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View Full Version : Dealer wrong on PPT profitability


gunprofit
08-08-2012, 1:14 PM
As many of you know, I work in a gunshop and don't have a fondness for PPT. Most of them are a pain with no profit. However, I have taken on PPTs as a personal challenge to turn them into something other than a time consuming non-profit situation. And, I freely and publicly admit that I am wrong about PPTs. Not all of them are profitless. Today, I had my first PPT that I was able to turn into 2 additional gun sales, with ammo, gun cleaning equipment, carrying cases, scope, etc. The total sales from this transaction was over $3,000.00. What I have been doing with PPTs is killing them with kindness, customer service and so on. As with all my customers, I try to find some sort of common ground to start with. My customer being a former Marine as myself, probably helped. Anyway, things went well for all involved. And, being man enough to admit misgivings concerning PPTs, I am writing this thread. I am sure all of the Calgunners are about to say "told you so", concerning PPTs. There you go, a dealer who admits his mistakes.

DVSmith
08-08-2012, 1:16 PM
Nice! Glad you found a way to make PPT work for you and your customers!

bohoki
08-08-2012, 1:18 PM
yes a ppt can be done efficiently it they would just make a good written procedure maybe have a pamphlet to hand out explaining all the things the buyer and seller need to provide

RedFord150
08-08-2012, 1:38 PM
Many retail businesses use 'Loss Leaders' as a way too get customers in the door. The belief is that the customer will buy profitable products or services while he is in thne store or will returm to spend his $ at a later date.
A 'loss leader' is a product or service sold at or below cust. This is no profit or a loss to the seller.
Do you think McDonald's makes a profit on the dollar menu or your local grocery store on a 19 cent watermelon?
You are a smart guy. You took your no profit PPT, made a very profitable sale, and probably got a customer for years too come.
How did you do it you say? You treated him well and made him want to buy from you.
You might be the first guy in retail gun sales to discover the secret to customer service :-0

Flintlock Tom
08-08-2012, 2:37 PM
Okay, so where's your shop so the rest of us can take advantage of your unique approach?

RazzB7
08-08-2012, 2:44 PM
Nice! Would you spread the word to other gunshops? So far you and TenPercent are the only ones I've seen who "get" this.

Curley Red
08-08-2012, 2:48 PM
If a business denies doing a PPT for me I will never shop there again, so it would be a loss to them. And when I do a PPT, if I am the one getting the gun I always buy something else at the time of picking up the gun and would come back again for more items.

So to deny me would be a permanent loss of my business and probably to the people that I tell.

russ69
08-08-2012, 3:27 PM
In any business, if you treat people in a fair and respectful manner, you will have a repeat customer. I buy a lot of gun stuff, you may not know me because I don't hang out in your store, but if you have nice stuff, at a fair price, I might drop a couple of thousand bucks on my next visit. However if I see you giving another customer a hard time, I'll just slip out the door and stay far away from your place of business.
I don't NEED anymore guns, I buy guns because it's fun. Take the fun away and I'm out of there.

Tripper
08-08-2012, 3:31 PM
I, for one, have a new mission

finding that 19cent watermelon

bohoki
08-08-2012, 5:43 PM
safeway got in trouble for selling gas as a loss leader

http://lawblog.legalmatch.com/2011/05/04/safeway-sued-for-selling-cheap-gas/

Eddy's Shooting Sports
08-08-2012, 5:47 PM
As many of you know, I work in a gunshop and don't have a fondness for PPT. Most of them are a pain with no profit. However, I have taken on PPTs as a personal challenge to turn them into something other than a time consuming non-profit situation. And, I freely and publicly admit that I am wrong about PPTs. Not all of them are profitless. Today, I had my first PPT that I was able to turn into 2 additional gun sales, with ammo, gun cleaning equipment, carrying cases, scope, etc. The total sales from this transaction was over $3,000.00. What I have been doing with PPTs is killing them with kindness, customer service and so on. As with all my customers, I try to find some sort of common ground to start with. My customer being a former Marine as myself, probably helped. Anyway, things went well for all involved. And, being man enough to admit misgivings concerning PPTs, I am writing this thread. I am sure all of the Calgunners are about to say "told you so", concerning PPTs. There you go, a dealer who admits his mistakes.


