

They are a nuisance because the idiots in our legislature decided that they are a nuisance.

They actually wrote it into the law that they are a nuisance.

Because they are a nuisance, they can be confiscated and destroyed per CA PC 18010

32310. Except as provided in Article 2 (commencing with Section
32400) of this chapter and in Chapter 1 (commencing with Section
17700) of Division 2 of Title 2, commencing January 1, 2000, any
person in this state who manufactures or causes to be manufactured,
imports into the state, keeps for sale, or offers or exposes for
sale, or who gives, or lends, any large-capacity magazine is
punishable by imprisonment in a county jail not exceeding one year or
imprisonment pursuant to subdivision (h) of Section 1170.

32315. Upon a showing that good cause exists, the Department of
Justice may issue permits for the possession, transportation, or sale
between a person licensed pursuant to Sections 26700 to 26915,
inclusive, and an out-of-state client, of large-capacity magazines.

32390. Except as provided in Article 2 (commencing with Section
32400) of this chapter and in Chapter 1 (commencing with Section
17700) of Division 2 of Title 2, any large-capacity magazine is a
nuisance and is subject to Section 18010.

18010. (a) The Attorney General, district attorney, or city
attorney may bring an action to enjoin the manufacture of,
importation of, keeping for sale of, offering or exposing for sale,
giving, lending, or possession of, any item that constitutes a
nuisance under any of the following provisions:
(1) Section 19290, relating to metal handgrenades.
(2) Section 20390, relating to an air gauge knife.
(3) Section 20490, relating to a belt buckle knife.
(4) Section 20590, relating to a cane sword.
(5) Section 20690, relating to a lipstick case knife.
(6) Section 20790, relating to a shobi-zue.
(7) Section 20990, relating to a writing pen knife.
(8) Section 21190, relating to a ballistic knife.
(9) Section 21890, relating to metal knuckles.
(10) Section 22090, relating to a nunchaku.
(11) Section 22290, relating to a leaded cane or an instrument or
weapon of the kind commonly known as a billy, blackjack, sandbag,
sandclub, sap, or slungshot.
(12) Section 22490, relating to a shuriken.
(13) Section 24390, relating to a camouflaging firearm container.
(14) Section 24490, relating to a cane gun.
(15) Section 24590, relating to a firearm not immediately
recognizable as a firearm.
(16) Section 24690, relating to an undetectable firearm.
(17) Section 24790, relating to a wallet gun.
(18) Section 30290, relating to flechette dart ammunition and to a
bullet with an explosive agent.
(19) Section 31590, relating to an unconventional pistol.
(20) Section 32390, relating to a large-capacity magazine.
(21) Section 32990, relating to a multiburst trigger activator.
(22) Section 33290, relating to a short-barreled rifle or a
short-barreled shotgun.
(23) Section 33690, relating to a zip gun.
(b) These weapons shall be subject to confiscation and summary
destruction whenever found within the state.
(c) These weapons shall be destroyed in the same manner described
in Section 18005, except that upon the certification of a judge or of
the district attorney that the ends of justice will be served
thereby, the weapon shall be preserved until the necessity for its
use ceases.

MattyB
12-04-2012, 1:44 PM
Sir.

I CAN NOT on or off duty , run around public ranges , take magazines from people and destroy them.

If I did , my administration will have a long talk with me.......

This is what I understand to be law (http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showpost.php?p=7556723&postcount=46)

IMNAL but I am under the impression based on the laws listed in the above post that..

A) You can have assembled pre-ban hi caps.

B) you can use them in any firearm save for a featured centerfire rile.

C) If you do not have a Hi Cap permit, a LEO has the ability to take and destroy them although does not have the abilty to cite you for possession of them.

D) I think ex-LEO or retired LEO can possess hi caps purchased after 1/2000 but Im not sure. Im not LEO present or prior so I dont really give two ****s about what they are granted to that I am not (well I do but in a jealousy type way only).

Also as a LEO you know damn well that you could confiscate a high cap during a traffic stop that moved onto a search of the vehicle in which they were found. I dont think having LEO casing shooting ranges for hi cap infractions would go over well in regards to what you else you could be doing to stop crime but its well within your authority to actually do it.

ap3572001
12-04-2012, 1:58 PM
My God!!!!! Has the lawsuit been filed yet?????

MattyB
12-04-2012, 2:03 PM
My God!!!!! Has the lawsuit been filed yet?????

Sucks huh?

ap3572001
12-04-2012, 2:05 PM
Sucks huh?

Sucks. and smells a bit illegal too.