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View Full Version : Best Optic for AR-15


scubamark13
05-10-2007, 9:41 AM
I am new to the Ar-15 scene and I am about to build my first. I was hoping for some help on which optic or red dot is the best buy for the money under $700.

1. I am not sure what kind of shooting I will be doing yet but I am sure it will be mostly outdoors and some indoor shooting.

2. I am looking for something that will hold its zero as well as perform in low light and bright light conditions.

3. I also will not be shooting long distances 100 yards or less.

4. My friends are Aimpoint and Trigicon fans but neither own one for me to try.

Any help you can give me would be a great help,

Thanks

Prc329
05-10-2007, 10:05 AM
I love my EOtech. If you want non magnified it is a very good choice. They do make a magnified one (uses a removable 4x I believe) but that will put you out of your price range.

scubamark13
05-10-2007, 10:20 AM
Which one are you using?

SuperSet
05-10-2007, 10:33 AM
If you're shooting 100y or less, then you'll want a red dot like the EOTech or AimPoint.
Heck, for $700, you can do the EOTech 512 + the 3X magnifier when it comes out later this summer.

Soldier415
05-10-2007, 10:42 AM
The Army uses the Aimpoint...but a large number of Soldiers buy the EoTech before deploying and use it in combat.

much better ergonomically and you don't have to worry as much about the aimpoint getting cuahgt on things as it protrudes so far above the weapon.

my 2 cents

Jicko
05-10-2007, 10:47 AM
1. I am not sure what kind of shooting I will be doing yet but I am sure it will be mostly outdoors and some indoor shooting.

3. I also will not be shooting long distances 100 yards or less.

4. My friends are Aimpoint and Trigicon fans but neither own one for me to try.

Any help you can give me would be a great help,

Thanks

EOTech or other red-dot/holo sights are meant for CQB/25yds to 100yds(or up to 200/300yds), yet the most effective use of these is really 25yds to 150yds....

I think you REALLY need to THINK about kind of shooting you wanna do.... "I am not sure what kind of shooting I will be doing yet", this make it VERY hard for anyone to recommend something.... since... anything recommended can be good for one thing, and absolutely terrible for the other....

It is good that you mentioned NOT engaging under 100yds, that kind put CQB type optics out of the picture (ie. not EOTech)....

Now, you need to define 100yds out to what?

If you want 100-300yds engagement, with occasional 500yds man-sized targets... then, something like Trijicon ACOG4x or ACOG3.5x would be good, for 700, you should be able to find used ones... or discounted new ones... from maybe Brownells... for fasted acquisition, you may want to pick up their BAC models with chervon or donut rather than the NSN .223 Ballistic reticle.

If you want to engage frequently at 300yds+ ranges, like mostly 300-600,700,800, then... you would need a scope... a 3-9x or 3.5-10x or 4-12x are amount the most popular choice... you should be able to find yourself a good Leupold 3-9x or 3.5-10x around that price

scubamark13
05-10-2007, 10:55 AM
Up until this afternoon when I pick up my lower I have always been a pistol shooter. To be honest with you I don't know how fun it will be shooting a rifle indoors. That is why I say I will mostly do outdoor shooting. I live in Southern CA and there aren't many places that I know of to shoot. So for now I would say that it will mostly be outdoor range shooting.

Again thanks for all your help,

Mark

SuperSet
05-10-2007, 10:59 AM
Mark,
I live in the Bay Area but I have seen some postings for some group shoots in SoCal. Have you considered going to those? It'll allow you to try out some different optics. It might help you make up your mind.
Hope this helps.

Jicko
05-10-2007, 11:00 AM
Welcome to the BRD(black rifle disease)-support-group.... we are ALL sick here...

Please edit your user profile to include your "location", then we can better help and point you out to place to go shoot... or to get-together events... you really should plan on just coming out and seeing what is out there first.....

Before you decide on anything.... try to read as much as you can on this site first... you will have tons of questions... use search frequently.... go and read up in the "new to calguns" forum....

