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asketes
07-02-2012, 2:55 PM
Hey everyone.

I have an M1 Garand and she's a beauty and amazing to shoot but she weighs in a little heavy on my wallet when I want to go plink around for a few hours.

I'm not a real big fan of the AK47/dragunov/sks type rifle designs (even though, practically & functionally speaking, they are amazing weapons).

I prefer a rifle that looks more military than tactical. i.e. the M16 Rifle I used in the military is preferable to the M4 styled AR15.

Here's kind of what I'm looking for:

Cheaper to shoot: 5.62x54mm/.223/7.62x54mm/7.62x39mm
Semi-Automatic (otherwise I'd grab a Remington 700)
$300-$700 for the weapon purchase.

If possible I'd really love to maintain the kick I get from my M1 (30-06) but I don't think it's likely with the cheaper ammo.


Any thoughts or ideas?

Thanks for reading,

-Rob

Capybara
07-02-2012, 3:14 PM
I don't know, if I were you, I would get over my Russian prejudice and get a VEPR in 7.62x54R. Beautiful and accurate rifle for about $800.00 or $900.00 that shoots .15 per round high power ammo that is essentially equivalent to the .30-06 your M1 shoots. This will be my next rifle.

PEZHEAD265
07-02-2012, 3:22 PM
Buy your self a saiga in 223.7.62x39 or 5.45x39 it shoild be 500 or under out the door.Great guns.

vikingm03
07-02-2012, 3:26 PM
Those russian calibers will mostly only have russian guns to shoot from. You can get an ar upper for 7.62x39 though.

If you are fine with .223, then get an ar15 and build it how you want it to look. You can even buy a surplus grip, forend, and stock for it (that's what I have now).

I don't own a gun in .308 so I don't know how much cheaper .308 is than .30-06, but if it is cheaper you could look at a m14 or FAL.

Also there is the mini-14 other ruger garand-look-alikes

Capybara
07-02-2012, 3:34 PM
.308 is the same price as .30-06.
.223/5.56 is now between .33 and .35 per round
The Russian calibers are all cheap, but even 7.62 x 39 isn't approaching the whoomp of your .30-06
7.62x54R is almost the same feel and ballistics and the ammo costs less than 1/3 of the cost of the cheapest .30-06 (HXP)
The VEPR fits your quest perfectly.

Calplinker
07-02-2012, 4:15 PM
You might consider a Hakim. They usually go for about $500 or so and some are even old enough to be C&R eligible, so cash and carry with no DROS.

I have one and it's a lot of fun to shoot. 8mm mauser is still inexpensive and easy to find.

TwinStick
07-02-2012, 4:26 PM
VEPR or PSL would be my suggestions...if you weren't against Russian firearms.

MiddleKingdom
07-02-2012, 4:34 PM
I'm not sure on the cost per round, but could you start reloading for much cheaper? I have a Garand and I'm considering that just to keep it affordable and to have consistent ammo as opposed to surplus.

asketes
07-02-2012, 4:34 PM
Awesome! Thank you guys for the quick replies! Will check out the two or tree that were mentioned that I haven't heard of yet -> VEPR,PSL,HAKIM.

Yeah I was playing with a Saiga for a while. Just didn't feel good in my hands.

Anyone else want to weigh in please do!

-Rob

Fate
07-02-2012, 4:36 PM
SVT-40 is another option.

asketes
07-02-2012, 4:38 PM
Haha I haven't ruled Russian firearms out, just looking to see if I can find a weapon that fits both the wallet and the style preference.

Trust me, if nothing better comes up I'll most like end up with an AR an AK variant. Both are solid and each has their own benefits.

TwinStick
07-02-2012, 4:38 PM
PTR 32, but it might be a little out of the initial purchase price range. It looks military, shoots cheap and doesn't look like every other AR15 or AK.

