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calif 15-22
04-16-2012, 8:09 AM
So this was my 3rd time out with my Daniel Defense M4 V4. First 2 times out I shot 250 rounds each time. First time with XM855. Second time with Ficcochi 50grain VMAX. Both time no issues.

Yesteday was at the range with 2 new items.
1. Brand new aluminum 10 rnd mags I had just got from 44mag.
2. Loaded with Prvi 69 grain hollow points.

After about 100 rounds the bolt would not go into battery. The first "click" nothing then ejected the round with charging handle and next round "click". Ejected that round then a third "click". After the 3rd "click" I could not get the bolt to pull back with the charging handle. The mag would also not release (I assume becase the bolt was not completely forward.)

Of course this was during the last minute of fire at Metcalf and I needed to unload and clear for the cease fire. I yanked and pulled and nothing. Bolt forwad, round in chamber, panic on my face.

So I had to raise my hand (like a complete noob which in hindsight I guess I am) and the RO came over. Nice guy. He YANKED on it. and the round came out then the mag could be released. He said "you need more oil". Went to the office and came back with a small dropper of oil and lubed the hell out of the bolt.

I had cleaned it after outing 1 but not after outing 2 so the gun had 350 rounds without a cleaning or oiling. First cleaning I oiled but must not have been enough. The RO said "these things like to be wet"

So my question is "how wet". Light film, drops, dripping wet? And how often do you oil?

Felt like such a noob . . .

the86d
04-16-2012, 8:13 AM
I always oil the bolt rings, light on the bolt lugs, light on the BCG pressure points (where the contact is made with the upper).

M_lizar
04-16-2012, 8:16 AM
I oil mine everytime I go out shooting.

chead
04-16-2012, 8:20 AM
No reason not to run wet if you're going to the range. At the very least blast it down with CLP, but just know it is going to blow out pretty quickly. Get some lube that will stay put and reapply after cleaning :)

HKMadness
04-16-2012, 8:23 AM
I don't lube it to the point of dripping. Apply a generous lubing, cycle the action with the charging handle several times, and wipe off the excess. The mag should still drop if the bolt isn't all the way forward, as long as the round has cleared the mag. Sounds like in your case it wasn't forward enough and the round was still being held by the mag.

I too noticed that my AR doesn't like too many rounds between cleaning and lubing the first time (350 isn't even that many, really, and I didn't lube it properly the first time). My AK on the other hand, would scoff at 350 rounds and say "is that all you got? Pfft!"

Definitely clean and lube your AR after every outing.

HK Dave
04-16-2012, 8:27 AM
Everyone is new at this at some time... don't feel bad about it. It's much worse to act like you know everything when you know squat.

Depending on the oil I use it changes the amount I use. A thicker type oil I basically coat the entire bcg. If I use something like remoil or CLP I hold the bolt out, and literally drench it in the spray oil, shake it off a bit then put it back in the gun. ;)

the86d
04-16-2012, 8:27 AM
Lower power TulAmmo makes mine cycle less manly (doesn't cycle my full sized A2 very well).

After say 150-200 rounds I started to have issues with TulAmmo. I put in some NATO rounds: perfect. Then some federal brass cased .223 and it was still happy.

ICONIC
04-16-2012, 8:31 AM
Don't sweat it. Nothing to be emabarassed about. I would be more embarassed if I muzzle swept some body or dropped a loaded gun.

You are new to AR's. welcome to the black rifle disease. I am sure it won't be your last

calif 15-22
04-16-2012, 8:33 AM
Everyone is new at this at some time... don't feel bad about it. It's much worse to act like you know everything when you know squat.

Depending on the oil I use it changes the amount I use. A thicker type oil I basically coat the entire bcg. If I use something like remoil or CLP I hold the bolt out, and literally drench it in the spray oil, shake it off a bit then put it back in the gun. ;)

That is probably where I'm going wrong. I did use Remoil Spray when I did my first clean and oil when new, but wipped off the excess and reinstalled the BCG.

I'll look into a thicker oil. Anyone have any good recommedations for an oil with more vicosity? Is Remoil OK just dont wipe off?

Thanks again guys . . . man I was really embarrased when the RO came out with his little can of oil.

Johnnyfres
04-16-2012, 8:39 AM
Happened to me too last time I was out I forgot my oil, had to borrow some from the range.
AR's like to be wet. I would not feel bad about it. Happens to the best of us.

peter95
04-16-2012, 8:41 AM
that is pretty weird.

I shot 1000 rounds before before re-oiling and it was fine. Maybe because I was generous my previous oiling of the bcg.

