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View Full Version : Video of Sheriff Lee Baca discussing his CCW policy.


h.bowman
08-01-2007, 7:15 PM
http://armsandthelaw.com/archives/2007/08/la_county_sheri.php

That is a small article.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19231683/site/newsweek/

That is a Newsweek story about it.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=YKbencrdF_8

That is a video about it. Interviews include Sheriff Baca, Chief William Bratton, other LA officials, and finally, a brief discussion with Sheriff Mike Carona.

If any of this has been posted already, my apologies. I haven't seen any of this until today.

On a side note: after about 2 months of jumping through the hoops, I picked up my CA CCW today.:cool:

M. Sage
08-01-2007, 8:11 PM
Ok, OT rant, but...

Does anybody else find it absolutely retarded-looking that Baca (and other CLEOs in CA, I know Fong has four) wears five stars on his collar? Bugs the crap out of me, but I can't put a finger on why.

Well, besides the fact that Baca is a worthless, pandering scumbag who peddles influence in the open. Where's the FBI on this guy, anyway?

dfletcher
08-01-2007, 9:02 PM
Ok, OT rant, but...

Does anybody else find it absolutely retarded-looking that Baca (and other CLEOs in CA, I know Fong has four) wears five stars on his collar? Bugs the crap out of me, but I can't put a finger on why.

Well, besides the fact that Baca is a worthless, pandering scumbag who peddles influence in the open. Where's the FBI on this guy, anyway?

My grandfather got his after 31 years in the Navy and WWII. Sheriff Lee & others got theirs at Butler's Uniforms. I'd say they're worth what you did to get them.

MudCamper
08-01-2007, 9:16 PM
Does anybody else find it absolutely retarded-looking that Baca (and other CLEOs in CA, I know Fong has four) wears five stars on his collar? Bugs the crap out of me, but I can't put a finger on why.

Because they mock 4 and 5 star generals, who must be truely great men to earn them.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_%28United_States%29

CRTguns
08-01-2007, 9:23 PM
The stars are a result of the power trip these *****s are on. You could give Gandhi a badge and gun and he'd turn into a ***** and ask for some ridiculous insignia too.

glockman19
08-01-2007, 9:27 PM
More on Chief Bratton:

http://www.fulldisclosure.net/Blogs/46.php

shark92651
08-02-2007, 7:50 AM
I missed the part in that video where Baca explains why he issued a CCW permit to Sylvester Stallone :rolleyes:

cadurand
08-02-2007, 9:30 AM
I worked for a police department, not as a cop, and we got a new Chief while I was there. He got to pick how many stars he wore. He went with 3 because the Sheriff of our county wore 4 and he wanted to make sure the "chain of command" was clear.

SemiAutoSam
08-02-2007, 9:39 AM
Gandhi would not accept a gun from everything I have read about him he was a man of peace.



You could give Gandhi a badge and gun and he'd turn into a ***** and ask for some ridiculous insignia too.

CCWFacts
08-02-2007, 10:26 AM
I worked for a police department, not as a cop, and we got a new Chief while I was there. He got to pick how many stars he wore. He went with 3 because the Sheriff of our county wore 4 and he wanted to make sure the "chain of command" was clear.

Wow, that's funny because there is no chain of command. The police and sheriffs are separate entities.

Pappy91W
08-02-2007, 2:49 PM
Wow, that's funny because there is no chain of command. The police and sheriffs are separate entities.

That would be incorrect.

The Sheriff is the CHIEF Law Enforcement Officer of the COUNTY of which the city resides in and IS accountable to.

Just ask Pomona PD how close they were to becoming DEPUTIES and how many times. (Among other cities)

tacticalcity
08-02-2007, 2:55 PM
What an idiot. If you're rich, have power, or have already been victimized then you can carry a gun. But otherwise, you can't.

After I've been victimized, is too late! Dumb ***!

rips31
08-02-2007, 3:41 PM
That would be incorrect.

The Sheriff is the CHIEF Law Enforcement Officer of the COUNTY of which the city resides in and IS accountable to.

Just ask Pomona PD how close they were to becoming DEPUTIES and how many times. (Among other cities)

so then what happens if the entity is both a city and a county? there's an appointed chief of police, but an elected sheriff. who's the cleo?

SemiAutoSam
08-02-2007, 3:50 PM
If you live in the city of Los Angeles within the county of Los Angeles the Chief of LAPD if your CLEO.

On the other hand if you do not live within any city limits thats located within La County that has its on PD the CLEO is the LACO Sheriff.

so then what happens if the entity is both a city and a county? there's an appointed chief of police, but an elected sheriff. who's the cleo?

grywlfbg
08-02-2007, 4:20 PM
Wow, that makes my San Mateo County Sheriff's getting busted for going to a brothel seem downright harmless! :p

http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2007/04/24/BAGFCPEH8C9.DTL

rips31
08-03-2007, 2:02 PM
If you live in the city of Los Angeles within the county of Los Angeles the Chief of LAPD if your CLEO.

On the other hand if you do not live within any city limits thats located within La County that has its on PD the CLEO is the LACO Sheriff.

thanks, sam. what i meant was sf. it is *both* a city and a county. afaik, it's the only one in kali that is such.

M. Sage
08-03-2007, 2:31 PM
I think Fong is the CLEO for SF, whichever way you look at it.

CCWFacts
08-03-2007, 2:36 PM
That would be incorrect.

The Sheriff is the CHIEF Law Enforcement Officer of the COUNTY of which the city resides in and IS accountable to.

