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KidnK9s
07-09-2012, 1:45 PM
Hey Troops,

I'm working on a clean-up for Saturday July 28th. Once again Marborg will back us up and I also hope to have local TV News there to offer some free publicity.

There is, however, the realization that the range will be closed down by months end due to extremely HIGH FIRE conditions. There is nothing we can do about this. We have been lucky over the past several years that due to OUR mothering of the range, that have allowed us to shoot.

There is a chance that if I can get a new fire-break cut, they might let us continue until further notice.

Thanx for all of your support...!

Craig
KidnK9s@cox.net

ckprax
07-10-2012, 2:04 PM
Awesome, I'll have to check my schedule but that should work for me.

TwinStick
07-10-2012, 3:44 PM
Damn, I'll be in Portland that weekend. Next time...

gtturborex
07-10-2012, 10:05 PM
July 28th should be good for me.

Capybara
07-11-2012, 5:01 PM
If they close the range, when do they usually allow it to be re-opened? After first rains or do they have a set month?

gtturborex
07-12-2012, 8:32 AM
I think it is after the rains begin.

Come on guys' we need more help...

Capybara
07-12-2012, 11:25 AM
Craig:

Any chance of that fire break being cut?

Dakine_surf
07-12-2012, 1:48 PM
I think I can make it... I have a triathlon the day after, but I will be down! Anything to help!

KidnK9s
07-13-2012, 7:53 PM
I need a head count for the clean-up... Not sure if a Fire Crew will be available until a few days before... I'm getting feed back from my local guys and most will not make it.

So let me know A.S.A.P...!

Thanx,

Craig

Rusty Scabbard
07-14-2012, 10:02 AM
80 % sure I can show up. If not travelling, I'll be there.

gtturborex
07-14-2012, 12:23 PM
In +1...

Let's work out the details for food and such as well.

Also if we can get that tractor from that local guy that would be awesome.

dougolupski
07-16-2012, 11:39 AM
I am in so long as I am not traveling as well.

Doug

Deadbolt
07-16-2012, 3:03 PM
I am in so long as I am not traveling as well.

Doug

basically this for me as well - i have some nagging feeling that the 28th i have something but my calendar isn't showing anything so who knows... put me down for 1 tentative - Nope - damn :


I have a work function I need to be present for on the 28th. I could do the 29th tho.

gtturborex
07-18-2012, 3:24 PM
Hey Craig,

What's the arrangement with Marborg for this cleanup? Our last cleanup we filled two dumpsters and still had plenty trash left for more. We left a huge pile of trash on the lower portion of the range that might take more than one dumpster itself.

If we could get the first two delivered early in the morning that would be great.

KidnK9s
07-18-2012, 7:07 PM
I've made the rounds and have no confidence in enough bodies to assist in this clean-up.

We'll have to get through August and plan one for early Fall. If by chance the range falls into closure for the fire-season, we can still have a clean-up, but no shooting and that, I feel, will yield even a lower turn-out.

As for the number of dumpsters, I can get up to 6 in a day, but I must be calling ahead to keep the turn-around going. We might have an easier time of arranging a tractor, fire-crew, etc... in the Fall.

As for the range improvements:

The video system is out due to high cost and bureaucratic paper-work.

New/more shooting tables... forget it, I will not bring anymore in for IDIOTS to blow the legs off.

Covered firing line awning, see above.

I might, however place metal silhouette targets, out at certain distances.

So that sit fore now. Comments welcome. Have a great summer and play safe.

Thanx,

Craig

gtturborex
07-18-2012, 7:11 PM
I'm in even if there is no shooting. Buuuuut... I'm out all of Aug until the 25th.

automatikdonn
07-19-2012, 6:00 AM
Having the local news crew there is a really bad idea, they are going to twist that into a story that says gun owners trash the land.

Deadbolt
07-19-2012, 8:19 AM
I've made the rounds and have no confidence in enough bodies to assist in this clean-up.

We'll have to get through August and plan one for early Fall. If by chance the range falls into closure for the fire-season, we can still have a clean-up, but no shooting and that, I feel, will yield even a lower turn-out.

As for the number of dumpsters, I can get up to 6 in a day, but I must be calling ahead to keep the turn-around going. We might have an easier time of arranging a tractor, fire-crew, etc... in the Fall.

