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View Full Version : The Origin Shotgun = illegal in Cali right?


1stLineGear
07-06-2012, 1:41 PM
would it be legal with a bullet button?

http://www.alliancearmament.com/origin12gaugeshotgun.aspx

Slim///
07-06-2012, 1:46 PM
Bullet button and pinned stock would be g2g

die2surf
07-06-2012, 1:47 PM
$1800 and up... ouch.

Dantedamean
07-06-2012, 1:48 PM
Ya but good luck finding a BB for it. I watched a vid of it online and it doesn't look like any mag release that a BB is made for.

stix213
07-06-2012, 1:50 PM
Bullet button and pinned stock would be g2g

This ^^^

The gun is almost 11lb, but they claim it is "lightweight"?????!!!??! What are they smoking?

Wherryj
07-06-2012, 3:12 PM
This ^^^

The gun is almost 11lb, but they claim it is "lightweight"?????!!!??! What are they smoking?

My Mossberg 590 weighs in at ALMOST that much with a forend light.

Actually, I think that you could buy TWO 590s and TWO Surefire forends for less than the price of that origin-and you wouldn't need a BB! :D

Ryan in SD
07-06-2012, 3:56 PM
The gun is almost 11lb, but they claim it is "lightweight"?????!!!??! What are they smoking?

PCP :D

Mesa Tactical
07-06-2012, 5:48 PM
$1800 and up... ouch.

US made.

Maintaining our national manufacturing base doesn't come free.

IVC
07-06-2012, 7:52 PM
Send the link to Yee. Maybe he gets a heart attack.

ClarenceBoddicker
07-06-2012, 8:16 PM
That's just a new version of the USAS-12. It & clip fed shotguns like the Siaga will be reclassified by ATF at some point as Destructive Devices.

grommit666
07-06-2012, 10:30 PM
It looks like a saiga 12 covered in legos. Just buy a S12, and a box of legos and save yourself $1000.

motorhead
07-07-2012, 2:27 AM
That's just a new version of the USAS-12. It & clip fed shotguns like the Siaga will be reclassified by ATF at some point as Destructive Devices.
unlikely. saiga was under threat by import restrictions. the whole thing was killed.
BTW, that's magazine fed.

CalNRA
07-07-2012, 2:34 AM
US made.

Maintaining our national manufacturing base doesn't come free.

everyone knows it's the smart thing to do to buy a Norinco 870 copy for 50 bucks cheaper and buy 400 bucks worth of tacti-cool stuff for it while waving the American flag.

Quiet
07-07-2012, 4:41 AM
That's just a new version of the USAS-12.
Acutally, the Alliance Armament Orgin-12 is a semi-auto only copy of the Izhmash Saiga-12.

The newest version of the USAS-12, is the MPS Inc AA-12.

Timeline:
1972-1986 = Atchisson Assault-12
1988-Present = Daewoo USAS-12 (second generation Atchisson Assault-12)
1989-1990 = Gilbert Equipment Co (Daewoo) USAS-12 (semi-auto only version imported to USA)
1990-2002 = Ramo Defense System USAS-12 (made from Daewoo parts kits & Fed 922r compliance parts)
2005-Present = MPS Inc AA-12 (third generation Atchisson Assault-12)

How they are classified by BATFE:
Atchisson Assault-12 = pre-'86 MG
Daewoo USAS-12 = post-'86 MG
Gilbert Equipment Co (Daewoo) USAS-12 = DD
Ramo Defense System USAS-12 = (select-fire version) post-'86 MG / (semi-auto only version) Title 1 shotgun
MPS Inc AA-12 = post-'86 MG

Demonicspire
07-07-2012, 8:10 AM
Does he also need the 18 inch barrel? I know it is different for rifles and shotguns, but is it defined by the round it fires, or the pattern of the gun?

Quiet
07-07-2012, 9:37 AM
Does he also need the 18 inch barrel? I know it is different for rifles and shotguns, but is it defined by the round it fires, or the pattern of the gun?

18" or greater length barrel, if it is not being transferred as a Title 2 firearm.

Alliance Armament sells three variants of the Origin-12.
Title 1 shotgun = 18.5" barrel
Title 2 SBS = 10.5" barrel
Title 2 AOW = 10.5" barrel
The Title 2 firearms require BATFE approval.

Digital_Boy
07-07-2012, 3:08 PM
Hmmmmm. Very nice. The mag release is sweet, but also problematic for CA since it seems the shooter just flicks his trigger finger forward to hit the paddle to drop the magazine. Would require a LOT of effort to redesign or modify to make it CA "bullet tip or other tool" friendly. :(

And at $1800, it's not TOO terribly far off from the prices for Saiga-12s that have been de-neutered with comparable accessories (rails, AR buffer tube friendly rear trunnion, no-rock magazine well adapter, et cetera).

Digital_Boy
07-07-2012, 3:16 PM
2005-Present = MPS Inc AA-12 (third generation Atchisson Assault-12)

How they are classified by BATFE:

MPS Inc AA-12 = post-'86 MG

Wishful thinking, but if MPS management decided the market was there for a semi-auto only version of the current AA-12, would it be classified as a Title 1 shotgun, or a DD?

Mesa Tactical
07-07-2012, 8:06 PM
And at $1800, it's not TOO terribly far off from the prices for Saiga-12s that have been de-neutered with comparable accessories (rails, AR buffer tube friendly rear trunnion, no-rock magazine well adapter, et cetera).

$1,800 is not unadjacent to the MSRP of a Benelli M4.

Wishful thinking, but if MPS management decided the market was there for a semi-auto only version of the current AA-12, would it be classified as a Title 1 shotgun, or a DD?

Earlier incarnations were DDs because they were imported. If MPS is making this in the US, then there would be no obligation or authority for the ATF to rule on its status, unless it was an NFA device (barrel less than 18", etc).

Quiet
07-07-2012, 8:09 PM
Wishful thinking, but if MPS management decided the market was there for a semi-auto only version of the current AA-12, would it be classified as a Title 1 shotgun, or a DD?
Title 1 shotgun
However, MPS Inc is on record stating they will never manufacture for the civilian market.