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velocity101
10-17-2012, 1:15 AM
Sorry in advance if this has already been asked, my search did not yield any results. What are California laws regarding carrying a rifle like an AR in your vehicle? I drive an SUV so I cannot technically lock it in a trunk. Does it need to be locked in a case?

Librarian
10-17-2012, 1:25 AM
No.

See the wiki -- http://wiki.calgunsfoundation.org/Transporting

Dhena81
10-17-2012, 1:28 AM
School zones are your enemy just lock it without loaded magazines in the firearm.

jeffrice6
10-17-2012, 2:58 AM
Its just a rifle....... Long gun rules apply

bighead
10-17-2012, 9:05 AM
What I don't understand is if the glove compartment has a lock why a pistol without a magazine in it cannot be stored.What is the rationale behind this?

mif_slim
10-17-2012, 9:32 AM
^ lawmakers. That explains everything.

edgerly779
10-17-2012, 9:35 AM
Within reach and control of driver plus when stopped and asked for license and registration usually in glove box so it is a good way to get shot or tasered. duh.

locosway
10-17-2012, 10:07 AM
No.

See the wiki -- http://wiki.calgunsfoundation.org/Transporting

This is correct until January... :)

velocity101
10-17-2012, 10:10 AM
Great! Thanks all for the replies.

RED VASQUEZ
10-17-2012, 2:42 PM
This is correct until January... :)

What happens in january?

HK35
10-17-2012, 3:04 PM
What happens in january?
SHTF :shrug:

Librarian
10-17-2012, 3:15 PM
This is correct until January... :)
No, correct until something else changes - the 2014 'no open carry' of rifles change applies OUTSIDE a vehicle, and both the context of the OP and the wiki link apply to vehicle transport.

xpbprox
10-17-2012, 3:20 PM
SHTF :shrug:

Hahaha

SNCaliber
10-17-2012, 4:14 PM
I usually have it in my case with a gun lock on it and magazine out of the rifle

send it_hit
10-17-2012, 5:18 PM
I usually have it in my case with a gun lock on it and magazine out of the rifle

heard of people having issue with transporting in this configuration... PD considered it "able to accept high capacity mags." While I'm aware it's not illegal to transport with an empty magwell, personally I keep an empty magazine in it.

Librarian, can you give any input on that? What would you suggest?

Josh.Ollar
10-17-2012, 5:24 PM
^^


i was also told to keep a empty mag in the AR so the bullet button can do its job. other than that its just a long rifle

Harrison_Bergeron
10-17-2012, 5:39 PM
That's not logical, it is mixing two different features. It either accepts a detachable mag, which cannot be determined by an empty mag well, or it has a fixed mag with a capacity greater than 10, which an empty mag well does not satisfy.

PD considered it "able to accept high capacity mags."

dragon7
10-17-2012, 5:46 PM
Ditto -- regarding leaving a bullet button locked mag in the rifle during transport.

tacticalcity
10-17-2012, 5:54 PM
Quick and minor terminology correction. Carrying has a specific meaning with regards to firearms. You are "transporting" it and not carrying it in your vehicle. I'm not entirely sure how you would carry an AR in your vehicle unless it were on your lap or doing something not only uadvisable but really odd. You could carry a handgun in your car by simply having it in your holster (if you have a carry permit).

Everybody knows what you meant but the way the title reads leads to a cocked eyebrow or two.

Maltese Falcon
10-17-2012, 6:11 PM
So I just realized something. My domicile abuts a private school at the back soccer field area, i.e., we are essentially neighbors.

As soon as I leave my driveway and place wheels on the public street, I have to have the long guns locked up?

Due to the layout of the area I sincerely doubt this would ever come up, you can't even tell it's a school area unless you knew in advance, but an over-zealous enforcement is possible.

Is there a difference between a private and public school and does it have to be posted as a 'School" with a yellow sign?

Otherwise how would you know?

.

Librarian
10-17-2012, 6:54 PM
So I just realized something. My domicile abuts a private school at the back soccer field area, i.e., we are essentially neighbors.

As soon as I leave my driveway and place wheels on the public street, I have to have the long guns locked up?

Due to the layout of the area I sincerely doubt this would ever come up, you can't even tell it's a school area unless you knew in advance, but an over-zealous enforcement is possible.