After RO put some oil on it, did it work fine?
Try doing a re-oil, remember how much oil you put on it next time you go out and monitor your AR. You are the one that will know your AR more than anyone else in that regard.

Dont feel embarrassed. Everything is part of a learning experience. Better to ask then acting like a Douche in front of people.

Gunsrruss
04-16-2012, 8:47 AM
You people need to clean your weapons. I would never put 350 rounds through my AR without cleaning the bolt and bolt carrier group. You get what you pay for. Wake up people, this is not airsoft!!!:mad:

P.Charm
04-16-2012, 8:54 AM
I always oil the bolt rings, light on the bolt lugs, light on the BCG pressure points (where the contact is made with the upper).

this is what I do and just started the "I'll clean it later" routine. I was shooting steel case yesterday and still no problems. I just make sure to oils the bolt rings and the rails of the bolt. and a light coat on the charging handle (but it gets ver little use itself)

it happens. I'm sure you will learn from it. I have never heard of anything bad happening from having too much oil.

goodlookin1
04-16-2012, 9:03 AM
Get a piston and run it dry

:hide:


:43::43::43:

PolishMike
04-16-2012, 9:07 AM
You people need to clean your weapons. I would never put 350 rounds through my AR without cleaning the bolt and bolt carrier group. You get what you pay for. Wake up people, this is not airsoft!!!:mad:


Lol thats the funniest thing I have heard in a week.


350 rounds for an AR is NOTHING. You can't even warm it up in that.

****, look at some of the guns that the pros run in practice. Filthy 14 made is what 40,000 rounds???

Lubrication is important. Cleaning is not.

sactobill
04-16-2012, 9:10 AM
I had a similar thing happen the first time I shot my PWS MK116. PWS and my dealer recommended Slick 2000 oil. No issues after that. I do clean it after a range session. Bore snake with Remoil, quick scrub with chamber brush using Remoil, clean bolt and then lube with Slick 2000 (4 small drops on each side).

FourLoko
04-16-2012, 9:13 AM
I've been using some very light grease on my Spikes upper with no issues at all. RSOs and old Marines love to tell you the thing should be drenched in CLP. It's not true.

I did add some more grease to the carrier and bolt on my last outing but no cleaning and nothing extreme in terms of "running wet."

BucDan
04-16-2012, 9:25 AM
Motor oil... Heh, my ak runs nicely with that.

cwin
04-16-2012, 9:40 AM
Nothing to be embarrassed about. I clean my ARs after every range trip, applying a generous amount of oil to the bcg but not to the point it's dripping wet.

Cobrafreak
04-16-2012, 9:41 AM
I run my 16" 5.56 with a heavy 9mm Carbine buffer and it runs so clean now even when shooting Wolf exclusively that I haven't cleaned it for 1000 rounds. I don't need to. I oil the bearing surfaces on the bolt carrier and the rings on the bolt. That's it. It runs smooth as silk and never jams in any way.

JNunez23
04-16-2012, 9:56 AM
Nothing to be embarrassed about. I clean my ARs after every range trip, applying a generous amount of oil to the bcg but not to the point it's dripping wet.

+1... This is all I do, no issues so far.

JamesY
04-16-2012, 9:59 AM
350 rds isn't much. I usually go through 600-900 rds before I clean (no re-lubing in between). I use Extreme Weapons Lube on the bolt and carrier. I tried using wheel bearing grease in another AR, but that didn't work too well. EWL is all I use for my ARs now.

proclone1
04-16-2012, 10:11 AM
Don't sweat it. Nothing to be emabarassed about. I would be more embarassed if I muzzle swept some body or dropped a loaded gun.

You are new to AR's. welcome to the black rifle disease. I am sure it won't be your last

Yup, only thing really to be embarrassed about IMO are safety no-no's/violations. Everything else should be fun learning & "Gee-wizz why didn't I think of that :facepalm: "

calif 15-22
04-16-2012, 10:13 AM
You people need to clean your weapons. I would never put 350 rounds through my AR without cleaning the bolt and bolt carrier group. You get what you pay for. Wake up people, this is not airsoft!!!:mad:

Funny I was expecting more responses like this.

I'll give it a good clean and oil tonight for the next outing this weekend.

It did run fine after the RO oiled it although I only shot another 50 or so then headed out. Got home and got distracted so I'll be cleaning it tonight.

Thanks for all the input guys . . . great forum to get good info.

HKDoc
04-16-2012, 10:18 AM
From a fellow newb, you did absolutely the right thing to raise your hand and let the ro know that you were having a problem. It would have been embarrassing if you didn't.

the86d
04-16-2012, 10:20 AM
...I have never heard of anything bad happening from having too much oil.