LONG before you figure out what optics to get, you would have to figure what "rifle" you are building.... 16" M4.... or 24" Varmithunter.... or 18" SPR.... or some precision long range rifle...

So, go read up more first...

Prc329
05-10-2007, 11:32 AM
Jicko has a good point.

Oh and I'm using the 552.a65

SuperSet
05-10-2007, 11:52 AM
Hey dude,
Can you clarify your request? I found it confusing:

3. I also will not be shooting long distances 100 yards or less.

Are you primarily shooting:
A) 100Y or less or
B) 100Y and out

Jicko
05-10-2007, 12:13 PM
Hey dude,
Can you clarify your request? I found it confusing:

3. I also will not be shooting long distances 100 yards or less.

Are you primarily shooting:
A) 100Y or less or
B) 100Y and out

ha ha ha

totally...

Jicko
05-10-2007, 12:17 PM
Let me just "repost", as a summary (most frequent engagement scenario):

Under 10yds
Pistol, knife, ballpen, karate, rifle-stock, YHM-Phantom-5C2 etc...

10yds(CQB) to 150yds
EOTech or other red-dot/holo sights are meant for CQB/25yds to 100yds(or up to 200/300yds), yet the most effective use of these is really 25yds to 150yds....

100yds to 300yds
If you want 100-300yds engagement, with occasional 500yds man-sized targets... then, something like Trijicon ACOG4x or ACOG3.5x would be good, for 700, you should be able to find used ones... or discounted new ones... from maybe Brownells... for fasted acquisition, you may want to pick up their BAC models with chervon or donut rather than the NSN .223 Ballistic reticle.

300yds+
If you want to engage frequently at 300yds+ ranges, like mostly 300-600,700,800, then... you would need a scope... a 3-9x or 3.5-10x or 4-12x are amount the most popular choice... you should be able to find yourself a good Leupold 3-9x or 3.5-10x around that price

PS. personally, on my CQB/IPSC/3-guns/tactical-match/10-150yds AR, I use EOTech 552.A65

wildcard
05-10-2007, 1:36 PM
If your targets are man sized targets up to 200 yds and speed is the name of the game.. I say get an eotech.

If you're looking for groupings and aiming at targets that are a few inches in diameter.. get yourself and IOR with 4X magnification.

And if you're loking for accuracy from 50 - 600 yds, get yourself a fixed 10X like a Super Sniper.

maxicon
05-10-2007, 1:47 PM
I also will not be shooting long distances 100 yards or less.

I read that as missing a semicolon:

"I also will not be shooting long distances; 100 yards or less."

Makes sense for a new AR shooter. I'd also guess he's not a long-distance shooter of other rifles, or he'd have more background in optics.

If these assumptions are true, I'd also recommend the Eotech in that price range. Best general purpose sub-100 yard optic for the AR, IMO, and the resale value is very good if he decides he doesn't like it. He could also get a Leupold CQ/T for less than his price range, but that's not really a beginner's scope...

ivorykid
05-10-2007, 8:39 PM
For "100 yards or less," I like the EOTech. I have the 512.A65. Great quick optic.

scubamark13
05-11-2007, 9:24 AM
Thanks everyone!

Yes it will be 100y or less.

I live in San Diego.

I am building a:

Stag Arms lower
Stag arms 2ht upper
Stag arms tatical butt stock
folding forward grip
Optic?

I just got a e-mail from Stag and my upper is out of stock so it looks like I will have 3 weeks to figure out which one I want to get. From what you guys are saying about EOTech I think I will get the EOTech Model 550 AA. Let me know what you think this one.

Also if you know somewhere I can go try it i would appreciate you letting me know where.

Thanks

SuperSet
05-11-2007, 9:51 AM
Scubamark13,
Unless you need the Night Vision capabilities of the 55x series, you'll probably want to go with the 512 AA version.
Or if you want to pony up the money, get the 553. It runs on 123 batteries, same as your tactical light, and has a built in riser.
Hope this helps.