I don't have any actual experience with it though. Just the PTR91.

cfusionpm
07-02-2012, 4:39 PM
What about a Mini 14?

http://www.ruger.com/products/mini14/index.html

If you can get a hold of cheap .308, an M1A is basically a Garand with a detachable mag. I absolutely love mine.

comblock
07-02-2012, 4:43 PM
Mini 14. It somewhat like an m14/m1a/garand actionbut shoots. 223

Revolver Ocelot
07-02-2012, 4:46 PM
AR in 5.45 or 7.62x39?

asketes
07-02-2012, 4:46 PM
I'm stubborn. Haha. The Mini14/30 and the M1A are too small for me. The VEPR looked interesting. Basically I want an M1 that shooter 5.56 x 54mm. Not gonna happen ;(

Capybara
07-02-2012, 4:52 PM
Just watch this, it will convince you like it convinced me that I must own this rifle. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P1aruqM7Py8

Tanner68
07-02-2012, 4:53 PM
I don't know, if I were you, I would get over my Russian prejudice and get a VEPR in 7.62x54R. Beautiful and accurate rifle for about $800.00 or $900.00 that shoots .15 per round high power ammo that is essentially equivalent to the .30-06 your M1 shoots. This will be my next rifle.

That wasn't on my radar, but now it is.

Sicarius
07-02-2012, 4:58 PM
Mini 14.
Kevin

PEZHEAD265
07-02-2012, 5:11 PM
The Hakim is 8mm and that ammo is getting hard to find and pricey[.50 each + shipping..The SVT-40 is way above his price range and also hard to find.What about a SKS or a AK 47??They are both great guns and with in your budget with the SKS being a little more accurate then the AK.

JBaus
07-02-2012, 5:33 PM
Buy your self a saiga in 223.7.62x39 or 5.45x39 it shoild be 500 or under out the door.Great guns.

Cheapest Saiga I saw that would OTD was under $600 with the Saiga .223 or 7.62 at $499 in the San Francisco East Bay Area.....

If you're in the SF Bay area and know of a Saiga OTD under $500...PLEASE SHARE!!!!

OR PLEASE PM ME....Thanks! =)

someR1
07-02-2012, 5:36 PM
build a budget AR15 or get a SKS.

Hoop
07-02-2012, 7:02 PM
I prefer a rifle that looks more military than tactical. i.e. the M16 Rifle I used in the military


Build an AR then. You could do it for about 800.

this rifle kit:

http://palmettostatearmory.com/index.php/ar-15-05/rifle-kits/20-chrome-lined-mp-rifle-kit.html

then buy a lower receiver, bullet button and get a deal on a removable carry handle sight or flip up off ebay.

Mossy Man
07-02-2012, 7:03 PM
maybe go for a mini-14

will feel a lot like your M1, but shoot a lot cheaper.

Mossy Man
07-02-2012, 7:05 PM
http://www.ruger.com/products/mini14RanchRifle/images/5801.jpg

with a few addons, will resemble an older wood military rifle

rogervzv
07-02-2012, 7:14 PM
I'm gonna chime in recommending that you consider the Mini 14. I picked up a new one two weeks ago and it is just wonderful. Nice tight groups, lightweight, and great looking. I get lots of questions and compliments at the range about it, and about my target groups with it. Theoretically it is not as accurate as an AR15 so I am told, but I at least am not a good enough shooter for either rifle to be the limiting factor for me, shooting from the shoulder.

Plus the Mini is a featureless rifle so no bullet button.

Reliable as all get-out. I really like the Mini!

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a331/Roger54/Gun%20Stuff/DSC_0731.jpghttp://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a331/Roger54/Gun%20Stuff/DSC_0732.jpg

Richard Erichsen
07-02-2012, 7:24 PM
You might consider a Hakim. They usually go for about $500 or so and some are even old enough to be C&R eligible, so cash and carry with no DROS.

I have one and it's a lot of fun to shoot. 8mm mauser is still inexpensive and easy to find.

AKA - Swedish Ljungman AG42/AG42B rifle, in 6.5x55 Swedish but being of intermediate length are sometimes rebarrelled for .308 Win. The Hakim is in 7.92x57 mm (8mm Mauser), which used to be cheap and available but is now becoming scarce. I would buy neither the Hakim nor the AG42 in it's original caliber without considering rebarreling it professionally and modifying the feed lips for the magazines accordingly.

R

Richard Erichsen
07-02-2012, 7:30 PM
VEPR or PSL would be my suggestions...if you weren't against Russian firearms.

