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View Full Version : AR-15 or AK-47 Please help me decide!


Travis590A1
04-16-2012, 10:20 PM
Hey guys as some of you know I have an I.O. Sporter (AK Clone) and its a decent rifle it goes bang but I dont fully trust it. With that being said im in need of a good combat type rifle so im on the fence with either getting a Saiga and taking it to a built party or turning to the dark side of the force and getting an AR lol. I do have tons of AK acessories i.e. mags, rails, mounts, and internals etc so it would make sense to get a new "reliable" AK but id be lieing if I said I havent been pondering an M&P 15 purchase for a while now. Decisions decisions someone help me decide please!!! Sadly I cant have both lol :facepalm:

smittty
04-16-2012, 10:36 PM
Hey guys as some of you know I have an I.O. Sporter (AK Clone) and its a decent rifle it goes bang but I dont fully trust it. With that being said im in need of a good combat type rifle so im on the fence with either getting a Saiga and taking it to a built party or turning to the dark side of the force and getting an AR lol. I do have tons of AK acessories i.e. mags, rails, mounts, and internals etc so it would make sense to get a new "reliable" AK but id be lieing if I said I havent been pondering an M&P 15 purchase for a while now. Decisions decisions someone help me decide please!!! Sadly I cant have both lol :facepalm:

I started with a Saiga and then converted it but still wasn't satisfied. I akways thought AR's were not for me but then my i git one as a gift and it was awsome (and still is).

I sold my saiga and never looked back. I've since built another AR and it was a ton if fun.

I would say that building and owning an AR is the more fun than any other firearm. They are like legos for adult males!

Horta
04-16-2012, 10:48 PM
I have had absolutely no problems with my M&P-15. It is an excellent buy for the buck. You may just owe it to yourself to try the AR-15 platform.

trespassingproductions
04-16-2012, 10:50 PM
I just sold all my Ak stuff and I am going to be buying my first AR this weekend. I want to get those tight groups...the AK sadly cant deliver

ChaneRZ
04-16-2012, 10:51 PM
Get the AR first then the AK down the road.

Josh3239
04-16-2012, 10:55 PM
I am sure I'll ruffle plenty of feathers but the AR is a more superior rifle in every single way. The AK has been playing catch up pitifully for years. Now I am obviously biased, my experience with AKs has been miserable, most performed decently at best and building or changing things was a giant pain in the ***. Despite what the naysayers say the AR is the best, what other rifle even comes close to it in its popularity for military/police, competition, hunting, and recreation? More and more nations are dropping AKs for AR derivatives. AK derivatives are not replacing any country's AR derivative.

We all know the AR is better ergonomically, in the speed of doing anything, better sights and optic mounting ability, other aftermarket parts from stocks to trigger only make it better. With spare uppers you have a multi-role and multi-caliber platform.

Sure someone will come along and bang the "rough environment" drum, they literally don't know what they are talking about. We've heard "rough environment" but never one specifically. The fact remains the AR performs excellent in all parts of the world and it has seen all parts of the world. The question of AR reliability is unique amongst Americans. The Iraqi Army wasn't questioning their reliability when they were begging the US government for M4s nor were the Israelis for decades after ditching their AKs, Galils, and Uzis. The Canadians are still content as are plenty of people.

But hey, I am just an AR guy and this my piece. You should get what makes you happy!

ExtremeX
04-16-2012, 11:03 PM
I was going to say get both, but then I actually finished reading your post lol...

They are two totally different weapons, both have the strong points and weaknesses.

If you really want a fighting rifle, you might want to consider a featureless AK or AR. The AK is also a lot cheaper. I have a Saiga 7.62 unconverted along with an AR. Needless to say that AR cost a crap load more than my AK.

You say you want reliable, but the only reliable firearm is the one you use, and experience good results with. You might get something tomorrow and it might work like crap, bad this or that, or it might work like a sewing machine out of the box. I don't typically trust something until I put it thought the motions myself.

Get what you can afford, get what you like, get what feels right. More important, go out and shoot the damn thing and get some trigger time regardless of what you choose.

MrPlink
04-16-2012, 11:06 PM
get a real AK, problem solved. / thread

Arnelcheeze
04-16-2012, 11:08 PM
BOTH

MrPlink
04-16-2012, 11:17 PM
BOTH

true.

For now though I would focus on an AK. With the Saiga exception AK's with true combloc barrels are getting harder to come by, esp if you want a kit. There are SOME acceptable US made barrels, but they can be very hard to find or rather expensive (though I suppose the same could be said of original combloc ones so this may be moot). If you are primarily considering a Saiga, then it wont matter. Those are not likely going anywhere, at least until Putin enacts "Operation Red Dawn II."

AR15s are DEFINITELY not going anywhere, so no point in rushing here.