As for the range improvements:

The video system is out due to high cost and bureaucratic paper-work.
not to mention would probably fall into the next concern...
New/more shooting tables... forget it, I will not bring anymore in for IDIOTS to blow the legs off.
dig
Covered firing line awning, see above.
dig
I might, however place metal silhouette targets, out at certain distances.
On this note - what about if one of us ( I can volunteer) assists with this and builds "concrete sinks" -- basically make a large hole, take the steel plate, put a 90degree bend in the bottom (or tack on some reebar - I dont weld but i have a buddy that does and owes me a favor) and then fill the 1-2foot cube hole w/ cement? Works great for outdoor motorcycle lock chocks - this would prevent theft of the plates
So that sit fore now. Comments welcome. Have a great summer and play safe.

Thanx,

Craig

comments in red

Dakine_surf
07-19-2012, 1:52 PM
^ I too could help with the targets... in fact I have a buddy who might be down to help as well... He has a welder and is a forum member.

Deadbolt
07-19-2012, 2:54 PM
nice - if you can furnish the welder ill cover cement and reebar ( bending reebar is a lot easier than bending plate steel lol but we'll need something to do that as well - i dont have a garage anymore :( )

KidnK9s
07-19-2012, 2:55 PM
Having the local news crew there is a really bad idea, they are going to twist that into a story that says gun owners trash the land.

I had the news crew there last year and it was a big success for us... It was a clear representation of US SHOOTERS actively taking part in the care of the range environment.

winslowgirl
07-20-2012, 9:06 PM
There is, however, the realization that the range will be closed down by months end due to extremely HIGH FIRE conditions.
Does anyone know if the Glass Factory is still open now?

DiogiDoc
07-20-2012, 10:44 PM
Drove up last Sat the 14th at 11 am. Was about 20 cars there. People even had EZ ups. Looked like an accident waiting to happen. U-turn, went to the driving range instead.

Deadbolt
07-22-2012, 5:44 PM
EZ ups are a clear sign of wanton mayhem - if only HLS would update their pdfs

./rollingeyes

Deadbolt
07-22-2012, 5:45 PM
also - cement stationed targets probably arent in the forest services' doctine

"so i would be really remiss if some put some at 50, 75, 125 and 200 yards"

really, id be super bummed

Nate
07-22-2012, 6:16 PM
EZ ups are a clear sign of wanton mayhem - if only HLS would update their pdfs

./rollingeyes

Really? The last time Craig and I went up in June, we put one up. It was a quiet day while we were there. We got there a little after 10am, and left around 2pm.

Deadbolt
07-22-2012, 7:14 PM
Really? The last time Craig and I went up in June, we put one up. It was a quiet day while we were there. We got there a little after 10am, and left around 2pm.

Comedy and sarcasm is lost on all in the Santa Barbara area. We're 100% seriously 150% of the time

:chris:

DiogiDoc
07-23-2012, 3:16 PM
All those EZ-ups, I thought I was at a Carnival with 50+ people milling around. I think someone was selling deep fried twinkies and funnel cakes too.

dougolupski
07-23-2012, 3:27 PM
Nope I wasnt selling funnel cakes this is Southern Cali we stay classy! Deep fried mozzarella.

It was organically produced from free range cows, with free trade labor in accordance with the latest hippy tree hugger rules and regulations.

Dakine_surf
07-25-2012, 1:32 PM
nice - if you can furnish the welder ill cover cement and reebar ( bending reebar is a lot easier than bending plate steel lol but we'll need something to do that as well - i dont have a garage anymore :( )

We could make that happen... I suck with a welder, but my buddy is decent. Sorry to hear about the garage... please tell me you have a covered space for your moto!

Deadbolt
07-25-2012, 4:30 PM
We could make that happen... I suck with a welder, but my buddy is decent. Sorry to hear about the garage... please tell me you have a covered space for your moto!

theres probably an ordinance against what was proposed. In hindsight it was a bad idea. Id recommend against this ( putting cement anchored steel targets on BLM land )

unless we get signed consent from the forest service. If they are into it, then we're gold but ultimately im sure theres words in a book somewhere against some abstraction of what we are suggesting :(

Capybara
07-28-2012, 4:25 PM
Went up to the Glass Factory last week on Thursday. Great weather, low 80s with a breeze. Besides the two guys I brought, we saw about 10 other shooters, a dad with some kids shooting .22s, a couple of guys shooting clays. We did bring an eazy up and some tables and chairs, I don't see a safety issue as long as you weight your eazy up so the wind won't blow it away.

