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Sousuke
06-09-2012, 12:45 PM
Hi all,

I have a few questions on the situation of disarming citizens and Katrina along with its relation to CA.

First, after a major earthquake (and I mean major i.e. not something we have seen in the last 100 years) what is the likelihood of something like Katrina happening here?

Second, does anyone have any information on exactly how the disarmament occurred? IE. Did police start forcing doors in? Were people able to stand up for their rights by shutting and locking their doors?

Third, did the police operate door to door or did they just use state registration information?

dvcrsn
06-09-2012, 12:58 PM
one difference is that thanks to Jack Scott ranting that he WANTED firearms confiscated after a major emergency on the floor of the Senate that was videotaped, confiscation after an emergency was made illegal because the NRA made it clear that inland Dems would be facing ads with that rant in the next election--and that would cost the Dems seats in areas other than right on the coast

RedMonkey
06-09-2012, 1:47 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRvmYzAKQK0

A quick NRA video regarding this very subject.

SilverTauron
06-09-2012, 2:21 PM
Hi all,

I have a few questions on the situation of disarming citizens and Katrina along with its relation to CA.

First, after a major earthquake (and I mean major i.e. not something we have seen in the last 100 years) what is the likelihood of something like Katrina happening here?
I wouldn't say its impossible. I doubt the state of emergency would last as long, being that earthquake disaster plans for California hopefully are in place somewhere within FEMA. Remember that the Katrina situation caught the authorities off guard on account of the storm weakening to a class 3 before landfall. That said the immediate aftermath will probably be unpleasant no matter whether its an earthquake, flood, tornado, etc.



Second, does anyone have any information on exactly how the disarmament occurred? IE. Did police start forcing doors in? Were people able to stand up for their rights by shutting and locking their doors?

From what information is available on the subject, there wasn't a viable defense available. Law Enforcement from all over the country were going door to door with AR15s and body armor searching homes for dead or flood survivors in need of help . If they encountered someone with a piece it got seized;there's a disturbing video on youtube of an 80 year old woman being tackled on camera when she went to retrieve her snub nose revolver following the LEO's request for guns in the home.




Third, did the police operate door to door or did they just use state registration information?


The confiscations were incidental to search and rescue. IIRC the primary goal was for the cops to clear each home one by one. Getting any kind of documentation and records would be impossible anyway, since Louisiana didn't have statewide registration nor did the City of New Orleans.

My thoughts on the subject: I doubt the police will be in a position to do any kind of organized confiscation. If an earthquake is sufficiently devastating to require Federal intervention on the level that Katrina demanded, there won't be squads of cops taking guns. In fact there won't be squads of cops at all, as communications , power,or transportation resources will be severely damaged or nonexistent. Police will be too busy trying to rescue people from the rubble to care about sending a runner to somewhere with a working phone line to get DROS papers on a given area-barring a security crisis.

That's what prompted the illegal order to simply seize everyone's arms-at that point in the Katrina crisis police were incapacitated , there were no resources or power available, and a lot of ghetto dwellers started realizing the lights weren't coming back on for a while. Desperate to salvage their sorry approval rating the powers that were did what they did to "seem" like they were trying to make a difference.

If crime begins to be a problem at the level where local politicians start breaking the law to save their image issues, its high time to get outta dodge. The best way to dodge a blow is to not be there.

HBrebel
06-09-2012, 3:04 PM
I wouldn't worry too much about that situation. In my area there are quite a few oath keepers and liberty minded folks. Plus they couldn't find my guns if they tried

speedrrracer
06-09-2012, 3:22 PM
I doubt it would be possible. Compared to Los Angeles, New Orleans is a tiny little ghost town.

Where are you going to get thousands of teams of cops to search almost five thousand square miles of LA County, containing almost 10 million people? What about OC? Are the cops going to stop at Seal Beach Blvd while all the OC peeps wave their guns from across the street? Now you're talking closer to 20 million people in the Greater LA Urbanized Area or whatever they call it.

There simply aren't enough cops to search that many homes in less than a year or so, and by then, either the disaster is over with or it's been full SHTF for about 11 months, at which point the cops aren't doing their jobs, they're at home protecting their families from all those sketchy militia-types who post in the Outdoors forum ;)

SanPedroShooter
06-09-2012, 8:57 PM
From what information is available on the subject, there wasn't a viable defense available. Law Enforcement from all over the country were going door to door with AR15s and body armor searching homes for dead or flood survivors in need of help . If they encountered someone with a piece it got seized;there's a disturbing video on youtube of an 80 year old woman being tackled on camera when she went to retrieve her snub nose revolver following the LEO's request for guns in the home.