I share your sentiment, but the hard facts, at least in my shop, are that PPT's rarely lead to follow up sales. I did have one exception recently like you, where a customer who came for a PPT from one of my regulars and has come back and bought three guns in the last 6 weeks or so.

It's not an attitude thing, just check my reviews, its that PPT's are done at shops that are centrally located between buyers. Most people have their "regular" shop closer to their home. I do PPT's and try to make them as smooth as possible, but I still think it something the state should be doing or at least allow dealers to charge a fee that more realistically covers their costs.

snook135
08-08-2012, 6:07 PM
Well done but it all comes down to customer service

STI
08-08-2012, 6:25 PM
Last year I was selling a rifle and I searched online for a gun store that was halfway between the buyer and I. I found Addax Tactical and we met there. I had never heard of them before that, but while I was there I looked around and liked the AR's they were making and ended up buying a $1700 AR15. Since then I have found several other gun stores while searching for a place to PPT. If they are dicks about PPT then I will not consider them for gun purchases.

gunprofit
08-08-2012, 6:33 PM
It's a real pleasure to read Calgunners positive comments. I appreciate the insight. The name of the store is Barnwood Arms, located in Ripon. I also wanted to share the other thing that myself and the others are passionate about and are working diligently on is overhead cost reduction. Enabling us to lower our prices. In fact, we are working hard on an entirely new price structure. As with most business, we are always seeking feedback to better the operation. The consensus is that most customers like the large and diverse inventory, the shooting range, and for the most part, our customer service. The one thing folks put on the front burner was our prices. They considered them too high. We've taken that feedback seriously and are working on reducing overhead so we can lower our prices. And, perhaps do a better job of price matching. So look for good things to come.

DannyInSoCal
08-08-2012, 6:35 PM
OC Armory does a great job with this also -

Last transfer I did - I bought a new set of ACU goggles -

And the guy I bought the sidearm from picked up a few t-shirts....

Scout2Diesel
08-08-2012, 7:23 PM
To an unskilled sales person a PPT is a perfect reason to fubar a sales opportunity... and collect evidence of who else is responsible for their low closing ratio's as if it's something out there in the Twilight Zone.

If you say it is a negative.... it is.

A good sales lead purchased from a marketing service can range from a few dollars to a few hundred dollars. That is just a phone number and address. A PPT brings two people into a store (one most likely with a little cash in pocket).:facepalm:

A good marksman does not punch the paper before he loads the chamber. Before people give you a sale ... you earn it.

Good sales skills are honed and it sounds as if your on target.

doug-y-doug
08-08-2012, 9:02 PM
It's a real pleasure to read Calgunners positive comments. I appreciate the insight. The name of the store is Barnwood Arms, located in Ripon. I also wanted to share the other thing that myself and the others are passionate about and are working diligently on is overhead cost reduction. Enabling us to lower our prices. In fact, we are working hard on an entirely new price structure. As with most business, we are always seeking feedback to better the operation. The consensus is that most customers like the large and diverse inventory, the shooting range, and for the most part, our customer service. The one thing folks put on the front burner was our prices. They considered them too high. We've taken that feedback seriously and are working on reducing overhead so we can lower our prices. And, perhaps do a better job of price matching. So look for good things to come.

Hey.... uhhh, can you open a branch in the East Bay??? Not even for the PPTs. Just for decent gun prices. :D

damon1272
08-08-2012, 9:22 PM
It is good to see another store that treats it's customers well. Two places that have garnered my support is Gusslers in Santee as this is his main business (transfers) and Rifle Gear in the LA area. I can say Rifle Gear was packed but when it was my turn they were great and processes the two transactions in under twenty minutes. I would add North County FireArms as they were quick and good to work with. As for supporting shops, I go to the ones that treat customers well. There are not too many out there but more and more are starting to get the picture. The old days of old codgers being jerks to folks is over. They lose business and turn new shooters aware from a great sport and understanding their rights as a citizen. Glad to see the change of heart.

biglou
08-09-2012, 11:28 AM
A gun shop that provides friendly customer service, no way. And you want to work on lower prices ? Be careful, word might get out.

hammerhands32
08-09-2012, 11:36 AM
Yeah, I am picking up from barnwood tomorrow and I was also planning on picking up some ammo.