Oil spits out of everything (smokey too), and the mist gets into your eyes with at least the 1st few shots, and greases up your paws...

bruss01
04-16-2012, 10:23 AM
I've had a similar experience.

My idea of lubing a gun, in general, is to wipe the piece or area being lubed with an oily patch, then use a dry patch to get all but a light coating off.

I discovered that method does not suffice for an AR rifle.

Some people advocate dunking the bolt in a can of oil, letting it drain a second to get the first few ounces of lub dripped off, then slap it in the gun before it starts to get too "dry"! Amazingly, they do seem to actully like to run this way.

I invested in a FailZero bolt & carrier (pretty penny!) with the idea that my usual lube method (oily patch followed by dry) would work. It did... for about 100 rounds. Then the RO dumped a buttload of oil (by my standards) into the bolt and carrier. I'll be damned if the darn thing didn't run like a top after that.

Based on that experience, I'd never take an AR into harms way without a small bottle of oil on me somewhere. It can literally be a life or death thing if you are talking about real world defensive use.

the86d
04-16-2012, 10:30 AM
Nickel-Boron BCG here, I really run it pretty dry.

(I never even shot it with the bolt the upper came with. I didn't have a Nickel-Boron BCG in the Corps. :) I just really like the SHINY Smiley Face when the ejection port cover is open.)

milotrain
04-16-2012, 10:33 AM
I use CLP break free. I drip it on the BCG and bolt when disassembled, rub it around with my fingers, leave it in a bag for 15-20, pull it out and wipe it dry (this is a cleaning step). Then I do it again but don't wipe it dry, and run it like that.

I like CLP better then rem oil for the AR because it stays put a little better. Rem oil is what I use in the revolver and shotgun. I would not use a motor oil as it will burn off and leave residue. CLP leaves a slick residue after burn off.

HK Dave
04-16-2012, 10:34 AM
Running any bolt in an AR dry, whether Nickel-Boron, Fail Zero, Stainless, Chrome whatever... is bad. Put some oil it folks, your upper will thank you for it. :)

BTW OP, what you did was not embarrassing, you did what was RIGHT.

What's embarrassing is going into a room full of children and saying, "THIS IS A GLOCK 40, I AM THE ONLY ONE PROFESSIONAL ENOUGH IN THIS ROOM TO HANDLE THIS"...and then proceed to shoot yourself in the leg. :D

HK Dave
04-16-2012, 10:36 AM
<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/wzY1_h1odJ8" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

http://youtu.be/wzY1_h1odJ8

Bah I dunno how to link videos. :P

MrPlink
04-16-2012, 11:17 AM
And i thought these were fighting guns...

Bhobbs
04-16-2012, 11:29 AM
I had some lubriplate out for my M1 and tried it in my AR. I put a light film on the BCG and it seemed to work fine.

Arnelcheeze
04-16-2012, 11:36 AM
thin layer of synthetic grease is all you need, do it once per cleaning.

p2rider426
04-16-2012, 11:46 AM
I just use some synthetic Mobil 1 on my AR after every cleaning and I have run it anywhere between 150-800 rds between cleanings and not a single FTE or FTF.

MarkL
04-16-2012, 11:49 AM
Calif 15-22, I was actually on the bench to the right of you when your malfunction occurred. I was the guy who grabbed your targets when the wind took them. :) I heard the range officer ask you if you had any oil. I was going to offer some up from my bag, but he went grab some for you.

Don't feel bad about the lube job. I've learned a lot about rifles the "hard-way". In-fact I was dealing with trigger disconnector issues on my Saiga 5.45 while you were experiencing your bolt problem. All part of the learning process.

I've been using Frog Lube lately on all my firearms, including my AR-15 bolt. I seems to be doing the job well and makes things run smoothly and clean-up a breeze. Have fun and may see you at the range again one day. :)

the86d
04-16-2012, 12:11 PM
<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/wzY1_h1odJ8" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

http://youtu.be/wzY1_h1odJ8

Bah I dunno how to link videos. :P

Glock-foot.

mif_slim
04-16-2012, 12:34 PM
a DD jamming?! Blasphemy!

;)

calif 15-22
04-16-2012, 12:55 PM
Calif 15-22, I was actually on the bench to the right of you when your malfunction occurred. I was the guy who grabbed your targets when the wind took them. :) I heard the range officer ask you if you had any oil. I was going to offer some up from my bag, but he went grab some for you.

Don't feel bad about the lube job. I've learned a lot about rifles the "hard-way". In-fact I was dealing with trigger disconnector issues on my Saiga 5.45 while you were experiencing your bolt problem. All part of the learning process.

