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USMCM16A2
05-25-2012, 11:31 AM
Folks,



NRA,CGF,CRPA must increase efforts to get the message out to firearms owners in this state, get the word out that we have a voice. Print, radio, TV, there are millions of firearms owners in California. Many of us have been silent for to long.
San Francisco, Los Angeles, DO NOT have a mandate to destroy our 2A rights. They can be fought, but the word has to be out there. And yes, I am member/contributer of the above organization. In our state we have seem to be able to give rights/privaleges to folks that may or may not deserve them, so we now must exercise our rights as a persecuted minority, and be vocal, diplomatic, but firm in our convictions. Thanks, to the above organizations for the work that they have done, and are doing. Thank you to all the individuals involved. A2

littlejake
05-25-2012, 12:25 PM
"These are the times that try men's souls. The summer soldier and the sunshine patriot will, in the crisis, shrink from the service of their country; but he that stands now, deserves the love and thanks of man and woman. Tyranny, like hell, is not easily conquered; yet we have this consolation with us, that the harder the conflict, the more glorious the triumph. What we obtain too cheap, we esteem too lightly; 'tis dearness only that gives everything it's value. Heaven knows how to put a proper price on it's goods; and it would be strange indeed, if so celestial an article as freedom should not be highly rated." -- Thomas Paine

Montu
05-25-2012, 12:29 PM
i think cgf flyers should come with every gun sold in ca.

And the gun shop should ask if you want to make a donation even if its just a dollar or two.

12voltguy
05-25-2012, 12:45 PM
Folks,



NRA,CGF,CRPA must increase efforts to get the message out to firearms owners in this state, get the word out that we have a voice. Print, radio, TV, there are millions of firearms owners in California. Many of us have been silent for to long.
San Francisco, Los Angeles, DO NOT have a mandate to destroy our 2A rights. They can be fought, but the word has to be out there. And yes, I am member/contributer of the above organization. In our state we have seem to be able to give rights/privaleges to folks that may or may not deserve them, so we now must exercise our rights as a persecuted minority, and be vocal, diplomatic, but firm in our convictions. Thanks, to the above organizations for the work that they have done, and are doing. Thank you to all the individuals involved. A2
why aren't you a CGN Contributor too?
you are using this fourm to get your words out?????????

Stonewalker
05-25-2012, 2:11 PM
Too many gun owners - especially in this state - don't understand that when the phrase "reasonable gun control" is spoken by CA Democrats and VPC/Brady/BLoomie that it always means "to solve gun crimes we need to reduce the number of gun owners".

We break gun owners out of this fallacy by telling them that the VPC has called for a ban on any rifle that can be fitted with a scope. They call them sniper rifles. (http://daysofourtrailers.blogspot.com/2008/02/for-hunters-who-dont-believe-theyre-on.html). Rights is rights, owning a gun without caring about rights makes you a free-loading elitist.

USMCM16A2
05-25-2012, 2:46 PM
Gents,



CGN contributor..............in addition. A2

bloodhawke83
05-25-2012, 2:56 PM
why aren't you a CGN Contributor too?
you are using this fourm to get your words out?????????

CGN doesn't do anything, its just a forum to discuss w/e.

12voltguy
05-25-2012, 3:00 PM
CGN doesn't do anything, its just a forum to discuss w/e.

really?
If it were not for this forum I wouldn't know about CGF or to donate;):facepalm:

12voltguy
05-25-2012, 3:03 PM
just joined NRA again
let the spamm mail start,lol

monk
05-25-2012, 3:19 PM
NRA is pissing me off with their constant nagging to renew my membership. It doesn't expire until August but they've been bugging me since February. Still, I do plan on renewing. Just donated last night to SAF as well.

nicki
05-25-2012, 3:27 PM
Folks,



NRA,CGF,CRPA must increase efforts to get the message out to firearms owners in this state, get the word out that we have a voice. Print, radio, TV, there are millions of firearms owners in California. Many of us have been silent for to long.
San Francisco, Los Angeles, DO NOT have a mandate to destroy our 2A rights. They can be fought, but the word has to be out there. And yes, I am member/contributer of the above organization. In our state we have seem to be able to give rights/privaleges to folks that may or may not deserve them, so we now must exercise our rights as a persecuted minority, and be vocal, diplomatic, but firm in our convictions. Thanks, to the above organizations for the work that they have done, and are doing. Thank you to all the individuals involved. A2

One thing you will notice is our opponents are smart enough to grandfather people, that means whatever they do effects future gun rights.

