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View Full Version : SB 1569 (Fuller) 2012: 10-day wait cut to 3 days


Librarian
02-25-2012, 6:26 PM
http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/cgi-bin/postquery?bill_number=sb_1569&sess=CUR&house=B&author=fuller

SB 1569, as introduced, Fuller. Firearms: waiting period.
Existing law prohibits a dealer from delivering a firearm to a
person within 10 days of the application to purchase or submission to
the Department of Justice of the information and fees required to
determine eligibility to own or possess a firearm. Violation of this
provision is a misdemeanor. Existing law requires a dealer to be
licensed to sell firearms, which license is subject to forfeiture if
the dealer delivers a firearm within the 10-day waiting period.
This bill would, instead, require a 72-hour waiting period for the
above provisions.

TNP'R
02-25-2012, 6:27 PM
http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/cgi-bin/postquery?bill_number=sb_1569&sess=CUR&house=B&author=fuller

That would be awesome. Would like to see it cut to instant checks though but still this would be a better than 10 days.

valkylrie
02-25-2012, 6:29 PM
Agreed.

wilit
02-25-2012, 6:31 PM
Well, definitely a step in the right direction. Unfortunately, I don't think this has a snowballs chance in hell of passing, but here's hoping for the best.

CitaDeL
02-25-2012, 6:53 PM
To quote Homer,... "Three days? But, I'm mad now...

jbolton
02-25-2012, 6:58 PM
What a joke. Should read second purchase- same day pick up. Even for the first.

Ubermcoupe
02-25-2012, 7:18 PM
Would like to see it cut to instant checks ... That would be awesome.

Had to re-order it for you. :thumbsup:

While I agree 3 days is better than 10, and it is a step in the right direction, I would rather see the wait struck down to instant (just like in “free” states).

I think we have a solid case (http://www.calgunsfoundation.org/news-blog/blog/entry/cgf-sues-california-over-unconstitutional-waiting-periods-publishes-legal-analysis-of-ab-144.html) in challenge to the 10 day wait already and support that.

If instant background checks for all purchases were not an option, I would rather see 10 days waits for first purchase and instant checks for every purchase after
vs
3 day waits for every gun.

I like to look at it like this:

Joe in LA wants to sell a Python in pristine condition for $500. I can book a last minute flight via SWA for $100 bucks, only take half a day of work off and come out ahead.
If I had to make two trips, three days apart I loose out on at least two half days of work and have to take two SWA flights.

If all they do is conduct an instant background check why should I wait 3 days? Just so some legislator can “feel better” about it?

socal2310
02-25-2012, 8:17 PM
I agree, I wonder if this might reduce the support for a challenge to the waiting period for those who already own firearms. Just waiting to hear from the legal eagles.

Ryan

zhyla
02-25-2012, 8:32 PM
It's still two trips to a dealer. Still two long drives for a PPT of that gun you just have to have. I'm not even sure the reason for the change. Trying to throw us a bone?

Connor P Price
02-25-2012, 8:41 PM
It's still two trips to a dealer. Still two long drives for a PPT of that gun you just have to have. I'm not even sure the reason for the change. Trying to throw us a bone?

This!

Especially in such a long state having to make two trips makes it hard to purchase guns that are far away. The wait needs to be gone, not shorter.

SilverTauron
02-25-2012, 8:51 PM
Here is a fact I find peculiar.

Illinois has a 72 hour waiting period in place for handgun sales .Which is the period of time this bill would propose for California.This connection may be relevant in light of Rep. Dan Lundgren's comment that Illinois is a "sister state to California for common sense gun laws".

sofbak
02-25-2012, 11:03 PM
this is at least a step in the right direction, but I'm waiting on some "movement" on this silly-azz "1 in 30" law. I'm buying a matched pair of revolvers soon, and I just realized that it will be at least 40 days, and FOUR trips to the dealer to get it done! How asinine is this?

I have a C&R, but I'll be damned and doomed if I'm going to pay this crappy state more "ransom" for a COE.........

Quiet
02-25-2012, 11:41 PM
Three day waiting period, so we are going back to how it was in 1955.

erik_26
02-26-2012, 7:04 AM
As others said, 3 is better than 10... but still not as sweet as 0.

Mesa Tactical
02-26-2012, 7:07 AM
Well, definitely a step in the right direction. Unfortunately, I don't think this has a snowballs chance in hell of passing, but here's hoping for the best.

