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View Full Version : M16A2 Mags


sleeper2020
05-15-2012, 11:02 PM
I left the service back in 99 and have had some spare mags, stripper clips, and speed loaders in my range bag since then. I haven't really thought much about them until I started thinking about building an AR-15 ( iam already working on a AR-10). My first question is will they fit in any AR-15 lower? I hear that there are different types like "DPMS compatible" and some such. I understand that the magazines are legal to possess and that they can be used in featureless rifles as a non-fixed magazine. Please correct me if I am wrong.

Quiet
05-15-2012, 11:09 PM
All Mil issued M16 magazines are STANAG and compatible with the AR15 style rifle.

You run into compatibility issues with the 7.62x51mm AR10 style rifles.
Which are mostly split into two groups, KAC/DPMS vs ArmaLite.

sleeper2020
05-15-2012, 11:12 PM
Outstanding thank you.

MrPlink
05-15-2012, 11:13 PM
yep, wont work in a 7.62/308 rifle, but you have the perfect reason to build a featureless AR15!

And maybe one day I will get off my butt and do the same!

::::looks at pile of pre-ban mags:::::

::::notices lack of featureless AR:::: :D

brando
05-15-2012, 11:19 PM
You might want to double-check that they aren't stamped "Restricted Military / Govt / Law Enforcement Use Only"

Dreaded Claymore
05-15-2012, 11:37 PM
You might want to double-check that they aren't stamped "Restricted Military / Govt / Law Enforcement Use Only"

Doesn't matter, legally. They can stamp whatever they want on there but it won't make them illegal to use or possess. You can know this because the law doesn't say anything about magazines with certain markings.

brando
05-15-2012, 11:54 PM
Ah, forgot - was during the AWB. Nevermind.

MrPlink
05-16-2012, 12:34 AM
You might want to double-check that they aren't stamped "Restricted Military / Govt / Law Enforcement Use Only"

Oh crap, like my Eotech! :p

Fate
05-16-2012, 12:45 PM
OP is good to go using them in a featureless build.

Dark Sky Solutions
05-16-2012, 12:50 PM
OP is good to go using them in a featureless build.

Are we sur about this? Where does the law state that u can use a highcap magazine if it is a featureless build? Hopefully librarian will chime in.

USMCforLIFE
05-16-2012, 12:52 PM
double check laws! it is illegal to use any US military issued gear on any non military weapon!

INDABZ
05-16-2012, 12:56 PM
Are we sur about this? Where does the law state that u can use a highcap magazine if it is a featureless build? Hopefully librarian will chime in.

Perfectly legal.........pretty sure you won't see it spelled out in any PC.....

As long as the rifle doesn't have any Features that make it a AW in CA....you can use what ever magazines you want....that you legally posses...

unusedusername
05-16-2012, 12:57 PM
double check laws! it is illegal to use any US military issued gear on any non military weapon!

True, but the chances of the military going after him for keeping a few magazines when he was discharged are unbelievably small, and the state of CA won't care either as long as the magazines were in the state pre-2000.

If he kept a Humvee then it would be a different story, but in my (not a lawyer) oponion he is fine to build a featureless rifle and use them.

INDABZ
05-16-2012, 12:58 PM
double check laws! it is illegal to use any US military issued gear on any non military weapon!

Ok....you talking about weapons while still in military on duty....?

USMCforLIFE
05-16-2012, 12:58 PM
True, but the chances of the military going after him for keeping a few magazines when he was discharged are unbelievably small, and the state of CA won't care either as long as the magazines were in the state pre-2000.

If he kept a Humvee then it would be a different story, but in my (not a lawyer) oponion he is fine to build a featureless rifle and use them.

wait so if the magazines where here before 2000 i can use them even though they are 30 rd? because damn i was in the infantry and i have a **** load of mags from back then

USMCforLIFE
05-16-2012, 1:01 PM
Ok....you talking about weapons while still in military on duty....?

no i am not really saying mags but any part from a m-16 if placed on a ar-15 makes it illegal in california!

unusedusername
05-16-2012, 1:01 PM
wait so if the magazines where here before 2000 i can use them even though they are 30 rd?

As long as they are used in a featureless (non-bullet button, no evil features) rifle then you can use legally owned 30 round magazines in California.