We have many gun owners who look at guns as something that isn't that important to them.

Many sports shooters wouldn't care if handguns or so called EBRs were banned. Those are the kind of persons who may breakout their shotguns maybe a few times per year for some trap shooting.

Vice President Biden for instance says no one is going to take his Beretta shotgun, yet while he was in the US Senate he pushed for handgun bans and bans on our EBRs.

I like the shift we are making here from gun rights to civil rights and that means we can reach a different group of folks.

Many of our strongest gun rights activists don't even own guns. Robert Levy who bankrolled Alan Gura in the Heller case is an example. He was a retired lawyer who spent 187,000 dollars out of his own money for a principle because he wasn't a gun owner.

He just had an issue with how could the second amendment be effectively dead, so he funded a case to bring it back to life.

Had he not funded Alan Gura we would be in real deep trouble right now.

The firearms industry is now not only alive, but making record profits and I personally think they should reimburse him for what he did because if he didn't do what he did, they could be out of business.

Many Americans like the free ride/lunch programs, in other words they let other people step up and do what they should be doing. Unfortunately yelling at them about their non action just gets them to tune out.

Surprisingly people will do stuff if a friend asks them and once they start they find they have fun and then they are hooked.

Humans are social creatures, this is why we need to have fun events to hang out at, to do things.

It is why we need to get in the face of our opponents because they are emotionally damaged drones who let fear control their lives. It is fun to watch them squirm.

Speaking of getting in the drone's faces, we have the upcoming SF gay pride parade on Sunday June 24th where wehave a pro gun contingent,, the Pink Pistols marching and our message is simple, armed self defense is a human right.

We have 100 million gun owners, if everyone of them would invest 10 dollars and 10 hours of their time for 3 election cycles, we wouldn't have a gun control problem.

Unfortunately less than 1 perecnet of them are really doing anything. The bright side of this of course means we have alot of room to grow.


Nicki

12voltguy
05-25-2012, 3:37 PM
NRA is pissing me off with their constant nagging to renew my membership. It doesn't expire until August but they've been bugging me since February. Still, I do plan on renewing. Just donated last night to SAF as well.

yup
I did that free year a few years back
3 weeks into it they start begging me to become a "real member"
put me off, I have no problem beliving they only have 5% of gunowners as members...........I really only joined because hoffmag says it's important, more so then CGF but I still send CGF more $ 1st

USMCM16A2
05-25-2012, 3:48 PM
Niki,



I appreciate what you are saying, and appreciate what you have done for us as a group in conjunction with Gene. This fight is not about gay/straight, black,white, brown gun owners this is a fight that involves all of us. It is a Civil Rights struggle and should be approached as such. We as group,firearms owners, have been divided in the past. AR guy/gals, hunters/non-hunters, black powder, so, on. It is time that it stops. A2

Ubermcoupe
05-25-2012, 7:14 PM
CGN doesn't do anything, its just a forum to discuss w/e.

:confused: It appears as though you just contradicted yourself.

monk
05-25-2012, 7:20 PM
Niki,



I appreciate what you are saying, and appreciate what you have done for us as a group in conjunction with Gene. This fight is not about gay/straight, black,white, brown. It is a Civil Rights struggle and should be approached as such. We as group,firearms owners, have been divided in the past. AR guy/gals, hunters/non-hunters, black powder, so, on. It is time that it stops. A2

You seem to believe that even when we prevail in this backwards state, that it'll be the end of it. Like us, anti-2A people have the belief that they'll live to fight another day. Another bit of law here, another case won there. It'll be never ending.

Still...bring it on.

bwiese
05-25-2012, 7:27 PM
Niki,

I appreciate what you are saying, and appreciate what you have done for us as a group in conjunction with Gene. This fight is not about gay/straight, black,white, brown. It is a Civil Rights struggle and should be approached as such.


So the fight against Prop 8 or segregation in the south are not civil rights struggles?

Logic like that is why general population doesn't like gunnies in CA.

nicki
05-25-2012, 8:06 PM
Niki,



I appreciate what you are saying, and appreciate what you have done for us as a group in conjunction with Gene. This fight is not about gay/straight, black,white, brown. It is a Civil Rights struggle and should be approached as such. We as group,firearms owners, have been divided in the past. AR guy/gals, hunters/non-hunters, black powder, so, on. It is time that it stops. A2

In the ideal world we would all be individuals, but we are in the real world and like it or not we are all in our various groups.