1forall
04-16-2012, 11:49 PM
I say...get the one that you want, AK or AR. I was in the same situation but in reverse. I really wanted an AK but went with the AR instead. Well, after assembling 2 AR rifles and even purchasing a VZ-58, I still was not totally satisfied until a bought an AK. IMHO it's all about what'll make you happy in the end, even if it's temporary.

Btw...I love all my rifles, just differently.

Hakoomay
04-16-2012, 11:51 PM
I was in the same shoe as you debating whether or not to go with ak or ar, and quite frankly, i'd go the AR route because they are reliable and you'll have wayyyyy more fun to customize it the way you want. AKs can always be had since they're so cheap (compared to an AR build of course).

C.W.M.V.
04-16-2012, 11:55 PM
Very few people who talk about AR reliability have hauled one through an Iraqi sand storm and had to wonder if it would fire.
Or watched as their 5.56 bounces off stucco and brick.
Its very disheartening.
You want a rifle that you can bet your life on, that will fire when you need it, then you get a good AK.
At least that has been our (my father and I) experience between Vietnam and Iraq.

Edit: but I am very biased. Using the 16 in peace time and combat has made me loath it.

AKSOG
04-17-2012, 12:26 AM
I enjoy shooting 7.62x39 way more than 5.56.

BretByron
04-17-2012, 12:43 AM
I'm glad I got my SKS while they were still $200 and my Saiga @$350, meanwhile the price on AR's has come down.

BradleyAbrams
04-17-2012, 12:45 AM
< snip >You want a rifle that you can bet your life on, that will fire when you need it, then you get a good AK. < snip >.

There it is.


BTW, I'd get a FN FAL (.308) before I'd get an AR.


This is my personal opinion; YMMV..


By the way, just for fun, you may want to check out the You-Tube "Twinkie Test"... :cool:

AR-15 vs Twinkie:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4KXiySQpSMM&feature=related


AK vs Twinkie:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=20kSnuFLQok&feature=relmfu




Video RESPONSE: AR vs Twinkie:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UhOb8q9CI-E


-

Slim///
04-17-2012, 1:34 AM
Really depends what you want it for

I'm selling all my AR stuff to fund my second AK.

j.primo
04-17-2012, 2:11 AM
That's easy.. AK

baih777
04-17-2012, 4:49 AM
get a AR. tons of options.
get another AK
get anotter AR
buy lots of ammo

BHPFan
04-17-2012, 5:29 AM
Really depends what you want it for


+1

If you want a rifle that will go bang everytime you pull the trigger and don't care about groupings, then get the AK. Besides, AKs are good enough to hit a target at up to 200 yards if you do your job.

Besides, since the OP has tons of AK accessories, it would make better sense to get the AK now and then buy an AR latter.

nicoroshi
04-17-2012, 5:50 AM
I just sold all my Ak stuff and I am going to be buying my first AR this weekend. I want to get those tight groups...the AK sadly cant deliver

Meh,
You obviously never shot an AK I built.
Iron sights 50 yards 20 rounds factory ammo
http://firingsquad.us/wp-forum/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view;id=475



To the OP
My humble suggestion is BOTH!
Since you say you can't get both I recommend the AR for now since you already own an AK then when funds allow follow what interests you.
For me it's the AK Platform (and yes I do own ARs also).
Decide what right for yourself but having one of each I believe is your first step

leoffensive
04-17-2012, 5:52 AM
IBTL?

Frankcis
04-17-2012, 6:27 AM
It is all preference buddy. I didn't care for the M16 I shot in the military but can't say I've shot AR15. I would go for the AK just cause I like the bad boy gun history. I didn't like neutered guns so I bought an M1A for when I leave Georgia and come back to Cali.

Calplinker
04-17-2012, 8:08 AM
Personally, I own both. Bought a Saiga already converted by another CalGunner, then did an AK build at a build party.

I also own a few AR's in 5.56 and .308. I tend to prefer the AR a bit, probably due to huge variety of parts to build it how you want it and of course accessories.

Having said that, the market for AK accessories is really taking off lately. There's some pretty cool stuff being made now.

Last month I picked up a new forearm for my converted Saiga with a pic rail top and then mounted a red dot on it. Awesome weapon for anything under 100-150yards. Fun and cheap to shoot and it undeniably hits a lot harder than the 5.56.

My next project is probably going to be a 7.62 X 39 AR. Just bought a handful of lowers to toss in the safe and am on the hunt for a good quality upper/LPK/mag combo that will work well together.

Something to consider.

If you can only have one at the moment, I'd suggest an AR as you already have an AK. You can build a very good quality AR for $800 or even less.

At some point, I want to buy a very high quality AK to toss in the safe and just "have". Cool thing about AK's is even buying a high end, boutique AK with a milled receiver and custom wood will still cost way less than a high end AR.

