View Full Version : About to start my AR build....and a totally seperate question...

04-09-2012, 9:11 PM
Well I went to Just Guns today and purchased an MMC stripped lower. $100 seemed great. Now it's just time to piece her together and this is what I'm looking at doing...

-Spike's Tactical Stnd LPK or RRA LPK w/ ERGO Grip
-Spike's or Bushmaster 5.56 complete upper
-10/30 Mags
-Sightmark Ultra Shot QD RDS (until I can get the $$$ for an EOTech EXPS-2)
-M4 Tactical 6-Pos Stock
-ST-T2 buffer

That's what I'm looking at so far.

On a side note, my friend is under 21 and wants to get an AR 15 BAD. He wants to build his own but isn't sure, and neither am I, if it is ok for him to buy a COMPLETE LOWER? Sort of random but thanks in advance for that.

04-09-2012, 9:19 PM
Welcome to the wonderful world of black rifles Matt. :-)

I'd go with the RRA LPK and the Bushmaster upper. I haven't heard good things about Spike Tactical's QC and overall reliability. RRA and Bushmaster on the other hand have proven track records and come highly recommended from many many well respected armorers, gunsmiths, and professional shooters.

Everything else looks good for your base build. I would also recommend getting some inexpensive iron sights (such as the Magpuls) and practice with those first before you get an optic (unless you already have some AR experience). Plus shooting with irons can be a lot of fun and a good challenge. :-) As for your friend, I unfortunately don't have the answer to that. Perhaps one of the other guys here can clue us both in on that matter.

Have fun and good luck!

04-09-2012, 9:42 PM
Didn't think about the iron sights, but maybe I'll just do that route until the EOTech. I really like the carry handle look. Those have a sight line correct?

04-09-2012, 9:46 PM
I think your under 21 friend will have to do an 80% build or buy an already-assembled rifle. I don't think there is an option where he can buy a receiver. Not sure about a complete lower, I'd put my money on complete rifle.
If I'm wrong...chime in.

Wicked K5
04-09-2012, 9:53 PM
Don't forget some kind of mag lock. In terms of sights, most folks would only consider Magpul if they were being used as a backup. Hence the name MBUS. If you can't fork out the money for Troy, A.R.M.S., or MI, you can go with a carry handle or Daniel Defense 1.5 like I did. They're a great iron primary sight that doesn't cost a lot.

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04-09-2012, 9:54 PM
Didn't think about the iron sights, but maybe I'll just do that route until the EOTech. I really like the carry handle look. Those have a sight line correct?
Yeah you can do an A2-style carry handle which does have the rear irons in it but you'll need the appropriate front sight assembly to go with it (which comes on a lot of uppers these days if they don't have a railed gas block). If you do the A2 style sights you can pick up a book on how to use them and you'll be able to adjust for windage and elevation out to 800 yards. If you want compact flip-up sights I'd recommend either Magpul or Troy for those.

what exactly do you mean by "sightline"?

04-09-2012, 9:59 PM
by sightline I meant like my line of sight through the iron sights.

04-09-2012, 10:44 PM
im still slightly confused...are you talking about co-witness with an optic (meaning the iron sights and the center of your optic's reticule line up with each other when properly zeroed), or just how the front and rear irons line up with each other?

04-09-2012, 11:07 PM
No no. I mean like is there a circle sight on the handle that lines up with the front sight, or is it just the top of the handle that lines up with the front?

04-09-2012, 11:17 PM
No no. I mean like is there a circle sight on the handle that lines up with the front sight, or is it just the top of the handle that lines up with the front?

An A2 rear sight has a proper peep built-in. You're NOT just using the top of the carry handle. I've never even heard of any sight like that.

And no, your friend under 21 cannot buy a complete lower. A complete lower is not a rifle, it's still just a Title 1 "Other" firearm, buttstock or not. You have to be 21 to purchase any firearm that's not a Title 1 rifle or shotgun.

04-09-2012, 11:24 PM
I wasn't sure if they did or not have a peep like that. Thank you.

I kept telling my buddy that I thought a complete lower was still consider "other" but he kept arguing saying that I was wrong. Thanks also for that.

04-09-2012, 11:42 PM
I did what your friend is trying to do. Unfortunately, your friend can't buy the lower on his own. However, his mom or dad could buy it and then transfer it to him.


