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View Full Version : I have an income tax lien, can i still purchase a firearm?


WILLDU02
03-30-2012, 1:37 AM
I had a divorce a while back which resulted in some unpaid taxes. I now have a tax lien filed by the state. Although I am still disputing it, will I be able to still buy a firearm here in ca? Thanks!

Bartin
03-30-2012, 1:51 AM
:popcorn:

bug_eyedmonster
03-30-2012, 5:10 AM
This is hard to answer, the general consensus from the government's prospective is, if you can afford a gun, you can afford to pay what's owned. If you are in the process of getting this resolved, you should call the CA DOJ and have them check. I would also consider having them running a background check and see if you will pass through the system before going to buy a gun, doing paperwork, losing money for a restocking fee, DRoS fee, and wasting the time of people at the gun store.

good luck.

littlejake
03-30-2012, 7:40 AM
As long as the state has not yanked your driver's license for unpaid debt you should be good to go. There certainly is no disqualifying question on the DROS or 4473 about unpaid taxes.

Oceanbob
03-30-2012, 8:09 AM
This is hard to answer, the general consensus from the government's prospective is, if you can afford a gun, you can afford to pay what's owned. If you are in the process of getting this resolved, you should call the CA DOJ and have them check. I would also consider having them running a background check and see if you will pass through the system before going to buy a gun, doing paperwork, losing money for a restocking fee, DRoS fee, and wasting the time of people at the gun store.

good luck.

BS

That's not hard to answer.

Tax liens are civil matters, so are hard money Judgements. These have NOTHING to do with gun rights. A tax lien won't even show up on a backround check.

Buy what you want and enjoy it.!

Be well,
Bob

Oceanbob
03-30-2012, 8:13 AM
As long as the state has not yanked your driver's license for unpaid debt you should be good to go. There certainly is no disqualifying question on the DROS or 4473 about unpaid taxes.


The State won't pull a DL for unpaid taxes. They will suspend a DL for unpaid Child Support or Alimony. However, that would still have nothing to do with a DROS or becoming a prohibited person. Nothing at all.

The only possible problem would be the buyer would have to use a California ID card instead of a Drivers License as a form of ID. Not a big deal to get a California ID card. I have both as well.

Be well, Bob

gotshotgun?
03-30-2012, 8:17 AM
Damn thorough response Bob; tax attorney?

winnre
03-30-2012, 8:32 AM
They will refuse a gun sale for unpaid traffic tickets though, no?

beretta929mm
03-30-2012, 11:02 AM
Try and buy a gun, if get denied, $25 down the drain.

Asking a tax atturney for advise would cost more than $25.

Conclusion:
Go buy a gun to see if you can pass DOJ.

oghl888
03-30-2012, 11:11 AM
You are screwed. Not only will you not be able to buy a gun, you will have to give up the guns already in your possession to me for safe keeping. This is to protect you from committing any tax-related gun violence while you are in dispute of your tax lien (for your own good), especially when you face the eventuality of having to pay whatever they say you owe them.

Seriously though, I have to believe you can buy a gun still. I don't see any reason why they can deny you because of a tax lien.

bug_eyedmonster
03-30-2012, 3:09 PM
BS

That's not hard to answer at all......Please, this is a no FUD zone. Thanks for playing along..:facepalm:

Tax liens are civil matters, so are hard money Judgements. These have NOTHING to do with gun rights. A tax lien won't even show up on a backround check.

Buy what you want and enjoy it.!

Be well,
Bob

Hello Bob,

While I can see where you are coming from, I've seen DOJ reject a prospective buyer from purchasing a firearm from unpaid parking tickets, unpaid child support, and other problems in the past. These are all civil matters. Before sending this gentleman into a gun store with the thought of being a gun owner, my suggestion was to simply check with the DOJ to see if he would be prohibited. This is cheaper than walking into a gun store and not only losing the $25 DRoS fee, but possibly paying a restocking fee as well.

http://oag.ca.gov/firearms/pfecfaqs#1

A person I've delt with was charged with unpaid child support in 1999, and in 2010 was denied purchase. The problem was solved, but somehow the case still lingered in the system (as a mistake) and took several months to clear up. I was not saying he was unable to purchase a firearm, I was recommending him to find out directly from the DOJ if it would pan out or not. Relax, go have a Coke and a smile... :)

Jerry

bug_eyedmonster
03-30-2012, 3:20 PM
The State won't pull a DL for unpaid taxes. They will suspend a DL for unpaid Child Support or Alimony. However, that would still have nothing to do with a DROS or becoming a prohibited person. Nothing at all.

The only possible problem would be the buyer would have to use a California ID card instead of a Drivers License as a form of ID. Not a big deal to get a California ID card. I have both as well.

