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Oregon_Border_Bandit
05-18-2012, 10:25 AM
1st thank You folks for answering in depth my OR to CA , AR transport / import questions yesterday.

Note: We go sage rat exterminating aka shooting Beldings ground squirrels ( by the "HUNDREDS" ! ) just across the border in extreme rural nor Cal on a 20,000 acre alfalfa farm fields and so I was an un indited co-conspirator / felon importing an assault rifle in the commission of an animal assassination mass murder !!! Call the Warren Commission we need to re open the case, lol.

RV - MOTOR HOME QUESTION: My 30 ft class A motor home is it a "home" , and not subject to locked unloaded carry as a home is not a vehicle ?

or

Is it a vehicle and subject to all laws of weapon , loaded , unloaded concealment and carry .

or

It is a home when stopped and occupied as a domicile in a public camp, park area, and then a vehicle when being actively driven or on a public street, highway, road or public access parking area ?

My 'guess' is it is a hybrid as to were it is located and weather it is moving.

NOTE: In the last year in Oregon ( paraphrasing ) Vehicle legal definition has changed > a car / vehicle is a 'public place' and NOT a 'private place' , and so You do not have ANY expectation to privacy in a vehicle and is subject to entrance - ingress and egress by the general public with all the liabilities and lacks of securities and former expectations there in

Digressing to my question. Example: I am parked in a public camp ground or in a public forest clearly of off the road way at a dead end away from any right of way or 2 lane road I have my loaded legal weapons inside, legal as per the definition in CA Flow Chart.

QUESTION: As per above, am I in my home or in my vehicle when parked for the week 'camping' in my motor home - RV ?

Thank you

Hanniballs
05-18-2012, 10:31 AM
QUESTION: am I in my home or in my vehicle when parked for the week 'camping' in my motor home - RV ?

Thank you

Your home.

Decoligny
05-18-2012, 10:39 AM
1st thank You folks for answering in depth my OR to CA , AR transport / import questions yesterday.

Note: We go sage rat exterminating aka shooting Beldings ground squirrels ( by the "HUNDREDS" ! ) just across the border in extreme rural nor Cal on a 20,000 acre alfalfa farm fields and so I was an un indited co-conspirator / felon importing an assault rifle in the commission of an animal assassination mass murder !!! Call the Warren Commission we need to re open the case, lol.

No date given here, so I will assume you are talking about the distant past, i.e. well beyond the statute of limitations.

RV - MOTOR HOME QUESTION: My 30 ft class A motor home is it a "home" , and not subject to locked unloaded carry as a home is not a vehicle ?

or

Is it a vehicle and subject to all laws of weapon , loaded , unloaded concealment and carry .

or

It is a home when stopped and occupied as a domicile in a public camp, park area, and then a vehicle when being actively driven or on a public street, highway, road or public access parking area ?

#3 is the correct answer. Home when camping, vehicle when driving.

My 'guess' is it is a hybrid as to were it is located and weather it is moving.

NOTE: In the last year in Oregon ( paraphrasing ) Vehicle legal definition has changed > a car / vehicle is a 'public place' and NOT a 'private place' , and so You do not have ANY expectation to privacy in a vehicle and is subject to entrance - ingress and egress by the general public with all the liabilities and lacks of securities and former expectations there in

Digressing to my question. Example: I am parked in a public camp ground or in a public forest clearly of off the road way at a dead end away from any right of way or 2 lane road I have my loaded legal weapons inside, legal as per the definition in CA Flow Chart.

QUESTION: As per above, am I in my home or in my vehicle when parked for the week 'camping' in my motor home - RV ?

Thank you

See Bold above.

cmichini
05-18-2012, 10:54 AM
my thought is if its rolling its a vehicle. if its chilling its a domicile. ymmv

Glock22Fan
05-18-2012, 11:36 AM
It is a home when stopped and occupied as a domicile in a public camp, park area, and then a vehicle when being actively driven or on a public street, highway, road or public access parking area ?


Yes.

OTOH, a car that you just happen to be sleeping in at the time is almost certainly not a home for this purpose.

BigDogatPlay
05-18-2012, 12:19 PM
Parked where you're allowed to live in it, then it's a domicile.

Rolling on the road it's a vehicle and all requirements for transporting firearms within apply.