Compared to some shooting areas I have seen, it wasn't too bad as far as trash. Yes, there was a lot of junk but I think a group of 10-20 people and half a dozen dumpsters could make that place sparkle in 4-6 hours. Except for the shotgun shells, there are literally thousands of them spread everywhere.

Shooters were safe, we called cease fires to change targets, "line is hot" when we were all ready to shoot.

I would definitely be up to help with the cleanup day, whenever you can organize it Craig and co.

Does anyone know if the range will still close for the fire season next week or if we may get a reprieve for the next month or so? Great range to shoot at and I made it there in a little over an hour. Nice to shoot at.

Deadbolt
07-28-2012, 8:58 PM
if we can organize a thorough clean it will stay open, next week as a deadline seems unattainable though.

Capybara
07-29-2012, 3:02 PM
Deadbolt, I don't understand what you wrote. Than range is supposedly closing for the fire season, not because there hasn't been a cleanup day? Even if it does close next week, we should organize the cleanup day/weekend soon.

I would definitely like to keep shooting there, it is far more enjoyable than most official ranges I shoot at.

Deadbolt
07-30-2012, 12:49 PM
Deadbolt, I don't understand what you wrote. Than range is supposedly closing for the fire season, not because there hasn't been a cleanup day? Even if it does close next week, we should organize the cleanup day/weekend soon.

I would definitely like to keep shooting there, it is far more enjoyable than most official ranges I shoot at.

Ahhh i see what you're saying. In past years we were able to have the range persist open - most likely because of a combo of more rain and clean ups. This seems like the first in several years that the range will be closed (for any reason )

winslowgirl
08-01-2012, 1:06 PM
"There is, however, the realization that the range will be closed down by months end due to extremely HIGH FIRE conditions. There is nothing we can do about this. We have been lucky over the past several years that due to OUR mothering of the range, that have allowed us to shoot."

I was up there again the other day and still saw no notice warning of imminent closure. The OP does not say where this realization originated. What or who specifically is the source? Anyone?

Capybara
08-04-2012, 5:01 PM
With yesterday's thunderstorms and the cool mornings we have had for the past month, perhaps we will get a reprieve and it will remain open for the rest of August?

dougolupski
08-04-2012, 5:39 PM
Well it was open today and is now starting to look pretty junky.

Capybara
08-09-2012, 5:45 PM
Yep, we need to do the cleanup. Craig or whomever organizes this with Marborg, etc. let me know when.

rdsr
08-11-2012, 10:51 PM
Went up today 8/11 and it was closed.








Roy

dougolupski
08-14-2012, 11:58 AM
Asked my friend who rides up there to keep an eye on the gate for me. If anyone else makes the drive be sure to post to let us know if it reopens.

Deadbolt
08-14-2012, 1:18 PM
will do but probably not until this heat wave breaks. Its way dry up there

dougolupski
08-14-2012, 1:29 PM
Yeah thats my hope is when the temp drops and the humidity and or fog roll in or a freak summer shower rolls through we might see the gates part once again

Dan_attacker
08-15-2012, 6:50 AM
Level III fire restrictions were put in place on Aug. 8 throughout the forest which prohibits shooting until the end of the fire season.

http://www.fs.usda.gov/Internet/FSE_DOCUMENTS/stelprdb5385075.pdf

patobravo
08-16-2012, 2:48 PM
In the past it's repoened once 2" (cumulative) of rain have fallen. I took my thirteen year old & his friends camping for a few days and intended to go shooting up there on 8/10 as well, I checked the Los Padres website to make sure it was open, the only closure I found on the site was Ojai so we went, CLOSED. I don't mind them closing it during fire season, I just wish they placed a notice more prominently located spot on their website. The next day while taking the boys to Red Rock I saw ranger Larry drive by and flagged him down. Apparently they had just closed it on Tuesday and said there was a notice on the website but they put it in a weird spot. Anyways, he's mentioned they have the seasonal fire fighters sitting on their hands doing not a whole lot so this might be a good time to get things cleaned up well. He thought maybe he could possibly get 20 extra hands. I can't spearhead organizing this but I can help pick up stuff and I will get the signs up once the date is set.

Rusty Scabbard
08-16-2012, 5:12 PM
Count me in once the date is set. No mind for me if it's closed to shooting. We can always bring some bows and arrows !