Just be aware the putting a fixed >10 round magazine in a rifle makes it an AW, so its gotta be featureless to be legal.

MrPlink
05-16-2012, 1:02 PM
Using hicaps is half the purpose of goin featureless. Check the flow charts or even the sticky on this forum by librian if you do not understand.

unusedusername
05-16-2012, 1:10 PM
no i am not really saying mags but any part from a m-16 if placed on a ar-15 makes it illegal in california!

Well, this is just plain not true.

If you legally aquired a m16 part, and it is not a full auto part then you can legally use it in CA in an ar-15 as long as you don't break any other laws. I'm not sure how you would legally aquire a used m-16 part though....

The difficulty is that some (nearly all?) discharged solders keep some governement property (like m-16 parts) without being able to show that they legally aquired it. If you have an expensive part, thermal imagers come to mind, then the military might go after you for keeping it, as technically it is theft.

Putting it on a rifle is not the issue, keeping it at all is the issue, however for some old beat up magazines that the government pays $1 each for, it is probably not worth their time tracking down veterans who kept a few magazines.

As far as the state magazine ban, if youwere in posession of the magazine pre-2000, and had it in the state of CA before then it is legal for you to keep, and use them, as long as you don't break any other laws while using them. Just don't sell them (as complete magazines, part is fine), build more of them, or use them on a fixed magazine rifle.

USMCforLIFE
05-16-2012, 1:16 PM
i was looking on bushmaster web site and it says all M-16 parts are illegal in california unless you have a class III license/FFL! i haven't seen it written on any california laws

Jeepers
05-16-2012, 1:28 PM
http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=22427/Product/M16-BOLT-CARRIERS

legal in a CA AR , and there are many many many mil. parts out there legally ready to buy and sell they(us gov) sell parts buy the pallet loads that end up for sale to us folks like the "m16 parts kits"

gun toting monkeyboy
05-16-2012, 2:09 PM
i was looking on bushmaster web site and it says all M-16 parts are illegal in california unless you have a class III license/FFL! i haven't seen it written on any california laws

Ok, take a deep breath. Calm down and let's take a look at this.

The parts that ARE illegal to have here in California, IF you own an AR style rifle are: the trigger, the selector, and the full-auto/burst sear. Those are the parts that make it fully automatic or enable the burst feature. That is it. The rest of the parts, INCLUDING the full-auto style bolt carrier are 100% legal. As long as you don't violate the AW law, you can put anything you want on your AR. Heck, you can even buy USGI surplus M16 uppers, slap them on a legal AR lower, and have a perfectly legal rifle.

There is a lot of misinformation out there on our laws. And a lot of it is pure BS. Unfortunately, many manufacturers believe that if they send anything here that is remotely questionable legally, the State of California will hunt them down and throw them in jail. What most of them don't realize it that our state agencies generally can't find their own @$$e$ with both hands 3 out of 4 times in a row. But the myth of what could happen to people looms over the internet. So a lot of companies won't even deal with California for fear of being shipped to San Francisco and being forced to listen to whiney hippie protest songs or eat tofu or something. And you will find all kinds of dire warning on their websites about how they won't ship item X, Y or Z to us. Usually followed by comments about how it is illegal to do so. And the fact that they are allergic to tofu, and just can't risk it. Just take it all with a grain of salt. Just because it is on the internet doesn't make it true. And just because the DOJ says it doesn't make it true either. If you want to know something about the laws here in California, ask on here. There are some seriously big brains that actually know what the laws say. That AW flow sheet up at the top of every page here has been picked up by police departments around the state to train their officers. The CGF has been pummeling the state in courts for years. Don't rely on third hand online gossip. Use the resources on here to educate yourself on what really is or isn't legal.

-Mb

SgtMerc
05-16-2012, 11:09 PM
Hey OP, depending on how many mags you have, you might consider modding them into permanently 10rd mags. Drill a couple of holes, rivet through them so the follower won't depress further than 9rds, and you've got yourself perfectly legal mags.

Or, your other option is to save your issued mags disassembled and bring them with you when you travel out of state. Shooters in Arizona, Nevada or Oregon aren't restricted from hi-cap mags. Just make sure to disassemble them before crossing back into Cali.