Is there a difference between a private and public school and does it have to be posted as a 'School" with a yellow sign?

Otherwise how would you know?

.

Yes, you need your long guns locked in a school zone; those apply to K-12, public or private.

The phrasing is (b) Any person who possesses a firearm in a place that the
person knows, or reasonably should know, is a school zone,
One might successfully defend on that point, but it doesn't seem a thread I want to hang my freedom on.

slo5oh
10-17-2012, 8:11 PM
Maltese,
Google gfsz and read the wiki page. I came across some interesting stuff in the wiki, we can only hope the whole gfsz law gets thrown out because of it, but some days I dream.

Hanse Davion
10-17-2012, 8:18 PM
I heard from a certain staff member at a certain range that unless I was law enforcement I am not allowed to carry magazines with the ammunition in them when transporting firearms. Basically I walked into the range to shoot and had my magazines loaded but the magazines themselves were not in the weapon. He said they had a training session with a DOJ official that told them this (alarm bells already went off in my head). I know that transporting mazazines in the same locked container is ok, but I do not see anything regarding the magazines loaded themselves in California or Federal law. Thus I conclude the certain staff member was spreading FUD through the FUD of a certain DOJ official. Correct?

707electrician
10-17-2012, 8:25 PM
Yes. Loaded magazines are fine when not inserted into the firearm

GettoPhilosopher
10-17-2012, 9:34 PM
I heard from a certain staff member at a certain range that unless I was law enforcement I am not allowed to carry magazines with the ammunition in them when transporting firearms. Basically I walked into the range to shoot and had my magazines loaded but the magazines themselves were not in the weapon. He said they had a training session with a DOJ official that told them this (alarm bells already went off in my head). I know that transporting mazazines in the same locked container is ok, but I do not see anything regarding the magazines loaded themselves in California or Federal law. Thus I conclude the certain staff member was spreading FUD through the FUD of a certain DOJ official. Correct?

Oldest FUD in the book. Even the friggin' CHP website will tell you loaded mags are fine SO LONG AS ROUNDS ARE NOT IN A POSITION TO BE LOADED/FIRED.

In the tube? No. In the magazine attached to the gun? No. In a magazine next to the gun? Yes. Shot shells in a side saddle? Yes. Etc.

velocity101
10-17-2012, 10:03 PM
Oldest FUD in the book. Even the friggin' CHP website will tell you loaded mags are fine SO LONG AS ROUNDS ARE NOT IN A POSITION TO BE LOADED/FIRED.

In the tube? No. In the magazine attached to the gun? No. In a magazine next to the gun? Yes. Shot shells in a side saddle? Yes. Etc.

Glad there are knowledgeable people in here setting the story straight!

sharxbyte
10-18-2012, 1:40 PM
Yes, you need your long guns locked in a school zone; those apply to K-12, public or private.

The phrasing is One might successfully defend on that point, but it doesn't seem a thread I want to hang my freedom on.

You are exempted to and from your vehicle though, as long as you live within the school zone IIRC, but I cant find the exact code

(c) Subdivision (b) does not apply to the possession of a
firearm under any of the following circumstances:
(1) Within a place of residence or
place of business or
on private property,
if the place of residence, place of business, or private
property is not part of the school grounds and the possession
of the firearm is otherwise lawful.

velocity101
10-18-2012, 3:15 PM
What's the law if in-route to somewhere you use a main street that happens to pass by a school? I guess don't get pulled over near a school zone or by a cop that knows you passed by it?

Silent909
10-18-2012, 3:23 PM
does it have to be locked in a hard case or is a padded case good as well?