Jicko
05-11-2007, 10:16 AM
Thanks everyone!

Yes it will be 100y or less.

I live in San Diego.

I am building a:

Stag Arms lower
Stag arms 2ht upper
Stag arms tatical butt stock
folding forward grip
Optic?

I just got a e-mail from Stag and my upper is out of stock so it looks like I will have 3 weeks to figure out which one I want to get. From what you guys are saying about EOTech I think I will get the EOTech Model 550 AA. Let me know what you think this one.

Also if you know somewhere I can go try it i would appreciate you letting me know where.

Thanks


Yours will be JUST like this then (minus the fake can). You can try to go to lanworldinc.com and see if Chris have one of those upper in stock, he probably can get it for you cheaper than you can get it directly from Stag. Be sure to get your bullet-button mag lock and 10rounds magazine, Chris have them too.

http://images22.fotki.com/v723/photos/2/26966/4693754/IMG_9361-vi.jpg

I personally liked the AA model, cheap and readily available batteries.

You may consider getting a 1/4" riser to achieve 1/3 co-witness, without the riser, it would be absolute co-witness, ie. your iron sight will be in the center of your EOTech.

I'm in San Diego, PM me if you want to get together to try out my EOTech.

I can also help you if you need help building your lower receiver too.

scubamark13
05-11-2007, 10:33 AM
That is a sick looking rifle.
I appreciate the offer I might take you up on it. I bought the prince50 designs mag-lock kit because the bullet button one from what I am told isn't approved by the DOJ yet.

Stupid question what is that on the bottom of your mag?

Jicko
05-11-2007, 12:19 PM
That is a sick looking rifle.
I appreciate the offer I might take you up on it. I bought the prince50 designs mag-lock kit because the bullet button one from what I am told isn't approved by the DOJ yet.

NO MAG-LOCK kit is approved DUH! A bullet-button or a prince50 or merely a hex-nut.... they are "EQUAL" in terms of legality.... we believed they are all LEGAL.... as long as you need a "tool" to remve the magazine...

If you are not comfortable with the Bullet-Button, then, continue to TOP LOAD with the bullet button... it is JUST the same.... (it may EVEN be better with the BB, imho, since, even when you have your magazine removed, there is still NOT an completely open mag well.... ie. if you insert a magazine, it will instantly be locked in place and NOT detachable anymore...)


Stupid question what is that on the bottom of your mag?

original Magpul..... go check out www.magpul.com they are are quality manufacturer, and they now do MUCH MORE than just the "original Magpul"

scubamark13
05-11-2007, 7:31 PM
Another stupid question Is it legal to change the mags with a tool?

Jicko
05-11-2007, 11:19 PM
Another stupid question Is it legal to change the mags with a tool?

Yes, legal. But if you are not comfortable, then keep top-loading.... top-loading is FUN, and $$ saving... since u will have a lot more to do

By the way, most likely, I'll be @ the Rainbow Range for their tactical match tomorrow 9-12, and will be there shooting after 12... look for my SPR... then we can chat more... :)

aplinker
05-12-2007, 12:58 AM
If you're not shooting out beyond 200 yds I would definitely go with an EOTech. I love mine. I have 3 now. I sold my Aimpont to buy the 2nd. If you don't own nightvision, just get the 512. It will save you some money. They're so nice.

You might want to consider buying something cheaper, though. I still have a 2X red dot that works great and holds zero I got for 60 bucks. With an EOTech, ACOG, Aimpoint you're paying for field ruggedness and save your life reliability. Lord knows I'm not one to skimp on my guns, though, so I'm not gonna tell you to keep your wallet in your pocket, either!

shark92651
05-12-2007, 10:30 PM
I love mine. I've got 4 Eotech 512's in stock. If anybody is interested PM me and I can cut you a deal. I'm just saying... :rolleyes:

kicker72
05-13-2007, 1:21 AM
Another +1 for Eotech, You can easily hit targets out to 300 yards, and it's super fast at acquiring targets at close distance.;)

scubamark13
05-14-2007, 9:10 AM
Thanks everyone for all your help I really appreciate it.