I say rivet because rivets can be drilled out, but epoxy is a pain in the neck to remove

MrPlink
05-16-2012, 11:29 PM
Hey OP, depending on how many mags you have, you might consider modding them into permanently 10rd mags. Drill a couple of holes, rivet through them so the follower won't depress further than 9rds, and you've got yourself perfectly legal mags.

Or, your other option is to save your issued mags disassembled and bring them with you when you travel out of state. Shooters in Arizona, Nevada or Oregon aren't restricted from hi-cap mags. Just make sure to disassemble them before crossing back into Cali.

I say rivet because rivets can be drilled out, but epoxy is a pain in the neck to remove

I know you have good intentions so please do not take this the wrong way, but that ranks among the worst advice I have ever seen given here. Given the cost of new mags (be it kits or true 10rders or blocked off mags) why in the hell would anybody in their right mind intentionally destroy pre-ban mags?
Do you have any idea how many people here would pay stupid amounts of cash for just ONE legally obtained 30rd magazine?

Furthermore, why the hell would he disassemble them? He had them in 99, case closed!

havegonetooz
05-17-2012, 12:58 AM
I think he was referring to using them in an evil feature build (??) with a pistol grip and all. Also, since he legally owned them prior to the ban, the OP is within his rights to repair (and not replace) his magazines.

Let's say the OP takes a 30 round magazine and uses the mag body only to make a 10 round mag by buying a spare spring, follower, and butt plate.

He now has a spring, follower and butt plate from a 30 round magazine legally owned before the ban. I believe he is within his rights to repair his magazine by buying a 30 round magazine body to repair the 30 round magazine he owned before the ban.

The end result would be 1 legally owned 30 round magazine and 1 neutered 10 round magazine. He repaired what he owned and did not replace anything, which I think is allowed in CA. He manufactured a 10 round magazine (legal) and repaired a 30 magazine (legal).

havegonetooz
05-17-2012, 1:00 AM
Oh and I forgot to say, A LOT of FUD in this thread

SgtMerc
05-17-2012, 4:44 PM
I know you have good intentions so please do not take this the wrong way, but that ranks among the worst advice I have ever seen given here. Given the cost of new mags (be it kits or true 10rders or blocked off mags) why in the hell would anybody in their right mind intentionally destroy pre-ban mags?
Do you have any idea how many people here would pay stupid amounts of cash for just ONE legally obtained 30rd magazine?

Furthermore, why the hell would he disassemble them? He had them in 99, case closed!

I wasn't trying to give advice as in "you should do this" but rather as throwing out an option that OP might not have considered. OP did not specify what kind of build they were making. If they're making a featureless, there's no reason to modify the mags.

That's why i also stated at the end that the rivets are removable (albeit with some difficulty, so "permanence" is arguable). I had a ton of 30rounders when i got out, but i don't have a featureless. TBH i understand some people like having a 30mag, but personally i've found that i burn through a LOT more ammo than i intend to.

The way i look at it, if i don't have a featureless rifle, i can't use the 30's unless i go out of state. I'm much more likely to go to the local range for the weekend than go out of state. So my 30 rounders are gathering dust except for the (rare) times i'm legally able to use them.

I'd rather they have a couple of rivets in them and be 10round usable than have a stack of 30s that i can only use once a year.

If OP is building a featureless, he can keep the 30s in original form, but if he crosses state lines with them, when he returns they're considered imported and therefore illegal. THAT is why i was saying to disassemble them. IANAL, but As far as i know, while ownership and use with a featureless is allowed, bringing them into the state, regardless of previous ownership, is importing.

Perhaps librarian or someone else can clarify? I'm just giving options based on my own experiences with surplus service magazines.

tl;dr- i don't have a featureless, so i (more frequently) use my 30s as riveted 10s. if you take intact 30s out of state, they must be disassembled upon return.

USMCforLIFE
05-17-2012, 4:47 PM
I know you have good intentions so please do not take this the wrong way, but that ranks among the worst advice I have ever seen given here. Given the cost of new mags (be it kits or true 10rders or blocked off mags) why in the hell would anybody in their right mind intentionally destroy pre-ban mags?
Do you have any idea how many people here would pay stupid amounts of cash for just ONE legally obtained 30rd magazine?

Furthermore, why the hell would he disassemble them? He had them in 99, case closed!

if thats the case then who wants mag kits because i have a **** load!