Capybara
08-17-2012, 5:29 AM
There is a lot junk out there, but there was also a lot of shootable objects still there as well. Is the goal to wipe the place clean or do we usually leave shootable targets?

Rusty Scabbard
08-17-2012, 9:34 PM
Clean up efforts rake up the loose trash & throw away the big stuff. It's pretty much impossible to try and leave targets.

Capybara
08-18-2012, 4:38 PM
Gotcha. I was unclear on how clean the cleanup should be since the next time the range opens people will undoubtedly drag out more junk to shoot and we start over again. I was guilty of bringing some melons to shoot but I have been told that biodegradable food targets should be eaten inside a week by the local flora and fauna?

Deadbolt
08-20-2012, 9:57 PM
shoot all the organics you want. Watermelon , apples, and tangerines @ 30yards if im out there with my p2000 :chris:

No one will scold you for fruit n veggies.


Televisions, automobiles and any sort of appliances are a no no tho

dougolupski
08-20-2012, 10:13 PM
No one will scold you for fruit n veggies
not true, you forgot about the vegans and the people against cruelty to vegetables.

Your in deep s!?t now.

Sent from my HD7 using Board Express

Deadbolt
08-20-2012, 10:50 PM
loooo

http://images.wikia.com/creepypasta/images/5/56/Disgusted-oh-god-why-text.png

snorky
08-29-2012, 1:30 AM
I too would be willing to help with range cleanup when I'm available. Being new to the Santa Barbara/Goleta area and CG, I would like to get to know fellow shooters around here.

Capybara
08-29-2012, 8:28 PM
I did some research and it seems from the past few years, the range (isn't its official name the Arroyo Seco Bowl?) usually reopens about the end of November/beginning of December? If it does, we need to get this cleanup done before the range re-opens, correct?

I plan on shooting my Mosin, Garand and some more fun toys up there as soon as it opens again and would like to participate in the clean up effort.

DiogiDoc
09-04-2012, 5:04 PM
Level III fire restrictions were put in place on Aug. 8 throughout the forest which prohibits shooting until the end of the fire season.

http://www.fs.usda.gov/Internet/FSE_DOCUMENTS/stelprdb5385075.pdf

Also, an article in the Santa Barbara Independent that suggests closure until mid November or the "end of fire season".

http://www.independent.com/news/2012/sep/02/fire-restrictions-los-padres-national-forest/

Deadbolt
09-06-2012, 10:39 PM
Also, an article in the Santa Barbara Independent that suggests closure until mid November or the "end of fire season".

http://www.independent.com/news/2012/sep/02/fire-restrictions-los-padres-national-forest/



rain rain ! Lets get this rolllllliinnnnnn !!!!

YES? YES! YES ! YES ! haah lets get her opened up !

Hows early Oct for everyone?

Deadbolt
09-07-2012, 10:01 PM
fine yo ho-dad sums a bishes

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KPR3KrZV3Tk


ill just have to boogey woogey on over all lonesome the ground be wet daddy

*snaps fingers

Capybara
09-08-2012, 10:08 AM
One rain day last week, we need a lot more of them

DiogiDoc
10-01-2012, 3:16 PM
One rain day last week, we need a lot more of them

Bah, heard it was 110 today in Santa Ynez.

Mchivasrule1
10-08-2012, 6:34 PM
Still closed

Dakine_surf
10-11-2012, 2:20 PM
Anyone think we can get something together soon? I would love it to be clean for the first day that it reopens!

Capybara
10-12-2012, 4:30 PM
I am up for it as well, but there are only one or two posters in this thread that have the connections with Marborg to get the dumpsters out there we would need.

We are starting to get some rain, shouldn't be too long now...

caluke
10-16-2012, 6:50 PM
I'm new to the forum, but want to help as much as I can. I've been shooting here for the last ten years. I would love to help get the range cleaned up in time for it to reopen. If we get a date set I will contact marborg and try to get the dumpsters set up. I know them pretty well, sure they will be willing to help us out.

DiogiDoc
10-17-2012, 9:32 PM
Great a GD fire on the 154 today. Fire season will probably go into December now!

TacticalPlinker
10-18-2012, 12:59 AM
Great a GD fire on the 154 today. Fire season will probably go into December now!