Lone_Gunman
08-09-2012, 12:28 PM
I was the seller in a PPT at Barnwood on Tuesday. I found the experience quite pleasant, which is not usually the case with PPTs. It was quick, painless, and the guy that did it was friendly. Ripon is about 40 minutes south of me, but I wouldn't hesitate to make the drive if they had something I was looking for.

cgates
08-09-2012, 3:04 PM
I have done a few PPTs at different places. Some places huff and puff about it and some places are glad to do it, and are very efficient, friendly, and helpful. When I do buy something new, its easy to return to the nice guys. I tell my friends about the good places and specifically suggest avoiding the guys who are less than happy to do a PPT for me.

tpf68
08-09-2012, 9:18 PM
Recently did a PPT in a shop I haven't been to in about 15 years. Its a great shop but not near where I live or typically travel. I understand the PPTs are necessary evils for the gun shops and I'm sure it costs them more to perform them than the the $10.00 "profit" even starts to cover. The owner's attitude was great and he was happy to do the PPT for us. I wandered around his shop and ended up spending about $150.00 in accessories, supplies and goodies as a result of the pleasant atmosphere and willingness to serve us.

If we didn't have to perform the PPT for the transfer, I wouldn't have gone into his shop. If his demeanor was rude, unpleasant, or unhelpful, I wouldn't have felt inclined to spend some money with him. As it turned out, it was a great transaction and I was more than happy to spend some money with him.

Its amazing what a good attitude and friendly service can turn into.

cc56
08-09-2012, 10:48 PM
There is a store in Rancho Cordova that I used to frequent, then they basically refused to do a PPT. I do not remember the specifics but they told me they only do PPT on Thursdays 1-3pm (basically). Then they told me I could go to a gun range down the street and they would do it. I have not been back to the Rancho Cordova store since. I used to buy things from them too. It may not make profit but when you have 3 gun store employees standing around it is something. You have to pay the guys whether your do a PPT or not. People who are friendly during a PPT will get my business, if you are not friendly I don't come back.

Bigedski
08-10-2012, 10:07 AM
Annie's get your gun in Corona is another good shop for your PPT and any other gun needs, every transaction both PPT and Gunbroker have been a pleasure doing business with them, both Jerry and Anne are friendly and helpful and I will always give them my business and recommend them to whomever asks.

Neptune
08-10-2012, 2:55 PM
Good customer service is always worth working for. You never know which customer is going to throw down big bucks and become your best customer.





__

JDeere
08-10-2012, 6:51 PM
A bad experience at a gunshop does stick with you for a very long time. Three years ago I was in the Rancho Cardova Gunshop. They had a Browning Nomad (over priced) that I wanted to buy. I presented my drivers license and CCW. I was with my son in his car and did not have proof of residency with me. Even thou most shops will let you bring residency at time of pickup and I thought you did not need residency when you have a CCW. Anyway none of this was acceptable to him so I told him forget it. Then my son decided he would like to buy it since I was not going to get it. At that time the store owner kicked us out and said this was a straw man purchase and to get out now! I informed him that a father and son is not a straw purchase. And that that my son is buying it for himself not for me. Needless to say I have not been back to that store.

huntercf
08-10-2012, 7:05 PM
The store I did a PPT at last year earned them another 5 gun sales from me, accessories, target ammo, cleaning supplies. Over $4000 worth of business.

jyo
08-10-2012, 10:28 PM
I have found that if both parties are preparded for the PPT with all the paperwork, DLs, handgun safety permit, lock etc., things can be done very quickly and that this is an opportunity for the store to possibly snag new customers. On the other hand, stores with a bad attitude towards PPTs like Martin B. Rettings in Culver City can LOSE a customer forever! Telling me and my PPT partner that it would take two to three hours of waiting time or even "maybe all day" for them to do a PPT means piss-poor CS even though myself and my brothers had brought several things from them in the past! Not any more...

RP1911
08-11-2012, 5:00 AM
The state in most cases requires transfers to be done via PPT. Some businesses spend thousands of dollars to bring customers to their doors.

Make the PPT experience a smooth one like gunprofit and word gets around (free advertising that you can't buy). If one out of 10 PPTs results in additional high profit sale or a new long term customer, then it's less dollars spent on advertising and more dollars available for inventory or increased bottom line.