I dunno. California's wait period used to be 15 days . . .

zinfull
02-26-2012, 8:16 AM
3, 10, 20 or more it is still a 2 trip to the store problem. That still means you have to buy in the area you live in or spend a lot of money on travel. It is just a bone and does nothing but say "We gave you something so shut up".

jerry

halifax
02-26-2012, 8:23 AM
It's still two trips to a dealer. Still two long drives for a PPT of that gun you just have to have. I'm not even sure the reason for the change. Trying to throw us a bone?

3, 10, 20 or more it is still a 2 trip to the store problem. That still means you have to buy in the area you live in or spend a lot of money on travel. It is just a bone and does nothing but say "We gave you something so shut up".

jerry

Yep

Meh, nothing to see here, move along.

Arondos
02-26-2012, 8:42 AM
In this whacko state we just need to approach this as an environmental issue.

We can cut greenhouse gas emissions if we can make one trip to the gun store to buy a gun instead of two. Think of the improvement in air quality, the children and endangered species that will be saved! :rolleyes:

barthel
02-26-2012, 12:22 PM
In this whacko state we just need to approach this as an environmental issue.

We can cut greenhouse gas emissions if we can make one trip to the gun store to buy a gun instead of two. Think of the improvement in air quality, the children and endangered species that will be saved! :rolleyes:

Lovin' this!!!!!!;)

Gray Peterson
02-26-2012, 1:10 PM
3, 10, 20 or more it is still a 2 trip to the store problem. That still means you have to buy in the area you live in or spend a lot of money on travel. It is just a bone and does nothing but say "We gave you something so shut up".

jerry

3 day waiting period versus 10 days will encourage sales for normal casual gun owners. Don't cut off nose despite face.

littlejake
02-26-2012, 1:25 PM
That would indeed be a step in the right direction. Although the purpose of NICS was to be the National Instant Check System.

Still, better that the 5 day wait back in '69 when I bought my first HG. It went from 5 to 15 then down to 10. So, there is some history of Sacramento retreating on the waiting period.

Bolillo
02-26-2012, 1:43 PM
3, 10, 20 or more it is still a 2 trip to the store problem. That still means you have to buy in the area you live in or spend a lot of money on travel. It is just a bone and does nothing but say "We gave you something so shut up".

jerry


Makes things a bit easier for buying in CA. I drive SF Bay Area -> LA to visit in-laws a few times a year. 72 hour waits means I can buy something over a long weekend. Ten day wait means I don't buy, since I don't ever stay with in-laws for that long and don't go often enough to complete a DROS within 30 days. Or, I find some some shooting iron in Sacramento while on my way up to Tahoe. I can pick it up on the way back from Tahoe just a few days later and not have to make a special trip after 10 days.

It's not "instant" yet, but 3 days is much more manageable. Better for CA FFLs, since they are going to get more impulse buys.

Ubermcoupe
02-26-2012, 1:54 PM
3 day waiting period versus 10 days will encourage sales for normal casual gun owners.

Gray,

I disagree.

Avg. CA Joe citizen, who may only be interested in one pistol and one shotgun, and maybe a hunting rifle won’t care.

Avg Joe will fill out his paperwork, go back to his life for 10-12-15 days, probably forget about picking up the gun, and then go “Oh Yeah, I have that home defense tool to go pick up.”

Knocking it down to a 3day wait can only help encourage collectors/aficionados/guys who need “x" to buy more; Guys/gals like me :thumbsup:

NytWolf
02-26-2012, 2:35 PM
Wow! Although it's not entirely perfect, at least it is positive legislation.

monk
02-26-2012, 2:50 PM
Couple of pro-gun bills being presented is always a good thing.

chillincody
02-26-2012, 3:10 PM
there was really a 15 day wait before ??? jebus christ If thats the case then im gonna look at this postively .if it can go 15. 10 to 3 which is a good sign still wont be worth it for a long drive and dros but might get other people to buy guns that was what kept me from buying was waiting 10 days,, so lets all stay positiv about this : )

Curley Red
02-26-2012, 3:16 PM
I believe it was Ronald Reagan that gave as the 15 day wait. Didn't it happen around when he took away our right to open carry loaded.

glockman19
02-26-2012, 4:00 PM
Nice but...If you already own a firearm you shouldn't have to wait any longer than it takes to DROS & NICS...what is that? an hour or less?

What "cool down period" does a multiple gun owner need?

Sunday
02-26-2012, 4:22 PM
Nice but...If you already own a firearm you shouldn't have to wait any longer than it takes to DROS & NICS...what is that? an hour or less?