I've been using Frog Lube lately on all my firearms, including my AR-15 bolt. I seems to be doing the job well and makes things run smoothly and clean-up a breeze. Have fun and may see you at the range again one day. :)

Talk about a small world . . .too funny. Thanks for grabbing those by the way. All in all a bit frustrating and embarrasing. Felt like the kid in shop class "Ahhh Mr. Shop teacher, my drill seems to be stuck in this hunk of metal".

Another Calgunner PM'd me about Frog Lube I may have to give that a try.

I think I just wipped to much oil off after the first cleaning. I spayed then wiped with a bore patch. Probably should not have cleaned off so much of the oil and the Remoil may be to light of a lube. I use the Remoil for my 870.

That RO was pretty cool about the whole thing and luckily he got it un-jammed.

Maybe I'll see you out there again . . . .

Latigo
04-16-2012, 12:59 PM
I've been using some very light grease on my Spikes upper with no issues at all. RSOs and old Marines love to tell you the thing should be drenched in CLP. It's not true.

I did add some more grease to the carrier and bolt on my last outing but no cleaning and nothing extreme in terms of "running wet."

^^ This. I never, ever oil a bolt. I use Lubriplate (grease)

russ69
04-16-2012, 1:03 PM
I've been shooting ARs for 30 plus years. The other day, my bolt wouldn't go into battery. I have to raise my hand and we get the bolt open. To make sure it wasn't a fluke, I did it again, same results.
Inspection at home showed that the headspace on that gun is near minimum and a little piece of crud in the chamber was enough to hold the bolt back. I also readjusted my die for maximum re-sizing after gauging my reload. The next time out the gun ran fine.
I guess you could say I'm an expert, and that was the first time in 30 plus years I ever had a problem with an AR. It sounds like you handled it just fine, no embarrassment needed.

killshot44
04-16-2012, 1:07 PM
I have never heard of anything bad happening from having too much oil.

I have. Too much oil just shortens the time before you'll need to clean the BCG again; it attracts and holds crud.

We only need to lube the CONTACT POINTS; which are the rings of the bolt, the four "skids" on the carrier, the bolt cam and the back of the bolt lugs.
A well-respected builder turned me to Phil's Tenacious Oil but any viscous lube that stays in place will suffice.

OP did the right thing calling the attention of the R.O., believe it or not they're there to help us (they just don't act like it sometime ;) )

Droppin Deuces
04-16-2012, 1:09 PM
I've been using the same bottle of Militec-1 for the past two years now. A drop or so on the bearing surfaces, rotating lug and extractor, then another through the vent holes to get the rings and it's good to go for a couple/few trips to the range. The action is as smooth as I've ever felt on an AR.

TreeHugger
04-16-2012, 1:11 PM
Well, it's not like your pants fell off :eek:

ejhc11
04-16-2012, 1:13 PM
I use this - no more cost than std. gun oil
http://www.slip2000.com/allconditionslube.html

Eljay
04-16-2012, 1:21 PM
I use a drop or two of oil on the rings, but I use grease for the rest.

Quickdraw Mcgraw
04-16-2012, 1:34 PM
I've been using the same bottle of Militec-1 for the past two years now. A drop or so on the bearing surfaces, rotating lug and extractor, then another through the vent holes to get the rings and it's good to go for a couple/few trips to the range. The action is as smooth as I've ever felt on an AR.

THIS^WORKS!!

repubconserv
04-16-2012, 1:34 PM
thin layer of synthetic grease is all you need, do it once per cleaning.

This. Grease stays put better than oil. Dont put thick grease on either, there are some pretty thin greases out there, NLGI 0....

hornswaggled
04-16-2012, 1:47 PM
You people need to clean your weapons. I would never put 350 rounds through my AR without cleaning the bolt and bolt carrier group. You get what you pay for. Wake up people, this is not airsoft!!!:mad:

You must be using ****ty ARs. Any decent AR will run for thousands of rounds with no cleaning as long as they're kept properly lubed. This isn't 1969 on the Ho Chi Min trail humping an M16a1.

Prc329
04-16-2012, 2:01 PM
I ran one of my uppers dry by accident and blew the gas rings :(

Gunsrruss
04-16-2012, 2:55 PM
[QUOTE=hornswaggled;8415066]You must be using ****ty ARs. Any decent AR will run for thousands of rounds with no cleaning as long as they're kept properly lubed. This isn't 1969 on the Ho Chi Min trail humping an M16a1.[/QUOTE

Yes, 1969 I was there. Chu Lai RVN. But I have learned to clean my rifle because I shoot my AR competitively;). Carbon kills a rifle like the AR. It also builds up and changes the way the M1A functions. But then I'm 64 :oji:not a youngster that will live forever. Take care of your equipment and it will take care of you:)

MarkL
04-16-2012, 3:01 PM
Talk about a small world . . .too funny.