The reality is most people are sheep, they go along with the flow. The reality is many people who are against us are only that way because they flow with the groups they are in on other issues.

Jesus didn't hang out with the righteous, he went out to save the sinners.

We can make the argument to people who are involved in other rights issues that their rights are dependent on our rights.

Oaklander is doing alot of ground work up in oakland regarding dealing with the violence problem, those are the types of efforts we need.

The great part is that even if we don't make alot of progress, our image is that we care and are working to be partners in viable solutions.

I don't want special rights, just equal. If something comes along that gies me a special right and I can set it up to expand everyone's rights, ( am going to jump on it in a heartbeat.

Stonewalker
05-26-2012, 2:49 AM
In the ideal world we would all be individuals, but we are in the real world and like it or not we are all in our various groups.

The reality is most people are sheep, they go along with the flow. The reality is many people who are against us are only that way because they flow with the groups they are in on other issues.

Jesus didn't hang out with the righteous, he went out to save the sinners.

We can make the argument to people who are involved in other rights issues that their rights are dependent on our rights.

Oaklander is doing alot of ground work up in oakland regarding dealing with the violence problem, those are the types of efforts we need.

The great part is that even if we don't make alot of progress, our image is that we care and are working to be partners in viable solutions.

I don't want special rights, just equal. If something comes along that gies me a special right and I can set it up to expand everyone's rights, ( am going to jump on it in a heartbeat.

Tribalism (group-think, or the tendency to gather into groups and then justify hatred between groups based on the differences between groups) is inherent in human nature. It's the easiest path to take. I'm not sure why, but it seems to take an incredible amount of intentionality and head-space to maintain individuality and critical thought. The easy position is to identify with a group and then adopt the values of that group. This "simple tribalism" allows people to go to work everyday, deal with their own personal problems and spend any extra energy they have on fun. All without ever having to commit brain cycles to identifying with people who are different from themselves.

Anyways, if we are going to be human rights advocates (self defense is a human right), then we must be vigilant against tribalism in our individual hearts. And since you brought up Jesus, I'll go ahead and say that the supernatural love embodied had no room in it for petty tribalism.

=Mike=
05-26-2012, 6:34 AM
So the fight against Prop 8 or segregation in the south are not civil rights struggles?

Logic like that is why general population doesn't like gunnies in CA.

And comparing those two is why the general population of gunnies dont think CA has any logic.

Dutch3
05-26-2012, 6:46 AM
What about organizations like Ducks Unlimited? There are duck clubs around here with million-dollar memberships, it seems like a pretty solid organization. Are they silent on these issues?

Honestly, sitting in a wet, freezing blind in the middle of a flooded rice field in December is not for me, but some very affluent people make a lifestyle out of it.

TNP'R
05-26-2012, 7:03 AM
What about organizations like Ducks Unlimited? There are duck clubs around here with million-dollar memberships, it seems like a pretty solid organization. Are they silent on these issues?

Honestly, sitting in a wet, freezing blind in the middle of a flooded rice field in December is not for me, but some very affluent people make a lifestyle out of it.

Well issues like the bullet button they probably don't care about. A lot of hunters don't see the need to own an ar-15 so they think people shouldn't own them anyway. The trouble with sports clubs sometimes is if their specific genre isn't effected they don't care.

Dutch3
05-26-2012, 7:27 AM
Well issues like the bullet button they probably don't care about. A lot of hunters don't see the need to own an ar-15 so they think people shouldn't own them anyway. The trouble with sports clubs sometimes is if their specific genre isn't effected they don't care.

I guess you are right. From the "Hunting Position Statement" on the DU site:

"Ducks Unlimited, Inc. does not direct its resources toward the influence of firearm or hunting legislation unless the legislation is clearly and directly related to waterfowl habitat conservation."

I expect they won't change their position until fancy semiautomatic shotguns start getting banned.