Just-in
10-18-2012, 4:31 PM
The laws are so confusing it is eat to cover all angles IMO to avoid unnecessary ****. Keep mags unloaded, keep ammo seperate, why do you really need loaded mags anyway is going to be a hard question to answer without pissing off the law or inviting a hard time. Keep guns locked. Pistols in a locked container, I travel with my at with an empty mag in the well and a lock through the ejection port. This state is so *** backward

myk
10-18-2012, 4:48 PM
The laws are so confusing it is eat to cover all angles IMO to avoid unnecessary ****. Keep mags unloaded, keep ammo seperate, why do you really need loaded mags anyway is going to be a hard question to answer without pissing off the law or inviting a hard time. Keep guns locked. Pistols in a locked container, I travel with my at with an empty mag in the well and a lock through the ejection port. This state is so *** backward

AGREED. We can sit here and discuss the law all we want to, but when you're pulled over by a belligerent LEO who's having a bad day and doesn't know the first thing about gun laws then you could be in a world of hurt. I drive around with my 'AR a lot because of my schedule, but the ejection port is locked, the mag is unloaded, the 'ammo is separate, and all of those containers are locked. Lately, I've been placing an empty 'mag in the well, because upon inspection it would look like the 'AR is capable of "detaching" its 'mag. Even with this super-paranoid arrangement I'm sure that one of these days I'm going to wind up in jail because of an LEO that doesn't know about this sort of thing...

GettoPhilosopher
10-19-2012, 6:29 PM
AGREED. We can sit here and discuss the law all we want to, but when you're pulled over by a belligerent LEO who's having a bad day and doesn't know the first thing about gun laws then you could be in a world of hurt. I drive around with my 'AR a lot because of my schedule, but the ejection port is locked, the mag is unloaded, the 'ammo is separate, and all of those containers are locked. Lately, I've been placing an empty 'mag in the well, because upon inspection it would look like the 'AR is capable of "detaching" its 'mag. Even with this super-paranoid arrangement I'm sure that one of these days I'm going to wind up in jail because of an LEO that doesn't know about this sort of thing...

The law is the law. I drive with my featureless AR locked in a guitar case, bolt back, safety off, loaded (legally owned) preban mags in the case.

I don't need to explain why I "need" that; there is no legal reason a cop would be searching my vehicle, and I sure as hell would never consent to a search. If it went that far A. I have copies of PC, flowchart, DOJ letter re rebuilds all in my case, and B. I'd have a nice broken lock for evidence to help Jason Davis buy a new car.

Now, am I saying be stupid? Of course not. I don't have the case visible from the outside of my car, and I don't plan on going all belligerent on someone who pulls me over. But "oh noes, don't exercise my rights lest a cop someday maybe disagree"? If that's your motto, why in the heck do you have an evil loophole OLL/bullet button in the first place? Yee and Kamala Harris say they're naughty. :p

Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk 2

10rounds
10-19-2012, 6:52 PM
Traveling with Firearms in California from the DOJ web site.
http://oag.ca.gov/firearms/travel

California Penal Code Section 12026.1
http://apps.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/appndxa/penalco/penco12026_1.htm

California Penal Code Section 12025
http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/appndxa/penalco/penco12025.htm

myk
10-19-2012, 7:44 PM
F**k man I might print that out and ride along with it. Yes, the law is the law, but again there are ignorant LEO's just like citizens (for example, everyone at the range looks at my Colt M4 and just RUNS) and ultimately the LEO controls traffic stops or other interactions with citizens 100%; you can't argue with them and it's up to the courts to decide your innocence. But again, I won't change my schedule either. I will continue to drive with my AR if need be...

AeroEngi
10-19-2012, 7:58 PM
The law is the law. I drive with my featureless AR locked in a guitar case, bolt back, safety off, loaded (legally owned) preban mags in the case.

I don't need to explain why I "need" that; there is no legal reason a cop would be searching my vehicle, and I sure as hell would never consent to a search. If it went that far A. I have copies of PC, flowchart, DOJ letter re rebuilds all in my case, and B. I'd have a nice broken lock for evidence to help Jason Davis buy a new car.

Now, am I saying be stupid? Of course not. I don't have the case visible from the outside of my car, and I don't plan on going all belligerent on someone who pulls me over. But "oh noes, don't exercise my rights lest a cop someday maybe disagree"? If that's your motto, why in the heck do you have an evil loophole OLL/bullet button in the first place? Yee and Kamala Harris say they're naughty. :p

Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk 2

I totally agree with everything you just said here but we all need to stop referring to the bullet button as a loophole. It just gives the anti's more ammunition against us.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

Bigtwin
10-19-2012, 8:21 PM
I totally agree with everything you just said here but we all need to stop referring to the bullet button as a loophole. It just gives the anti's more ammunition against us.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

+10000

It is NOT a LOOPHOLE, it is following the LAW!