VEPR = Russian (Izhmash, who bought Molot where VEPRs are built)
PSL = Romanian (Cugir SA)

R

Capybara
07-02-2012, 7:49 PM
I agree with the OP, I have two ARs and I like the 5.56 but when I shoot my Garand, it is a lot more fun to shoot frankly. Bigger boom, some recoil. That's why the 5.45 x 39 doesn't interest me except for cost. 7.62 x 39 is more fun but I figure, if you are going to go for it, go all of the way (while remaining affordable). That is the appeal of the 7.62 x 54R round, plus I can shoot it in my Mosins and it is the only cheap bigger bore round on the market that is truly affordable. Plus I have heard nothing but effusive praise for the VEPRs, they are like a high end AK.

Calplinker
07-02-2012, 7:53 PM
The Hakim is 8mm and that ammo is getting hard to find and pricey[.50 each + shipping..The SVT-40 is way above his price range and also hard to find.What about a SKS or a AK 47??They are both great guns and with in your budget with the SKS being a little more accurate then the AK.

By golly, you're right. I didn't realize it had gone up in price so much. I must have bought 1000+ rounds awhile back and I'm glad I did!!!

I second the guys recommending a VEPR. What's not to like about a semi-auto 7.62X54 that you can shoot for less than 20 cents a round? I have an SVT-40 and they are a lot of fun but also expensive to buy (at least here in the U.S.). The VEPR is next on my list of guns to pick up soon.

frankm
07-02-2012, 7:53 PM
If you want to use this new rifle for any longer-range shooting, i.e., anything besides spray and pray, build an AR. I sold my converted Saiga to build my AR. I'm a rifleman dangit, not a carbineman.

xibunkrlilkidsx
07-02-2012, 8:01 PM
Than buy a Ar from a reputible Mfg...or even build your own. can be done if you dont want to get overly tactical to get it under 800

tuna quesadilla
07-02-2012, 8:50 PM
I built an M16A2 clone for about $750 using parts from the classifieds on this very forum. That was awhile back. Nowadays with places like Palmetto State Armory you can go even cheaper and have a decent rifle.

someR1
07-02-2012, 9:08 PM
please keep the Garand too :)
it's a great piece of american history that will hold its value....and probably increase in value over time

caldude
07-02-2012, 9:17 PM
Another option is the FN-49. Versions were made in several calibers, although some are rare and pricey. The 8mm version is probably closest to your price range.

ElvenSoul
07-02-2012, 9:21 PM
VZ58 cheap and your choice of mag or stripper clip.

asketes
07-02-2012, 10:14 PM
http://www.ruger.com/products/mini14RanchRifle/images/5801.jpg

with a few addons, will resemble an older wood military rifle

They seemed so small, are there kits or mod items I can get that will make it a bit longer, similar to my M1?

I know I sound like a moron trying to get something basically like my M1. I guess I'm a little jaded and in love with it.

I really appreciate all the great feedback and opinions; I've also been looking into some of the Russian weapons named above. What a great experience, my first thread here. haha

It will be a month or so until I decide which direction I want to go but I will probably -ask a few questions here and there and most definitely share my final decision with images and videos! :)

-Rob Duncan

asketes
07-02-2012, 10:18 PM
I agree with the OP, I have two ARs and I like the 5.56 but when I shoot my Garand, it is a lot more fun to shoot frankly. Bigger boom, some recoil. That's why the 5.45 x 39 doesn't interest me except for cost. 7.62 x 39 is more fun but I figure, if you are going to go for it, go all of the way (while remaining affordable). That is the appeal of the 7.62 x 54R round, plus I can shoot it in my Mosins and it is the only cheap bigger bore round on the market that is truly affordable. Plus I have heard nothing but effusive praise for the VEPRs, they are like a high end AK.

I'm glad to know that it wasn't just me. A lot of people, not here on the forums but friends and such, were saying to just replace the M1. It's not so simple; my weapon commands this respect when I go shooting. I know it sounds silly but I'm generally the loudest person on my range (not always but most of the time) and I get a lot of people walking up to me and admiring my well kept rifle. I'll always take her to the range but it would be nice to have something similar.

A lot of people here are recommending the Mini 14, I need to look more into it but is the M14 a California legal rifle? I mean, maybe I am mistake, is the Mini 14 a smaller version or something completely different with no correlation between the two? (mini 14 looks beautiful, just kind of small)

Also, Thank you for the feedback on the VEPR. If I end up going with something other than America, this is most likely the path I will take. :)

asketes
07-02-2012, 10:20 PM
It seems my three primary options are:

Mini 14
AR 15 (probably go with Bravo Company, any feedback about these guys? My friends highly recommend them.)
VEPR

All three seem like winners in their own right and I need to do research on customization AND find them in person and at the very least feel and play with them, and hopefully shoot them as well.