Yup. It's right in that area. Not sure what set it off and not sure when it will be out. But you can follow the news about it here; http://www.kvta.com/news/

gtturborex
10-18-2012, 6:33 AM
Yup. It's right in that area. Not sure what set it off and not sure when it will be out. But you can follow the news about it here; http://www.kvta.com/news/

Well if it burns the range area there will be less trash to pick up and there will be no reason for it to be closed since there would no longer be a fire hazard.

winslowgirl
10-19-2012, 11:34 AM
Yup. It's right in that area. Not sure what set it off and not sure when it will be out. But you can follow the news about it here; http://www.kvta.com/news/Well, I clicked on the link to see if there was any further news on the fire and was confronted with this, which has resonance with me if not actual relevance to the issue at hand.



KVTA News Thursday October 18, 2012

"Oxnard police now say they shot and killed an innocent bystander Saturday night in La Colonia because they thought he was one of the two armed suspects they'd been chasing on foot. During the chaotic running gunbattle with the two suspects, 24-year-old Oxnard residents Jose Zepeda and Justin Villa, they apparently lost track of Villa who was found later wounded by gunfire hiding in a shed. Police say when they came up on Zepeda there was another young man standing nearby that turned out to be 21-year-old Alfonso Limon. Officers, thinking Limon was Villa, fired on both Zepeda and Limon, killing both of them. . . Police say 9 officers fired their guns during the entire incident. "

There more about this available by clicking the link.

Capybara
10-22-2012, 3:49 PM
Nice one Oxnard PD on shooting and killing an innocent bystander. If you have ever lived in Oxnard, you know that Oxnard PD doesn't exactly have a sterling reputation to begin with. Wonder if this will result in some long due comeuppance for them or if this will just be swept under the rug?

We have been getting some much needed rain, hopefully they will open the Glass Factory again soon.

Deadbolt
10-22-2012, 7:54 PM
Very sad indeed. Oxnard is truly a cow's testicle of a town - one side or another, its a bovine scrotum all around.

That being said...



DRIZZLE!!! lets hope for more! Might get into the Glass Factory before mid nov!

btw i heckled the Forest Service @ the Goleta Lemon Festival - basically if we get 1" of rain within 7 consecutive days, the range will be opened :clap:

Capybara
10-26-2012, 7:09 AM
Good to know that's the goal. Please keep us abreast of any developments with the Glass Factory re-opening, my Mosin and Garand want to play.

Capybara
11-08-2012, 2:07 PM
Rain today, but not much though. More rain please!

Dakine_surf
11-13-2012, 10:30 AM
Anyone here if the range is open yet? I sent ranger lary a PM.

TwinStick
11-13-2012, 12:11 PM
So when's the clean-up?

Californio
11-16-2012, 11:43 AM
Ugly article on the Glass Factory

http://www.edhat.com/site/tidbit.cfm?nid=103721&showcomments=T#topComment

dougolupski
11-16-2012, 1:29 PM
UGHHHHHH. I had to post something, so much hate for most people never trying a shooting sport.

Dakine_surf
11-16-2012, 4:31 PM
Yeah I had to just leave a comment telling people that we would be more than happy to have more volunteers out with us during the next clean up.

artoaster
11-16-2012, 4:50 PM
Ugly article on the Glass Factory

http://www.edhat.com/site/tidbit.cfm?nid=103721&showcomments=T#topComment

To be expected until everyone does their part. Sometimes it's a look into the mirror that begins a change.

Capybara
11-16-2012, 5:20 PM
Ah jeez, just what you would expect. According to the locals, we are all full auto shooting, drunken rednecks. The reality of it is that we could do a monthly cleanup and it would still look bad because of a few idiots just leave their junk, then a few more, etc. Unless there was a full time security person, it is going to look like various levels of what it is, but they also don't understand that at least the area is contained. If they close it, this same mess will be scattered all over the national forest, amazed that with all of the supposedly intelligent SBers up there that they don't realize this.

I agree, it is a disgrace that certain shooters are too lazy to pick up after themselves, but as usual, it is us law abiding citizens who pickup everything we shoot and more and bring it home to dump, that get blamed. Let me know when the cleanup is. I will bring a camera and we should post a nice little video on the Calguns site about our cleanup efforts, we could point some of the supposedly unbiased media in SB toward it to prove that we do our part, we can't help it if there are drunken idiots who don't.

Pulsewave
11-16-2012, 6:39 PM
Yeah I agree, I mean, being able to shoot up there is a privilege and based on being responsible. Anyone going up there to shoot should know better and to be mindful about picking anything up that they bring up there before they leave.