What "cool down period" does a multiple gun owner need? It a dumb down period for those who don't realize people can sometimes own more than one gun!!!

vincnet11
02-26-2012, 4:34 PM
If it passes I wonder how many years it takes before it goes into effect.

Librarian
02-26-2012, 4:40 PM
If it passes I wonder how many years it takes before it goes into effect.

Unless otherwise specified in the bill, those that become law are effective the following January 1.

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=161873

watsonville
02-26-2012, 6:49 PM
Would also prefer instant check after initial firearm purchase over 3 day wait that the government allows but if it passes I won't complain

dustoff31
02-26-2012, 7:23 PM
I believe it was Ronald Reagan that gave as the 15 day wait. Didn't it happen around when he took away our right to open carry loaded.

Nope. It was Gov. Moonbeam. Took effect in 1976, IIRC.

wilit
02-26-2012, 8:22 PM
California has also had a waiting period for handgun sales since at least 1923. The California Legislature increased the handgun waiting period from one to three days in 1955, to five days in 1965, and to the current 15 days in 1975. [2] Figure 1, "California Handgun Waiting Periods & Murder Rates" plots the murder rate per 100,000 Californians during the period 1952 through 1990. [3] (The use of a murder *rate*, which counts murders relative to the size of the population, eliminates changes in the number of murders caused by changes in the number of people living in California.)

The increase from one to three days in 1955, and from three to five days in 1965, had no apparent effect on rising murder rates. Indeed, the California murder rate went from a bit above 2/100,000 people in 1952, to over 10/100,000 by 1975. While it is certainly true that murder rates rose throughout the United States during this period, as Figure 1 shows, California's murder rate rose *even faster* than the murder rate for the rest of the United States.

The first full year of the fifteen day waiting period, 1976, showed a 1% decline in murder rates - followed by continually rising murder rates, peaking in 1980. In fact, murder rates didn't start to decline until 1981, five full years after the new waiting period took effect. Can the advocates of waiting periods take heart from the fact that California's murder rates *eventually* fell?

http://www.firearmsandliberty.com/cramer.waiting.html

So, here's a summary.
1923-1955, 1 day waiting period.
1955-1975, 3 day waiting period
1975-1997?, 15 day waiting period
1997?-Present, 10 day waiting period (dropped to 10 days with the addition of NICS)

ArcherDog
02-26-2012, 8:36 PM
I was watching Terminator tonight and the gun store owner mentioned the 15-day waiting period for the 1911 Arnold was trying to get. The rifles (including an Uzi) had zero waiting period. I thoiught that was for the movie, but I guess that was the law in 1983/4

hoffmang
02-26-2012, 9:48 PM
This is part of a co-ordinated strategy. The Silvester case makes the point that a waiting period for those with guns already is unconstitutional and irrational. Combined with this, should it pass, then one would have to wait 72 hours for the first gun and never again thereafter.

-Gene

Echidin
02-26-2012, 9:48 PM
Gray,

I disagree.

Avg. CA Joe citizen, who may only be interested in one pistol and one shotgun, and maybe a hunting rifle won’t care.

Avg Joe will fill out his paperwork, go back to his life for 10-12-15 days, probably forget about picking up the gun, and then go “Oh Yeah, I have that home defense tool to go pick up.”

Knocking it down to a 3day wait can only help encourage collectors/aficionados/guys who need “x" to buy more; Guys/gals like me :thumbsup:

I don't know anyone who doesn't think about picking up their firearm at least a couple times a day during their 10 day wait, just saying.

SmellOfCordite
02-26-2012, 11:17 PM
I am keeping my fingers crossed on this. I have a feeling that this could potentially devastate my bank account since impulse buys would be at an all time high. Especially since I don't have to plan for the 10 day wait, hmmm.

Zues
02-26-2012, 11:27 PM
not instant but still better than 10 days

SilverTauron
02-27-2012, 5:21 AM
I am keeping my fingers crossed on this. I have a feeling that this could potentially devastate my bank account since impulse buys would be at an all time high. Especially since I don't have to plan for the 10 day wait, hmmm.

Don't get too worried for your bank account just yet, as the BATFE requires a special report anytime someone buys two handguns from the same FFL within a 7 day period. I forget the form number off the top of my head, but the serial # and make of the pistols are required for submission.

BroncoBob
02-27-2012, 5:53 AM
This is part of a co-ordinated strategy. The Silvester case makes the point that a waiting period for those with guns already is unconstitutional and irrational. Combined with this, should it pass, then one would have to wait 72 hours for the first gun and never again thereafter.