Dreaded Claymore
07-02-2012, 10:27 PM
Dude, get an AR-15 with a 20" barrel, and then put THIS on it. Wooden stock and handguard from Ironwood Designs. (http://ironwooddesigns.com/IWDAR15.html)
http://i845.photobucket.com/albums/ab17/DreadedClaymore/ironwood_designs_AR-15.png

doug-y-doug
07-02-2012, 10:27 PM
If you're willing to try the AK type, you should also check out the M76. It's an accurate, milled semi-auto that shoots 8mm Mauser. If you go the 50s Yugo route, it comes out to just over 20 cents per round shipped.

Hoop
07-03-2012, 7:18 AM
It seems my three primary options are:

Mini 14
AR 15 (probably go with Bravo Company, any feedback about these guys? My friends highly recommend them.)
VEPR


The VEPR looks really cool but parts availability would irk me. AR15 parts grow on trees.

Use the AR 15 upper kit I linked. They are all milspec parts FN barrels etc.

Seaweed02
07-03-2012, 8:01 AM
I also have an M1 Garand, and I absolutely love it. I think you should go ahead and choose another rifle from the many suggestions you have gotten on this thread. Because we all "need" new rifles from time to time. But......


I also can think of a couple fo alternatives that will let you shoot your Garand more cheaply. One is to buy the military surplus 30.06. I bought a thousand rounds of some stuff from Greece and it is clean, and accurate. Best of all it didn't cost me an arm and a leg.

You can also convert your Garand to shoot .308, and I may be wrong but I don't think it is a permanent conversion. I think it is an insert that you can install and remove quite easily to go from .308 back to 30.06 when you feel like it. Again I could be wrong.

Carl.

NewbieDave
07-03-2012, 8:13 AM
Send one of your Garand to Shuff's and get this done... all the likes of your M1 without the weight.

http://shuffsparkerizing.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/mini-g-2.jpg


http://shuffsparkerizing.com/services/the-mini-g/

Standard
07-03-2012, 8:50 AM
Keep the Garand and reload for it. With the price of 5.56 these days, it's what 75% of the cost of 30-06 surplus? Reloading will make it even closer.

asketes
07-03-2012, 8:55 AM
Send one of your Garand to Shuff's and get this done... all the likes of your M1 without the weight.

http://shuffsparkerizing.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/mini-g-2.jpg


http://shuffsparkerizing.com/services/the-mini-g/

I think you misunderstood me when I said 'she weighs in a little heavy on my wallet'. I was referring to the cost of the ammo, not the weight of the rifle.

The size and weight is half of what I find so endearing about the M1.

asketes
07-03-2012, 8:57 AM
Keep the Garand and reload for it. With the price of 5.56 these days, it's what 75% of the cost of 30-06 surplus? Reloading will make it even closer.

I agree. Truth be told I said it's my rifle but it's really my step-dads. Even though I shoot it fairly regularly and him not at all, I'm not sure if it will get handed down to me. IF I owed the rifle properly I would be looking heavily into reloading. Until that time though, I don't want to invest money into a reloading device when the weapon may not fall into my hands.


To those that are wondering: For the record, I'm not ditching the Garand, just looking to add something a bit cheaper (but similar to the style of the Garand) so I can shoot a lot more round through it.

Reloading is just not an option right now.

There have been a lot of great responses and suggestions. It's time I go off and look at some of the weapons you guys have suggested.

Of course, I am always looking for more suggestions :)

-Rob

bruss01
07-03-2012, 9:02 AM
Hey everyone.

I have an M1 Garand and she's a beauty and amazing to shoot but she weighs in a little heavy on my wallet when I want to go plink around for a few hours.

I'm not a real big fan of the AK47/dragunov/sks type rifle designs (even though, practically & functionally speaking, they are amazing weapons).

I prefer a rifle that looks more military than tactical. i.e. the M16 Rifle I used in the military is preferable to the M4 styled AR15.

