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wiggin
02-11-2012, 7:27 PM
So I tried to start my first build. CA DOJ blocked the purchase and told me it was because the state of Pennsylvania blocked the purchase. They put me in touch with the PA state police and they told me that they did not block the sale and that California is misreading the flag that just indicates that I have a misdomeaner charge. Its not a charge that would make me a prohibited person. So PA has explained this all to CA DOJ! But CA DOJ still says to me that even though they now know it is a glitch in their system and that they Know I am not a prohibited person, they still can't approve the sale until PA removes the flag. PA now says they can't remove the flag and shouldn't need to because the flag has nothing to do with prohobiting me from purchasing a firearm. So they now say the FBI can erase the flag...and now I'm impatiently waiting to hear back from them. Sorry I know this rambles on but I've been stressing all week. Oh and this would of been my 5th firearm purchase in CA since I received that misdomeaner 15 years ago. I also had a CCW for 2 years.
Please tell me this will work out! Anywhere I can turn to for help? Thanks:confused:

axel4488
02-11-2012, 7:39 PM
Sounds like you need to contact the CGF and after they fix this make a nice donation.

SilverTauron
02-11-2012, 7:44 PM
What kind of misdemeanor charge is it?

PA might not think it matters, but if California considers the charge a 'prohibited offense' their legal opinion is irrelevant. Sounds like as far as the California DOJ is concerned you are a prohibited person. Proceeding further will require legal action of some sort. Sorry to hear you got barred.


Edit: Indeed, according to California's guidelines on prohibited categories misdemeanor offenses are included in their criterion. It wouldn't matter if the offense happened in Pennsylvania or the planet Mars, if the DOJ knows about it = banned category.

• Any person who is convicted of a misdemeanor listed in Penal Code section 29805 (refer to List of Prohibiting Misdemeanors)

Source documentation here:http://oag.ca.gov/sites/all/files/pdfs/firearms/forms/prohibcatmisd.pdf

Doheny
02-11-2012, 8:45 PM
/\ The way I read the OP's post is that neither state considers him a prohibited person, rather, it's bureaucratic red tape.

wiggin
02-11-2012, 8:48 PM
What kind of misdemeanor charge is it?

PA might not think it matters, but if California considers the charge a 'prohibited offense' their legal opinion is irrelevant. Sounds like as far as the California DOJ is concerned you are a prohibited person. Proceeding further will require legal action of some sort. Sorry to hear you got barred.


Edit: Indeed, according to California's guidelines on prohibited categories misdemeanor offenses are included in their criterion. It wouldn't matter if the offense happened in Pennsylvania or the planet Mars, if the DOJ knows about it = banned category.

• Any person who is convicted of a misdemeanor listed in Penal Code section 29805 (refer to List of Prohibiting Misdemeanors)

Source documentation here:http://oag.ca.gov/sites/all/files/pdfs/firearms/forms/prohibcatmisd.pdf

Neither state considers it a prohibiting midemeanor! Both CA DOJ and PA state police have told me so. The flag is there for the sole purpose of letting PA officials know that I have a charge on my record. PA said the only thing it would prevent me from doing in PA is carry concealed. It was a paraphernalia charge. I was caught with a marijuana pipe a few months after my 18th birthday...and haven't broken the law since. I just don't understand how or why it is coming back to haunt me now. Are they really going to take away one of my most cherished freedoms?!

Clinton
02-11-2012, 11:01 PM
What's in PA that you can't buy here? Just curious.

choprzrul
02-11-2012, 11:19 PM
I'm 80% sure that milling your own receiver should take care of this....

.

Librarian
02-11-2012, 11:35 PM
/\ The way I read the OP's post is that neither state considers him a prohibited person, rather, it's bureaucratic red tape.

Looks that way to me.

OP, I am sorry to say so, but you need a lawyer to straighten this out. Having bureaucratic agencies in different states pointing fingers at one another is just too stupid for a regular person.

Lawyers love to cut red tape. Lengthwise. :eek:

ubet
02-12-2012, 7:05 AM
Having bureaucratic agencies in different states pointing fingers at one another is just too stupid for a regular person.



You owe me a new laptop, I just spit coffee all over mine reading that.

Shellshocker66
02-12-2012, 7:13 AM
So I tried to start my first build. CA DOJ blocked the purchase and told me it was because the state of Pennsylvania blocked the purchase. They put me in touch with the PA state police and they told me that they did not block the sale and that California is misreading the flag that just indicates that I have a misdomeaner charge. Its not a charge that would make me a prohibited person. So PA has explained this all to CA DOJ! But CA DOJ still says to me that even though they now know it is a glitch in their system and that they Know I am not a prohibited person, they still can't approve the sale until PA removes the flag. PA now says they can't remove the flag and shouldn't need to because the flag has nothing to do with prohobiting me from purchasing a firearm. So they now say the FBI can erase the flag...and now I'm impatiently waiting to hear back from them. Sorry I know this rambles on but I've been stressing all week. Oh and this would of been my 5th firearm purchase in CA since I received that misdomeaner 15 years ago. I also had a CCW for 2 years.
Please tell me this will work out! Anywhere I can turn to for help? Thanks:confused:

This is the part I love! If you have made 4 prior purchases, why on earth would CA DoJ suddenly decide you can't purchase another?