MudCamper
05-18-2012, 12:31 PM
I believe "domicile" is the wrong term. That means a permanent residence. Your RV is a "residence".

While you are camping in your RV, it is your residence. Both 25400 (12025) (concealed) and 25850 (12031) (loaded) include exemptions for your residence. So while using it as a residence you can load and conceal. While driving you can't.

But be careful of other laws, which do not include a residence exemption, like CCR Title 14, Div 3, Chap 1, s 4313 which prohibits possession in a State Park unless it is locked up. (See Firearms in Forests and Parks (http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=186457) for more details on that topic.)

sfpcservice
05-18-2012, 12:50 PM
There was some caselaw on this where a dude got popped for 626.9 (CA gun free school zone). I think he was sleeping in a motorhome or van conversion that was within 1000 feet of a school. I think it was on the street though and not in a camp site.

Curley Red
05-18-2012, 12:52 PM
Parked where you're allowed to live in it, then it's a domicile.

Rolling on the road it's a vehicle and all requirements for transporting firearms within apply.

As a fellow RV'er I agree with BigDog 100%.

Mssr. Eleganté
05-18-2012, 12:59 PM
Here's some good reading on the subject...

http://www.llrmi.com/articles/legal_update/9th_warrantless_search_home.shtml

Just using the motorhome as a residence isn't enough.

dls
05-18-2012, 2:42 PM
I'm pretty sure you can have an open container in the back while underway. We were pulled over for speeding years ago by CHP, and we were drinking in back. So there must be some difference.

ar15robert
05-18-2012, 2:49 PM
I'm pretty sure you can have an open container in the back while underway. We were pulled over for speeding years ago by CHP, and we were drinking in back. So there must be some difference.

Yup open container is fine just not in the front driver passenger area.But firearms i was told my cops is rolling lock it up stopped and parked(camped) you can unlock it.

BigDogatPlay
05-18-2012, 8:38 PM
I'm pretty sure you can have an open container in the back while underway. We were pulled over for speeding years ago by CHP, and we were drinking in back. So there must be some difference.

There is a specific exemption in the VC for open containers in the living area of RV's. VC 23225(c) and 23226(c).

Oregon_Border_Bandit
05-18-2012, 9:28 PM
Again, thank You folks for answering & enlightening me "thumbs up":D

Quiet
05-18-2012, 11:23 PM
Parked where you're allowed to live in it, then it's a domicile.

Rolling on the road it's a vehicle and all requirements for transporting firearms within apply.

:iagree:

And this goes along with what I was taught when I was getting my CA POST certs.

If the RV is parked and hooked up, then it's considered a residence.
Firearms can legally have a loaded and/or concealed in the RV.

If the RV is moving or parked on the road/street/highway/etc or parked in a non-designated area, then it's considered a vehicle.
Firearms must be unloaded and in a locked container.

CFletch08
05-19-2012, 8:55 AM
It might be worth the time to just get a CCW permit, so you could carry in your vehicle regardless.

emsalex
05-19-2012, 9:35 AM
He's not A CA resident,

Oregon_Border_Bandit
05-19-2012, 5:56 PM
He's not A CA resident,

Yes, I am no longer a CA resident. I am an OR resident with a valid OR concealed carry permit.

So this begs the question, how hard is it to get a CA - CCW permit .

As I remember it living down in San Diego for 20+ years it was almost impossible to get a CCW as the SD County Sheriff who then slithered his way into the job as SD City PD Chief was totally anti 2nd Amendment.

If I remember it is the county & Sherrif's political views were You live in CA ( just as in OR ) that determine as to how hard it is to get one, and so if You live in the boondocks out in Modoc, Plumas, Yolo or some other small rural county were the Sheriff is 'normal' it is is rather easy.

In OR it is a sort of 'shall issue' state and they cannot just deny you just because Your not a diamond broker carrying diamonds or transporting armored car cash.


If this is the case , then if You live in LA, SD, SF, or other anti Constitution county then why not move to another 'free' county for a temp indeterminate time to apply and get a CCW and then move back to a Communist county were You plan to stay ?

Move up to rural Boondock county CA in the RV to a nice RV park ( leave the wife at the home base in LA county ) she don't fish anyways, lol , and get a new address in happy acres RV park in Boondock county northern CA, then get Your CCW then unhook the RV and drive back to Your wife and permanent home back in LA (Hell-A ) Dumb Idea ?