Yea, I started reading your first post and said...wow that sounds familiar. Then when you said "Metcalf", I knew it had to be you. Nice rifle and scope btw! Yea, I was checkin it out. :)

PhoS
04-16-2012, 3:41 PM
I use this - no more cost than std. gun oil
http://www.slip2000.com/allconditionslube.html

+1 for slip2000 , I run my AR on the 'wet' side but not to the point of dripping.

I lube everything that makes contact with something else.

sl4ck3r
04-16-2012, 4:22 PM
Running any bolt in an AR dry, whether Nickel-Boron, Fail Zero, Stainless, Chrome whatever... is bad. Put some oil it folks, your upper will thank you for it. :)

BTW OP, what you did was not embarrassing, you did what was RIGHT.

What's embarrassing is going into a room full of children and saying, "THIS IS A GLOCK 40, I AM THE ONLY ONE PROFESSIONAL ENOUGH IN THIS ROOM TO HANDLE THIS"...and then proceed to shoot yourself in the leg. :D

these are suppose to run without any oil AT ALL.
http://www.andersonrifles.com/

JUm3
04-16-2012, 4:33 PM
slip is cool. but honestly brakefree CLP has always worked and a bit cheaper.

a gunsmith once told me to use auto transmission oil.

anyoen use some of that froglube stuff?

Prc329
04-16-2012, 4:53 PM
CLP works fine.

Omega13device
04-16-2012, 5:59 PM
Carbon kills a rifle like the AR.

Carbon doesn't kill ARs, lack of lubrication does.

This may be a shock but cleaning your rifle doesn't mean it will be clean next time you shoot it. What happens as soon as you fire the next shot? If you're shooting it, it's dirty, and surprise!! It still works.

Second, with proper lubrication any carbon or debris will get pushed out of the way by the reciprocating action of the bolt carrier. Pull the bolt back and look inside the upper at the rails on which the BCG rides. They'll be clean and shiny. That's why Filthy 14 was able to go 40,000+ rounds without cleaning. The muck gets pushed out of the way to places where it doesn't hurt anything.

Now, is it bad to clean? No. If it's a habit that's totally ingrained, or you just enjoy it, go for it. But that doesn't suggest that you HAVE to clean in order to have a reliably functioning AR.

Omega13device
04-16-2012, 6:11 PM
these are suppose to run without any oil AT ALL.
http://www.andersonrifles.com/

Yeah...or it could just be marketing. How else would FailZero get people to spend an extra $120 on a BCG so they can avoid spending $5 for a bottle of lubricant?

"Oil attracts dirt, sand, grit and other harmful particles." O RLY? I didn't know oil had magnetic properties for attracting dirt. :rolleyes:

If I'm someplace where a lot of sand and dirt is blowing around, I'll be way better off with sand and lube than just sand.

Shoot-it
04-16-2012, 6:14 PM
That's nothing to be embarrassed about .At least you were being safe and all.
Now you know what to do next time that happens or keep it from happening.

One time I had a double feed with that carbon 15 sealed mag well.I had to to use a small screw driver to get it fixed.My fault I didn't pull the handle all the way back and let it go I was trying to be quiet.

AfghanVetOrcutt
04-16-2012, 7:00 PM
I used Militec-1 through 2 deployments in Afghanistan. Countless firefights and I had never had a jam or an issue with reliability. I also cleaned my weapon everyday when I came back from mission (not counting days I didn't go on missions which wasn't often). I used Militec to clean and as lube, I use it still for my USP .40.

smalltime
04-16-2012, 7:36 PM
Saw a few mentions of filthy 14 and thought I'd finally read the article. It didn't quite go 40k rounds without cleaning but still impressive.

At Brady, Texas, in March 2009, it suffered a malfunction, which was reduced with immediate action. The bolt was wiped down at 6,450 rounds. At Prairie du Chien, Wisconsin, in May 2009, it had several failures to extract, and the extractor spring was replaced at 13,010 rounds. At Wamego, Kansas, in June 2009, two bolt lugs broke at 16,400 rounds. We replaced the BCG. At Columbus, Ohio, in November 2009, we had several failures to extract at 24,450 rounds. The shooter gave it a field cleaning and replaced the extractor and extractor spring. At 28,905 rounds, we finally cleaned Filthy 14.

Gunsrruss
04-16-2012, 7:43 PM
Carbon doesn't kill ARs, lack of lubrication does.