Just offering my views of both, but don't think you can go wrong with either. Just don't buy low quality. I prefer more of the mid-range to upper range stuff.

ZX-10R
04-17-2012, 8:15 AM
I have both...Groups and long distance accuracy...AR...Groups and short range accuracy AK and AR. Reliability...AK for me all day. Round...AK. Ammo price...AK.

Get an AR...It is nice to have both...I switch off depending on how I feel at the range.

Was actually thinking of getting a second AR...My 2nd one is Sold to a buddy. My DD is just to awesome to ever get rid of but I want a Colt AR.

OWN BOTH.

LovingTheYear1911
04-17-2012, 8:18 AM
AR first, then save up for an AK. You will want both. Trust me.

NorCalK9.com
04-17-2012, 10:17 AM
I started with AR's owned alot of then. I shoot alot and sitting on a bench the AR was fun for controlled bullseye shooting! I had RR, DD, STAG, AERO, ARMALITE uppers, SPIKEs........ And then I got an AK. A wasr10/63 that ran flawlessly, could hit out to 300yards, and then I built an M63 ak, then I sold a couple of AR's and bought more ak's and ak kits. Built those kits, sold the rest of the AR's bougbt more ak's and kits, built those kits, bought an AR 7months ago, mp15 shot it for 2 week, sold it! Built 4 more ak's, bought 2 more ak's, put one of my aero lowers I had left over together, threw a stag upper on it. Didnt like it! Sold it 2 months ago, have built 3 more ak's since then... Next is a m64 yugo milled hopefully!
But dont do what u say nor what others here say!
Once you have a quality ak and a quality ar figure out for yourself what you like better!
Good luck OP

NorCalK9.com
04-17-2012, 10:19 AM
I meant I when I said dont listen to what u say! Lol

NYsteveZ
04-17-2012, 10:56 AM
Its a disease. You start with one, and then? See sig

CSACANNONEER
04-17-2012, 10:58 AM
VZ58 or H&K (any model). The whole AR vs. AK thing is just too over done.

zeddy
04-17-2012, 11:14 AM
I enjoy shooting 7.62x39 way more than 5.56.

AMEN......

The last couple times I went desert shooting, I took all four of my AR's, and three (out of my 12) AK'S, nor did I or anyone that was there touch the AR's. 7.62 is so much more fun to shoot. Just a all around fun toy. I'm going desert shooting tomarrow, and all im taking are AK's. Maybe one AR (to shoot at).....:43: GET AN AK......

Baga
04-17-2012, 11:28 AM
Both...

Mamluke
04-17-2012, 11:37 AM
Very few people who talk about AR reliability have hauled one through an Iraqi sand storm and had to wonder if it would fire.
Or watched as their 5.56 bounces off stucco and brick.
Its very disheartening.
You want a rifle that you can bet your life on, that will fire when you need it, then you get a good AK.
At least that has been our (my father and I) experience between Vietnam and Iraq.



^^^^ This +111111111

Lego Land?!!!
This ain't no game son, this is a battle rifle:

http://blogs.phoenixnewtimes.com/valleyfever/r-lee-ermey1.jpg

....

Some of the more recent AR's are catching up with reliability though:
Sig 516 Patrol (short stroke pushrod piston).
LWRC M6A2 (short stroke piston)
Noveske N4
S&W M&P 15
Blackheart BHI-15



All of the above (except the M&P 15 at $1200) are pricey!

The beauty of all this; is you can have BOTH:

So I do recommend a Smith & Wesson M&P 15 (not the sporter model) as it would be my choice too for an 'economy' reliable AR-15.

.....

maddoggie13
04-17-2012, 11:44 AM
Just get both now...you will have both sooner or later.

tacticalcity
04-17-2012, 11:52 AM
I did the AK thing for a while. The myth is very different from the reality. I wasn't impressed. I found ARs to be more reliable, more practical, and more fun.

hefedehefe
04-17-2012, 12:21 PM
I have both. Both of mine are reliable, but with the $ for an ar, I would buy 2 saigas. I have 3 Saigas and love them all. My 308,12,and 545 are all sweet, but if I could only choose 2 I would take the 12 and the 545

Lifeon2whls
04-17-2012, 1:14 PM
I'm glad I got my SKS while they were still $200 ...

hehehe I got my SKS when they were less than most Mosins ;)

KandyRedCoi
04-17-2012, 1:43 PM
OP, would u trust your life to a firearm that requires a BB?

i went the saiga route kept it featureless and i would bet my life on it, you already have AK parts so it makes a lot of sense to gothe Saiga route imho

function > form

with that being said, im still gonna build an AR for kicks and giggles...the other member was right when he said its like LEGO for adult males...it probably wont be my go to battle rifle tho :) to each his own and ymmv

ZX-10R
04-17-2012, 5:31 PM
OP, would u trust your life to a firearm that requires a BB?

i went the saiga route kept it featureless and i would bet my life on it, you already have AK parts so it makes a lot of sense to gothe Saiga route imho

function > form

with that being said, im still gonna build an AR for kicks and giggles...the other member was right when he said its like LEGO for adult males...it probably wont be my go to battle rifle tho :) to each his own and ymmv

Good point. Only reason I would buy a Saiga.

f308gt4
04-17-2012, 5:40 PM
I have both, sort of. I've had an AR for a while, and recently bought a Saiga 308, which I converted to AK-style (I.e. pistol grip, tapco trigger, stock, etc.). I love both for different reasons.