Harrison_Bergeron
10-19-2012, 9:22 PM
I read it to be more of a dig at people who insist on treating things like empty mag wells and legally owned high caps as illegal "just to be safe" yet have no problem owning and transporting an evil black rifle. You either follow the legislator's intent, or you follow the letter of the legislation, picking and choosing is just illogical. If you are following the intent, then BBs are a loophole that you should be just as afraid of.

I totally agree with everything you just said here but we all need to stop referring to the bullet button as a loophole. It just gives the anti's more ammunition against us.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

GettoPhilosopher
10-20-2012, 2:31 PM
I totally agree with everything you just said here but we all need to stop referring to the bullet button as a loophole. It just gives the anti's more ammunition against us.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

+10000

It is NOT a LOOPHOLE, it is following the LAW!

I read it to be more of a dig at people who insist on treating things like empty mag wells and legally owned high caps as illegal "just to be safe" yet have no problem owning and transporting an evil black rifle. You either follow the legislator's intent, or you follow the letter of the legislation, picking and choosing is just illogical. If you are following the intent, then BBs are a loophole that you should be just as afraid of.

Yeah, sorry if the sarcasm didn't translate well, I was typing on mobile.

My point was, as Harrison pointed out, I don't understand the combination of "oh noes, take the upper off, put a cable lock through the ejection port, put an empty mag in the lower, and keep the ammo locked in a separate locked box in a separate container JUST TO BE SURE!!!" and "I'm going to buy an OLL". If you're that scared of the cops, why buy an OLL at all?

tanakasan
10-20-2012, 3:05 PM
does it have to be locked in a hard case or is a padded case good as well?

Padded case is OK. Lock it through the zipper pulls with one of those tiny luggage locks.

Robert

myk
10-20-2012, 8:32 PM
If you're that scared of the cops, why buy an OLL at all?

This is a police state, brother, you know that. Fear of ignorant cops is completely justified in this a** backwards state, and there are a ton of threads in this forum alone that speak of law abiding gunners running into problems with the law. I will stress again that I will exercise my 2A rights, ignorant cops or not, because as I look at it, there's risk we take going through anything in life...

GettoPhilosopher
10-21-2012, 2:05 PM
This is a police state, brother, you know that. Fear of ignorant cops is completely justified in this a** backwards state, and there are a ton of threads in this forum alone that speak of law abiding gunners running into problems with the law. I will stress again that I will exercise my 2A rights, ignorant cops or not, because as I look at it, there's risk we take going through anything in life...

Like I said, it's the contrast that threw me. I'm with you on that last sentence, and I understand other people prefer to be more conservative.

I don't understand taking a low risk on an OLL then refusing to take an even lower risk on using your legally owned prebans.

RileyBean
10-21-2012, 3:36 PM
Not saying this is "correct" - but I keep AR in hard case, empty 10 round in well (BB rifle), luggage lock on case, 3 full 10/20 mags in separate pistol hard case (also with luggage lock, same 3 digit combo).

Librarian
10-21-2012, 3:54 PM
Not saying this is "correct" - but I keep AR in hard case (1), empty 10 round in well (BB rifle) (2), luggage lock on case (3), 3 full 10/20 mags in separate pistol hard case (4) (also with luggage lock, same 3 digit combo)(5).

If you're happy with that, that's well within the requirements of current and Jan 2013 law. Nothing wrong with being blatantly in compliance!

Just to re-cap:

(1)Either hard or soft case would be fine.

(2)A BB or other magazine lock equipped long gun does not require a mag in it. The whole point is to be able to drop a mag using a tool to operate the mag lock, and that will be required whenever a magazine is inserted in that mag well. The gun itself is modified so it can no longer accept 'detachable' magazines; that seems to be too subtle a point for some folks.

(3)A locked case for a long gun is required (today) only to pass through school zones (Federal law - California GFSZ ignores long guns); your trunk, if you have one, is fine. (Registered 'assault weapons' require the locked case for transport all the time, except for Bill Wiese who puts bullet buttons on his OLLs for transport. :D)

A locked case for a long gun will become necessary in Jan 2013, for outside a vehicle, if that case is not designed as a gun case. (If it IS a gun case, just needs to completely enclose the gun.)