Did you speak to more then one agent at the DoJ? Maybe it was one agents interpretation.

But it does sound like you're going to probably have to get a lawyer to write some letters to get it removed.

Sorry that really it awful to have to go through this after 4 successful purchases.

tenpercentfirearms
02-12-2012, 8:01 AM
Please contact us so we can see if we can assist.

http://www.calgunsfoundation.org/about/contacts.html

Capt_Communist
02-12-2012, 8:11 AM
Good luck

hoffmang
02-12-2012, 8:39 AM
I can save you the step of contacting us directly. Go ahead and contact Jason Davis whose contact info is here (http://www.calgunsfoundation.org/resources/cgf-hotline.html) and tell him that CGF sent you.

-Gene

brassburnz
02-12-2012, 9:36 AM
When I read the OP's post the first time (I had to read it a couple of times to sort things out.) I couldn't understand what he was talking about. Now I can see one heck of a mess that could happen to anyone.

It will be interesting to see how this all works out. Calguns Foundation to the rescue!

AragornElessar86
02-12-2012, 9:45 AM
I can save you the step of contacting us directly. Go ahead and contact Jason Davis whose contact info is here (http://www.calgunsfoundation.org/resources/cgf-hotline.html) and tell him that CGF sent you.

-Gene

This is the image I have in my head:
http://bolstablog.files.wordpress.com/2009/07/knight-on-white-stallion.jpg

wiggin
02-12-2012, 9:52 PM
I can save you the step of contacting us directly. Go ahead and contact Jason Davis whose contact info is here (http://www.calgunsfoundation.org/resources/cgf-hotline.html) and tell him that CGF sent you.

-Gene

Thanks! I will try and contact Jason tomorrow.

big red
02-12-2012, 10:10 PM
California seems to be willing to latch on to anything under the current Attorney General to deny someone. after four purchases sounds like a television investigation report to me (LOL). The mentality of all state management for years has been to deny everything requested on the intitial level and let the citizen appeal. It creates a need for a larger state worker force. Granting claims and applications properly the first time around would help decrease state work by about a third. Sounds like you are caught up in a mess like I am over a stolen car we found but the highway patrol won't impound the car or arrest the current owner for having stolen property in his possession. I am sure you will resolve your issue a lot quicker than I will but welcome to a citizen's world under C. Harris.

lhecker51
02-13-2012, 3:13 PM
If folks do not get it yet, the quickest way to gun confiscation is to make the compliance path so narrow, only few could do so, or make it cost prohibitive. It is just a matter of time before we can get every citizen banned from owning a firearm due to current and many more future eligible misdemeanors, restraining orders, etc. and still be considered recognizing their 2nd Amendment rights IF they can walk the narrow path with one leg tied while juggling numerous volumes of firearms law.

Yell at the idiot racing down a residential street? Get branded an unstable individual with anger management problems and lose your right to keep and bear arms. It's just a matter of time folks. They will redefine "unstable" to include rants in forums and social networks. If you want to own guns in the future, you better look, act and speak like Mr. Rogers. Sure is a beautiful day in the neighborhood!

Need to restore your rights after a malicious restraining order, misdemeanor, etc? Sure! No problem! Get a lawyer and get ready to empty your account.

wiggin
02-13-2012, 10:11 PM
quick update
So this was not PAs mistake or problem but they appear to be trying to work with me to fix it. Unlike CA DOJ who know they made a mistake but have done nothing to correct the error. The PA state police FBI liaison officer called me this morning, asked me a few questions and then stated she would contact the FBI for me and do what she can to try and get the flag erased.
I tell you one thing when this gets resolved there will be alot of purchases made that I was previously on the fence about. Nothing like a reminder to show me how fragile our freedoms really are.

wiggin
02-18-2012, 3:57 PM
Two state agencies called me today(a saturday 3 day weekend) to tell me that the FBI "modified my flag". I had to go back to my ffl and fill out the same paperwork plus an additional form...and start the 10 day wait all over again. But I will get my rifle!:thumbsup:

Librarian
02-18-2012, 5:51 PM
:jump:

Yay!