This may be a shock but cleaning your rifle doesn't mean it will be clean next time you shoot it. What happens as soon as you fire the next shot? If you're shooting it, it's dirty, and surprise!! It still works.

Second, with proper lubrication any carbon or debris will get pushed out of the way by the reciprocating action of the bolt carrier. Pull the bolt back and look inside the upper at the rails on which the BCG rides. They'll be clean and shiny. That's why Filthy 14 was able to go 40,000+ rounds without cleaning. The muck gets pushed out of the way to places where it doesn't hurt anything.

Now, is it bad to clean? No. If it's a habit that's totally ingrained, or you just enjoy it, go for it. But that doesn't suggest that you HAVE to clean in order to have a reliably functioning AR.

I think the name Filthy 14 speaks for it's self. Some of us have risen above the dirt and grime to do what is needed for our equipment. Hopefully my life will never depend on a dirty rifle because I have no pride in keeping it clean.

Mossy Man
04-16-2012, 8:42 PM
i rarely ever oil my mini

i clean it now and then, runs fine

Horta
04-16-2012, 9:00 PM
Lube every time you shoot.

InkHammer
04-16-2012, 9:57 PM
+1 on slip 2000 EWL "extreme weapons lube". It is thick enough, and actually bonds to the metal.

InkHammer
04-16-2012, 10:05 PM
+1 on slip 2000 EWL "extreme weapons lube". It is thick enough, and actually bonds to the metal.

HonkingAntelope
04-16-2012, 10:44 PM
So this was my 3rd time out with my Daniel Defense M4 V4. First 2 times out I shot 250 rounds each time. First time with XM855. Second time with Ficcochi 50grain VMAX. Both time no issues.

Yesteday was at the range with 2 new items.
1. Brand new aluminum 10 rnd mags I had just got from 44mag.
2. Loaded with Prvi 69 grain hollow points.

After about 100 rounds the bolt would not go into battery. The first "click" nothing then ejected the round with charging handle and next round "click". Ejected that round then a third "click". After the 3rd "click" I could not get the bolt to pull back with the charging handle. The mag would also not release (I assume becase the bolt was not completely forward.)

Of course this was during the last minute of fire at Metcalf and I needed to unload and clear for the cease fire. I yanked and pulled and nothing. Bolt forwad, round in chamber, panic on my face.

So I had to raise my hand (like a complete noob which in hindsight I guess I am) and the RO came over. Nice guy. He YANKED on it. and the round came out then the mag could be released. He said "you need more oil". Went to the office and came back with a small dropper of oil and lubed the hell out of the bolt.

I had cleaned it after outing 1 but not after outing 2 so the gun had 350 rounds without a cleaning or oiling. First cleaning I oiled but must not have been enough. The RO said "these things like to be wet"

So my question is "how wet". Light film, drops, dripping wet? And how often do you oil?

Felt like such a noob . . .

I'm surprised no one mentioned one thing before...

You gotta remember that this is a brand new gun, and all of the different pieces need probably around 1000 shots to settle in all the way. Until that happens, you do have to clean it more frequently than a 'normal' AR to give extra lubrication and extra room until all the bumps get smoothed out.

As far as cleaning/oiling my own rifle is concerned, less is more. I just use a paper towel soaked in CLP to do the first pass, let things sit for a bit, and then use a second dry towel to wipe down all the parts so that only a thin oil layer is left. Once that's done, I just put a tiny dab of CLP on the four BCG "skids", a drop into the two oil holes, and rack the bolt a few times to spread it around. That's it.

With the above, it's easily enough for 300+ shots with PMC ammo before you start to notice some slight resistance when you pull the charging handle.

kuya51
04-16-2012, 11:24 PM
http://quib.weaponevolution.com/Assorted/lube21.jpg

I'm sure some have seen this picture for lube points for AR's. I'm a newbie and have been following this.

leoffensive
04-17-2012, 6:05 AM
i dont like oil as it just drips away. ive had amazing results with generic high temp wheel bearing grease. just on the bolt where it rides on the inside of the carrier and the locking lugs. and the on the rails of the bolt carrier. thats it.

remember just a little bit is all you need and that small little can of grease will last damn near forever.

the only oil you need on the ar is on the gas rings one drop is good

calif 15-22
04-17-2012, 7:54 AM
http://quib.weaponevolution.com/Assorted/lube21.jpg

I'm sure some have seen this picture for lube points for AR's. I'm a newbie and have been following this.

Thanks Kuya that is very helpful pic . . .