Speedpower
05-17-2012, 4:59 PM
if thats the case then who wants mags because i have a **** load!

ME! :43:

darrenc75
05-17-2012, 5:15 PM
if thats the case then who wants mag kits because i have a **** load!

fixed?

SgtMerc
05-17-2012, 5:19 PM
I am always interested in obtaining more replacement parts kits

USMCforLIFE
05-17-2012, 5:21 PM
fixed?

detachable had them for ever!

sleeper2020
05-17-2012, 6:40 PM
detachable had them for ever!

no bud he fixed your post for you. because he knows that you ment to say you were selling magazine repair kits not complete magazines. get it?:cool:

USMCforLIFE
05-17-2012, 6:49 PM
no bud he fixed your post for you. because he knows that you ment to say you were selling magazine repair kits not complete magazines. get it?:cool:

ah got it! little bit slow here lol i am not selling them i dont have them here i have already moved most my gear back home in the mid west i am getting out of the corp next year!

sleeper2020
05-17-2012, 6:51 PM
lol grats bud :)

Sniper3142
05-17-2012, 9:19 PM
If OP is building a featureless, he can keep the 30s in original form, but if he crosses state lines with them, when he returns they're considered imported and therefore illegal. THAT is why i was saying to disassemble them. IANAL, but As far as i know, while ownership and use with a featureless is allowed, bringing them into the state, regardless of previous ownership, is importing.


WRONG.

LCMs (Large Capacity Magazines) that were possesd in the state of California prior to 2000 can me taken OUT of the state AND returned by the owner. In other words, you can leave this state with your LCMs (like to go to another state for a shooting competition) and return with them LEGALLY.

Dave07997S
05-17-2012, 9:42 PM
You might want to double-check that they aren't stamped "Restricted Military / Govt / Law Enforcement Use Only"

None of my mags from the Army have that stamped on them...then again I'm like him, I got out in the 90s. My unit let me keep my TA50, and low and behold I had 13 30 rd. magazines. Im building a featureless rifle as we speak with a Colt AR15A2 upper.

Dave

Dave07997S
05-17-2012, 9:46 PM
WRONG.

LCMs (Large Capacity Magazines) that were possesd in the state of California prior to 2000 can me taken OUT of the state AND returned by the owner. In other words, you can leave this state with your LCMs (like to go to another state for a shooting competition) and return with them LEGALLY.

This...owning high capacity mags that were gotten before 2000 are not illegal to own. Just don't place this LCM in a bullet button gun unless outside the state and in a state that allows it.

Dave

SgtMerc
05-17-2012, 10:28 PM
WRONG.

LCMs (Large Capacity Magazines) that were possesd in the state of California prior to 2000 can me taken OUT of the state AND returned by the owner. In other words, you can leave this state with your LCMs (like to go to another state for a shooting competition) and return with them LEGALLY.


This...owning high capacity mags that were gotten before 2000 are not illegal to own. Just don't place this LCM in a bullet button gun unless outside the state and in a state that allows it.

Dave


Are you guys serious? you mean i've been dismantling my pre-2000 mags this whole time thinking i was importing? gah. that's a swift kick to the head.

That's why i said IANAL as far as i know. I apologize. I was under the impression that the act of crossing the border became "importing." i'm almost positive i read that here on calguns somewhere.

Edit: I found the exemption via an old Librarian post. Thanks for correcting me, guys.

[exemption] (23) The importation of a large-capacity magazine by a person who
lawfully possessed the large-capacity magazine in the state prior to
January 1, 2000, lawfully took it out of the state, and is returning
to the state with the large-capacity magazine previously lawfully
possessed in the state.

MikeR
05-17-2012, 10:59 PM
If the mags you owned prior to 2000 were in your possession and were in CA for more than .00001 second you can legally bring them back to CA. When you leave there is no time limit. I can leave the state and come back (yea right, come back =) 5 years from now and bring all my mags i owned prior to 2000 with me.

I believe you didn't even have to be a resident at the time as long as they and the owner were here at some point before 2000.

Personally i would rebuild all of them to new mags if you are worried about the guberment. I rebuilt mine because Thermold makes crap mags and they have purdy colors now ...and windows. :D

With all the different options these days even if i only had 10 rounders i would still go FL. Bullet buttons suck ***, ESP. on an AK.