(4)Ammunition, in or out of magazines, may be transported in the same case as the gun (so long as no ammunition is actually in the gun.)

(5)Ammunition need not be transported locked up.

RileyBean
10-21-2012, 4:48 PM
Good to know I have it covered all around - and if I did not have my hot CCW, and S did HTF, it would take all of 5 seconds to have hot AR in my hands.

artoaster
10-21-2012, 5:20 PM
I get really tired of the suggestion of an empty mag to prove it's non-detachable.

If one were to see a firearm and it had no magazine in it at least that begins the logic of possibly an unloaded firearm. Confirmation of an empty chamber completes the process of determining an unloaded firearm.

Why skip over A. to get to step B. when transporting a firearm and make the weapon look more likely to be loaded?

Silly laws don't need silly responses. The existence of a working bullet button requiring a tool meets the requirement. Why overthink this sh*t.

Daze
10-22-2012, 5:37 PM
I've started just keeping the upper and lower disassembled, I can reassemble the weapon in 2 seconds flat and I'm not carrying it for self defense so I figure better safe than sorry ( I've had a few people I know get zinged for stupid things they did with their rifles and loose them.) My case is big enough to accommodate the weapons in two pieces so for me it was as simple as re positioning the fastening straps. Just one persons .2 cents though.

Librarian
10-22-2012, 6:39 PM
I've started just keeping the upper and lower disassembled, I can reassemble the weapon in 2 seconds flat and I'm not carrying it for self defense so I figure better safe than sorry ( I've had a few people I know get zinged for stupid things they did with their rifles and loose them.) My case is big enough to accommodate the weapons in two pieces so for me it was as simple as re positioning the fastening straps. Just one persons .2 cents though.

Well, if you want to do that, it's OK, but the issue is transporting a firearm - and a disassembled firearm is still a firearm.

Kokopelli
10-22-2012, 8:16 PM
Thanks Librarian!

residentbazinga
10-23-2012, 11:50 AM
Ive read this entire thread and still nobody answered the question about SUV transportation... The only reason i bring this up is because i also own an suv and that is what i drive to the range... If the rifle is all the way in the back as far as it can be with a cable lock through the magwell and the case also has a padlock on it and all ammo is toward the front of the vehicle (whether loaded in magazines or not), is that considered legal transportation??? Im only refering to transporting rifles in an SUV, not handguns...

Librarian
10-23-2012, 12:28 PM
Ive read this entire thread and still nobody answered the question about SUV transportation... The only reason i bring this up is because i also own an suv and that is what i drive to the range...

If
the rifle is all the way in the back as far as it can be

with a cable lock through the magwell

and the case also has a padlock on it

and all ammo is toward the front of the vehicle

(whether loaded in magazines or not), is that considered legal transportation???

Im only refering to transporting rifles in an SUV, not handguns...
I may have missed it, but I think yours is the first to mention an SUV.

There are many vehicles that do not have a 'trunk', that very useful built-in locked container.

For (non-'registered assault weapon') long guns, inside a motor vehicle, California law has no restrictions whatsoever - no lock of any kind, no case of any kind. You could drive around with an unloaded uncased unlocked AR across your lap if you like.

And, no law, either California or Federal, cares about the transportation of ammo - no case required, no lock required, no separation from either the driver or any of the guns required.

Federal Gun Free School Zone law requires a locked case or locked gun rack for long guns.

Beginning in 2013, the new 'no open carry of long guns' law requires - for OUTSIDE A VEHICLE - a case designed as a gun case that completely covers the gun, or any other completely covering case NOT designed as a gun case, locked.

And cable/trigger locks have no legal application regarding CA transport rules; all CA law regarding locks and transportation refer to a completely enclosing locked case, for which a cable lock does not qualify. Cable/trigger locks are 'check off' items for FFLs when delivering a purchased gun - no lock (or, in the case of long guns, safe affidavit), illegal for the FFL to hand over the gun to the purchaser.

Again, please read the wiki article -- http://wiki.calgunsfoundation.org/Transporting. This stuff is FAQ, and it's all collected there.

The thread has circled the same info several times - no new info available. Closed.