I couldn't make it to the range this weekend due to spending it with Mom. Let me know when you go again.

Thanks

tiger222
05-14-2007, 2:27 PM
just to confuse you a little- there is a scope on ARF - a GRSC budget short dot for $350 that will be avail in june/july. takes cues from the S&B short dot, which really is the best scope for an AR, and makes it somewhat affordable and has ranging out to 600m on a M4 platform using SS109/M855

it's a 1-4 power illuminated scope. I have one on order and should be interesting to see how it turns out.

if you don't like magnified optics, then an eotech or aimpoint should work.

either way - no matter what - have fun!!

scubamark13
05-16-2007, 9:09 AM
Check it out this is what I have so far
I hope it works.

Cpl. Haas
05-16-2007, 10:18 AM
Check it out this is what I have so far
I hope it works.

Nice looking rifle! What kind of magazine is that?

As for optics, I've got an EOTech 512.A65 on my OLL and I love it! They're completely parallax free, so you won't find yourself struggling to focus your eye between the reticle and the target... you just look through the sight window, and the reticle appears to be "painted" on the target.

scubamark13
05-16-2007, 4:50 PM
It's the Stag 10-30 mag. I just bought the EOTech 512.A65 from www.riflegear.com the guy a few posts up he hooked me up. I will install this weekend and try it out. I am sure I will like it from everything people have been saying about it.

I will post more pictures after I get it on,

Mark

scubamark13
05-21-2007, 4:56 PM
My first build is complete. Thanks everyone for your advice. Let me know what you think

3GunFunShooter
05-21-2007, 5:19 PM
Tiger222,
I have one on order also. Looks like a great scope for the $.
Lot of 3 gunners are interested.
Have you heard any more about delivery?

50 Freak
05-24-2007, 11:49 PM
Scuba....

Any reason your ARMS BUIS is so far forward?

scubamark13
05-25-2007, 9:15 AM
I am pretty sure it is all the way back it may be one notch up. I am new to the rifle scene and I haven't quite figured out where I need it yet. I am going out this weekend to try it out and sight it in. I guess I will have to figure out where it works the best.

Do you have any suggestion on a good starting point for both the Eotech and the BUIS?

Thanks,

Jicko
05-25-2007, 10:52 AM
Compare yours to mine, yours is definitely NOT all the way to the back.

scubamark13
05-25-2007, 11:12 AM
Do you have pictures somewhere or is it in your link?

Jicko
05-25-2007, 11:19 AM
Do you have pictures somewhere or is it in your link?

Post #19 of this thread!!

tiger222
05-25-2007, 12:05 PM
Tiger222,
I have one on order also. Looks like a great scope for the $.
Lot of 3 gunners are interested.
Have you heard any more about delivery?


hey 3gun - I was told mid June at the earliest, more likely July, I'm #403 ? or something like that - how about you?

scubamark13
05-25-2007, 1:52 PM
Yours does lool further back is there any reason to have it so far back?

3GunFunShooter
05-25-2007, 1:53 PM
I'm 350 something.
Had not heard Mid June or July. I check AR15.com each day for an update.
Can't wait to get it. Are you getting the LaRue mount?
They are pricey, but will hold zero if you have to take it off.
I have been using the Simmons 1.5-5 Diamond Pro. Great scope for the money. I paid 49.99 from CDNN. Looking forward to using the BDC on it.

Prc329
05-25-2007, 2:17 PM
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v425/naytwan/DSC00927.jpg

See how close it is to the charge handle?

maxicon
05-25-2007, 6:42 PM
I like mine further ahead of the charging handle too, when I can do it. Just one less thing to get in the way.