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View Full Version : Approximately how many OLL's do you think have been DROS'd in CA?


youngunner
04-24-2012, 5:02 PM
Hi all, I hope this question is on-topic, apologies otherwise.

I'm doing a course report on unjust laws and I could think of nothing better than to talk about CA's assault weapon ban and how we are forced to comply with silly contraptions like a bullet button. I'd like to add in my report some figures on just how many CA legal OLL's are out there to further drive home the point of just how useless this law is. I was considering writing to the DoJ but i'm not sure they will even provide an answer. Before I go that route a buddy of mine told me about this forum and said if anybody could give you a ballpark figure, it would be Calguns. My guesstimate would be about 100K total today and perhaps that figure is increasing about 15% year over year. Does that sound reasonable?

Thanks!

Baconator
04-24-2012, 5:05 PM
registered? 0

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

lazyworm
04-24-2012, 5:07 PM
zero

youngunner
04-24-2012, 5:08 PM
Sorry, perhaps my terminology was incorrect. When I said "registered", I meant OLL's that have been through the DROS process. Although, it would be interesting to know how many are made available each year in CA as well.

youngunner
04-24-2012, 5:14 PM
zero
Either I'm not using the right terminology or I stumbled into a touchy subject...starting to think it is the latter. Perhaps this topic is not the right choice after all :|

Maltese Falcon
04-24-2012, 5:16 PM
These is no registration for OLLs.

Amount sold over the years is probably north of 300,000.

.

welchy
04-24-2012, 5:21 PM
Long guns are not required to be registered. I would agree with Maltese, the number of OLL sold in CA is very high. CADOJ will not give you an actual number that would be admitting they are monitoring DROSes of non-registered weapons. ;)

skkeeter
04-24-2012, 5:22 PM
OP, go ahead and change your title and change register to the dross process. Most people know what you mean, but change it and you won't get so many smart ***** remarks.

Maltese Falcon
04-24-2012, 5:23 PM
Here is original Calguns post.

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=34397

.

youngunner
04-24-2012, 5:34 PM
Title changed as suggested, thanks for the correction on my terminology, I want to be as factually correct as possible.

Also, thank you for the 300K number, I was way off! I'm nearly certain that the amount made available per year is going up, i wonder if its rising linearly or exponentially? With a figure like 300K i wouldnt be surprised if its latter since prices go down as volume goes up.

Librarian
04-24-2012, 5:41 PM
AG's web site - http://oag.ca.gov/firearms/statistics - has a doc covering DROS numbers http://oag.ca.gov/sites/all/files/pdfs/firearms/forms/dros_chart.pdf?

The data split into long guns and handguns with 1991.

The OLL movement begins with January, 2007, the effective date of AB 2728. See http://wiki.calgunsfoundation.org/History_of_%27Assault_Weapon%27_laws.

No way to tell how many of the long guns since 2001 (around 200K/year) are OLLs.

Maltese Falcon
04-24-2012, 5:42 PM
As in most firearms purchases, new ones sold to first time gun owners is probably low, percentage wise.

Repeat buyers are the market. 2009 was probably the peak year (Re: Obama election). Anyone who wants one in CA probably already has one.

.

TreeHugger
04-24-2012, 5:46 PM
I'm sure it's WAY more than gun haters like to know. Any time someone tells us that we cannot have it, it just makes it that much more popular, the "anti's" just never learn.

bob7122
04-24-2012, 6:30 PM
i would be willing to bet more than 400,000. some people buy multiple lowers and others build from 80% lowers.

MrPlink
04-24-2012, 7:02 PM
Anyone who wants one in CA probably already has one.



I dont agree with that at all. Look at this forum alone! You can not go more than 5 threads without somebody asking about their first ak or ar.

I can not tell you about how many people I meet in real life who are all excited in getting their first AR or AK.