-Gene

This ^^^^^

joe_sun
02-27-2012, 6:19 AM
This is part of a co-ordinated strategy. The Silvester case makes the point that a waiting period for those with guns already is unconstitutional and irrational. Combined with this, should it pass, then one would have to wait 72 hours for the first gun and never again thereafter.

-Gene

I hope so Gene but every time I see a pro gun bill I remember what happened to AB 613. These people voted against removing language in the Penal Code that was deemed unconstitutional by the courts. How irrational is that. :facepalm:

BobB35
02-27-2012, 6:31 AM
will not pass

ke6guj
02-27-2012, 6:52 AM
Don't get too worried for your bank account just yet, as the BATFE requires a special report anytime someone buys two handguns from the same FFL within a 7 day period. I forget the form number off the top of my head, but the serial # and make of the pistols are required for submission.

so, that doesn't mean that you wouldn't be able to buy as often as you want, just that you would be "added to a list". I'm on enough lists already that one more won't hurt.

1859sharps
02-27-2012, 8:47 AM
http://www.firearmsandliberty.com/cramer.waiting.html

So, here's a summary.
1923-1955, 1 day waiting period.
1955-1975, 3 day waiting period
1975-1997?, 15 day waiting period
1997?-Present, 10 day waiting period (dropped to 10 days with the addition of NICS)

actually I seem to remember a brief period where the handgun wait jump to 20 days I believe it was. was not a legislative change, but an administrative change by the DOJ. this was early to mid 90's while the DROS Forms were still being mailed and just before things went electronic, but pre NICS.

We got to the point we are by mostly small incremental advances in anti gun laws. I am OK...VERY ok with reversing in small incremental advances in PRO Gun laws. makes things less scary to a lot of people. So, here is hoping the wait drops to 3 days.

Ultimately no wait period is ideal, but hey...3 days is a GREAT start in that direction.

stix213
02-27-2012, 9:25 AM
I don't think this will pass without throwing a bone to the anti's

Ubermcoupe
02-27-2012, 11:28 AM
I don't know anyone who doesn't think about picking up their firearm at least a couple times a day during their 10 day wait, just saying.

True for you and me, but for someone like my neighbor who is only interested in his one HD pistol... :shrug:

Hopalong
02-27-2012, 11:32 AM
So we go from "really silly" to, "silly light"?

Thanks, but no thanks.

BigFatGuy
02-27-2012, 11:39 AM
Really, guys? If it can't be exactly the way you want, then it should be as horrible as it can be?

I guess in the 60's the Black civil rights movement should have just given up until we got a Black president, because what's the point before that?

The womens' civil rights movement has been a useless failure because we still haven't had a woman as president, right?

Rights get taken away in tiny pieces, we are using the PROVEN STRATEGY against them to take the rights back.

kemasa
02-27-2012, 11:41 AM
Don't get too worried for your bank account just yet, as the BATFE requires a special report anytime someone buys two handguns from the same FFL within a 7 day period. I forget the form number off the top of my head, but the serial # and make of the pistols are required for submission.

Incorrect.

The reporting is 5 business days of the FFL, meaning that if the FFL is only open one day per week, then it would be 5 weeks. The form is atf-f-3310-4

Also, in "border" states there is a requirement to report the purchase of semi-auto rifles with a caliber greater than .22, which include CA.

The reporting does not really mean anything (other than being annoying). It does not prevent you from buying firearms or anything else. The CA DOJ knows what you bought as well. You can buy from different FFLs and it will not get reported.

berto
02-27-2012, 11:50 AM
Instant check. I'm willing to concede a wait for the first gun.

The second trip to the FFL chills commerce whether it's the next day, three days, or 10 days. Gas, driving time, tolls, etc. all eat into any savings and discourage commerce.

I support this bill as better than what we have and hope the strategy Gene mentioned eventually yields instant checks.

kemasa
02-27-2012, 11:56 AM
http://www.firearmsandliberty.com/cramer.waiting.html

So, here's a summary.
1923-1955, 1 day waiting period.
1955-1975, 3 day waiting period
1975-1997?, 15 day waiting period
1997?-Present, 10 day waiting period (dropped to 10 days with the addition of NICS)

Not quite correct. There was never a 15 day waiting really. It was 10 days and 5 days for mailing in the DROS form USPS. This is why the waiting period is 10 days since the mail is no longer used.