USMCM16A2
05-26-2012, 9:41 AM
Folks,


I corrected my latest post, what I meant to say were the comments in the edit. We as shooters are made up of every race,ethnicity, sexual orientation so on. It was a case of open mouth insert foot, say one thing mean another. We are in this together, A2

Meplat
05-26-2012, 10:16 AM
Well, maybe a start would be to quit pissing and moaning and name calling. Maybe a little less self righteousness and a bit more concern for their little corner of the struggle would get them a little more interested in our battles. I wonder just how many on this forum actually called or wrote or emailed their representative to try to help the hound hunters recently?

This forum seems to have a lot of EBR & LTC folks that were not raised in the hunting tradition. Many seem to be younger people who were not interested in guns until they became infatuated with EBRs and all things tacticool. God bless them; we need all the help and recruits we can get. But let me clue you in on something; I hate AR pattern rifles! That stems from the experience of losing friends, who died with a jammed up, useless POS rifle in their hands, that was foisted off on the guys in Viet Nam! They didn’t even come with cleaning kits, they were supposed to be self cleaning, they didn’t even have a forward assist. Stoner should have stuck to airplanes! I realize the ARs are a lot better rifle now than then. Many of the problems have been solved. But unless equipped with a push rod gas system, it still craps where it eats.

I have a lot of friends and family that are primarily hunters; only two have EBRs. I wouldn’t have an AR in my safe. But we all follow this forum, we all contribute to CGF, and we are down for the fight. They are all ready to fight the bullet button ban, when personally few of them would be inconvenienced if every BB ever mad was dumped in the ocean. There are hunters and competition target shooters who are solidly on board against any farther infringement of the 2A, and to roll back the ones that already exist. Sure there are slackers that can’t see beyond their own personal pursuits. And they may be a higher percentage in the major population centers than here. But all the local folks I hunt with are absolutely in the fight. We used the get a lot of SF & LA types come to the valley and hunt pheasants in the AG fields with us. Now some of them needed solidarity training badly. Some would not hunt with us if we were packing handguns, which was alright with us because their gun handling safety was scary.

Where were the EBR guys when we lost trapping? Watching wild kingdom or animal planet? Where were they when we lost the Mountain Lion battles, or Lead bullets, or hounds? Why do we not see the log in our own eye but concern ourselves with the mote in our neighbor’s?

If you want more hunters on board, make an effort to locate and befriend them, maybe get an invite to go hunting with them. Locating people you know that are hunters may be a little iffy, because they, like other shooters often keep a low profile to avoid persecution and discrimination, especially in the workplace. Find out what their concerns are. Help them in their fights. Get them to go out and shoot your EBR with you. That is the best way to get them on board. Then we can fight for all our rights together.

Remember, to secure your rights you must be willing to allow others theirs. That is what must be understood by all the different interests involved. There is MSM propaganda against us all. Media depictions of cuddly cute little Lion cubs got us a ban on Lion hunting. Now in the US the highest number of human fatalities due to wild animals is by Mountain Lions, not allergic reactions to bee stings, not poisonous snakes, not venomous spiders, not bears; MOUNTAIN LIONS! Media spread Hysteria over evil and unusual looking guns got us assault weapon bans. Now propaganda about BBs is being spread, when no one can point to a crime being committed with a BB equipped weapon. The media will vilify us all to keep chipping away at our freedom. So remember, what your neighbor thinks he knows about your EBR is probably not true. And what some of you think you know about hunting and hunters is damn sure not true. And you both have to realize that if one is a little nervous about EBRs, and the other a little squeamish about killing one’s own food, you have to get over it and stick together, that is the price of liberty. “To have it you must give it!”

motorhead
05-26-2012, 1:26 PM
in my 55 years here, the biggest enemy i've encountered is APATHY. one of the largest reasons we have the reprehensible creatures in power that we do. watch the election turnouts. usually 50% or more of those eligible to vote are too lazy to MAIL IN a ballot.

what was it happens when good men do nothing?

pennys dad
05-26-2012, 7:34 PM
CGN doesn't do anything, its just a forum to discuss w/e.

Hi There, CGN does help. CGN supports the C3 or Calguns Community Chapters: http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/forumdisplay.php?f=183

We put host shoots, man gun show booths, host new shooter events, work events non shooting events. We are partnering with a few organizations to support their PRO2A agenda's and help expose them to the CGN community. We operate basically under the concept of: Getting the Calgunner out from behind the keyboard and out to meet other shooters in their area. We hope by meeting others and shooting, talking and making friends we can form communities and strengthen our voice.

CGN pays for all the efforts we take on in the C3