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View Full Version : Help IDing a iver johnson single shot SG


chillincody
08-23-2012, 2:57 PM
Hello everyone

Im here hoping that some one can help me Id this shotgun I have , the only markings I can see on it are

Receiver is marked with Iver johnson arms .........fit...(im guessing is fitchburg. mass )

under trigger guard it says 1781B ? any way to date the gun based on this?


barrel says on top 12 gauge full mod choke ( I think )
and its a little less than 26 in barrel
http://i1186.photobucket.com/albums/z361/chillincody420/082312145129.jpg
http://i1186.photobucket.com/albums/z361/chillincody420/082312145217.jpg

So what do you guys say
Is it worth anything ?
how old do you say it is?
And what model is it ?
I went to el cajon gun exchange and they said id was a winchester model 37 ( because the butt plate said winchester :rolleyes:) and charged me to tell me totally wrong info:( well thanks for reading and hope you can help

chillincody
08-24-2012, 2:46 PM
so no one has any info?? Where are the sg gurus at?

ouch1
08-24-2012, 3:22 PM
There is not alot of info out there on the interwebz on these old skatterguns. But I have a funny feeling someone is looking through some books for info for you.

-ouch1

chillincody
08-24-2012, 3:30 PM
There is not alot of info out there on the interwebz on these old skatterguns. But I have a funny feeling someone is looking through some books for info for you.

-ouch1

Yeah Ive been looking online for a while cant find any helpful info which is why I posted this thread You know its a tough ? when calgunners are looking in books lol

sephy
08-24-2012, 4:45 PM
That's an Iver Johnson Champion. You are correct about Fitchburg, Mass.

Here are some links to some on gunbroker, some with detailed pictures of the receiver markings:

1 (http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=302151473)
2 (http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=300963562)
3 (http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=302836034)
4 (http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=302463533)

Some information on the gun and serials:

iver johnson single barrel champion shotguns with a single letter suffix to the serial number were manufactured between 1920 and 1929. it seem that most of the 410 were used quite a bit and very few are in excellent condition. the original finish was an oil finished stock, browned barrel and case hardened frame.

CHAMPION MODEL 36--------------------------------1909-1922
Single barrel; rebounding center mounted hammer; top lever operated break open design; gauges: 12, 16, and 20; barrel length: 28, 30, and 32 inches (features barrel and lug forged in one piece) bored full chock only; American black Walnut butt stock and fore-end; automatic extractors; weight 6 pounds; overall length with 30 inch barrel 45 inches; case hardened receiver (nickel available as option), browned barrel; automatic ejectors extra cost option; .410 bore, 24 and 28 gauges offered in 1913; 24 gauge dropped 1928; all gauges except 12 dropped after 1941; name changed to Champion single Barrel in 1917.
CHAMPION SINGLE BARREL---------------------------1923-1978
This is the same gun as the earlier Model 36 champion except that the smaller gauges are now built on the same frame as the large gagues. See above picture for specifications. The exact year production stopped has not yet been determined. Some of these single barrel shotguns have been seen with Canadian marking, these were most likely shipped to Canada and then marked as there is no evidence that Iver Johnson’s Arms & Cycle Works ever had a manufacturing factory in Canada
VALUE: 100%=$250 60%=$95
Add 15% for 24, 28 gauges
Link to above discussion (http://www.thefirearmsforum.com/showthread.php?t=75429)

Later they switched to the serial in all letters LINK (http://www.antiqueguns.com/phorum/read.php?10,10396,10396#msg-10396)

From the information I gathered from those two people, I figure that your shotgun, being the "B" in Fitchburg, is from 1925 (just my guess).

The values you see on Gunbroker are pretty accurate. There are a lot of them out there. They are great little guns though and a lot of people have learned to shoot with them.

chillincody
08-24-2012, 5:02 PM
That's an Iver Johnson Champion. You are correct about Fitchburg, Mass.