1859sharps
02-27-2012, 12:11 PM
So we go from "really silly" to, "silly light"?

Thanks, but no thanks.

so you would rather piss and moan about a 10 day wait than take a step that improves the situation?

IF it's the right thing to support this, and if it passes.....that in NO way means we can't then come back another day with a new plan to get zero wait.

when the anti gun groups passed the first AWB it didn't go as far as they wanted....so they came back another day, got a little bit more, then came back the "next day" and got some more, then came back yet another day and a little bit more and so on. Same with the handgun roster and more.

Nothing wrong with reversing a little bit at a time. too many in the 2nd camp think the win needs to be all or nothing or it's of no value or a sell out or some other BS issue.

I would LOVE to have a single lawsuit win or a single super bill pass that fixes everything in one quick sweeping action. Not going to happen...that isn't real life. So, we need to take our wins where we can, and then come back the next day to build on that previous win until things are fixed.

Wherryj
02-27-2012, 3:54 PM
Gray,

I disagree.

Avg. CA Joe citizen, who may only be interested in one pistol and one shotgun, and maybe a hunting rifle won’t care.

Avg Joe will fill out his paperwork, go back to his life for 10-12-15 days, probably forget about picking up the gun, and then go “Oh Yeah, I have that home defense tool to go pick up.”

Knocking it down to a 3day wait can only help encourage collectors/aficionados/guys who need “x" to buy more; Guys/gals like me :thumbsup:

Firearms are like potato chips. Who can have just one?

adamsreeftank
02-27-2012, 3:59 PM
I hate the fact that if I'm driving somewhere away from home and decide to stop into a local gun shop, I can't buy any consignent or used handguns since I won't be back in the area within a month, if ever. This really hurts the gun shops in small towns. I might plan a road trip to visit a few shops if we were a cash and carry state. If nothing else, you would think a CCW would be an exemption to the wait.

SilverTauron
02-27-2012, 4:07 PM
Incorrect.

The reporting is 5 business days of the FFL, meaning that if the FFL is only open one day per week, then it would be 5 weeks. The form is atf-f-3310-4


At my FFL, they are open 5 days a week. Thus =7 days between purchases.You are correct on the letter of the law however.



The reporting does not really mean anything (other than being annoying). It does not prevent you from buying firearms or anything else. The CA DOJ knows what you bought as well. You can buy from different FFLs and it will not get reported.

The BATFE requires the specific serial number and model of handgun when submitting the 3310.4 document, which is information I would rather make them earn their pay to acquire.

kemasa
02-27-2012, 4:25 PM
At my FFL, they are open 5 days a week. Thus =7 days between purchases.You are correct on the letter of the law however.


Yes, from that one FFL. The reporting requirement is based on that for that one FFL. You can go and buy handguns from multiple FFLs and it won't get (directly) reported to the BATF.


The BATFE requires the specific serial number and model of handgun when submitting the 3310.4 document, which is information I would rather make them earn their pay to acquire.

That is funny. You don't think that they get the information from the CA DOJ? When I had an inspection, they had all the information regarding multiple purchases from the CA DOJ. Since all the information gets reported to the CA DOJ, FFL is CA should not have to report it to the BATF at all.

Then again, that would assume a reasonable law, which seems to be a contradiction in terms :-).

Darklyte27
02-27-2012, 6:46 PM
Criminals will be happy to hear this, instead of waiting 10 days to hurt/murder/rape/rob you they will only have to wait 3.

glockman19
02-27-2012, 10:03 PM
This is part of a co-ordinated strategy. The Silvester case makes the point that a waiting period for those with guns already is unconstitutional and irrational. Combined with this, should it pass, then one would have to wait 72 hours for the first gun and never again thereafter.

-Gene

Much more palatable.

Mesa Tactical
02-28-2012, 5:39 AM
so you would rather piss and moan about a 10 day wait than take a step that improves the situation?

Welcome to the gun rights movement, 1859sharps!

microwaveguy
02-28-2012, 5:51 AM
Criminals will be happy to hear this, instead of waiting 10 days to hurt/murder/rape/rob you they will only have to wait 3.

Since when do these criminals buy from an FFL and do a backround check ?

jmlivingston
02-28-2012, 6:00 AM
With a 3 day wait, if I purchase a gun early in the week I can have it in hand for a trip to the range that weekend. Still want it gone, but 3 days is much better than what we have now.

amtz.zero
02-28-2012, 9:36 AM
Since when do these criminals buy from an FFL and do a backround check ?