CALI-gula
02-18-2012, 6:02 PM
Two state agencies called me today(a saturday 3 day weekend) to tell me that the FBI "modified my flag". I had to go back to my ffl and fill out the same paperwork plus an additional form...and start the 10 day wait all over again. But I will get my rifle!:thumbsup:


Awesome. Common sense prevailed, in spite of the village idiot(s) in the Sacramento bureaucracy that refused to budge.

Good to hear.

.

Levelheadsteve
02-18-2012, 6:37 PM
What's in PA that you can't buy here? Just curious.

Every handgun that isn't on the California approved list and Quaker Steak & Lube chicken wings.

Shellshocker66
02-18-2012, 7:12 PM
Grats!

wiggin
01-08-2015, 5:44 AM
So here we are 2015 and I'm dealing with the same scenario all over again. Another purchase denied despite fixing it all back in 2012. California is ridiculous

SanPedroShooter
01-08-2015, 6:41 AM
And here I was thinking Silver Tauron was back..

sl0re10
01-08-2015, 6:41 AM
So here we are 2015 and I'm dealing with the same scenario all over again. Another purchase denied despite fixing it all back in 2012. California is ridiculous

should contact some of the gun rights orgs. You could be a good public interest lawsuit case.... California acting in bad faith to use the background check system to deny any legit gun purchases they think they can get away with due to having a excuse... while spending the fees collected to keep that system running on other things.

BigPimping
01-08-2015, 12:54 PM
I'm 80% sure that milling your own receiver should take care of this....

.

Well put sir. Touche!!!!

Ronin2
01-08-2015, 1:52 PM
I'm 80% sure that milling your own receiver should take care of this....

.

:rofl2:

SkyHawk
01-08-2015, 2:05 PM
So here we are 2015 and I'm dealing with the same scenario all over again. Another purchase denied despite fixing it all back in 2012. California is ridiculous

File a NICS appeal online, today. https://forms.fbi.gov/nics-appeal-request-form

Get the DROS number from your FFL if you didn't get a copy originally, and use it for the STN on the appeal form.

mabilis_matulis
01-08-2015, 2:07 PM
Good to hear that OP

The Last American Hero
01-08-2015, 2:17 PM
If folks do not get it yet, the quickest way to gun confiscation is to make the compliance path so narrow, only few could do so, or make it cost prohibitive. It is just a matter of time before we can get every citizen banned from owning a firearm due to current and many more future eligible misdemeanors, restraining orders, etc. and still be considered recognizing their 2nd Amendment rights IF they can walk the narrow path with one leg tied while juggling numerous volumes of firearms law.



My ex-IRS agent buddy assures me the IRS can levy felony tax evasion charges on anyone at anytime, and make them stick if they want to.

Mostly due to incredibly broad "received value" concept used to ding Nancy Reagan for "back taxes" for not reporting borrowing dresses (used only at official functions as an unpaid "public servant", being nice to all sorts of people she'd much rather not be around) as "Income".

IIRC, there is not "incidental exchange" protection, even for the smallest "benefits". Buddy gives you a lift across town? That could be charged as Income equal to cost of taxi.

Sorta like how if you really piss of local cops they can tail you and hit you with dozens of traffic violations.

thetaxman
01-08-2015, 3:27 PM
I'm not entirely sure where to start with this one, but if the IRS filed a criminal complaint (outside of administrative/civil procedures) against an individual for failing to report deemed income because your buddy gave you a ride across town, then every Tax Attorney in the country would take it pro bono and then sue the IRS under the FTCA for malicious prosecution.

Criminal fraud requires a burden of proof beyond a reasonable doubt - your ex-IRS buddy is a grade 1 doofus.

My ex-IRS agent buddy assures me the IRS can levy felony tax evasion charges on anyone at anytime, and make them stick if they want to.

Mostly due to incredibly broad "received value" concept used to ding Nancy Reagan for "back taxes" for not reporting borrowing dresses (used only at official functions as an unpaid "public servant", being nice to all sorts of people she'd much rather not be around) as "Income".

IIRC, there is not "incidental exchange" protection, even for the smallest "benefits". Buddy gives you a lift across town? That could be charged as Income equal to cost of taxi.

Sorta like how if you really piss of local cops they can tail you and hit you with dozens of traffic violations.

bandook
01-08-2015, 9:25 PM
Lol. I agree. Maybe there is a reason your pal is EX IRS. There is also the matter that your pal can gift you $14K worth of stuff every year without any tax issues. (This is what allows you to receive Christmas and Birthday presents without sending a check to the IRS).

ugimports
01-08-2015, 9:58 PM
File a NICS appeal online, today. https://forms.fbi.gov/nics-appeal-request-form

Get the DROS number from your FFL if you didn't get a copy originally, and use it for the STN on the appeal form.

The DROS number is the CA state number. That is not the transaction number for NICS and they won't know what to do with it.