Silly or unlawful idea ?

Quiet
05-19-2012, 11:12 PM
If this is the case , then if You live in LA, SD, SF, or other anti Constitution county then why not move to another 'free' county for a temp indeterminate time to apply and get a CCW and then move back to a Communist county were You plan to stay ?

Move up to rural Boondock county CA in the RV to a nice RV park ( leave the wife at the home base in LA county ) she don't fish anyways, lol , and get a new address in happy acres RV park in Boondock county northern CA, then get Your CCW then unhook the RV and drive back to Your wife and permanent home back in LA (Hell-A ) Dumb Idea ?

Silly or unlawful idea ?

Issuance is normally based where your permanent residence is located (county/city).
If you move to another residence, you have 10 days to notify your issuing agency of the move. [PC 26210(b)]
If you move to another county, your permt becomes invalid after 90 days. [PC 26210(d)]
You will then need to apply to an issuing agency where your new residence is located.

Depending on the issuing agency, as part of the application process, they interview your neighbors and confirm that address you give is your permanent/primary residence.

There is a "non-resident" permit. It's a "non-resident" permit because you do not have to be a resident in the county/city of the issuing agency.
However, those permits are only valid for 90 days and only valid in the county it was issued in. [PC 26220(b)]

Oregon_Border_Bandit
05-20-2012, 8:04 PM
Issuance is normally based where your permanent residence is located (county/city).
If you move to another residence, you have 10 days to notify your issuing agency of the move. [PC 26210(b)]
If you move to another county, your permt becomes invalid after 90 days. [PC 26210(d)]
You will then need to apply to an issuing agency where your new residence is located.

Depending on the issuing agency, as part of the application process, they interview your neighbors and confirm that address you give is your permanent/primary residence.

There is a "non-resident" permit. It's a "non-resident" permit because you do not have to be a resident in the county/city of the issuing agency.
However, those permits are only valid for 90 days and only valid in the county it was issued in. [PC 26220(b)]

1st thank you for taking the time to answer my musings.

WOW, You guys "ARE" in hell.

I got my CCP ( You call it a CCW ) in one county and it's good all over OR and WA too .

Up here in OR You pay about $25 & go to the boring class while Joe the gun shop owners says "Class this is the bullet, this is the gun. this is the dangerous end" yada yada yada , answer a multiple answer questionnaire , get a claim check ticket that says Your are good to go, then go to the Sheriffs office, give them a Money order for about the same amount, they check you for priers / convictions, ( no interviews with neighbors or character references ) they finger print you, smile and say cheese, and 'Wa La' You are now a certified good guy.

In OR when a cop runs Your vehicle license plate Your CCP is also on the same data base and so the officer who stopped You already knows via the dispatcher You are a Concealed Carry Permit holder , which I don't mind as I always have had a nice casual interlude with the officers who pull me over minor traffic offenses aka one time for burned out tail light, one time for tree leaves blowing out of my dump trailer, it seams that because I have passed the FBI background check they kind of know I am a law abiding guy, and a right wing Glenn Beck lover lol as if the 'Buck Ofama' , NRA, Ruger, Dan Wesson, Browning deer decal and the TNP = ( Nutn Fancy Project) plus the MagPul oh and Olympic Arms also IDPA stickers in the back of don't already give me away.:D

So basically in OR it is MUCH easier to get a concealed carry license.

You really have to be cemented to California own a business, or have loved ones who wont leave ( specially to the cities ) to stay in CA.

Some people say "I cant afford to leave" I say "You cant afford to stay"

IGOTDIRT4U
05-21-2012, 3:26 PM
I'm pretty sure you can have an open container in the back while underway. We were pulled over for speeding years ago by CHP, and we were drinking in back. So there must be some difference.

Yes. There is case law on this. And I don't see why it wouldn't extend to firearms. Anything behind the 'cab' area is good to go for any otherwise legal activity. Go hit up the Good Sam forum site, this gets hashed overr at least once a week.

The link to the warrantless searches all deal with Fed cases based upon marijuana. The probable cause in each case was presented either by a witness, snitch or cannine. (plus other factors)

IGOTDIRT4U
05-21-2012, 3:30 PM
There is a specific exemption in the VC for open containers in the living area of RV's. VC 23225(c) and 23226(c).

Well, that updates my thread. Didn't know there was a specific VC.