I think what he means is that during the 10 or 3 day wait, you are not protected from criminals, and they won't wait around during the waiting period to go and rob/kill/rape you.

NorCalDustin
02-28-2012, 9:55 AM
Really, guys? If it can't be exactly the way you want, then it should be as horrible as it can be?

I guess in the 60's the Black civil rights movement should have just given up until we got a Black president, because what's the point before that?

The womens' civil rights movement has been a useless failure because we still haven't had a woman as president, right?

Rights get taken away in tiny pieces, we are using the PROVEN STRATEGY against them to take the rights back.
I'm also getting a little sick of that attitude... Sometimes the only way to affect change is slowly and incrementally.

kemasa
02-28-2012, 9:58 AM
I think what he means is that during the 10 or 3 day wait, you are not protected from criminals, and they won't wait around during the waiting period to go and rob/kill/rape you.

No, since he said that criminals would only have to wait three days to hurt you.

Quite clearly a person who doesn't get that criminals can't legally buy firearms, so the waiting period does not concern them. People illegally selling firearms don't have a waiting period, it is cash and carry.

There are many, including firearms owners, who have bought into the lies of the liberals and the media. The waiting period only negatively affects the law abiding, such a person being threatened by a criminal, but they are not able to get a firearm and the police won't provide protection until the person is under attack, which is far too late, but the police can do a report afterwards and notify the next of kin.

Uxi
02-28-2012, 10:46 AM
This is part of a co-ordinated strategy. The Silvester case makes the point that a waiting period for those with guns already is unconstitutional and irrational. Combined with this, should it pass, then one would have to wait 72 hours for the first gun and never again thereafter.


I can live with that.

HaloFire
04-03-2012, 6:18 PM
In this whacko state we just need to approach this as an environmental issue.

We can cut greenhouse gas emissions if we can make one trip to the gun store to buy a gun instead of two. Think of the improvement in air quality, the children and endangered species that will be saved! :rolleyes:

Fellas,

We gotta learn how to spin better. Arondos only has part of it.

The biggest argument against a 10 day wait period is simple. The state is endorsing murder 1.

Look, if someone gets pissed off and in the heat of passion buys a gun and kills someone else, they haven't had much time to prepare (they're liable to make mistakes and get caught).

But if you make them wait ten days, some may cool off, others may not...

Now that same individual has 10 days to think of how NOT to get caught while committing murder. The state has a better chance of catching someone when they're not in the right of mind committing a crime, someone who's had the opportunity to ferment and plan out a crime is much more dangerous.

See...

monk
04-03-2012, 6:45 PM
Not quite correct. There was never a 15 day waiting really. It was 10 days and 5 days for mailing in the DROS form USPS. This is why the waiting period is 10 days since the mail is no longer used.

That's what I thought.

REH
04-03-2012, 7:14 PM
In this whacko state we just need to approach this as an environmental issue.

We can cut greenhouse gas emissions if we can make one trip to the gun store to buy a gun instead of two. Think of the improvement in air quality, the children and endangered species that will be saved! :rolleyes:

Very good.......................

Wrangler John
04-04-2012, 3:58 AM
I don't know anyone who doesn't think about picking up their firearm at least a couple times a day during their 10 day wait, just saying.

Meet the Wrangler. Being gray of hair and experienced in life enough to measure suture lines in feet rather than inches, and having two safes for firearm storage, you now know someone who doesn't think about picking up their firearm a couple of times a day. In fact, I forgot about the last one for twelve days until Mrs. Wrangler, ever the champion personal assistant, checked my calendar.

The older one becomes, the less anticipation plays in our lives. Too often an eagerly anticipated gun has proven to be not so great, such as the Model 29 that had a defective trigger rebound slide, or the Remington 700 Varmint rifle that came with a warped stock. I will admit that back in 1962 the three weeks it took for Ye Olde Hunter to ship me a cosmoline entombed 1917 Enfield via Railway Express seemed a lifetime. But I was a just a kid then, prone to excitement and wonder for how things worked.

Be patient, all this stuff doesn't mean anything anyway. Real happiness is found elsewhere. :)

OleCuss
04-04-2012, 5:44 AM
And here I thought happiness was only found at the range with a new firearm! What have I been missing all these years? ;)

In truth, a 10 day wait has never really bothered me personally. But in principle it is just wrong. And if I were in different circumstances it might be a real bother.