Thanks to all for the good info. I picked up a bottle of Breakfree CLP last night and gave it a good clean and lube. The guy at Gun Vault also mentioned Slip2000 but they don't carry it. :facepalm:

Heading out this weekend again. I think I'll start a range book on this rifle to document the cleaning and round counts. Funny I have a log book for all 3 of my trucks and 4 dirt bikes but didn't think of starting one for my new rifle.

Thanks again guys all the info was very helpful . . . not to mention the support for not being too embarrased by what happened.

Take care . . .

arsilva32
04-17-2012, 8:25 AM
well if you need to run it that wet than you have a worthless paperweight. one of my ar pistols has not been cleaned in 1000 + rounds and still fires without a problem. its a beater you can count on. i think allot of ar parts are to far out of spec hence you need gobbs of lube.

Knife Edge
04-17-2012, 11:36 AM
We are supposed to lubricate these things?

sharxbyte
04-17-2012, 12:31 PM
Wake up people, this is not airsoft!!!:mad:

Hey! I clean and oil my Airsoft guns too! >:[

clutchy
04-17-2012, 9:00 PM
You may or may not have noticed but your gun will start to break in around those ammo counts, just keep it lubed and it will get smoother and smoother :)


good luck!

JMP
04-17-2012, 10:18 PM
Funny thread--I clicked the title just in case someone was posting a story about "that guy" refering to me (no, I didn't recently shoot my foot off at the range). I am not an AR person, but figured what the heck and bought the gimmick of the Anderson R-85 treatment to avoid some of the messy cleanup (compared to a bolt). Runs dry and works fine, not a single jam or malfunction. Can't speak to the longevity since I don't shoot it that much.

UserM4
04-17-2012, 10:32 PM
Any gun lube will be just fine as long as you keep it lubed. Get whatever is on sale.

UserM4
04-17-2012, 10:32 PM
Any gun lube will be just fine as long as you keep it lubed. Get whatever is on sale.

ERdept
04-17-2012, 10:41 PM
Get a piston and run it dry

:hide:


:43::43::43:



YES! It needed to be said. :p:D

motorwerks
04-17-2012, 11:57 PM
slip is cool. but honestly brakefree CLP has always worked and a bit cheaper.

a gunsmith once told me to use auto transmission oil.

anyoen use some of that froglube stuff?

ATF seems like a bad idea but to each their own. Fruglube works great and smells like a urinal mint. I've been using it and Milltec-1 for a while now I love them. My gas rings get oil, BCG's, and Handgun slides get a little grease (froglube calls is paste) but jsut on the bearing surfaces (if its a phosphate bolt.... the shiny areas with no coating).

http://shop.velcronius.com/FrogLube-Products_c3.htm

http://www.militec1.com/

Jsnscot
04-18-2012, 12:08 AM
Froglube has been working great for me.

HK Dave
04-18-2012, 12:08 AM
Get a piston and run it dry

:hide:


:43::43::43:

HEHE

I'd be willing to bet that my DI gun lubed, will outlast your piston dry. ;)

xoutxkastx
04-18-2012, 12:19 AM
So my question is "how wet". Light film, drops, dripping wet? And how often do you oil?

Felt like such a noob . . .

No need to feel like a noob. I made the same mistake too. I thought that I had lubed my BCG properly and come to find out the darn thing has to be disassemble and cleaned. To answer your question. I just spray some oil on my palm and give the BCG a quick coating(lol sounds like pron) after every cleaning. I also put a little grease on parts that show some wear. Remember its better to ask than having something tradgic happen to your rifle and even worse to you. GL on the next time out.

Peter W Bush
04-18-2012, 12:23 AM
You people need to clean your weapons. I would never put 350 rounds through my AR without cleaning the bolt and bolt carrier group. You get what you pay for. Wake up people, this is not airsoft!!!:mad:

If a combat rifle can't go 350 rounds without a cleaning then it is a POS not worth owning.

Motor oil... Heh, my ak runs nicely with that.

Lol I think mine would run on urine if it had to.

^^ This. I never, ever oil a bolt. I use Lubriplate (grease)


+1000. Lubriplate may be the best firearm grease ever. A Calgunner sells a package of their grease and oil. Buy some!

xblax619
04-18-2012, 7:25 PM
Get a piston and run it dry

:hide:


:43::43::43:

^This. I have run over a thousand rounds in my Adams Arms upper without ever removing it from my lower. I have yet to lube anything within the chamber, etc and haven't had a single issue.

glock7
04-18-2012, 9:45 PM
Run it wet. Nothing wrong with that. Over 12k rounds on my 2 ar's tells me it's ok. I like to clean it after each session. In case of zombie outbreak or invasion of the Russians or Chinese, or solar flares or emp attacks by the Iranians or south Koreans. But that's just me...😉

Don the savage
04-19-2012, 7:39 AM
I use Tetra Gun grease. Wipe a good coat on the BCG and I haven't had an issue since i started using it. I had a lock up in the desert in arizona shooting some of that poly coated wolf. Since then i always use grease on any heated moving part (bolt, slide, barrel) grease stays longer and tetra is sythetic so it seems to hold up better to heat.

calif 15-22
04-19-2012, 8:40 AM
Thanks to all for the responses. I did order some Slip2000 online and bought some CLP and gun oil locally for now. Cleaned and oiled and ready for the weekend.