Here's kind of what I'm looking for:

Cheaper to shoot: 5.62x54mm/.223/7.62x54mm/7.62x39mm
Semi-Automatic (otherwise I'd grab a Remington 700)
$300-$700 for the weapon purchase.

If possible I'd really love to maintain the kick I get from my M1 (30-06) but I don't think it's likely with the cheaper ammo.


Any thoughts or ideas?

Thanks for reading,

-Rob

Rebarrel your Garand to 7.62 NATO. That's what I'm doing. It doesn't permanently alter the gun either, you can switch back to the original barrel if you want later.

ETA: Just read the post where you fess up that it's not really your gun, so I'm guessing you can't alter it. If you still like the Garand, you can buy one from the CMP already barreled in 7.62 NATO.

Standard
07-03-2012, 9:07 AM
What's the benefit of doing that though? A lot of cost to rebarrel, while 308 isn't any cheaper than 30-06

asketes
07-03-2012, 9:09 AM
Sticky situation I know. Sucks b/c I take care of her and keep her nice and oiled and used.

Maybe I'll see if he'll sell her to me.

asketes
07-03-2012, 9:15 AM
I'm leaning towards the Saiga IZ 332 100 Series 762 x 39mm or a .223 AR15.

Specific Pacific
07-03-2012, 10:53 AM
ptr91 or psl

tpf68
07-03-2012, 12:22 PM
Start reloading for the M1..... You know you're going to do it sooner or later, might as well be sooner. That'll be lighter on your wallet and you still get to shoot the M1 = WIN/WIN

2Aon2wheels
07-03-2012, 2:19 PM
I have a VEPR in 7.62x54r. Awesome gun. I would only shoot surplus through it though. It chews up cases pretty bad, so I would not plan on reloading it.

brianm767
07-03-2012, 3:05 PM
I'd build a budget Vietnam looking early M16 SP1 style rifle, it's next on my list.
http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b116/brianm767/SP1.jpg

Eat Dirt
07-03-2012, 3:12 PM
You might consider a Hakim. They usually go for about $500 or so and some are even old enough to be C&R eligible, so cash and carry with no DROS.

I have one and it's a lot of fun to shoot. 8mm mauser is still inexpensive and easy to find.

I'll second that on the Hakim
I got one a while back and it's a Great Rifle

Ammo is still on the cheap side / For now
Also It always get's people coming over and asking " What the heck is that thing making all the noise "

PEZHEAD265
07-03-2012, 3:32 PM
Cheapest Saiga I saw that would OTD was under $600 with the Saiga .223 or 7.62 at $499 in the San Francisco East Bay Area.....

If you're in the SF Bay area and know of a Saiga OTD under $500...PLEASE SHARE!!!!

OR PLEASE PM ME....Thanks! =)

Classic arms has them for 399+ shipping.

PEZHEAD265
07-03-2012, 3:45 PM
Cheapest Saiga I saw that would OTD was under $600 with the Saiga .223 or 7.62 at $499 in the San Francisco East Bay Area.....

If you're in the SF Bay area and know of a Saiga OTD under $500...PLEASE SHARE!!!!

OR PLEASE PM ME....Thanks! =)

Classic arms has them [7.62x39] 399+ shipping
Centerfire Systems has the [5.45x39] 379.00+ shipping.They have the 7.62x39 wiTh the AK style fore-end for 479.00

donw
07-03-2012, 3:50 PM
get your garand re-barreled in 7.62x51 / 308. i have a friend that did it and he loves it!

i seem to recall that there is a .264 barrel available for it, too...

Dreaded Claymore
07-03-2012, 5:33 PM
Please do not let anyone hack apart your Garand.

Every time someone Bubbas a Garand, R. Lee Ermey cries.

paul0660
07-03-2012, 5:45 PM
Too much work to turn a bolt? The zombies are not here yet.

mj1
07-03-2012, 6:12 PM
Spend the money on a basic hand loaders set in 3006 from Lee. Or slow fire with a 03 or 03A3 for the power rush. air soft is an option too. Join CMP and buy 3006 in bulk.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v130/montereyjack/4121f51b.jpg

asketes
07-03-2012, 10:07 PM
Please do not let anyone hack apart your Garand.

Had no intentions, not with my M1 at least.