Some observations:
AK is super simple with regard to takedown, cleaning etc. Almost Glock-like in its simplicity. I like a gun that is easy to takedown and clean. Not that the AR is difficult to take down, but the AK is undoubtably simpler.
AR- much more goodies available.
AR- real easy to swap uppers to get a different configuration/caliber
AK- bullet button sucks. The AR bullet button is definately better.
Accuracy- moot point for me, since I am limited by my shooting ability rather than the rifle. I imagine that is probably the case for 80%+ on this site.
Reliability- haven't had any issue with either, although the Saiga is still pretty new (only about 100 rounds downrange).

The cool thing about the Saigas is that you can have essentially the same rifle in multiple calibers. I am thinking about getting a Saiga-12 next.

You really can't go wrong with either. If the OP already has an AK, then I would suggest going the AR route. For anyone else, I'd say, flip a coin and pick one, then eventually get the other. Because having both is great for fun factor. And it let's you reply to these types of post with actual experience of having both rifles.

Good Luck!

stix213
04-17-2012, 5:46 PM
I own a few AR's with virtually no issues with them, but the truth is my bet my life on rifle is my converted Saiga that I've already put over 4,000 rounds through. YMMV I run it featureless with a solar tactical grip wrap, and have gotten used to it.

Not expecting to ever need to bet my life on a bet your life rifle, but who knows...

kellanmeigh
04-17-2012, 6:29 PM
this is a no-brainer - get the AK and don't look back.

When the chips are down, you can trust your life to an AK. That cannot be said about an AR-platform rifle/carbine. I've carried a GAU-5/A for Uncle Sam and believe you me, It's far from my first choice for a battle rifle. Too d@mned fussy IMHO. If I couldn't have an AK pattern rifle for whatever reason, then a FAL or an HK 91 would sub nicely. BTW, that GAU-5/A was brand new when it was issued to me. What a pile.

I personally would go for an unaltered Saiga IZ-132 as my SHTF go-to rifle. No blasted bullet button to hinder you, no hooks and barbs hanging out to snag/slow you down, no wood stock to crack on you. Maybe, maybe, get a scope and mount from Kalinka, do pick up some Saiga factory-issue mags, a couple of spam-cans of ammo and call it GTG.

Before someone steps in and says "It can't take an AK magazine!", I see that as a non-issue. I'm not big on having to do 'other things' to my rifle just to use AK mags. Factory Saiga magazines, while not cheap, do work flawlessly.

My final thought -5.56 NATO is a plinker's round IMHO. 7.62 X 39 is a Git 'r' done! round.

Just the views of an old warhorse that has been there and done that. YMMV. Void where prohibited. One coupon to a customer per day.

I apologize if I stepped on a bunch of AR owner's toes but those are my jaded opinions. AR pattern rifles are very accurate, I do own 'a few' AR pattern rifles but I will not trust my life to one. Sorry.

:oji:

zombiescanlearn
04-17-2012, 6:38 PM
I have both, a H&K MR556 and an AK from Turners I traded my FNP9 for with another Calgunner. I have fun shooting both, but the AR is a far superior weapon - but that's my personal experience, I'm sure there are others who would disagree. You can't go wrong with either one. The AK is cheaper.

KandyRedCoi
04-17-2012, 7:00 PM
what makes an AR far superior to an AK? just a question as i dont own an AR yet but i do own a Saiga 762...

vikingm03
04-17-2012, 7:35 PM
Get both. ar then ak in my opinion.

Mamluke
04-17-2012, 8:02 PM
... I have fun shooting both, but the AR is a far superior weapon - ....

what makes an AR far superior to an AK? just a question as i dont own an AR yet but i do own a Saiga 762...

Here we go again ....

http://nefariouslabs.r30.net/Dead%20Horse.jpg



.... it'll never end ... :D

...

r8dr rider
04-17-2012, 8:13 PM
Socom II.....best of both worlds. Heavy hitting 308 caliber, reliable, easy maintenace/break down, compact, modular, no BB or weird grip wrap or configurations...nuff said

RED VASQUEZ
04-17-2012, 8:31 PM
If you're one of those fortunate few to get a reliable, working product from I.O. then I say keep it. Buy or build an AR when your budget allows so you can have two different weapon platforms to play with. Then you have the option of upgrading your base weapons as you choose.