I thought I read somewher that the cops in that video were volunteers from California....;)

Paul S
06-09-2012, 10:27 PM
And..a friendly bone to pick...

"I mean major i.e. not something we have seen in the last 100 years"

Share that view with residents of Tehachapi - 1952
Northridge, Coalinga, Santa Cruz (Loma Prieta quake) These were by definition based upon the Richter scale Major earthquakes.

pc_load_letter
06-09-2012, 10:43 PM
My father in law is San Diego PD. I asked him once about SDPDs disaster response\plan. He chuckled. He said not much is in place for San Diego if a Katrina style disaster hit. He said SDPD has zero plans to confiscate, much less search for arms. He went on to state that they'd expect 20% or less reporting for duty. Most cops would stay with their families.

Sousuke
06-09-2012, 10:52 PM
And..a friendly bone to pick...

"I mean major i.e. not something we have seen in the last 100 years"

Share that view with residents of Tehachapi - 1952
Northridge, Coalinga, Santa Cruz (Loma Prieta quake) These were by definition based upon the Richter scale Major earthquakes.

Hi,

I didn't mean to belittle the loss of life or people affected by earthquakes in the last 100 years. I just know that there are larger earthquakes possible that have the power to completely cut off entire cities from the world for weeks, months etc (with reference to Katrina).

Fate
06-09-2012, 11:11 PM
I have family and friends in southern Louisiana. To a T, they all state that Katrina style confiscations will never happen there again because people won't stand for it again.

They all mention that the standard response from residents in the area is "this time, we'll shoot 'em dead, if they try." Some even state they have heard people will shoot on sight anyhow, "just in case."

I wouldn't want to be a LEO in Louisiana should K2 happen.

Sunday
06-10-2012, 1:41 PM
The problem is 6 gestapo against 1 person is no match and 12 people will never organize to protect themselves from the gestapo.

alfred1222
06-10-2012, 1:49 PM
The problem is 6 gestapo against 1 person is no match and 12 people will never organize to protect themselves from the gestapo.

My AR holds a lot of bullets, MOLON LABE

NYsteveZ
06-10-2012, 3:40 PM
My father in law is San Diego PD. I asked him once about SDPDs disaster response\plan. He chuckled. He said not much is in place for San Diego if a Katrina style disaster hit. He said SDPD has zero plans to confiscate, much less search for arms. He went on to state that they'd expect 20% or less reporting for duty. Most cops would stay with their families.

Hmmm...Im in your area (North County), and if you want to count the wildfires of the past few years, we've already experienced mild/medium SHTF. Even a major magazine had us on the cover with the words "Not Katrina". For the most part everyone behaved, although there were a couple incidents of stupidity even witnessed by me, the PD had a good handle on things. BTW-Kudos to your father-in-law. Also, from what Ive seen, things were REALLY bad in Big Easy. Residents firing shots at police? Of course they are gonna call the National Guard! Thank the residents of 9th Ward for the military action. Speaking of...IF things get bad here or LA, sure the PD may be at 20%, but we have Pendleton, 29 Palms, the Navy, Miramar...I wouldnt want the USMC knocking at the door. As a former Marine who served in Iraq, it may not go well.

wjc
06-10-2012, 7:04 PM
The problem is 6 gestapo against 1 person is no match and 12 people will never organize to protect themselves from the gestapo.

Tell that to the French Resistance. They did it all the time. :D

blakdawg
06-10-2012, 7:54 PM
Another scenario is the LAPD's retreat from Florence/Normandie after the Rodney King beating verdict.

I for one am not expecting any sort of meaningful organized relief or rescue for weeks following a major event. There aren't enough roads, not enough people, not enough equipment, and not enough giving a ****. And the people being rescued will immediately go "full retard", making any attempt at helping that much worse. (see, e.g., post-quake Haiti.)

Instead of house-to-house searches for guns, the scenario that scares me is the Superdome/forced evacuation = internal refugee situation, where people are separated from their pets, families, guns, real, and personal property, warehoused in an impromptu concentration camp (er, "shelter"), and then bused hundreds or thousands of miles away before being issued a debit card worth a few hundred dollars and a crappy trailer.

It's basically impossible to make a meaningful house-to-house search of a major metro area for guns; but it's not so tough to search people for weapons/cash/contraband one-by-one as they're herded into a sports stadium or onto a bus/train.

And, frankly, if things go "full retard", that's pretty much what I expect, because urban/suburban people are not going to be prepared to live without infrastructure, much less defend themselves from looting/fire, etc . . . it won't take long before people are begging for "relief", which will no doubt involve being treated like cattle in exchange for some pretty crappy food and water.