JBaus
07-03-2012, 10:49 PM
Classic arms has them [7.62x39] 399+ shipping
Centerfire Systems has the [5.45x39] 379.00+ shipping.They have the 7.62x39 wiTh the AK style fore-end for 479.00

Those are great prices, but then you have to factor in the DROS,FFL Fee and State Tax....Which is why the non-converted Saiga .223 and 7.62 at a sticker of $499 is NOT that bad at all.

JBaus
07-03-2012, 10:51 PM
I'm leaning towards the Saiga IZ 332 100 Series 762 x 39mm or a .223 AR15.

I was actually going to get the 7.62 Saiga, but a PPT on a WASR 10 fell in my lap and I had to jump on it.

asketes
07-03-2012, 11:34 PM
I'd build a budget Vietnam looking early M16 SP1 style rifle, it's next on my list.
http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b116/brianm767/SP1.jpg

If I get an AR, this is kind of what I was going after.

http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/BCM-M16-A4-AR15-Bravo-Company-carbine-rifle-s/146.htm

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v445/bravocompanyusa/BCM%20Complete%20Rifles/IMG_0384001_.jpg

asketes
07-05-2012, 8:22 AM
Tactical M1 anyone? haha

http://cdn5.thefirearmsblog.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/sag_ebr_stock-tm-tfb.jpg

Eat Dirt
07-05-2012, 8:26 AM
^^ That's just Wrong ......

bruss01
07-05-2012, 9:39 AM
Please do not let anyone hack apart your Garand.

I agree that these great old warhorses that are still in good shape are worthy of preservation.

But if you've got a rifle with a really beat-to-hell stock, bad muzzle and or throat erosion, next to no finish left on it, that you never shoot because of ammo or some other consideration... is it better to let the old beast rot away in the back of the gun safe, unloved, unappreciated? Or would it be better to fix it up, maybe customize it... put some decent wood on, a short barrel (if that's what you're interested in), and maybe chamber it in a round that is is in modern military use and compatible with other firearms you own? I can see reasons for doing it... primary among which is, that the gun will then be USED and SHOT instead of just taking up space somewhere. Frankly I believe John C. Garand would agree with that viewpoint, as his tools were made to be used.

gorenut
07-05-2012, 10:11 AM
I would love a Vepr Hunter in x54r
http://www.atlanticfirearms.com/data/default/images/catalog/large/VEPR54RHUNTER.jpg

Unfortunately these are out of your price range.

If you want Garand-esque with cheaper ammo, Mini 14 is pretty much the go-to choice. It'll definitely be smaller. Hogue stocks are a little bigger, but you won't get the massive platform as the Garand... though I think it'd be a waste to have such a big rifle shoot small rounds anyways.

Mossy Man
07-05-2012, 10:26 AM
thats a pretty sexy rifle gorenut...how much do those run

PEZHEAD265
07-05-2012, 10:41 AM
About 1200.00 plus shipping and dros and what ever other tacked on costs.I would wait a year or two and the will come down.

Capybara
07-05-2012, 10:42 AM
I'm telling you, all of you guys who haven't checked out the VEPRs and are just all hot and bothered about Mini 14s and Saigas, watch a few videos and read up on them, they are the total high-end AK and you can get 'em in 5.45, 7.62x39 and 7.62x54R. They are just beautiful and much more accurate than than the Mini 14 and Saiga, although, yes, they cost a lot more.

Sunday
07-05-2012, 10:45 AM
Reload!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

gorenut
07-05-2012, 10:49 AM
I'm telling you, all of you guys who haven't checked out the VEPRs and are just all hot and bothered about Mini 14s and Saigas, watch a few videos and read up on them, they are the total high-end AK and you can get 'em in 5.45, 7.62x39 and 7.62x54R. They are just beautiful and much more accurate than than the Mini 14 and Saiga, although, yes, they cost a lot more.

My only problem with the Veprs is that I'm not a fan of the stock. I don't really want a wannabe Dragunov stock and unfortunately the traditional rifle stocks are only available on the Hunter models. If they offered a standard Vepr with the traditional rifle stock, I'd be all over it.

asketes
08-01-2012, 8:03 AM
Here's a pick of my new Saiga 7.62x39

Picked it up on Monday, taking her to the range for the first time today.

http://i291.photobucket.com/albums/ll311/robduncan2972/Firearms/saiga_ak47_762x39mm.jpg