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Blue
07-22-2007, 4:53 PM
Which one do you guys recommend? An M261 or one of the Ceiner kits?

rksimple
07-22-2007, 5:46 PM
Both seem to have quite a following. I like my Ciener, even though J.A.C. is a jerk. I have a few thousand through mine with no problems.

bwiese
07-22-2007, 6:12 PM
I have no opinion on reliability or functionality of the variety of 22LR conversions out there; 22LR ain't my gig.

However, I will note that if you get a complete 22LR AR-pattern upper with a true 22LR barrel, you'll likely get improved accuracy. With this setup, you lose the ~0.001" 'slop' as regular 223/5.56 rifles have bores of ~0.224", while 22LRs have bores of ~0.223".

Fjold
07-22-2007, 6:22 PM
All conversion kits are never going to be as accurate as a dedicated upper, like Bill says. The actual SAAMI specs are:


SAAMI figures for .22 Long Rifle -

Bore diameter - 0.217"

Groove diameter - 0.222"

caduckgunner
07-22-2007, 6:27 PM
I would go with the Ceiner kit. It seems to be easier to get parts and 10 round mags for.

Blue
07-22-2007, 6:38 PM
The cool thing about the M261 is that the magazines insert into a regular AR magazine keeping the look/feel the same as the real deal.

bwiese
07-22-2007, 6:43 PM
Fjold,

Thank you for the correct numbers. I knew there was slop but not exact values.

blacklisted
07-22-2007, 6:57 PM
What's the difference in standard twist rates between .22lr and .223? Does this have a significant effect on accuracy? How much lead fouling is to be expected when using a conversion?

I don't plan on getting one, but these are questions that I haven't really seen satisfactory answers for.

caduckgunner
07-22-2007, 7:14 PM
I think .22 use a 1:14 or 1:17 twist, I think.

rksimple
07-22-2007, 7:24 PM
What's the difference in standard twist rates between .22lr and .223? Does this have a significant effect on accuracy? How much lead fouling is to be expected when using a conversion?



Caduck is right on the twists. As far as accuracy, with my Stag 2h and the Ciener kit, I get about 1 inch groups at 50 yards with minimags.

As far as leading, in the Air Force manual for the m261, it says to put a few 5.56 through it after firing 22lr. Blows out the gas system and removes any lead.

Blue
07-22-2007, 8:03 PM
And it'd be legal to use one of these kits in an OLL right?

grammaton76
07-23-2007, 1:23 PM
All conversion kits are never going to be as accurate as a dedicated upper, like Bill says. The actual SAAMI specs are:


SAAMI figures for .22 Long Rifle -

Bore diameter - 0.217"

Groove diameter - 0.222"

Fascinating. Fjold, you just earned a mention on thegunwiki:

http://thegunwiki.com/Gunwiki/RefARcal22lr

|-007-|
07-23-2007, 2:32 PM
My Ciener kit was worth the money. I've been trying different ammo, and so far the Winchester high velocity has worked the best. PMC Zapper did not have enough recoil to operate the mechanism and Aguila Sniper Sub Sonic often jams up. The cheap Federal .22lr works well according to another Ciener owner at my range.

However, with the sniper sub sonic I've noticed improved accuracy and range, but you do have to lob it.

Overall, it's satisfying to shoot .22 ammo like crazy since it costs so much less.

saki302
07-23-2007, 3:26 PM
Why not go all out and get an LM7 belt-fed .22LR upper? :D

It cost me a grip, but I have tons of old std-cap belts from my old 1980's Tippmann to use..
And I was wondering for awhile what I was going to do with my OLL :D

-Dave

50 Freak
07-23-2007, 9:36 PM
I use a Colt 22 conversion kit along with the Aguilar SSS (60 grain) 22LRs. Been very happy with it.

AJAX22
07-23-2007, 9:57 PM
I gave my brother a A1 upper AR with one of those 80's colt factory conversion kits, he loves it and hasn't had a problem in 2k rounds (he runs a few .223 at the end of each trip to clear the gas system)

apparently the slower twist rate works well with the .22 LR conversion.

I'm now looking for one for myself ;)

Unregistered
07-23-2007, 10:15 PM
who has dedicated 22lr uppers for sale and in stock?

Blue
07-23-2007, 10:54 PM
And it'd be legal to use one of these kits in an OLL right?

Sooo.......?

rksimple
07-24-2007, 7:59 AM
And it'd be legal to use one of these kits in an OLL right?

Of course.

Blue
07-24-2007, 9:14 PM
Of course.

With features?