Be well, Bob

WRONG. If you have unpaid child support or alimony, ad your CDL is suspended, you can not use your CID to purchase a firearm, mainly, because it's the same number. I just called the CA DOJ, and confirmed that you can still buy a firearm with a tax lien under your name. Thanks for playing champ. If you'd like to confirm, their number is (916) 227-7527 (firearms div).

Jerry

Oceanbob
03-30-2012, 4:29 PM
WRONG. If you have unpaid child support or alimony, ad your CDL is suspended, you can not use your CID to purchase a firearm, mainly, because it's the same number. I just called the CA DOJ, and confirmed that you can still buy a firearm with a tax lien under your name. Thanks for playing champ. If you'd like to confirm, their number is (916) 227-7527 (firearms div).

Jerry

That's what I said. You can buy a firearm with a tax lien, no problem. It doesn't matter what approved ID you use. People with a suspended DL are not prohibited from buying a handgun. (unless they have some Felony Issues like a Felony Drunk Driving conviction; then of course they are a lifetime prohibited person). People with an expired DL can buy a handgun if they have a CID that is not expired. (and a second form of ID that proves up an address).

Back on subject: The op has nothing to worry about. Tax liens, Student loan liens, Money Judgements, State liens, Federal liens, liens from 24 hour fitness, liens from your bank, liens from your credit card company..none of these will prohibit you from buying a firearm. These are not criminal matters.
They are civil matters.

Be well, Bob

Squid
03-30-2012, 4:43 PM
be connected with your driver's lic.

And, yeah, that makes total sense, if a guy is short money for child support, lets take away his lic. so he loses his job.

And it seems like so many lower paying jobs REQUIRE a valid DL.

If "the court" finds he is sitting on a phat stack and just refusing to pay due to War With Wife THEN sure put him "on ice" until he finds his checkbook or tow his Ferrari, but I digress.

BUT if those tax liens somehow convert to criminal charge.....???

Oceanbob
03-30-2012, 5:39 PM
The State can also suspend other Professional Licenses to make a 'deadbeat' comply. Real Estate, Contractor License, etc..including of course your Drivers License. They can and will LEVY any and all Savings and Checking accounts.

This sort of action is common. Of course, you're correct, how do you get to work?....you drive anyway. Since you can't renew the tag, they tow the car if you get pulled over. Lately, they have allowed these 'deadbeats' to make payment arrangements and get their license back, but don't miss a payment.

The child support issue is the largest problem by far. During the divorce an amount was decided. After the man loses his job (in this economy) he should have filed a 'MODIFICATION of SUPPORT' to lower the payments. Many men don't have the skills to do that. The result is this amount of arrears grows beyond being realistic and can run into the 10s of thousands. A friend I know owed $54,000 in back support. :eek:

But this still is not criminal and won't prevent a DROS from being approved.

Be well, Bob




be connected with your driver's lic.

And, yeah, that makes total sense, if a guy is short money for child support, lets take away his lic. so he loses his job.

And it seems like so many lower paying jobs REQUIRE a valid DL.

If "the court" finds he is sitting on a phat stack and just refusing to pay due to War With Wife THEN sure put him "on ice" until he finds his checkbook or tow his Ferrari, but I digress.

BUT if those tax liens somehow convert to criminal charge.....???

freonr22
03-30-2012, 5:49 PM
WRONG. If you have unpaid child support or alimony, ad your CDL is suspended, you can not use your CID to purchase a firearm, mainly, because it's the same number. I just called the CA DOJ, and confirmed that you can still buy a firearm with a tax lien under your name. Thanks for playing champ. If you'd like to confirm, their number is (916) 227-7527 (firearms div).

Jerry

If I chose to let my cdl expire for instance, it is not a valid ID. My California ID is still valid... One has nothing to do with the other. Many people dros w/ id is my point, whether or not have a valid lic. In some cases.

RustyMacHine
03-30-2012, 8:57 PM
The State won't pull a DL for unpaid taxes. They will suspend a DL for unpaid Child Support or Alimony. However, that would still have nothing to do with a DROS or becoming a prohibited person. Nothing at all.

The only possible problem would be the buyer would have to use a California ID card instead of a Drivers License as a form of ID. Not a big deal to get a California ID card. I have both as well.

Be well, Bob

I don't get this.

Using an ID instead of your DL won't get you denied from purchasing a firearm, if your driving privilege has been suspended ?

My ID and my DL have the same info and the same exact numbers.


What makes it so different/ another way around it?
.



