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eighteenninetytwo
02-23-2012, 6:31 PM
Brought up by my old man, ex british army. I told him I had a 9mm (beretta) and was ensuring that I trained with iron sights aswell as the laser in the crimson trace grips. He said make sure you practice with both types of sights in low light, and then added "and make sure you practice once in a while with no ear defenders". I asked why and he pointed out that the disorienting flash bangs as used by the army are just that, flash and also bang. And if used to shooting. And hearing little, all of a sudden hearing a shot at full volume when already under stress, would just as likely disorient the shooter as well as the person they're shooting at, thus if a follow up shot was needed it would likely be less effective. anyone else do that?

BoJackUSMC
02-23-2012, 6:43 PM
I think he has good point, but for training purpose I would always wear hearing protection. I have done my share of shooting without ear protection during my military service and shooting without one sucks. Also, I do not think burglar will use flashbang when they try to break into someone's house. Only time you will get disoriented when you shoot very small and tight indoor place like inside the tank, car, or indoor range. Inside the house, you will be fine.

Snoopy47
02-23-2012, 6:47 PM
I did a training exercise where I was pummeled by a trainer for 1 minute straight, and then engaged a target with my weapon after being disorientated.

My ear protection came off in the process while on the ground, and I engaged the target without them. Since then I have a slight ringing in my right ear and it never goes away, and is most predominant when everything it quiet.

I really regret that day, and it will be with me the rest of my life, and mind you this was while shooting outside.

Itís part of the risks I suppose. I will never actively shoot without hearing protection unless it is a life and death situation.

Lead Waster
02-23-2012, 7:01 PM
As long as you are the one that shoots first and hit your target then the disorientation from your first shot should not be too important!

I highly agree that you should protect your hearing at all times. It's no good practicing without ear pro if it leaves you with such bad tinnitus that you don't hear that intruder breaking into your house!!

InGrAM
02-23-2012, 7:02 PM
I wouldn't do it. You would have practice doing it quit a bit to actually become acclimated to it. I agree with what Snoopy47 said, ringing in the ears is a pain. I played in a band for 4 years and I get the same ringing every once in a while. Very high pitched ringing that goes to a hissing, ocean type noise (for me), then fades out. It sucks but damn I had some fun :D

fullrearview
02-23-2012, 7:29 PM
Brought up by my old man, ex british army. I told him I had a 9mm (beretta) and was ensuring that I trained with iron sights aswell as the laser in the crimson trace grips. He said make sure you practice with both types of sights in low light, and then added "and make sure you practice once in a while with no ear defenders". I asked why and he pointed out that the disorienting flash bangs as used by the army are just that, flash and also bang. And if used to shooting. And hearing little, all of a sudden hearing a shot at full volume when already under stress, would just as likely disorient the shooter as well as the person they're shooting at, thus if a follow up shot was needed it would likely be less effective. anyone else do that?

Some truth to that. There have been instances where an entry team used flashbangs on every door in a house... By the time the got to the room where the perp was, he was unaffected. They learned that the body will adapt to it, and learn to shut down the response when it happens.

The thing with a gun shot though... something like 60% of people get auditory exclusion when involved in a shooting...

http://www.killology.com/art_psych_combat.htm

His "On Combat" book should be required curriculum for all military and LEO training in the US.

As for training, I do shoot about 50 rounds every six months without hearing protection. The ringing goes away quickly. No long term affects here.

L84CABO
02-23-2012, 7:51 PM
They're your ears. But no way in hell would I ever do that. Not ever! And hearing loss can be very gradual and unnoticeable. By the time you finally figure out that firing 50 rounds every six months without ear protection really was causing some damage, it will be too late :facepalm:

Outta Control
02-23-2012, 7:53 PM
There is a low-light home defense course this Saturday if anyone is interested in Nor Cal.

cfusionpm
02-23-2012, 7:58 PM
I did a training exercise where I was pummeled by a trainer for 1 minute straight, and then engaged a target with my weapon after being disorientated.

My ear protection came off in the process while on the ground, and I engaged the target without them. Since then I have a slight ringing in my right ear and it never goes away, and is most predominant when everything it quiet.

I really regret that day, and it will be with me the rest of my life, and mind you this was while shooting outside.

Itís part of the risks I suppose. I will never actively shoot without hearing protection unless it is a life and death situation.

Yeah, hearing something like that terrifies me. I had surgery on my ears as a kid, and as a result they're pretty sensetive. Even today, I can't go scuba diving or sky diving because of the effects the pressure has on my ears. Besides shooting, I keep ear plugs in even when I go to things like concerts or air shows. Anything above about 110dB is really painful to me, and anything above 140dB can cause perminant damage.

Kempfer
02-23-2012, 8:00 PM
Some truth to it.

First time I went through a shoot house with no ears I was like holy sh*t that sucks balls. The sound didn't surprise me more than the pressure I felt on my ear drums. Kinda like Pepper Spray, its good to experience once but no need to do it over and over.

Spirit 1
02-23-2012, 8:32 PM
I did a training exercise where I was pummeled by a trainer for 1 minute straight, and then engaged a target with my weapon after being disorientated.

My ear protection came off in the process while on the ground, and I engaged the target without them. Since then I have a slight ringing in my right ear and it never goes away, and is most predominant when everything it quiet.

I really regret that day, and it will be with me the rest of my life, and mind you this was while shooting outside.

Itís part of the risks I suppose. I will never actively shoot without hearing protection unless it is a life and death situation.

Hey, Snoopy, don't give up yet!

When I was in my late teens I was out at Bodega at the ocean with a 'friend'. There's was a couple of big rocks on the beach that came together sorta like a cave. When I went up to look inside he tossed a cherry bomb in between the rocks!

My right ear was 3/4 useless after that and both rang continually for years. Maybe 3-4 years later I suddenly noticed one day that my hearing was back and the ringing was unexplicably gone. I think it had gradually returned some time before, I just never noticed I guess. Have had excellent hearing ever since, both sides, far above average like before I got hurt.

So maybe give it a few years and your hearing may still be restored.

fullrearview
02-23-2012, 8:40 PM
They're your ears. But no way in hell would I ever do that. Not ever! And hearing loss can be very gradual and unnoticeable. By the time you finally figure out that firing 50 rounds every six months without ear protection really was causing some damage, it will be too late :facepalm:

Maybe, we shall see...;)