I used to be a bit more reserved talking about my firearm addiction in public, now if I mention anything firearm related there is always somebody within ear shot chiming in about how they or their /best friend, brother mother, sister, father, boyscout troop leader, accountant, landscaper etc etc is just about to buy or build their first AR/AK etc etc etc

It was not like that a few years ago. Things are slowly changing

peter95
04-24-2012, 7:31 PM
More and more people are beginning to learn and be more comfortable about knowing people with guns.
A while back, if people heard you owned a firearm it was weird and they would think that u need a special license.

The sport is getting popular...

paratroop
04-24-2012, 7:36 PM
well i have 5 ARs. And 3 aks And not one of those was ever DROSed. So maybe you are still asking the wrong question.

reznunt
04-24-2012, 7:51 PM
Either I'm not using the right terminology or I stumbled into a touchy subject...starting to think it is the latter. Perhaps this topic is not the right choice after all :|

don't worry about it. this site is overflowing with wise asses. i'm sure they knew what you wanted to ask, but instead of helping to correct your words, they chose to act like children. you had better grow a thick skin if you plan on sticking around.

Baconator
04-24-2012, 7:53 PM
don't worry about it. this site is overflowing with wise asses. i'm sure they knew what you wanted to ask, but instead of helping to correct your words, they chose to act like children. you had better grow a thick skin if you plan on sticking around.

And yet you are the one calling people names

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

TreeHugger
04-24-2012, 8:11 PM
Children children, isn't it almost past your bed time :)

frankm
04-24-2012, 9:15 PM
well i have 5 ARs. And 3 aks And not one of those was ever DROSed. So maybe you are still asking the wrong question.

There's around 700,000 previously unregistered AW's in KA. Then there's the pre-Dros PPT. Let's not talk about those. :)

jbush
04-24-2012, 9:38 PM
I don't think OPs report is concerned with prebans or others. It appears he is looking for a number on how many people have had to jump through hoops and get an OLL to get around the ban on listed rifles or lowers to own an AR or AK. I'm not sure that would be a good report. While it might show how obsurd the gun laws are, it could as give the antis something to think about.

Quiet
04-24-2012, 10:54 PM
Enough have been sold in the last 5 years to motivate the firearms industry to manufacture more "CA legal" type firearms.

And more than enough to convice firearm maufacturers that were banned by make/model to change their markings on their reciever so that their new recievers can now be considered "off-list".

Safe guess would be more than 400,000 since 2007.

tenpercentfirearms
04-25-2012, 8:25 AM
I don't think there is any possible way to know.

The other question is do you just want off list receivers or are you now taking into consideration off list rifles? What I mean is many people will just buy a AR15 lower or an AK flat or what have you and then build it up. However, many, many manufacturers are now sending CA compliant rifles, pistols, and shotguns into the state. Do you count those complete firearms as just lowers? Or do you just want lowers?

Either way, there is no way to tell. I would sum it up around "a grip".

Long guns are not required to be registered. I would agree with Maltese, the number of OLL sold in CA is very high. CADOJ will not give you an actual number that would be admitting they are monitoring DROSes of non-registered weapons. ;)

It is impossible for CA DOJ to monitor such things. When I submit your DROS, there is no data submitted except the number of long guns, but that could be any long gun or really any non-handgun. They have absolutely no way of knowing what you bought.

robert101
04-25-2012, 12:49 PM
Actually, I'm glad there might not be a way for the DOJ to count the OLLs. All it takes is some polititian with an anti-gun attitude to want to "close a loop hole" on this topic. Less they know the better for us. So, to that end, my guess would be 1 total since 1997.

Maltese Falcon
04-25-2012, 12:56 PM
I dont agree with that at all. Look at this forum alone! You can not go more than 5 threads without somebody asking about their first ak or ar.

I can not tell you about how many people I meet in real life who are all excited in getting their first AR or AK.

I used to be a bit more reserved talking about my firearm addiction in public, now if I mention anything firearm related there is always somebody within ear shot chiming in about how they or their /best friend, brother mother, sister, father, boyscout troop leader, accountant, landscaper etc etc is just about to buy or build their first AR/AK etc etc etc

It was not like that a few years ago. Things are slowly changing

haha, I agree with that. What I meant to imply is: "Anyone who knows about them and wants one, probably already has one."