.

freonr22
03-30-2012, 9:13 PM
One is a valid Id, one is not. Depending on your reason for suspension, makes you prohibited or not. Say you had a suspended lic from a std non injury misdemeanor DUI, but we're in compliance with the court and DMV and have a current id, Id good, cdl not. Equals non prohibited, but good Id equals ok to buy. just not drive.


Say you have a felony DUI. equals cdl invalid form of id, Id still valid, but prohibited. Or something like that.

Oceanbob
03-30-2012, 9:14 PM
I don't get this.

Using an ID instead of your DL won't get you denied from purchasing a firearm, if your driving privilege has been suspended ?

My ID and my DL have the same info and the same exact numbers.


What makes it so different/ another way around it?
..

If your DL suspension isn't a felony or even related to being a prohibited person. Why should it matter.?

Who cares what the numbers are?

Copy and Paste: To buy a gun

You must have a valid CA Driverís License or CA ID Card and you must bring a copy of other documentation indicating that you are a CA resident. Acceptable documentation includes a utility bill from within the last three months, a residential lease, auto registration, a property deed,or military permanent duty station orders indicating assignment within California. Unacceptable documentation includes, but is not limited to, a passport, an account statement from a financial institution, and a pay stub.

Prohibited persons: (copy and paste)

State of CA Firearms Prohibiting Categories

Unless otherwise stated, if you fall into any of the following categories you are prohibited from possessing a firearm in CA for life.

Person convicted of a felony or any offense in section 12021.1 of the Penal Code.
Person who is a fugitive from justice.
Person while under indictment for just about anything.
Person whoís addicted to drugs.
Person denied a firearm as a condition of probation.
Juveniles who are or were wards of the juvenile court because of some crime they committed canít own a firearm until they reach age 30.
Person who has just about any kind of restraining order filed against them canít possess a firearm while the restraining order is in effect.
Person found by a court to be mentally incompetent to stand trial, found not guilty to some crime by reason of insanity, or found to be a mentally disordered sex offender.
Person placed under a conservatorship because of a mental disorder or alcoholism.
Person who communicates a threat to a licensed psychotherapist against someone else and the psychotherapist reports it to law enforcement is prohibited from possessing a firearm for the next six months.
Person taken into custody as a danger to self or others and committed to a mental health facility is prohibited from possessing a firearm for the next 5 years.
Person who is a voluntary patient in a mental health facility is prohibited from possessing a firearm between admission and release.
Firearms Prohibiting Misdemeanors

Any person convicted of any of the following misdemeanors is prohibited from owning a firearm in CA for 10 years following the conviction.

Threatening public officers, public employees, school officials, public appointees, judges or their staff or immediate families.
Intimidating witnesses or victims.
Attempting to take a firearm away from a police officer.
Unauthorized possession of just about any kind of weapon in a state or local public building or at a public meeting.
Possessing a loaded firearm within the state capitol or legislative offices.
Possessing a loaded firearm within the governorís mansion or the residence or any other constitutional officer.
Providing a firearm to a person for use by a criminal street gang.
Assault or battery on anyone.
Assault with a stun gun, taser, deadly weapon, or any instrument likely to produce great bodily injury.
Shooting at an inhabited dwelling or just plain grossly negligent discharge of a firearm.
Willful infliction of physical injury on a spouse, former spouse, cohabitant, former cohabitant, or the mother or father of a child of one of these people.
Violation of a court order against harassment, disturbing the peace, threats or acts of violence, or violating a domestic protective/restraining order.
Drawing, exhibiting, or using any deadly weapon other than a firearm for any reason except self-defense.
Drawing or exhibiting a firearm in the presence of a police officer.
Purchasing, selling, manufacturing, shipping, transporting, distributing, or receiving an imitation firearm. This does not include obvious toys.
Inflicting serious bodily injury by drawing or exhibiting a firearm or any other deadly weapon.
Threatening to commit any crime that might result in the death or great bodily injury to another person.
Possessing a firearm in a school zone or on school grounds.
Willfully, maliciously, and repeatedly following or harassing another person (stalking).
Carrying a loaded firearm with the intent to commit a felony.
Possessing any deadly weapon with the intent to assault anyone.
Allowing a firearm in or to be discharged from a motor vehicle that you own or are driving (no matter who in the vehicle has possession of the firearm).
Criminal possession of a firearm in public while wearing a mask.
Unauthorized possession, transportation, manufacture, or sale of a machinegun.
Possession of armor piercing ammunition.
Carrying a concealed or loaded firearm or any deadly weapon or wearing a police uniform while picketing. (Does this include real cops?)
Bringing or sending contraband into or possessing contraband within a juvenile or youth authority institution. (Contraband could be a pack of cigarettes)
Firearms prohibitions as specified in sections 8100, 8101, & 8103 of the Welfare and Institutions Code (You gotta look this up yourself).