KandyRedCoi
04-17-2012, 8:32 PM
mine was an honest question from the person who posted it. in which way manner shape or form did he come to such conclusion?

im an AR AK noob not trying to start a nother ak/ar war here :)

NorCalK9.com
04-17-2012, 10:14 PM
And the fuel has spilled out, now we're just waiting for someone to create a spark, and this thread is going to blow!
Popcorn time!



AK74 CRAPS ON AR'S ALL DAY EVERY DAY TIL THE END OF TIME!

BOOOOOM ITS STARTED
just kidding guys n gals. AR's are of course much better and everyone will find out if we have ground war with korea and russia

edwardjames
04-17-2012, 10:47 PM
i would get the AR, due to the many options and versatility of it , you can always get another AK down the road.

but when it gets down to it. get what you feel comfortable with . its your rifle, not ours.

Exdc
04-17-2012, 10:52 PM
See my signature.

JMP
04-17-2012, 11:03 PM
If you can't have both, I'd assume it's due to cost. If the decision is close why not go AK, which will be cheaper and save the difference for other stuff? Or, pick the route opposite your buddies, so you can shoot their guns too. Having to choose is like deciding whether you are willing to sacrifice an arm or a leg.

Capybara
04-17-2012, 11:22 PM
I have a nice AR and a really nice AR pistol. I find my self wanting an AK or at least a Saiga, just for the simple fact of ammo costs. AR brass is getting close to $380.00 per thousand rounds shipped. I like the 7.62 round but the 5.45 is the cheapskates dream, that ammo is ridiculously cheap if you want to just go out and blast.

I like the traditional AK with wood furniture but I am hopelessly confused about what the best AK47 or 74 value is that has wood furniture and decent build quality.

I agree with the others, we all need both, each are cool in their own way.

Travis590A1
04-18-2012, 1:14 AM
Whoa gone for a day and my post just blew up! lol so much to answer...First of ya the bb on the AK is kind of a pain but in a shtf senario that sucker is getting taken off, my first grab for home defense is my mossy (hence the name). I am leaning twords an M&P just to have variety and also I think an AR would be better for the gf in a shtf senario (less recoil) but things may change who knows. Does anyone know of any gunshops near Oxnard where they have both options?

constable
04-18-2012, 3:28 AM
get a good solid ak, not a wasr

Meety Peety
04-18-2012, 4:04 AM
Get an AR. You'll have much more support during next week's AR Vs. AK discussion.

the86d
04-18-2012, 5:03 AM
I don't eat Twinkies, but I would love to have both.

AR's now, but an AK is in my future if the Mayans are wrong, and Obama doesn't starve us...

wurger
04-18-2012, 5:09 PM
AK = ghetto. Personal opinion. You asked.

NorCalK9.com
04-18-2012, 5:36 PM
^^^ = ignorance!!!
Sorry you.posted

Bhobbs
04-18-2012, 5:50 PM
M1 Garand. Why go for a weak a** cartridge designed for full auto when you can't have a full auto rifle?

NorCalK9.com
04-18-2012, 5:54 PM
Wow the looney bin musta released a couple people early!
I dont know if ive ever heard someone call x39 a weak @$$ round before.
Ohh yeah the ak craps on the garand too! Lol

Popcorn/couch

Travis590A1
04-18-2012, 5:55 PM
AK = ghetto. Personal opinion. You asked.

Blasphamey! Ak's are crude! lol there is a difference. If you have a well built AK it is a freakin tank. MOST $600 AK's will outlast most $1,000 AR's under most circumstances there are always exceptions though. I just got back from the range today with mine and I remembered why I bought it in the first place. They are tons of fun to shoot and you always get guys at the range askin things like: Is that a .308? Isnt that Illegal? Is it full auto, and last but not least can I shoot it?! Oddly enough my buddy was also with me with his bushmaster and nobody even really noticed it lol I think im still going to go for a AR next though especially since my I.O. Has been running flawless now. It punched a few primers a while back but after a diff brand of ammo the rifle has been chewing everything up like an Arsenal! haha ok maybe not like an Arsenal but you get the picture lol. ;)

Travis590A1
04-18-2012, 6:02 PM
M1 Garand. Why go for a weak a** cartridge designed for full auto when you can't have a full auto rifle?

WHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAT???????????!!!!!!!!!!! Oh my geebus I havent laughed that hard in a while. The 7.62x39 is a lot of things but weak is not one of them. Thats why some guys choose the ak over the ar simply due to the rounds themselves (.223 vs 7.62 soviet) The M1 is and awsome rifle but there are reasons its no longer the U.S. service rifle (other than political and financial reasons) silly you shoulda bought an AK! :facepalm:

X231
04-18-2012, 6:02 PM
"One of the bulldozers uncovered the decomposing body of an enemy soldier, complete with AK47. I happened to be standing right there, looking down into the hole and pulled the AK out of the bog. "Watch this, guys," I said, "and I'll show you how a real infantry weapon works." I pulled the bolt back and fired 30 rounds - the AK could have been cleaned that day rather than buried in glug for a year or so. That was the kind of weapon our soldiers needed, not the confidence-sapping M-16." David Hackworth

Travis590A1
04-18-2012, 6:13 PM
"One of the bulldozers uncovered the decomposing body of an enemy soldier, complete with AK47. I happened to be standing right there, looking down into the hole and pulled the AK out of the bog. "Watch this, guys," I said, "and I'll show you how a real infantry weapon works." I pulled the bolt back and fired 30 rounds - the AK could have been cleaned that day rather than buried in glug for a year or so. That was the kind of weapon our soldiers needed, not the confidence-sapping M-16." David Hackworth

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RgrJElGOMMg

And the winner is!

rdsii64
04-18-2012, 7:09 PM
Normally when some is choosing between an AR15 or an AK47, and asks for help deciding, some will offer an opinion one way or the other. That gernally starts the age old AR vs. AK debates. shoot them both then buy what you like. If you can't make up your mind, buy one each. You can never have to many guns.

BroncoBob
04-18-2012, 7:13 PM
I own several AR's but good God after buying my first AK I just love them. Buy the AK....

ICONIC
04-18-2012, 7:24 PM
I have two ar's just picked up my saiga today I will be taking it to the range on friday. First impression ak's are heavier than ar's. Also mag release on the ak is going to take some getting used to.

frankm
04-18-2012, 7:26 PM
I sold my converted Saiga and SKS to fund my AR. As a former Marine, I can hit anything within 500 meters if not more (qual. expert). Mine has a 20" barrel. If I had to go with a 16" barrel, I wouldn't have sold my AK. In other words, make a personal decision, what you feel in your gut.

ramathorn
04-18-2012, 7:32 PM
I am sure I'll ruffle plenty of feathers but the AR is a more superior rifle in every single way.... You should get what makes you happy!

Really? AR15 loses to a tasty treat... the deadly twinkie! Don't take your AR to a food fight! lol.

[All joking aside, get one of each, you'll end up with both eventually!]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9wIFsG0ey4g

Bhobbs
04-18-2012, 8:41 PM
WHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAT???????????!!!!!!!!!!! Oh my geebus I havent laughed that hard in a while. The 7.62x39 is a lot of things but weak is not one of them. Thats why some guys choose the ak over the ar simply due to the rounds themselves (.223 vs 7.62 soviet) The M1 is and awsome rifle but there are reasons its no longer the U.S. service rifle (other than political and financial reasons) silly you shoulda bought an AK! :facepalm:

The 7.62x39mm is not weak compared to the 5.56x45 NATO. The .30-06 puts out twice the energy. It was designed to allow somewhat controllable full auto fire for 300 meter engagements.

If you buy an M1 Garand, it will be an actual military rifle. It will say US Rifle caliber .30 M1 stamped on the receiver. You can use the rifle exactly as it was designed. Every time I take it to the range I have people ask me about it, ask to shoot it or just watch. I haven't had the same happen with my AR15 or seen it with anyone shooting an AK.

Josh3239
04-18-2012, 9:00 PM
mine was an honest question from the person who posted it. in which way manner shape or form did he come to such conclusion?

im an AR AK noob not trying to start a nother ak/ar war here :)

I'll PM my response I wrote to you. People get too invested money-wise and ego-wise and I honestly don't want to start a flame war. Though I'd be happy to send my response via PM to others if they want it.

FX-05 Xiuhcoatl
04-18-2012, 9:05 PM
Sks

FiveSeven
04-18-2012, 9:11 PM
In Murphy's law way of thinking, AK is a better choice.

Josh3239
04-18-2012, 9:14 PM
WHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAT???????????!!!!!!!!!!! Oh my geebus I havent laughed that hard in a while. The 7.62x39 is a lot of things but weak is not one of them. Thats why some guys choose the ak over the ar simply due to the rounds themselves (.223 vs 7.62 soviet)

Then I'd say those guys are uninformed. IMO they could have gotten a much better rifle in an AR chambered in 6.8, 300AAC, .308, .50 Beowulf or even one in 7.62x39.