Seriously I went up there one time during the weekend, and I saw some guy blowing up fire extinguishers (about 3-4 of them) with his AK-74 and didn't even bother to clean up his mess. I should've probably called him out on it. Cause every time I go up there, my friends and I only bring paper targets and bio-degradable stuff, not fire-extinguishers, electronics, glass bottles, and other crap.

Foebia
11-17-2012, 7:21 AM
Lol, fire extinguishers... His boss is gonna be pissed.

TacticalPlinker
11-17-2012, 4:17 PM
Ugly article on the Glass Factory

http://www.edhat.com/site/tidbit.cfm?nid=103721&showcomments=T#topComment

Yeah, I don't get what the author or any realistic logical person expects. It's an unregulated range open to the general public and with no on-site "waste management" resources (ex. dumpster) and no "authority" representation of any kind, short of the occasional ranger.

The people who create the bulk of the mess...
- are not Calguns members
- are not NRA members
- are not CRPA members
- are not members of any other gun rights organization
- likely don't follow or give a damn about gun laws
- most of them don't even abide by existing laws
- are regulated range rejects (ex. banned/asked to leave for not following the rules and/or state laws)
... the list continues.

The only mess I left when I was up there last consisted of shell casings because there are literally thousands of them on the ground in every direction, and paper targets because other people were already shooting at them down range.

Foebia
11-17-2012, 4:39 PM
He is just some anti-gunner making some noise, never go to Santa Barbara but i am sure there are worse areas. But the area is pretty embarrassing and we need to do better in the gun community. That being said there is always a few jagoffs that will always screw things up, perhaps the same people that throw cigs out their window when driving thought the cyn.

Maybe we need to rent a few home depot trucks and fill them up with the trash, great photo op, and have a bbq, calguns meet at sunset do some promoting.

Capybara
11-30-2012, 9:52 PM
Foebia:

If you check the other Glass Factory thread at the top of this forum, you'll see that we are brainstorming ways we can make a BIG cleanup happen, probably at the end of January. I am beginning a list of volunteers in that thread, please post up there and I will add your name to the list.

One of the challenges is no matter which weekend we choose to do it, it will always be bad for about 30-40% of the volunteers. So if we want 40-50 Calgunners to show up, we really need commitments from about 80 of them. There is a trash company up there, Marborg, who will probably bring us some dumpsters, that's why it will be important to get some press for them, for Calguns and I am throwing out the idea to get some local Boy Scout troops involved, I have some Scouting connections.

Would love to have you join us, we really need to get just about every Ventura and Santa Barbara Calgunner we can to join in.

artoaster
11-30-2012, 10:17 PM
I was thinking of everyone here as I put out old campfires, picked up plastic bottles, aluminum and even tiny bits of packaging on a trip to the Sespe. No, I didn't get paid because I do it for my own sense or what is right and good.

I saw bullet holes and shotgun pellets and damage done to signs we all paid for in taxes. But, this was a hiking trail and I couldn't help but think how shooters are much worse.

A range cleanup at the Glass Factory is a fine idea. Let's...

Simply115
12-01-2012, 8:29 PM
Foebia:

If you check the other Glass Factory thread at the top of this forum, you'll see that we are brainstorming ways we can make a BIG cleanup happen, probably at the end of January. I am beginning a list of volunteers in that thread, please post up there and I will add your name to the list.

One of the challenges is no matter which weekend we choose to do it, it will always be bad for about 30-40% of the volunteers. So if we want 40-50 Calgunners to show up, we really need commitments from about 80 of them. There is a trash company up there, Marborg, who will probably bring us some dumpsters, that's why it will be important to get some press for them, for Calguns and I am throwing out the idea to get some local Boy Scout troops involved, I have some Scouting connections.

Would love to have you join us, we really need to get just about every Ventura and Santa Barbara Calgunner we can to join in.

Really? In that case... I'm pretty much available anytime. I'll need a ride of some sort because I'm in Ventura.


Sent from the Realms Of The Haunting :73:

RedMonkey
12-02-2012, 6:04 AM
Hello everyone,

There's lots of interest and great ideas being generated for the next Glass Factory cleanup so we've created a new thread specifically for it. Please stop posting on this thread and use THIS LINK (http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?p=9832993#post9832993) to the new thread to continue the conversation and to check for updates.

RM