Sunday
06-11-2012, 1:35 PM
Tell that to the French Resistance. They did it all the time. :D It didn't happen in New Orleans.

Dreaded Claymore
06-12-2012, 12:28 PM
I wouldn't say its impossible. I doubt the state of emergency would last as long, being that earthquake disaster plans for California hopefully are in place somewhere within FEMA.

In Before FEMA Camps

unusedusername
06-12-2012, 1:40 PM
It didn't happen in New Orleans.

If it did then we would not have heard about it.

jwkincal
06-12-2012, 1:56 PM
I wouldn't say its impossible. I doubt the state of emergency would last as long, being that earthquake disaster plans for California hopefully are in place somewhere within FEMA.

Two years ago a group of seismologists, first responders, and engineers did a study which concluded that some infrastructure may be out of operation for 3 months or more.

Now... those of you who actually live here... imagine the California summer with no running water?

Kukuforguns
06-12-2012, 5:00 PM
Two years ago a group of seismologists, first responders, and engineers did a study which concluded that some infrastructure may be out of operation for 3 months or more.

Now... those of you who actually live here... imagine the California summer with no running water?

I have. That's why I have a lot of water stored in multiple locations.

SilverTauron
06-12-2012, 5:19 PM
I have. That's why I have a lot of water stored in multiple locations.

For what its worth , even if you don't live in CA having water stored up is a very good idea.

a1c
06-12-2012, 5:39 PM
I hate to say it, but even if something major happens in California, it won't be a repeat of Katrina.

Why? Because the government will do its very best to rescue Californians, especially the LA/San Diego/OC area and the SF Bay Area, which are huge economies, not to mention the Central Valley infrastructure, which is key to the West's food supply.

Now if that happened in the northernmost counties of California (think Jefferson State), it might then be a repeat of the early 20th century, since after all, that area (except for the I-5 corridor) is not as key. But it's also incredibly sparsely populated. And people over there don't really like the Feds anyway, and are much more self-reliant than the coastal suburbanites.

In Louisiana, the people most affected were poor. Many of them didn't vote. The economy there was already in the crapper. The French Quarter remained safe from flooding waters, so the tourists would come back eventually. So yeah, there was a social and class gap. People were treated like dirt because they didn't matter as much to local and national politicians. Just like with the Rodney King riots, where the people affected were poor or hard-working immigrants.

blazeaglory
06-12-2012, 9:20 PM
Basically Katrina did what the federal government wanted to do but couldnt. The wards Katrina hit used to be the murder capital of the WORLD for a while. They did a test (before Katrina) in the 3rd ward. The police fired over 1000 rounds and then monitored 911 for incoming calls. They received a total of 2 calls. One of the calls was an old lady reporting fireworks.

Katrina did Louisiana a favor. Sad but true. Even sadder is I joined the Red Cross to help. Stank like a slaughter house gone rancid.

SilverTauron
06-13-2012, 7:48 AM
The nature of a major earthquake is also much different from a citywide flood.

After Katrina it was still possible for police and authorities to go door to door via boat.After a major earthquake land based transport becomes impossible, due to roads and highways being either physically destroyed or clogged with damaged cars, buildings, etc. Speaking of buildings, after a severe seismic event its tremendously unwise to re-enter a damaged building-even if its still standing.Police officers won't risk being killed in a sudden building collapse for anything less than saving someone's life.

Capybara
06-13-2012, 10:07 AM
One of the best scenarios I have ever read for this is in Albert Brooks' first novel, released last year, titled, "2030:The Real Story of What Happens to America" http://www.amazon.com/2030-Real-Story-Happens-America/dp/B0078XOKNK/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1339606759&sr=8-1&keywords=2030+the+real+story+of+what+happens+to+am erica

He did his research and the scenario depicted in the book seems pretty spot on, other than it happens 18 years from now. But the response and general aftermath, having been a lifelong Californian who went through about half of the big quakes listed above, seems pretty dead-on accurate.

Los Angeles is struck with a mega-quake and life is never the same. Police, Red Cross, the Military are all overwhelmed and guess what, it's because we are still near bankruptcy in 2030, just like today. The bottom line is that in the scenario, people are forced to leave their flattened homes to live in government sponsored relocation tent cities.

I agree with the posts above that say that all of the authorities in LA will be basically helpless if the big one (like the 9.4 in the story) hits. We are woefully underprepared, (unlike the Japanese, and look at how much hardship they have had to endure after their Tsunami and Quake) If a quake that size hits LA and you live here, basically you had better be prepared to move to a new state and start over again as far as material possessions. We would never be able to afford to re-build LA if an earthquake flattened it.