Weak and powerful bullets is just silly as is stopping power. Bottom line is damage to your brain, heart, CNS, femoral artery, carotid artery and probably more places than I've heard of will kill you quickly. It doesn't matter if it is a .50 BMG or a .22LR or a knife. All of them can kill you so who cares about power. As far as performance goes the 7.62x39mm is poor performing. Even the commies figured it out and moved to the 5.45mm (which also sucks IMO). The bottom line is that unless you hit something critical or the bullet yaws in the tissue performance is poor. That is exhibited in the lack of deaths despite being shot at the North Hollywood shootout and the Stockton School shooting.

gotshotgun?
04-18-2012, 9:21 PM
What's amazing is that the AR and AK are 50+ year old weapon systems and we (USA, Russia, China, the world) have not jumped to the next real evolution in technology. Only tweaks to those original platforms or creations that are very much following the original blood lines have been made. There is a reason for this. It's because they are both very good.

Remember the US was considering adopting the FAL as its last battle rifle before it chose the M14 instead (political reasons). But that shows that if another system was dramatically superior to the AR design, the US would consider it, regardless of country of origin, and likely adopt it.

Travis590A1
04-18-2012, 10:25 PM
Then I'd say those guys are uninformed. IMO they could have gotten a much better rifle in an AR chambered in 6.8, 300AAC, .308, .50 Beowulf or even one in 7.62x39.

Weak and powerful bullets is just silly as is stopping power. Bottom line is damage to your brain, heart, CNS, femoral artery, carotid artery and probably more places than I've heard of will kill you quickly. It doesn't matter if it is a .50 BMG or a .22LR or a knife. All of them can kill you so who cares about power. As far as performance goes the 7.62x39mm is poor performing. Even the commies figured it out and moved to the 5.45mm (which also sucks IMO). The bottom line is that unless you hit something critical or the bullet yaws in the tissue performance is poor. That is exhibited in the lack of deaths despite being shot at the North Hollywood shootout and the Stockton School shooting.

In this post Im refering to traditional calibers of the 2 rifles the 5.56 and 7.62. Im not talking about these 6.8, .50 BMG, and other military calibers. Im a civilian sheepdog lol I dont have thousands to spend on rare and expensive calibers I have yet to see a local store stock 6.8. This post is comparing the AK chambered in 7.62 and the AR chambered in 5.56/.223. You are right about one thing regardless of caliber you need to connect with your target and I can do that very well with the 7.62 round and I hope to achieve the same with the .223 very soon.

flak88mm
04-18-2012, 10:47 PM
Get the AK first, it has more firepower than the AR

C.W.M.V.
04-18-2012, 11:48 PM
Then I'd say those guys are uninformed. IMO they could have gotten a much better rifle in an AR chambered in 6.8, 300AAC, .308, .50 Beowulf or even one in 7.62x39.

Weak and powerful bullets is just silly as is stopping power. Bottom line is damage to your brain, heart, CNS, femoral artery, carotid artery and probably more places than I've heard of will kill you quickly. It doesn't matter if it is a .50 BMG or a .22LR or a knife. All of them can kill you so who cares about power. As far as performance goes the 7.62x39mm is poor performing. Even the commies figured it out and moved to the 5.45mm (which also sucks IMO). The bottom line is that unless you hit something critical or the bullet yaws in the tissue performance is poor. That is exhibited in the lack of deaths despite being shot at the North Hollywood shootout and the Stockton School shooting.

Well, most anyone whos been in a gunfight cares about it.
Thing is that you have to actually hit the target, and if its behind much cover the 5.56 wont do it.

Its very disconcerting to watch your fire bounce off the other guys cover. Luckily in the 1st team we always had armor on hand. 120 main gun had no issues with penetration :)

If your talking about open warfare where no one uses armor or heavy cover, and just stands there waiting to get shot then sure 5.56 works fine.

The key here is balance. I know full well that the AK is not as inherently accurate as the AR (though most civi's have this idea that the AR they buy at the shop is the same as the ones issued. I dare say they would be pissed if they spent a grand and got the pile that most guys are issued!), but the AK has two things that the AR does not-inherent reliability and a well balanced cartridge. I don't need to be able to hit someone 500 meters away because the modern battlefield gives very few opportunities for that sort of shot. I need a weapon that can give good suppressive fire, with a round that can penetrate moderate cover, and that gives good accuracy out to 150 meters. A weapon with those characteristics will serve a rifleman far better in the overwhelming majority of situations than one that is pin point accurate, but fires a round that literally has trouble penetrating heavy brush.

EDIT: I'd agree that a 16 in x39 would be a good compromise but you lose all the reliability that comes in the AK platform. So at that point your left with a weapon that's a bit more accurate, a lot less reliable, and fires the same round. Win for the AK.

Jason P
04-19-2012, 12:18 AM
Buy a Saiga, and DROS a lower at the same time. Enjoy blasting the bejesus out of the Saiga while building the AR slowly over time with quality components. When finished, enjoy both.

Rinse and repeat...

ChaneRZ
04-19-2012, 12:22 AM
Umm let me see, buy a VEPR instead!

Nookieaki
04-19-2012, 2:11 AM
Get both, i did.