Here are some links to some on gunbroker, some with detailed pictures of the receiver markings:

1 (http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=302151473)
2 (http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=300963562)
3 (http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=302836034)
4 (http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=302463533)

Some information on the gun and serials:


Link to above discussion (http://www.thefirearmsforum.com/showthread.php?t=75429)

Later they switched to the serial in all letters LINK (http://www.antiqueguns.com/phorum/read.php?10,10396,10396#msg-10396)

From the information I gathered from those two people, I figure that your shotgun, being the "B" in Fitchburg, is from 1925 (just my guess).

The values you see on Gunbroker are pretty accurate. There are a lot of them out there. They are great little guns though and a lot of people have learned to shoot with them.

Awesome man thanks that is the info I was looking for :DI owe you a beer didnt think it was that old and didnt know that H&R now owns iver johnson . but now I know

BigDogatPlay
08-25-2012, 11:31 AM
Been off the board for a few days. :)

Gun is definitely a Champion. I own examples in 16 and in.410. Both of my guns have a much narrower, less hand filling fore end than the OPs and mine have a slight Schnabel under cut at the front of the fore end.

The number behind the trigger guard ending in B is the serial number. If you pop the fore end off the serial number, more than likely without the B, should be stamped into the wood and it should - hopefully - match the serial number behind the trigger guard.

The 16 I have is a full choked 30 inch barrel with a solid rib and is ejector only. Grip and fore end are tastefully but modestly checkered. I learned to shoot trap with this gun in my late teens and it has a number of 25 straights to it's credit. I rarely shoot it anymore because 16 gauge ammo is hard to find and I don't reload for it but the bore is bright with zero corrosion and it's ready to go.

Have fun with yours.

HatersLOVEme : )
08-26-2012, 10:49 AM
I have one of those chambered in 410 that was sold by Montgomery Wards under their Hercules line name but from my research its a Iver Johnson Champion just re badged / made specifically for Wards your lucky yours is stamped / numbered mine doesn't have any identification markings on it that I could see it was a pain in the butt to find info on it even more so since I think someone had shortened the barrel to 18" make it a truck / snake gun so I didn't even barrel length to go on . Nice quality single shot no really worth a whole lot but many of a shooter cut their teeth / learned on this very type of shotgun ( I have even heard of Guys getting them machined / bored out for 3" magnum loads ) thanks for sharing :yes:

chillincody
08-26-2012, 1:36 PM
I have one of those chambered in 410 that was sold by Montgomery Wards under their Hercules line name but from my research its a Iver Johnson Champion just re badged / made specifically for Wards your lucky yours is stamped / numbered mine doesn't have any identification markings on it that I could see it was a pain in the butt to find info on it even more so since I think someone had shortened the barrel to 18" make it a truck / snake gun so I didn't even barrel length to go on . Nice quality single shot no really worth a whole lot but many of a shooter cut their teeth / learned on this very type of shotgun ( I have even heard of Guys getting them machined / bored out for 3" magnum loads ) thanks for sharing :yes:

I didnt know it even had markings until i stripped it down to bare metal and with the use of a mag glass I was barely able to make out a few markings . And would it even need to be bored out to use the 3 in mag rounds ? I was always told it could use 2 3/4 or 3 in shot shells is there a diffrence ??

BigDogatPlay
08-26-2012, 9:27 PM
Three inch shells = no, in that gun. 2 3/4 inch only.

The longer the shell, the more shot it will hold. While velocity of comparable loads between 2 3/4 inch and three inch remains the same, more weight of charge = more powder required to achieve the same velocity. Many modern guns are made to accept three inch shells and will also accept 2 3/4. A 2 3/4 chamber more often than not will not accept a three inch length shell, and for an older gun that was made decades before the three inch shell was first created, I would not do any kind of chamber conversion.

chillincody
08-26-2012, 9:41 PM
thanks big dog :) that makes sense