Consider if I got an invitation to go on a hunting trip tomorrow and I had to supply the firearm? I have no one who will loan me a suitable firearm and the right firearm is in my friendly gun shop down the street? Why should I have to wait 10 days or more in order to get the firearm and then be able to hunt? Is the state saying that in order to take advantage of unanticipated opportunities I must start purchasing a wide array of firearms in order to meet any possible contingencies?

And no, I don't hunt.

One other thing? Isn't the 10 day waiting period effectively a "prior restraint"? I am first restricted from exercising my RKBA for a defined period of time - and then my right becomes magically available based on absolutely no criterion at all other than I waited 10 days?

Sort of like saying, you object to something a POTUS is going to do 2 days from now. No problem, you can speak out against that policy/action, you just have to wait until 8 days after the action or policy is completed and then you can object when that objection is now meaningless?

It's a really idiotic way to deal with a fundamental right.

BigDogatPlay
04-04-2012, 5:48 AM
Not quite correct. There was never a 15 day waiting really. It was 10 days and 5 days for mailing in the DROS form USPS. This is why the waiting period is 10 days since the mail is no longer used.

While the above is technically correct, speaking as someone who started purchasing in 1976, it was functionally a 15 day wait for handguns then. Several I still own spent 15 days in jail back then.

A copy of the handgun DROS paperwork also had to be mailed to the CLEO in your city of residence... I filed a lot of them when I was a young dispatcher.

MadMax
04-04-2012, 6:17 AM
I will take it with a yes please. Any step in the right direction is just that, a step in the RIGHT direction.

kemasa
04-04-2012, 8:07 AM
While the above is technically correct, speaking as someone who started purchasing in 1976, it was functionally a 15 day wait for handguns then. Several I still own spent 15 days in jail back then.


Yes, that is true, but it is important to be technically correct and understand what it really was, rather than thinking that it was 15 days, then was reduced to 10 days.

I sent in many DROS forms and they wanted them mailed by the end of the day, which was annoying as it would have been much easier to mail it the next morning.

darkwater
04-26-2012, 8:16 AM
Failed to get out of committee

CURRENT BILL STATUS


MEASURE : S.B. No. 1569
AUTHOR(S) : Fuller.
TOPIC : Firearms: waiting period.

TYPE OF BILL :
Inactive
Non-Urgency
Non-Appropriations
Majority Vote Required
Non-State-Mandated Local Program
Fiscal
Non-Tax Levy

LAST HIST. ACT. DATE: 04/24/2012
LAST HIST. ACTION : Set, first hearing. Failed passage in committee.
COMM. LOCATION : SEN PUBLIC SAFETY

TITLE : An act to amend Sections 26815 and 27540 of the Penal
Code, relating to firearms.

Demonicspire
04-26-2012, 8:20 AM
IMO any argument that can wait for a trip to the gun store can probably wait 10 days. 3 days is still annoying, but I'm all for progress.

sharxbyte
04-26-2012, 11:26 AM
"We gave you something so shut up".

jerry


:43:Good luck xD :rofl2:

Librarian
04-26-2012, 11:26 AM
The vote: UNOFFICIAL BALLOT
MEASURE: SB 1569
AUTHOR: Fuller
TOPIC: Firearms: waiting period.
DATE: 04/24/2012
LOCATION: SEN. PUB. S.
MOTION: Do pass as amended, and re-refer to the Committee on Appropriations.
(AYES 2. NOES 5.) (FAIL)


AYES
****

Anderson Harman


NOES
****

Hancock Calderon Liu Price Steinberg

SilverTauron
04-26-2012, 2:32 PM
Ouch.

Did the "Nay" reps vote because they just don't like guns, or was there actual community support for keeping the 10 day restriction in place?

Inyoite
04-26-2012, 2:45 PM
Dammit. Just saw this thread, and was picking up the phone to call Jean. She's a good friend of mine and an awesome woman. :mad:

amtz.zero
04-26-2012, 3:14 PM
The vote:

So this won't be happening?:no:

CCWFacts
04-26-2012, 3:23 PM
The vote:

I'm shocked!

Note that this bill is the most harmless, trivial of changes. 10 days to 3 days. There's no public outcry over waiting periods not being long enough. And yet they can't even get this bill out of committee.

This is California's future. And I believe the Democrats will achieve a super-majority in November, meaning they will also be able to pass tax increases without any Republican ayes.

dfletcher
04-26-2012, 3:25 PM
Ouch.

Did the "Nay" reps vote because they just don't like guns, or was there actual community support for keeping the 10 day restriction in place?