If you're ever at Metcalf and see a noob with a ton of Oil and Grease dripping off his DDM4, the bench, his hands, the range bag, etc . . . stop by and say "Hi".

Thanks again guys . . .

4Defense
04-19-2012, 6:23 PM
So my question is "how wet". Light film, drops, dripping wet? And how often do you oil?




Grease the bolt. Grease stays put. Oil will run off after awhile.

A tube of synthetic grease is around $5 at Wally World. It would last a very long time. Then go to the $1 store and get a small art brush to use for applying the grease to the bolt.

Yes, grease will attract more dust and dirt but unless you're constantly in the desert, it will take thousands of rounds before the bolt ceases. I don't think anybody would shoot thousands of rounds in a single outing.

For cleaning, use 99% isoprophyl alcohol . You can buy them by the gallon at beauty supply stores. They are around $8 a gallon. Put it in a spray bottle. It would knock the grease right off the bolt. Then dry using a towel. Whatever is left of the alcohol would just evaporate.

Used to be an oil guy but now every single handgun and rifle is greased except for the trigger part which is oiled.

BIRDHUNTER757
04-19-2012, 7:18 PM
Do a search on Frog Lube. Great stuff! I don't use oil any more!

HermanH
04-19-2012, 7:38 PM
So far my experience has been removing the initial oil on my Colt LE6920, and it was pretty heavy, then a drop of oil and use my finger to run it across the interference points. We tore down the bolt down to the firing pin because Colt really DOES fire rounds out of it for testing and had to remove brass as well carbon; was already crud everywhere and we hadn't fired a shot ourselves. I'm glad Colt fire tests their guns.

I don't over oil any of my pistols nor the LE6920, however, I have tried Lubriplate on my 92FS and it seem to work well so I may try that after my 2nd outing.

The reason my friend doesn't recommend too heavy an oiling is it will hold more carbon than a lightly oiled rifle. My first 200 rounds went without a hitch. When I got it home, I tore down the upper again and cleaned out all the carbon everywhere; tore down the bolt again, cleaned up more carbon. I didn't see too much if any, in the buffer tube so I left it for now but will clean it up after my next session.

Having said this, and having my Marine friend actually show me all this, I took out the Colt M4 manual and looked up cleaning and it clearly states in bold print: lightly lubricate the following parts:

windage drum/rear sight detents
ejection port cover latch
ejcttion port cover spring
action springs and pins
front sight detent
charge handle catch
inside rear or bolt
mouth of bolt key
bolt carrier exhaust ports
forward assist

It made no mention of other parts such as the cam pin but I lightly oiled it as well as the firing pin and extractor.

Let's see if Colt is correct.

olhunter
04-19-2012, 7:56 PM
Buy this. Put it on everything.

http://www.slip2000.com/slip2000-EWL.html

B!ngo
04-19-2012, 8:29 PM
Hey, everyone's a newbie at one point. Some, when people are shooting back at you, others at the range. I'm still a newbie with an AR and think it's cool that he's helping others learn.
FWIW, I've used SLIK 2000 EWL for quite some time but switched over to Mobil 1 grease and oils (depending on the parts) on all of my handguns. Seems perfect.
B

You must be using ****ty ARs. Any decent AR will run for thousands of rounds with no cleaning as long as they're kept properly lubed. This isn't 1969 on the Ho Chi Min trail humping an M16a1.

Nate G
04-19-2012, 8:32 PM
That is probably where I'm going wrong. I did use Remoil Spray when I did my first clean and oil when new, but wipped off the excess and reinstalled the BCG.

I'll look into a thicker oil. Anyone have any good recommedations for an oil with more vicosity? Is Remoil OK just dont wipe off?

Thanks again guys . . . man I was really embarrased when the RO came out with his little can of oil.

mobil 1 works great for me and a quart will last you a LONG time

Saym14
04-19-2012, 9:11 PM
dripping wet works, better than dry.

glock7
04-20-2012, 7:25 PM
^that's what the wifey says...