****

Having or not having a DL has nothing to do with buying a gun.

Be well, Bob

RustyMacHine
03-30-2012, 9:29 PM
If your DL suspension isn't a felony or even related to being a prohibited person. Why should it matter.?

Who cares what the numbers are?

Copy and Paste: To buy a gun

You must have a valid CA Driverís License or CA ID Card and you must bring a copy of other documentation indicating that you are a CA resident. Acceptable documentation includes a utility bill from within the last three months, a residential lease, auto registration, a property deed,or military permanent duty station orders indicating assignment within California. Unacceptable documentation includes, but is not limited to, a passport, an account statement from a financial institution, and a pay stub.

Prohibited persons: (copy and paste)

State of CA Firearms Prohibiting Categories

Unless otherwise stated, if you fall into any of the following categories you are prohibited from possessing a firearm in CA for life.

Person convicted of a felony or any offense in section 12021.1 of the Penal Code.
Person who is a fugitive from justice.
Person while under indictment for just about anything.
Person whoís addicted to drugs.
Person denied a firearm as a condition of probation.
Juveniles who are or were wards of the juvenile court because of some crime they committed canít own a firearm until they reach age 30.
Person who has just about any kind of restraining order filed against them canít possess a firearm while the restraining order is in effect.
Person found by a court to be mentally incompetent to stand trial, found not guilty to some crime by reason of insanity, or found to be a mentally disordered sex offender.
Person placed under a conservatorship because of a mental disorder or alcoholism.
Person who communicates a threat to a licensed psychotherapist against someone else and the psychotherapist reports it to law enforcement is prohibited from possessing a firearm for the next six months.
Person taken into custody as a danger to self or others and committed to a mental health facility is prohibited from possessing a firearm for the next 5 years.
Person who is a voluntary patient in a mental health facility is prohibited from possessing a firearm between admission and release.
Firearms Prohibiting Misdemeanors

Any person convicted of any of the following misdemeanors is prohibited from owning a firearm in CA for 10 years following the conviction.

Threatening public officers, public employees, school officials, public appointees, judges or their staff or immediate families.
Intimidating witnesses or victims.
Attempting to take a firearm away from a police officer.
Unauthorized possession of just about any kind of weapon in a state or local public building or at a public meeting.
Possessing a loaded firearm within the state capitol or legislative offices.
Possessing a loaded firearm within the governorís mansion or the residence or any other constitutional officer.
Providing a firearm to a person for use by a criminal street gang.
Assault or battery on anyone.
Assault with a stun gun, taser, deadly weapon, or any instrument likely to produce great bodily injury.
Shooting at an inhabited dwelling or just plain grossly negligent discharge of a firearm.
Willful infliction of physical injury on a spouse, former spouse, cohabitant, former cohabitant, or the mother or father of a child of one of these people.
Violation of a court order against harassment, disturbing the peace, threats or acts of violence, or violating a domestic protective/restraining order.
Drawing, exhibiting, or using any deadly weapon other than a firearm for any reason except self-defense.
Drawing or exhibiting a firearm in the presence of a police officer.
Purchasing, selling, manufacturing, shipping, transporting, distributing, or receiving an imitation firearm. This does not include obvious toys.
Inflicting serious bodily injury by drawing or exhibiting a firearm or any other deadly weapon.
Threatening to commit any crime that might result in the death or great bodily injury to another person.
Possessing a firearm in a school zone or on school grounds.
Willfully, maliciously, and repeatedly following or harassing another person (stalking).
Carrying a loaded firearm with the intent to commit a felony.
Possessing any deadly weapon with the intent to assault anyone.
Allowing a firearm in or to be discharged from a motor vehicle that you own or are driving (no matter who in the vehicle has possession of the firearm).
Criminal possession of a firearm in public while wearing a mask.
Unauthorized possession, transportation, manufacture, or sale of a machinegun.
Possession of armor piercing ammunition.
Carrying a concealed or loaded firearm or any deadly weapon or wearing a police uniform while picketing. (Does this include real cops?)
Bringing or sending contraband into or possessing contraband within a juvenile or youth authority institution. (Contraband could be a pack of cigarettes)
Firearms prohibitions as specified in sections 8100, 8101, & 8103 of the Welfare and Institutions Code (You gotta look this up yourself).


****

Having or not having a DL has nothing to do with buying a gun.

Be well, Bob

My DL isn't suspended and I do have both DL and ID.
Last year I was trying to sell a gun and the potential buyer just got a DUI (no he didn't buy the gun) The reason I asked was because you seemed knowledgeable enough and that way I can steer people in the right direction if they have the same issue... Don't be Mad.:p

Thanks for the info.:)
.