Just ask Pomona PD how close they were to becoming DEPUTIES and how many times. (Among other cities)

Wait, so the sheriff has authority over police within the county? I thought they were separate entities. What kind of authority does the sheriff have? Can the sheriff fire police officers, or set police department policy? If the police disobey an order from the sheriff, does the sheriff have legal recourse? Ie, if a police officer disobeys orders from his chief, that could be cause for disciplinary action, firing, etc, by the chief. If an officer disobeys a sheriff, can the same thing happen?

Cato
08-03-2007, 3:40 PM
It's encouraging to see at least one top LEO support the Second Amendment. The report seems to say it's easy to get concealed weapons permit in the OC. Is this so?

Cola King Martini
08-03-2007, 6:00 PM
It's encouraging to see at least one top LEO support the Second Amendment. The report seems to say it's easy to get concealed weapons permit in the OC. Is this so?

Getting a CCW in Orange County is not as easy as 'shall issue', but it's pretty close considering the state we live in.

tango-52
08-03-2007, 6:23 PM
It's encouraging to see at least one top LEO support the Second Amendment. The report seems to say it's easy to get concealed weapons permit in the OC. Is this so?
It is not a slam dunk. You have to be able to state a good cause (and not "Just because the 2A says I can", or "Just because I want one"). What makes you personally more likely to be a victim of crime than someone else. Go to www.calccw.com for more info. They won't write your good cause for you, but they will be happy to help you with the process. Oh, and don't take the CCW classes first, unless you just want to do it for fun. You need to make sure that the instructor is on the Sheriff's list of approved trainers. There is a gun store chain in So. Cal (the one everyone loves to hate) that is pushing CCW classes (rumor is they get a kickback). The instructor reportedly is not on the OC approved list. :eek:
Also, Avid Shooter has never been a good cause for OC. If an instructor tells you it is, you should be concerned about what else he is telling you too. And above all, never ever lie on the application or omit information because you figure they will never find out about that drug bust when you were 16 because that record was sealed, right? It is very possible in OC, but it does take a little effort. Good luck.

Bad Voodoo
08-03-2007, 6:58 PM
I think Fong is the CLEO for SF, whichever way you look at it.

:smilielol5:

Gawd, that gets funnier every time I hear it.

-voodoo

CSDGuy
08-03-2007, 8:05 PM
Wait, so the sheriff has authority over police within the county? I thought they were separate entities. What kind of authority does the sheriff have? Can the sheriff fire police officers, or set police department policy? If the police disobey an order from the sheriff, does the sheriff have legal recourse? Ie, if a police officer disobeys orders from his chief, that could be cause for disciplinary action, firing, etc, by the chief. If an officer disobeys a sheriff, can the same thing happen?

In general, the Sheriff's Department and City PD's are separate entities. The Sheriff can NOT fire PD officers, nor can the Sheriff DIRECTLY set PD policy. However, a Sheriff CAN take legal steps to disestablish a Police Department. On the other hand, the District Attorney is NOT subservient to the Sheriff's Department and could take action against the Sheriff's Department. I do not know if it is possible for either a DA's office or the DOJ to take over the administration of a Sheriff's Department or reorganize it should the need arise...

All I know for sure is that the politics of a Sheriff disestablishing a PD would not likely go over too well with the voters... so, it all gets a bit complicated.

BigDogatPlay
08-03-2007, 8:34 PM
It is very possible as the District Attorney is actually the chief law enforcement officer of the county, similarly to how the Attorney General is the same for the state and likewise the federal goverment. And for what it's worth, someplace in California law it specifies that the only officer who can arrest the elected sheriff is the coroner. Go figure.

The COP of a city police department and the sheriff of the county are the chief executive officers of their agencies and are the persons who are the most empowered under the law. They appoint and empower the deputies / officers under them and the Penal Code grants peace officer authority to those they appoint.

The wearing of stars, generally, is largely based on how layered and matrixed the command staff is. Both LAPD and LASD have online org charts that show the command staff. The two agencies have persons in ranks that have one, two, three and four stars hence the top dudes wear five.

Chief Fong of SFPD wears four because there is only three layers of command staff below her. Same with Sheriff Carona of OC. Sheriff Cogbill here in Sonoma County wears three and the two assistant sheriff's wear two. Chiefs in smaller agencies tend to wear one or two, unless they are the type that gets their jollies wearing a bunch of stars.

Smokeybehr
08-04-2007, 7:56 AM
Here's the Fresno CoP wearing his 4 stars:

http://www.csufresno.edu/alumni/2006/06/a_photo_jerry_dyer.jpg

And here's the Sheriff with her 4 stars:

http://www.fresnostatenews.com/2007/02/margaretmims.jpg

Who do you think has the real power around here?

Here's MY sheriff - notice that he doesn't have to worry about any stars.

http://www.msoexplorers.org/sitebuilder/images/Sheriff_resizeweb-185x266.jpg

He hands out CCWs like Pez, which is why we love him. He's ex-CHP and takes the job seriously.

And here's our CoP, who I've never seen in person, and I live just down the street from the old PD office where this picture was taken:
http://www.cityofmadera.org/Police/The_Department/Divisions_and_Activities/Chief_Kime.jpg

Another star lover. Fresno has about 10x the pop that Madera has, and pays their officers about 10% more.

M. Sage
08-04-2007, 11:51 AM
Lol, I just pointed out the stars to my wife, she said if she was ever elected sheriff, she'd have 10 stars. Put 'em all the way round her collar.

But yeah, the reasons above are probably why the stars bug me. IMO, this is probably the top reason behind the stars:

...they are the type that gets their jollies wearing a bunch of stars.