When I first found out about OLLs in 2009 (Wot is dis?), I built four within two years. My bank account suffered greatly.

I would bet the number of people who have more than one is a much higher percentage than any other firearm. They are like jigsaw puzzles that you can put together in infinite ways.

.

youngunner
04-25-2012, 3:33 PM
Wow, my buddy wasn't kidding, you guys are awesome. That graph of long-gun DROSs/year is absolutely perfect. Even though we can't know for show how many of those are for AR/AK type weapons, we know its a subset of that and probably a significant subset (a grip) of that after 2007.

You guys are the best, I'm definitely going to be sticking around.

Thanks again

Hunter47
04-25-2012, 3:42 PM
Wow, my buddy wasn't kidding, you guys are awesome. That graph of long-gun DROSs/year is absolutely perfect. Even though we can't know for show how many of those are for AR/AK type weapons, we know its a subset of that and probably a significant subset (a grip) of that after 2007.

You guys are the best, I'm definitely going to be sticking around.

Thanks again

You can also extrapolate by just going to multiple guns stores and look at all the ARs available for sale vs. rifles in general. I have been counting the number of ARs at the local ranges and it is now over 50% of the rifles. No two are alike. They are the Honda of guns!

youngunner
04-25-2012, 3:42 PM
I used to be a bit more reserved talking about my firearm addiction in public, now if I mention anything firearm related there is always somebody within ear shot chiming in about how they or their /best friend, brother mother, sister, father, boyscout troop leader, accountant, landscaper etc etc is just about to buy or build their first AR/AK etc etc etc

It was not like that a few years ago. Things are slowly changing

This is so very very true. Although not a story directly related to AR/AK, it talks to the same point. Just the other day I was talking to a buddy of mine about the Dan Wesson Valor I just bought and told him about the SSE process that allowed me to do that. After I mentioned SSE, some stranger I've never met that was sitting next to us leaned over and asked if he could join our conversation as he just read about SSE and was intrigued by it. I don't think I could ever imagine this scenario happening like that in public, but it brought a smile to my face that it did!

Librarian
04-25-2012, 4:22 PM
Wow, my buddy wasn't kidding, you guys are awesome. That graph of long-gun DROSs/year is absolutely perfect. Even though we can't know for show how many of those are for AR/AK type weapons, we know its a subset of that and probably a significant subset (a grip) of that after 2007.

You guys are the best, I'm definitely going to be sticking around.

Thanks again

If you want to see something interesting, drop the data from 2000-2006 in Excel and add a trend line - that one comes out just about horizontal.

Then, add a data series using 2007-2011, and put in a trend line; that one climbs at about 30 degrees.

Something changed in 2007. We think we know what that change was.

winnre
04-25-2012, 4:27 PM
I wonder if he can ask the Brady bunch and what answer they may give....

Maltese Falcon
04-25-2012, 4:33 PM
If you want to see something interesting, drop the data from 2000-2006 in Excel and add a trend line - that one comes out just about horizontal.

Then, add a data series using 2007-2011, and put in a trend line; that one climbs at about 30 degrees.

Something changed in 2007. We think we know what that change was.

When did CGN come into existence? What are the CGN active user numbers per year?

I am willing to bet the trend lines are similar.

...perhaps a positive feedback loop? http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/images/smilies/wink.gif

.

bomb_on_bus
04-25-2012, 7:54 PM
If you want to see something interesting, drop the data from 2000-2006 in Excel and add a trend line - that one comes out just about horizontal.

Then, add a data series using 2007-2011, and put in a trend line; that one climbs at about 30 degrees.

Something changed in 2007. We think we know what that change was.

This right here would make a sound arguement or paper as there is a direct link between the AWB/OLL and the flow chart :D So far Calguns has some credit for almost a dozen of my toys.

Schlyme
04-25-2012, 9:15 PM
I used to think the only way get a legal ar was with the monster man grip or some other ugly contraption(no offense to those with them). When i found out about the whole BB loop hole and within a month I got my JD lower. And it won't be my last either!