INFAMOUS762X39
04-19-2012, 2:40 AM
Save yourself the headache and get Both.

TreeHugger
04-19-2012, 7:10 AM
If you prefer

* stereotyping bad guy look
* don't mind shooting larger MOA
* much easier cleaning
* cheaper ammo
* that distinctive AK sound (CLACK CLACK) when fired
* ejected casing hitting your fellow shooters that are two to three benches away from you

then get an AK. Otherwise, get an AR. Or like most have suggested, get both if possible.

zfields
04-19-2012, 7:32 AM
If you prefer

* stereotyping bad guy look
* don't mind shooting larger MOA
* much easier cleaning
* cheaper ammo
* that distinctive AK sound (CLACK CLACK) when fired
* ejected casing hitting your fellow shooters that are two to three benches away from you

then get an AK. Otherwise, get an AR. Or like most have suggested, get both if possible.

Sounds like you never shot an AK.

They fly about 15-25 yards right and forward.


As for the rest of this thread..... entertainment.

OP, dont judge Ak's based on that POS you picked up. I think people have been saying that since yoru first thread saying it was a piece of crap. US made major parts, and Ak's dont mix.

TreeHugger
04-19-2012, 7:42 AM
Sounds like you never shot an AK.

They fly about 15-25 yards right and forward.

I had a Hungarian SA85M for about 10 yrs(one of the best) and yes, I've shot it many times. But for me, I tend to grab my AR or bolt a lot more often.

Mr. Gillious
04-19-2012, 7:57 AM
Hey guys as some of you know I have an I.O. Sporter (AK Clone) and its a decent rifle it goes bang but I dont fully trust it. With that being said im in need of a good combat type rifle so im on the fence with either getting a Saiga and taking it to a built party or turning to the dark side of the force and getting an AR lol. I do have tons of AK acessories i.e. mags, rails, mounts, and internals etc so it would make sense to get a new "reliable" AK but id be lieing if I said I havent been pondering an M&P 15 purchase for a while now. Decisions decisions someone help me decide please!!! Sadly I cant have both lol :facepalm:

this might be a tad bit off topic, but i noticed you want combat type rifle. this is just me but when i think of combat as in "today can certainly be my last day on earth/this is one reason i can go to the range on a budget and throw down mass quantities of rounds all day" i choose not only ak, but a range of ak design like the rpk/aes10b, psl or dragunov, draco pistol....mmmm sounds good listing them down. i'm guestimating when the time will come i'd have a collection like that. but it's also because i'm cheap and i like the cost of ammo.

your ammo stash could be huge!

zfields
04-19-2012, 8:03 AM
I had a Hungarian SA85M for about 10 yrs(one of the best) and yes, I've shot it many times. But for me, I tend to grab my AR or bolt a lot more often.

More power to you if you are a group shooter. For me, it doesn't hold interest like run and gun does.

Had the Hungarian? That's a shame you got rid of it. I'd like to pick one up sooner or later. I've been eyeing a really nice noricino a friend has for sale, but the heavy profile 20" barrel is not something I want to get into again.

TreeHugger
04-19-2012, 9:57 AM
More power to you if you are a group shooter. For me, it doesn't hold interest like run and gun does.

I like both, am finishing up a run n gun AR.

Had the Hungarian?

Yeah, it is a shame having to get rid of the Hungarian :(

ExtremeX
04-19-2012, 10:21 AM
Buy a Saiga, and DROS a lower at the same time. Enjoy blasting the bejesus out of the Saiga while building the AR slowly over time with quality components. When finished, enjoy both.

Rinse and repeat...

+1!

Ruiner
04-19-2012, 10:34 AM
This is like asking if I would prefer to have my left or right testicle. The answer is BOTH.

NorCalK9.com
04-19-2012, 10:57 AM
Lol does anyone notice how ar guys pull the ghetto/terrorist/hollywoodshootout/ card every time this discussion pops up?
Oh and for the guy that said 545x39 is a pos round. Check out my coyote shots with 556 at 300 yards out of a saiga556 20in barrel. 556 sux after 100 yards!
545x39 is awesome out 4x the 559 in wounding power.

NorCalK9.com
04-19-2012, 11:23 AM
Hope this works!
http://i.imgur.com/aXz8r.jpg

kotton
04-19-2012, 11:38 AM
That settles it then. Go for a AK in 545 to prepare for the inevitable coyote apocalypse!

TreeHugger
04-19-2012, 11:40 AM
This is like asking if I would prefer to have my left or right testicle. The answer is BOTH.

My friend's father only has one, its twin was shot off in WWII :facepalm:

osis32
04-19-2012, 11:41 AM
The ak sucks for optics but it's a great weapon. I own both enjoy both. I second the buy both sentiment. Experience will tell you which you prefer. They both have their strengths and weaknesses all depends on what you wanna do and how you wanna do it.