We're in CA. In CA "D" stands for "Don't like guns ...."

SilverTauron
04-26-2012, 3:39 PM
We're in CA. In CA "D" stands for "Don't like guns ...."

Yikes.

I don't live there, so correct me if this is too trite, but it would seem California has become a single party state, much like pre-2003 Iraq and Soviet Russia were in the past.

Window_Seat
04-26-2012, 3:41 PM
Is it really a surprise? We now know that even though they are fully aware that the background check is instant, they still don't want us to have access to a fundamental right.

Until they are booted out (which will not happen as long as people keep watching MSNBC, CNN & Jersey Shore), the only way is in the court system, where we will see the most progress (http://wiki.calgunsfoundation.org/Litigation_Past_and_Present).

Erik.

barca101
04-26-2012, 3:44 PM
Even for some law enforcement officers 3 days would be great. I would hate to ask the Sheriff or Chief a letter that you may have to wait a week(s) for.

Uxi
04-26-2012, 3:49 PM
Problem with the court system is expecting them to stay static. We've had a continual 2 steps forward, 1 step back every step of the way. They'll keep on keeping on. As bad as it is, they can and are trying to make it worse. Bullet buttons on pistols? Only revolvers aren't evil? For now.

craised
04-26-2012, 4:22 PM
How about(La Malafa) SB 1567 ?? Did it pass the committee stage of the game?

RMP91
04-26-2012, 4:32 PM
Knew it wasn't going to happen from the start...

This state is too far to the left to be redeemed...

T-minus 2 years, 63 days before I'm financially able to pack my bags, leave this state and NEVER COME BACK (except for family/friend visits)

Librarian
04-26-2012, 4:58 PM
How about(La Malafa) SB 1567 ?? Did it pass the committee stage of the game?

No - see the bill thread http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=540439

CnCFunFactory
04-27-2012, 11:34 AM
So does this mean that the "enemy" has played into our trap... wasn't there a suit ongoing that said any wait is unconstitutional if you already own a firearm or something to that extent?

dfletcher
04-27-2012, 5:19 PM
Yikes.

I don't live there, so correct me if this is too trite, but it would seem California has become a single party state, much like pre-2003 Iraq and Soviet Russia were in the past.

This is not quite true. While it is accurate that CA is a one party state controlled by the Democrats it is not quite the same as old Iraq or the Soviet Russia.

In Iraq and Soviet Russia you could enjoy a good cigar after a meal in a nice restaurant ...... :p

jwkincal
04-27-2012, 5:29 PM
I believe that in old-school Iraq you could own an AK, too!

bulgron
04-27-2012, 5:34 PM
Yikes.

I don't live there, so correct me if this is too trite, but it would seem California has become a single party state, much like pre-2003 Iraq and Soviet Russia were in the past.

It's not any different than the one-party state that is Illinois, except bigger and probably not quite as corrupt. Probably.

Give it time. And then we too can be every bit as corrupt as Illinois. And then everything will be better. Just ask the people who keep voting Democrat.

I'm really not looking forward to what the Democrats will do once they have complete control of the ability to raise taxes. On the other hand, it'll be amusing watching my Dem friends try to blame everything on the mean old Republicans once the Republicans are finally and completely and officially an irrelevant force in Sacramento.

Sunday
04-27-2012, 5:42 PM
It's not any different than the one-party state that is Illinois, except bigger and probably not quite as corrupt. Probably.

Give it time. And then we too can be every bit as corrupt as Illinois. And then everything will be better. Just ask the people who keep voting Democrat.

I'm really not looking forward to what the Democrats will do once they have complete control of the ability to raise taxes. On the other hand, it'll be amusing watching my Dem friends try to blame everything on the mean old Republicans once the Republicans are finally and completely and officially an irrelevant force in Sacramento.

It is just as corrupt, pay attention . The TV news doesn't cover anything of much importance.

Sunday
04-27-2012, 5:45 PM
Criminals will be happy to hear this, instead of waiting 10 days to hurt/murder/rape/rob you they will only have to wait 3. what makes you think the criminals wait 10 days? .do you watch too much TV?

Sunday
04-27-2012, 5:47 PM
Dammit. Just saw this thread, and was picking up the phone to call Jean. She's a good friend of mine and an awesome woman. :mad:

call anyway!!!

vincewarde
04-27-2012, 5:55 PM
I agree that in this state, we will only see progress via the courts. I believe that many of CA's laws will be struck down eventually. I just hope it is in my lifetime.