04-09-2012, 11:44 PM
An A2 rear sight has a proper peep built-in. You're NOT just using the top of the carry handle. I've never even heard of any sight like that.
hit it on the nose...the A2 carry handle has 2 kinds of peep sight holes that you can flip between. The "O1" is the small hole, your "day sight". Use that for precise shots and for longer ranges. The "O2" is your "night sight" or "reactive sight". It's a lot larger than the other one and is meant to be used for rapid target engagement (like if you were doing speed or combat drills) and for engaging targets at night. Using the O1 rear sight aperture (the technical term for the "holes), I've been able to hit center mass on a man-sized target at 800 yards with standard 62 grain military issue ammo. I shot from the prone with a loop sling and there was no wind. Took a few rounds to get on target but I was able to hold about a 5 inch, 10 round group with an M16A2 (I was really surprised the rifle shot that well given how worn it was). Irons are a really great way to practice the fundamentals of shooting. In the Marines we've got an acronym (one of a billion) that we use...SGSTAB.

S: Stance. Make sure when you shoot, no matter from what position that you're firmly grounded and balanced. If you're sitting or kneeling, make sure that you have "bone on bone" contact. Having your elbows sitting on your muscles will make your shooting platform more unstable and susceptible to the natural shaking of your body.
G: Grip. Pull the weapon tight into your shoulder pocket with your non-firing hand. Don't force the weapon to assume a position but try to let it naturally become an extension of your body. Muscling the gat will only make it shake more.
S: Sight alignment. This applies to both optics and iron sights. Get a good stock/cheek weld (chipmunk cheek) so that you can comfortably look down the sights properly (especially important with certain optics that don't have zero parallax). For irons, line up the front sight post with the center (both horizontally and vertically) in your rear sight aperture. When aiming, focus on the tip of the front sight post while maintaining the alignment with the rear sight. If you focus on the target or the rear sight your shots will be off. It takes practice and time.
T: Trigger control. Slow is smooth, smooth is fast. Squeeze your trigger like you would a lemon. The discharge of the weapon should surprise you (just don't lose control of your weapon!).
A: Aim. This is the natural position of your body and weapon. When you set yourself in for your shot your body and weapon should comfortably and naturally be pointed at your target. You shouldn't have to force the weapon on target. If you find that you're off a bit, adjust your stance/position some.
B: Breathing Control. This is one of the most important factors in shooting. Calmly breath in and out through your nose while aiming down your sights. You will be able to see the natural rise and fall of the weapon. When you're ready to take the shot, exhale about half of your breath out and hold it when your sights are on target, then you slowly squeeze your trigger and *BANG*. Lead goes flying. :D Resume your normal breathing afterwards and keep the rifle on target. That follow-through is important, especially if you're going to be firing at a more rapid rate.

Sorry if I went on a tangent or told you stuff that you already know. I just hate it when people think that having an optic is the "end all be all" solution for shooting. Granted, optics are nice and they can be a really big help, but without a solid mastery of the basics it's just another expensive doodad.

I love passing on what I've learned over the years and learning new things myself. Perhaps we should start a thread dedicated to shooting techniques and such?

04-10-2012, 1:09 AM
OP have your friend do a quick search on here. There was a thread in just the last week from a guy under 21 looking to build an AR, and it explained all the options and problems. Unfortunatly, I believe his only options are buy a complete rifle or have mom or dad buy a lower and give it to him. If mom or dad are up for that its an easy solution.

04-10-2012, 7:19 AM
Ya I'll pass on the info to him. As for my route, I'm thinking of just getting the stnd RRA LPK and getting an ergo grip. I didn't realize their $200 LPK is with a different trigger setup.

04-10-2012, 7:36 AM
Matt since your in Sac town like me check this guy out for your buddy.

80% lower (http://sacramento.craigslist.org/bar/2943687813.html)

He charges 100 bucks for your 80% lower paper weight, and about 40 dollars an hour to "coach" and "watch" you complete your lower. I talked with the guy and he said it takes about 1.5 hours to complete a lower.

Good luck, and welcome to the BRD family :)

04-10-2012, 7:42 AM
I'll definitely pass that along to him. Thanks :)

04-11-2012, 7:39 AM
Ok just found something that may make my build a bit cheaper (money wise), but had 2 questions on it. Del-Ton is coming out with an M4 kit (may have already had it, just says in stock date is 6-23-12), how is Del-Ton quality wise on their rifle kits? I've seen some mixed reviews on them from looking around online and it seems to be 50/50 on them. Also second question, the kit comes with a "Pre-Ban" buttstock. What does a Pre-Ban buttstock mean here in CA? Thanks guys. :)

04-16-2012, 10:52 PM
Well decided to axe the Del-Ton rifle kit, and just build up with what I want. I'll be going with a complete upper from ar15depot.com, as well as their LPK and stock assembly. Sunday I picked up 2 20rd .223 PMC FMJ's for $9 a pop, and today I got a modified PMAG 10/30. Here some pix... :D


PMC's inside

Now just waiting till Friday to go pick up my lower, then waiting until next Tuesday to order up my LPK. Will keep this one updated as I go.